Yes, the free loaders will be segragated from everyone else who isn't too cheap to pony up 15 dollars a month. They get a free ride to level 50, which is really the best part of the entire game. They can either stay at 50 and pay extra for the end game content, pony up the monthy fee which is less than the cost of a night at the movies, or hop onto the next game that offers free rides.
Originally posted by ktanner3 Yes, the free loaders will be segragated from everyone else who isn't too cheap to pony up 15 dollars a month. They get a free ride to level 50, which is really the best part of the entire game. They can either stay at 50 and pay extra for the end game content, pony up the monthy fee which is less than the cost of a night at the movies, or hop onto the next game that offers free rides.
Are you channeling the spirit of segregation with this post?
F2P is sopposed to mean you get to play the entire game...for free. But you will be unable to enjoy certain conviences, new content or vanity type stuff without either paying for it or subscribing depending on whether the game has a secondary sub model or just a cash shop.
Even ripoff F2P games that try to squeeeze you into using the shop do so by making it harder and harder to level or stay competitve without the use of the shop, but it is still techinically possible to do so.
DDO lets f2p players enjoy the entire game, you buy new modules as desired. But if your really dedicated you can even earn the points to buy them without money.
Bioware is literally slicing off hunks of the game and telling F2P people that cant touch it, period; without paying for the right.
This is not F2P, this is Freemium, and an excellent example of how how NOT to implement it at that.
So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.
This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?
if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.
Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)
Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?
I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?
Yes you are missing, free is not free.
In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.
To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay.
A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .
Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.
But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?
Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...
Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....
Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)
Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)
Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.
In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.
To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay.
A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .
Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.
But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?
If you lack any self-control, then it is your fault for being milked. You DO have the option to NOT pay, you know?
So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.
This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?
if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.
Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)
Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?
I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?
Yes you are missing, free is not free.
In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.
To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay.
A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .
Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.
But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?
Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...
Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....
Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)
Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)
Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.
The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.
[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?
[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy. Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.
So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.
This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?
if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.
Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)
Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?
I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?
Yes you are missing, free is not free.
In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.
To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay.
A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .
Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.
But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?
Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...
Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....
Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)
Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)
Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.
The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.
[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?
[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy. Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.
Lets wait and see what a final option will be.
Edit: They added cartel coins for deluxe adition, and it was not in their initial design. Things are still changing and are not cast in stone.
So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.
This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?
if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.
Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)
Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?
I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?
Yes you are missing, free is not free.
In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.
To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay.
A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .
Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.
But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?
Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...
Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....
Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)
Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)
Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.
The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.
[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?
[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy. Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.
Lets wait and see what a final option will be.
Edit: They added cartel coins for deluxe adition, and it was not in their initial design. Things are still changing and are not cast in stone.
Adjusting how the GTN operates is a major undertaking, and not just tweaking how coins are calculated though.
Gabe was very definitive in his response. I don't see EA spending money and then completely scrapping what they've invested time in, so if there is any change, I'd expect it to be a minor tweak. Maybe like upping the maximum postings from zero to 1 .. woohoo lol
So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.
This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?
if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.
Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)
Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?
I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?
Yes you are missing, free is not free.
In fact many "Free" games make more money than when they were subscription. That is why they when "Free" to begin with.
To answer your more specific questions. You will probably get limited access to the things you discribe-- unless you pay for it. If you want to have more access to PVP then you will have to pay. If you want premium classes then you will have to pay.
A subscription is when you pay a single price and get what you pay for .
Free to play is when you get nickel and dimed by the company until you realize you spent more money on "Free" than you would have with a subscription.
But hey, Free to play is the wave of the future... Yay?
Thank Pete, I was beginning to think I was the only person who seemed to notice this as well! I much prefer to stick with my monthly subscriptions to be honest. Access to everything for a fixed price, rather than trying to calculate how much I spent this month, or budgeting for a month nickel and diming...
Luckily in STO and CO I get a monthly Stipend for being a sub allowing me to participate in the 'Item Shop' Wonder if SWTOR will do the same....
Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)
Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)
Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.
The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.
[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?
[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy. Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.
Lets wait and see what a final option will be.
Edit: They added cartel coins for deluxe adition, and it was not in their initial design. Things are still changing and are not cast in stone.
Adjusting how the GTN operates is a major undertaking, and not just tweaking how coins are calculated though.
Gabe was very definitive in his response. I don't see EA spending money and then completely scrapping what they've invested time in, so if there is any change, I'd expect it to be a minor tweak. Maybe like upping the maximum postings from zero to 1 .. woohoo lol
The F2P players will just sell stuff to vendors then. Good thing for subscribers... we will get richer,,,
Ah come on, they can't be just giving out stuff for free for real. It's not related to how bad a company they are, for once: they just can't give you everything for free, or else they'd go bankrupt.
What I say is that if they give you the 50 first levels free, and the possibility to try out zones or raids etc... like once before paying, well it's already great, and you just pay if you like it and you want more -maybe you pay more, but at least you know what you're paying for. My problem with spending cash on a game is not the amounts I pay but the fact that I feel it's wasted sometimes. Here if you waste your money, shame on you.
F2P in this way is just a bigger free trial. But I mean if I can play the solo campaigns for free, well it's worth it IMHO
Originally posted by ktanner3 Yes, the free loaders will be segragated from everyone else who isn't too cheap to pony up 15 dollars a month. They get a free ride to level 50, which is really the best part of the entire game. They can either stay at 50 and pay extra for the end game content, pony up the monthy fee which is less than the cost of a night at the movies, or hop onto the next game that offers free rides.
The game isn't worth a monthly fee. They're still thinking it is. This is why Freemium games never seem to pull off the success of actual F2P games. Most every western company doesn't get F2P at all, period. When you go in with the mindset that your potential revenue generators are a bunch of free-loaders and then treat them like shit, then you're bound to fail. The Bioiware team is an embarassing case study in incompetence and short-sightedness. Let's see how far this gets them a year or so from now.
F2P never was free, the only difference is that u can customize ur gameplay experience without paying a sub if you dont want to , Like Lotro or AoC as an example, or even STO.
Although to a certain extent, discussion of SWTOR's FReemium system is a bit premature because they have still not released the finer details of it, their monetization system does seem a bit bizzare.
I think this is mostly because that the game wasn't meant to be a FTP type game in the first place. (Maybe a tacked on cash shop for vanity items or a reduction of Legacy costs,not a complete overhaul.) I think the main reason why the FTP set up is bizzare, and in my mind unsustainable, is because the primary motivator for the FTP overhaul isn't to make long term money, but to deflect EA"s investors from continued concern over SWTOR's subscription numbers which was dragging down the EA stock price. Once the game goes ftp, EA no longer has to talk about subscribers, the game's performance will be measured in terms of revenue, and EA has already demonstrated it can be awfully clever when releasing financial figures.
As to the secondary motivation to switching to FTP, I fear that SWTOR is just a reworking and expansion of the Warhammer On Line cash shop. The FTP accounts are not expected to buy vanity items or access warzones and OPs from the cash shop. The cash shop's primary market audience will be the subscribers themselves. At first the items will be mostly vanity in nature, but likely will slowly drift towards the pay to win end of the spectrum. As the game ages, (and subscribers continue to dwindle) the subscribers will find more and more required barriers to overcome in the cash shop. Case in point will be the Makeb level cap expansion, which will be a required optional purchase in the cash shop if you want to continue progressing in the game.
Again, EA claims that they are basing their model on Turbine's LOTRO, but I suggest it will be more like WAR's. WAR has an endless trial with severe restrictions. (TOR equivalent FTP account). WAR sells mounts, vanity pets, and P2W perks in the store.
More importantly, the game which never had an expansion in content, requires who to buy a Reknown Cap Augment in order to be competative in the game.
Of course, maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't seem like a LOTRO system where most of the csh shop items can be obtained by grinding in game. Then again, LOTRO is slowly drifting from FTP to P2W, and the game design itself pushes players towards either subbing or the cash shop a little bit more as time goes on. Freemium which is supposed to be a hybrd of the best of P2P and FTP can also be a hybrid of the worst of P2P and FTP is not implemented correctly.
Then again, maybe SWTOR will find a happy medium, but locking out FTP players from so much of endgame, and conversely giving away what many see as the best part of the game is logic confounding.
As a side note, in regard to segregation. I find it cnfusing that SWTOR's subscribers can simulataneously herald the FTP system as what will save TOR and make it a huge success; and with their next breath call FTP players free-loading scrubs who shouldn't have access to chat, forums, etc. It would seem to me that you have to decide if you want to have your cake or it. Also, the first person to make a Portal joke either wins a prize or a smack. (Like anyone got this far in a wall of text.)
Ok making F2P people pay for the new content is understandable. It makes sense, However if they make Subbed players pay for new content its a cash grab. Seriously People consiter Funcom Greedy and then Bioware wants to pull this crap on you. Time to re-evaluate who we are calling what.
Because i can. I'm Hopeful For Every Game, Until the Fan Boys Attack My Games. Then the Knives Come Out. Logic every gamers worst enemy.
So I was looking at their f2p model and really had to laugh. According to their differences between subs and f2p players chart http://www.swtor.com/free/features you can see that their will be two distinct classes of players. The freemium players won't be able to compete in pvp(with one warzone a day limit you will never have warhero gear), meaning you will be garbage in pvp. "Thats ok, I'm a raider" you say? Well, you are not allowed to do any raids.
This means that subscription players will not let you into their guild, and why should they, you would be utterly worthless. So basically their new model is going to create a population of bums floating around the galaxy? Maybe they will allow pan handling at starports for cartel coins?
if I come off as trashing free to play, players, or subscription players, I really am not trying to accomplish that. I'm just pointing out the segregation in community that this system will create.
Did I mention that free players have limited auction house usuge? Congratulations on being broke.(see pan handling comment above)
Limited travel options? Awesome, so maybe TOR will be the first game to have hitchhiking? ###, gas, or grass?
I usually don't argue for one system or another and usually judge game's by whether or not they are fun; However I'm seriously confused by this model, wouldn't it be better to just announce that free to play is instead a free trial in an attempt to move boxs instead of coming up with this half witted attempt? Both would rake in some needed cash, but the system they are implementing just seems horrible. Am I missing something?
I don't see a problem with that, having 2 class of players had a great result for Anarchy Online and FC!
"you are like the world revenge on sarcasm, you know that?"
I think the freemium model looks good. Really no complaints on my part, though I am subscriber and will remain one for the time being. I never get into the F2p models, they are all too restrictive, understandably.
So why do you think EA owes you a completely free game with no limitations? If its not good enough for you to give them money for either a sub or micro purchases WHY would you waste your time playing it?
Then again, maybe SWTOR will find a happy medium, but locking out FTP players from so much of endgame, and conversely giving away what many see as the best part of the game is logic confounding.
Its not really confounding is it? Loads of people will play the game for the "story". This will make the game look better to the investors at least in the short term.
You said it, ftp isn't meant to be long term. Get the numbers up, get the stocks up, slowly pull away from the game.
At least the F2P will allow you to pretend it is Kotor 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8 like they said it was prior to launch. Drop in play the stories and drop back out.
That is if they let you complete the story quests on F2P.
They do let you play to level 50 which are the end's of the main story quests. Which is kind of why I wondered why they didn't just do a free trial to level 50 model instead of this f2p setup.
It's the same exact thing. It's a free trial to 50 for the most part.
As a few posters already stated, this model is basically for us, players who waited for a KotOR 3 or, if you like to see that way, a trial to lvl50.
When they announced the f2p matrix I wrote the same, I loved the story, but didn't wanted to pay a monthly fee just to play all the classes over (and I wasn't interested the crappy mmo-like part of ToR). With this model EA only 'fixing' their mistake, and allowing us to finish the rest of the classes, without subscription, like any other decent single player rpg games.
Limited flashpoints, and no operations? Who cares?
F2P is sopposed to mean you get to play the entire game...for free. But you will be unable to enjoy certain conviences, new content or vanity type stuff without either paying for it or subscribing depending on whether the game has a secondary sub model or just a cash shop.
...
This is not F2P, this is Freemium, and an excellent example of how how NOT to implement it at that.
There is no standard to advertising a game as F2P. If you're getting bent out of shape after years of companies doing this, you're in for a long ride.
No one is going to advertise a game as Fremium. That's just a term players in the genre use.
1) It's pretty much the easiest to implement. Just limit players access to instanced content
2) They believe that they will get a decent retention rate of players trying the game for the first time that will choose to subscribe
I personally don't believe that failed subscription games find success by going F2P to the cap and then expecting people to pay subs. There's a reason why the game failed with a sub based model, it's because players didn't think it was worth a sub.
It baffles me that companies keep clinging to the idea that every MMO is worth $15 a month. They need to start looking at alternative forms of payment, such as cash shops or permanent unlocks for a single payment.
Comments
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Are you channeling the spirit of segregation with this post?
F2P is sopposed to mean you get to play the entire game...for free. But you will be unable to enjoy certain conviences, new content or vanity type stuff without either paying for it or subscribing depending on whether the game has a secondary sub model or just a cash shop.
Even ripoff F2P games that try to squeeeze you into using the shop do so by making it harder and harder to level or stay competitve without the use of the shop, but it is still techinically possible to do so.
DDO lets f2p players enjoy the entire game, you buy new modules as desired. But if your really dedicated you can even earn the points to buy them without money.
Bioware is literally slicing off hunks of the game and telling F2P people that cant touch it, period; without paying for the right.
This is not F2P, this is Freemium, and an excellent example of how how NOT to implement it at that.
Rewards for Sub owner in cartel points (click on image to see it)
Subs vs F2P (click on image to see it)
Edit. 50 GTN listings is the current limit, so there is no change here.
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
If you lack any self-control, then it is your fault for being milked. You DO have the option to NOT pay, you know?
The GTN will be significantly gimped for freemium users.
Hyperspace Beacon: SWTOR's Gabe Amatangelo on 1.4 and free-to-play
http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/09/18/hyperspace-beacon-swtors-gabe-amatangelo-on-1-4-and-free-to-pl/
Sep 18th 2012
[Massively]: I'm excited for the opportunity to see what a free-to-play model will do for TOR. However, there have been some mixed reactions regarding F2P in general. What is your take on F2P, and what do you believe it will add to the player's experience in the game?
[Gabe]: It will make galactic trade market entrepreneurs happy. Free-to-play members can buy but can't list, meaning more customers with less competition. Who wouldn't like that? My take is that what happened to the music industry is happening to online games. Free-to-play options are the future of most, if not all, online games. There are all types of players out there, and the ability to subscribe to a game -- or multiple games -- is a dividing characteristic. This will open the game up to more types of players to try or retry the game, which will be good for all players.
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
Lets wait and see what a final option will be.
Edit: They added cartel coins for deluxe adition, and it was not in their initial design. Things are still changing and are not cast in stone.
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
Adjusting how the GTN operates is a major undertaking, and not just tweaking how coins are calculated though.
Gabe was very definitive in his response. I don't see EA spending money and then completely scrapping what they've invested time in, so if there is any change, I'd expect it to be a minor tweak. Maybe like upping the maximum postings from zero to 1 .. woohoo lolWant a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
The F2P players will just sell stuff to vendors then
. Good thing for subscribers... we will get richer,,, 
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
Ah come on, they can't be just giving out stuff for free for real. It's not related to how bad a company they are, for once: they just can't give you everything for free, or else they'd go bankrupt.
What I say is that if they give you the 50 first levels free, and the possibility to try out zones or raids etc... like once before paying, well it's already great, and you just pay if you like it and you want more -maybe you pay more, but at least you know what you're paying for. My problem with spending cash on a game is not the amounts I pay but the fact that I feel it's wasted sometimes. Here if you waste your money, shame on you.
F2P in this way is just a bigger free trial. But I mean if I can play the solo campaigns for free, well it's worth it IMHO
You give EAWARE too much credit.
Lets wait 6 month instead of 1 year lol.
Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language
Although to a certain extent, discussion of SWTOR's FReemium system is a bit premature because they have still not released the finer details of it, their monetization system does seem a bit bizzare.
I think this is mostly because that the game wasn't meant to be a FTP type game in the first place. (Maybe a tacked on cash shop for vanity items or a reduction of Legacy costs,not a complete overhaul.) I think the main reason why the FTP set up is bizzare, and in my mind unsustainable, is because the primary motivator for the FTP overhaul isn't to make long term money, but to deflect EA"s investors from continued concern over SWTOR's subscription numbers which was dragging down the EA stock price. Once the game goes ftp, EA no longer has to talk about subscribers, the game's performance will be measured in terms of revenue, and EA has already demonstrated it can be awfully clever when releasing financial figures.
As to the secondary motivation to switching to FTP, I fear that SWTOR is just a reworking and expansion of the Warhammer On Line cash shop. The FTP accounts are not expected to buy vanity items or access warzones and OPs from the cash shop. The cash shop's primary market audience will be the subscribers themselves. At first the items will be mostly vanity in nature, but likely will slowly drift towards the pay to win end of the spectrum. As the game ages, (and subscribers continue to dwindle) the subscribers will find more and more required barriers to overcome in the cash shop. Case in point will be the Makeb level cap expansion, which will be a required optional purchase in the cash shop if you want to continue progressing in the game.
Again, EA claims that they are basing their model on Turbine's LOTRO, but I suggest it will be more like WAR's. WAR has an endless trial with severe restrictions. (TOR equivalent FTP account). WAR sells mounts, vanity pets, and P2W perks in the store.
http://store.origin.com/store/ea/ContentTheme/pbPage.warhammer-online-bundles
More importantly, the game which never had an expansion in content, requires who to buy a Reknown Cap Augment in order to be competative in the game.
Of course, maybe I'm wrong, but it doesn't seem like a LOTRO system where most of the csh shop items can be obtained by grinding in game. Then again, LOTRO is slowly drifting from FTP to P2W, and the game design itself pushes players towards either subbing or the cash shop a little bit more as time goes on. Freemium which is supposed to be a hybrd of the best of P2P and FTP can also be a hybrid of the worst of P2P and FTP is not implemented correctly.
Then again, maybe SWTOR will find a happy medium, but locking out FTP players from so much of endgame, and conversely giving away what many see as the best part of the game is logic confounding.
As a side note, in regard to segregation. I find it cnfusing that SWTOR's subscribers can simulataneously herald the FTP system as what will save TOR and make it a huge success; and with their next breath call FTP players free-loading scrubs who shouldn't have access to chat, forums, etc. It would seem to me that you have to decide if you want to have your cake or it. Also, the first person to make a Portal joke either wins a prize or a smack. (Like anyone got this far in a wall of text.)
Because i can.
I'm Hopeful For Every Game, Until the Fan Boys Attack My Games. Then the Knives Come Out.
Logic every gamers worst enemy.
I don't see a problem with that, having 2 class of players had a great result for Anarchy Online and FC!
"you are like the world revenge on sarcasm, you know that?"
One of those great lines from The Secret World
So what do people that bought the game get? I have yet to see a single thread about it.
Compare EQ2 F2P LOTRO F2P and SWTOR F2P
Click on image to enlarge
EQ2
LOTRO
SWTOR
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
Already posted it but here:
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
Its not really confounding is it? Loads of people will play the game for the "story". This will make the game look better to the investors at least in the short term.
You said it, ftp isn't meant to be long term. Get the numbers up, get the stocks up, slowly pull away from the game.
It's the same exact thing. It's a free trial to 50 for the most part.
As a few posters already stated, this model is basically for us, players who waited for a KotOR 3
or, if you like to see that way, a trial to lvl50.
When they announced the f2p matrix I wrote the same, I loved the story, but didn't wanted to pay a monthly fee just to play all the classes over (and I wasn't interested the crappy mmo-like part of ToR). With this model EA only 'fixing' their mistake, and allowing us to finish the rest of the classes, without subscription, like any other decent single player rpg games.
Limited flashpoints, and no operations? Who cares?
There is no standard to advertising a game as F2P. If you're getting bent out of shape after years of companies doing this, you're in for a long ride.
No one is going to advertise a game as Fremium. That's just a term players in the genre use.
It's pretty clear why they chose this model.
1) It's pretty much the easiest to implement. Just limit players access to instanced content
2) They believe that they will get a decent retention rate of players trying the game for the first time that will choose to subscribe
I personally don't believe that failed subscription games find success by going F2P to the cap and then expecting people to pay subs. There's a reason why the game failed with a sub based model, it's because players didn't think it was worth a sub.
It baffles me that companies keep clinging to the idea that every MMO is worth $15 a month. They need to start looking at alternative forms of payment, such as cash shops or permanent unlocks for a single payment.