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I'm sick of the "skill" argument in MMO's...
Hrimnir
Member RarePosts: 2,415
This is something i've been needing to post ever since GW2 releases. I'm going to show you why the entire argument of being rewarded for "skill" is a total load of crap in MMO's.
First and foremost. I do understand the desire to remove the "gear" variable from the equation. The problem is all these people act like thats the only variable and that as long as everyone is on level playing ground as far as gear goes, then all of sudden it makes for this super skill based competitive environment.
Here is why thats a load of shit:
1. All classes are not created equal and class balance is a myth.
2. You almost never encounter 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, etc, situations in RvR or Instanced Battleground style PVP.
3. People who complain about gear in game, are the same people who will buy G15 keyboard and program the living hell out of it so they can do 1 button press combos and things that are not normally intended by the game.
Elaborations:
1. The only time you can make a claim that you beat someone on pure skill is if you happened to encounter someone who has equal gear, levels, and is the same class, with the exact same build as you. This literally almost never happens. If you do get the rare 1v1 scenario is almost always a different class, and the way MMO's are always set up are with a quasi rock paper scissors method. Certain classes are always better against others. For example, in vanilla wow, a good warlock will almost always get handled by even a mediocre rogue. Thats just an example off the top of my head. But it holds true in every MMO that has PVP.
2. This somewhat ties into point 1, but you rarely encounter where you and your 2 buddies come around a corner and encounter 3 people. Which again, theoretically for it to be fair they would have to have the same group makeup as yours too. SO, usually its either 2v3 or 3v4, 5v2 etc.
3. The point here is basically people are full of shit. They say they want to have a level playing ground, but what they really mean is they want to make sure they have the advantage and not the other guy. And since they may not be able to invest the time or effort to get the better PVP gear, they want to make sure that other people can't as well, so the advantage shifts in their favor.
In conclusion:
Skill based PVP in an MMO or an MMO style game is a MYTH, period, end of conversation. There are simply too many uncontrolled variables for it ever to be a truly competitive environment. If what you truly seek is skill based PVP, go play something counterstrike where more variables are controlled.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Comments
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Let me pull a single line out of your post and throw it back at you. People are full of shit.
You are using a onesided view to look at the situation. Go look at it from a different perspective.
Lol.
I've read many stupid posts today. This one just isnt worth my time. Just tell this to the players of Darktide (Asheron's Call) and Darkfall and you will be laughed at. They are on an entirely different level than the rest of the MMO community.
That is all. This is not worth my time.
EDIT: Actually fun fact: Darktide was so competitive that one of the players on the server "Dread OG" posted youtube videos bragging about his skill in AC. Very entertaining, but Darktide was always ultra competitive as glitches created by the developers that were never fixed became actual game mechanics. (fast casting)
Here is a link to his video where he introduces himself as the "Best PK in AC" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5hj91DzNKw
OP does have a point. The notion of balanced classes for PvP just brings so many variables that its more or less impossible to foresee the maths, which ultimately determines the winning side.
Yeah, if they are organised and plan/train together.
Agreed. Hrimnir won't, though.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Are you on crack?, Asheron's Call is a sandbox, not a themepark in any way, shape or form.
LOL best joke of the day !
100% skill based
no classes
100% random loot no 2 items are the same ( best loot system i have ever seen )
no hold my hand quest
huge open world with NO instances, or zones.
pvp server is pvp on the entire map NO safe zones not even in town, oh and NO instance to hide in.
crafting that actually improves your items, not just craft 100 leather boots and dump them into a vendor to level up your crafting.
pvp actually takes skill, no CC or stealth for noobs to use as a crutch. allowing you to fight and beat multiple players at once. i have seen great pvpers fight 5+ people at once and kill them all. and not because of facerolling geared out crap like in thempark pvp.
i will just stop now because obviously you either never played AC or maybe you tried it and it was to hard for you to stick with.
This is all needs to be said about your arguments as you are without a doubt human.
You pretty much nailed it. I agree with the last setence too. Hes obviously not an old school mmo'er.
AC Forever #1
You want to duel? Play something designed from the ground up for that.
Eve is a sandbox
Uo is a sandbox
Swg is a hybrid
Daoc, EQ & ac ARE themeparks. Just not wow clones obviously.
Ask your doctor about getting an MRI and PET.
Otherwise, the first half of your suggestion was eloquent. I propose we further expound on it and make an even bigger button that blows PvP'ers and the dumbnutt game techs that rewrite my game to suite only their needs to Kingdom Come the next time they gimp my PvE archer right before I'm about to solo a wilderness boss.
We lose more good archers that way man =(
AC is a sandbox.
SWG is NOT a hybrid, its also a sandbox (PRE CU)
You could have stopped at LoL , uh lol
I kid i kid
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
I would like an explaniton of your opinion please. Not trying to start a fight, I just wwould like to know where your coming from. Otherwise Im pretty sure your going to need your asbestos suit. Not from me mind you but there are others who will argue at the drop of a hat. Me, im just curious.
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
Open non instanced at all world - you can have that in a themepark e.g. daoc
Random loot, oh tsw again
No clasees, several themeparks, incld tsw again
Crafting that is meaningful - daoc, gw2
Stealth, what that got to do with it, eve has stealth are you saying eve isn't a sandbox because it has stealth?
Quest arcs - ac has them. Are they sandbox?
Is the content player driven?
Can you build empires, make towns and forts?
if your not on darktide is your content other players or is it a bunch of mobs?
mind I've seen worse I've seen people calling everquest if all games a sandbox on other threads.
Some people take themepark to be a derogatory term meaning basicly wow clone.
The term existed long before wow and applied specifically to EQ, but to mmos in general that weren't user content driven like uo.
I played daoc for many years, daoc IS a themepark, but its nothing like wow. It has no instances, minimal quests, and you could argue some player driven content in pvp (within the rules / factions laid down by the rvr ruleset), but its still a themepark, as is AC.
I don't mean themepark as an insult.
Perhaps we should have 3 terms for mmos
Sandbox - eve, uo, df etc..
Themepark - daoc, gw2, EQ etc..
Lame wow copy corridor and hub grinder - swtor, rift, Aoc, lotr etc..