Yeah, I don't know how people can say its NOT an rpg. It is pretty light on the rpg elements but so is Diablo 3 and yet its referred to as an rpg.
Yeah, Diablo in an MMO environment would definately be on par with other MMORPGs. Conversely, most MMORPGs without the MMO would be questionable, as RPGs.
The context changes things. In the case of MMOs, it means cutting slack all over the place, because making an MMO is so monumentally difficult or somesuch, I dunno.
Just look at WoW, even that's considered an MMORPG.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Originally posted by itgrowls Actually you're not accurate, all of the dodging doesn't occur 100% from the dodge mechanic, you can straffe and get that effect, you can hide behind object and the mobs have to get to you etc heck i've even dove off a cliff and into water to give the mobs a harder time how is that not action?
So, GW2 is "action" because it has very common MMO mechanics such as Facing, Line of Sight and Distance Limitations?
I can do all of those things in WoW. So, I guess by your logic WoW is now an action game.
Yeah, I don't know how people can say its NOT an rpg. It is pretty light on the rpg elements but so is Diablo 3 and yet its referred to as an rpg.
Actually Diablo is referred as hack& slash and sometimes as action rpg.
It is not referred as just rpg or crpg. At least not more often than it is referred as mmorpg or not more often than LoL is described as mmorpg. (yes I actually saw people describe it like that).
Anyway, I suppose there was a time when I actually contributed useful things to this site way back when. But now I recognize it for what it is and that time has passed lol.
also, isn't your calling out of my opinion that his opinion is stupid, basically the same thing I did ?
No;;;i am simply disagreeing with your way of dealing with people who might have different interpretation of terms MMO. I don't think even remotely implied that your opinion is stupid. I just don't feel there are any absolutes or my interpretation is the only right one when it comes to MMOS.
seriously though I have been playing RPGs for over 20 years calling GW2 not an RPG is ridiculous and saying it's not an MMO is equally ridiculous.. i could go around saying GW2 has more sandbox elements than themepark but that statement doesn't make me look any less stupid even if it is just my opinion
I thought we just got over this on alst page? anyways...
Only day i will start calling other people stupid for having a different opinion is when i am completely full of myself. But since i am not, i respect others opinions as much i expect them to respect mine.
Now if someone is twisting facts is another matter. Look at the new title Star Citizen for example. The whole MMO term is evoloving with every new title so much that the creator doesn't want to confine his game into any limitations of one definition.
So your 20 years of experince playing RPG got nothign to do with interpretation of the term MMO. Which is not absolute and never was.
Valid opinion: I don't like baseball, I think it is boring to watch.
Stupid opinion: baseball is not a sport.
you know, I remember that there used to be a time where people could actually be WRONG. But now apparently, we have to respect evreryone's opinion regardless of how delusional those opinions are.
You are comparing apples and oranges here.
I never said I didn't like GW2; in fact, I like it.
I just consider it a different type of MMO than you do. The difference here is that you are calling me stupid for it.
I'm actually calling your opinion stupid .
i also don't care if you like or dislike gw2...I'm arguing with you because you are trying reject the classification of a game that everyone agrees on just to make some kind of point. This does nothing but cause confusion, and I always thought it was a really sily thing to do. This is just like the people who swear that skyrim isn't a sandbox.
Nice job proving his point. Skyrim is a great game but there's no way I would classify it a sandbox, and neither would any of my friends (the only way I could see that argument is if we're talking about additional mods, but I'll assume we're talking about the standalone game here.) OUR definition of sandbox would imply that we can create persistent objects in the game world and even terraform to at least some extent, hence being like "a kid in a sandbox".
So by your own example there, you prove that we all have our own subjective definitions for these words, and for you to believe that GW2 is in a "classification that everyone agrees on" is just plain asinine. I personally know numerous people who think of GW2 as more of a console/action rpg with mmo elements, rather than a conventional mmorpg, and I happen to agree with them.
You're calling peoples' opinions stupid, while asserting your own as if it's fact. Do we see the irony here?
So in short. It maybe didnt live to everyones expectations
It all depends on whether you blame yourself, or everything else in the world, for managing your expectations?
Agreed.
But but but....I was just a victim to magical hype train! I couldn't do nothing I tells yah!
Or, ya know, if you were expecting an MMORPG from a title labeled as MMORPG.
Oh I see, see I was under the impression that an MMORPG was a persistent rpg world that is shared by a large amount of players. Pretty sure GW2 fits this definition to the T.
can you please argue your point of why gw2 is not an MMORPG?
It's more of an MMOAAG (Massively Multiplayer Online Action Adventure Game) than an MMORPG. I mean, even SOE isn't labeling Planetside 2 as an MMORPG, but rather an MMOFPS. There's a reason why we label things differently, so we can see what they are beforehand.
That's still not really accurate. GW2 is still stat and chance based combat like a RPG. Also has no-aim tab targeting. The only "action" is the dodge mechanic.
Yeah, I don't know how people can say its NOT an rpg. It is pretty light on the rpg elements but so is Diablo 3 and yet its referred to as an rpg.
Yeah, I could see people arguing that GW2 is an action rpg. But it is most definitely an rpg, not really up for debate.
Wow... people are still arguing over whether GW2 is an 'MMORPG'?! Seriously!?
You guys do realize that if you were to somehow rationalize GW2 NOT being an MMORPG, then you would also have to accept that nearly every other MMO ever made would also have to 'not be an MMORPG'.
I really hope that some of you don't categorize videogames for a living, or I could see people buying games like Uncharted, expecting Call of Duty. It's one thing to dislike a game. It's an entirely different thing to attempt to change it's label to rationalize disliking it.
Wow... people are still arguing over whether GW2 is an 'MMORPG'?! Seriously!?
You guys do realize that if you were to somehow rationalize GW2 NOT being an MMORPG, then you would also have to accept that nearly every other MMO ever made would also have to 'not be an MMORPG'.
I really hope that some of you don't categorize videogames for a living, or I could see people buying games like Uncharted, expecting Call of Duty. It's one thing to dislike a game. It's an entirely different thing to attempt to change it's label to rationalize disliking it.
Yes, thank you lol .
so many people here seem to think that "fanbois" like me will just jump down their throats if they say anything negative about the game.
but come the freak on. This has nothing to do with GW2 this is about trying to deny the fact that an rpg game is an rpg, and somehow believing that gw2 is more like god of war (action) than it is like wow (rpg).
I am kinda dissapointed with GW2 and been a few days since I logged in.
Mostly what made me dissapointed was all the hand holding and everything almost giving to you with no sweat.
- Only humanoid mobs have any real sense of danger the rest are all easy as hell even could solo veterans and champions on my mesmer because the ai is dumb.
- Dynamic events are nice and all but way too repetitive, bring some REAL consequences! some that last more than a couple of minutes/hours, make them tougher!! There's no sense of danger or worryness while losing any dynamic event because after a couple of minutes you have a chance to win it back.
- Dungeons are also a farce with some vet mobs harder than bosses!! Arah dungeon's event getting stuck every week for the whole weekend then starts working again on monday's server's restart.
- Defeating a boss and in the chest that spawns you get 95% of the times pure crap that sells very cheaply. (Even on world event bosses)
- Story quest should have added every dungeon in the game or at least some of them to prepare people for the last part of the storyline, nothing frustrated me more than seeing people joining arah exp not story with lvl 40s armour, c'mon man? then they whine because they keep on dying on every vet..
- The game spoonfed too much and some people get to 80 and seem like retards even if you explain what they have to do they do not follow.
- Lack of any interaction apart of ty for ress someone or they ress you.
There's other stuff too but it's getting long anyway and I'm sure this will get ignored so why bother.
I am kinda dissapointed with GW2 and been a few days since I logged in.
Mostly what made me dissapointed was all the hand holding and everything almost giving to you with no sweat.
I've gotta agree with you on the handholding.
For a majority of the game, the challenge seems to come more from trying to get other people to pay attention, then from being challenged yourself. There are still a few fights that still seem challenging, but most of them I think I've just gotten the hang of. This is to be expected though, even with amazing games like Shadow of the Colossus, once you figure out the boss fights they kind of become 2nd hand, and sometimes even trivial.
What sucks about GW2, though, is that a lot of people's first instict is to cry about something they can't do / get, rather than trying to figure out how to do it themselves. Such a privilaged mindset absolutely destroys these kinds of games, and is largely responsible for a lot of MMOs being as lackluster as they now feel.
The people I've met ingame that actually make the effort to enjoy it themselves, seem to have a much more pleasant experience overall, than the people who are expecting to just cakewalk through everything.
I am still enjoying the game though, and have found challenge in other aspects. I've been doing a lot of build experimentation, and working w/ the guild to get them more formidable in WvW. We've been having a lot of fun in PvP trying out new strategies, and learning how to overcome seemingly unbeatable odds through superior tactics & cooperation.
GW2 is a very fun online co-op game, but it's not a good MMORPG to me.
No progression, no sense of accomplishment, no reason to group up with people or talk to anyone outside your guild, it's way to casual and nothing has consequence or purpose.
I played for 2 hours during pre-launch, haven't been back, didn't grab me. I may make it back to try....It is free, once ya own it...
I did not like the classes I played, and probably didn't help playing during the zerg rush of new people...The latest posts on it have not help make me want to go play it again though...As I like mmos with depth, not ADD, I can play for 10 to 30 minute systems.
I did like the news on EQN, maybe it will have some depth, but it is a long way off.
So knowing the differences between the two games in the series... what is GW2 if not an MMO? This should be good. I bet if I asked that in a poll, I'd get a dozen different answers.
I would say a very stripped down MMO, more like MMO lite.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
We can all agree that some people here had unrealistic expectations. And thats putting it lightly.
"Savior of MMORPG" , "Sandbox" ... to say the few.
And than some people woke up...
Ouch.
What we have in fact is a MMO "lite" with very high production values. Some new ideas - some implemented good some bad.
Its also a spiritual sucessor to GW1 which does some things better (more open world) and some worse (skill system)
But is it a bad game ?
I value quality of the game by value i get from it.
I got over 300 hours out of it so far. And while I myself log in much less these days. The fact that i can log in whenever I want makes me sure I will get at least 300 more. And the Halloween events just come to show how Anet will add content constantly to the game.
I find this an excellent value for B2P product.
So in short. It maybe didnt live to everyones expectations ( It did to mine . I pretty much expected all the shortcommings )
But it does not make it a bad game. And certanly not a game not worth to have.
So even if you are leaving you will probably be back.
Peace out
I expected dynamic events to be truley dynamic like they claimed, with towns/settlements to be taken over and events I never seen before to keep popping up, but instead I see the same events getting repeated.
I expected good WvWvW, like DAoC, with one WvWvW zone like DAoC, but instead I see 3 copies of the same WvWvW map and 1 central map, all 4 are seperate from the others, and WvWvW is dominated by ranged. You have almost all ranged going at it back and forth, so if you prefer melee, you'll be slaughtered before you even get to the enemy lines.
So basically, the two features that got me interested in this game weren't any fun for me past a the newness phase, so I left. I won't call GW2 a bad game, just not the game I was expecting or the game for me.
GW2 is a very fun online co-op game, but it's not a good MMORPG to me.
No progression, no sense of accomplishment, no reason to group up with people or talk to anyone outside your guild, it's way to casual and nothing has consequence or purpose.
Been this way in every MMORPG I have played since the first year of Daoc ...not sure what your trying to prove here
GW2 is a very fun online co-op game, but it's not a good MMORPG to me.
No progression, no sense of accomplishment, no reason to group up with people or talk to anyone outside your guild, it's way to casual and nothing has consequence or purpose.
Been this way in every MMORPG I have played since the first year of Daoc ...not sure what your trying to prove here
I'm not trying to prove anything, not sure what you're trying to prove here though.
GW2 is a very fun online co-op game, but it's not a good MMORPG to me.
No progression, no sense of accomplishment, no reason to group up with people or talk to anyone outside your guild, it's way to casual and nothing has consequence or purpose.
Been this way in every MMORPG I have played since the first year of Daoc ...not sure what your trying to prove here
I'm not trying to prove anything, not sure what you're trying to prove here though.
He's showing how absurd it is to claim GW2 is not an MMO because it doesn't fit in the same mould as all the same cookie-cutter MMO's released since WoW came out.
If you want gear-based progression, gear-based PvP and Raiding you are more than welcome to play the dozens of games that provide that experience. GW2 set out to from the very beginning as something different for those tired of the same "MMO" mechanics of the past decade.
look on the brightside, those 5 hours every day for the last 60 days or so you've spent playing the game can be put to better use.
“Nevertheless, the human brain, which survives by hoping from one second to another, will always endeavor to put off the moment of truth. Moist” ― Terry Pratchett, Making Money
GW2 is a very fun online co-op game, but it's not a good MMORPG to me.
No progression, no sense of accomplishment, no reason to group up with people or talk to anyone outside your guild, it's way to casual and nothing has consequence or purpose.
Been this way in every MMORPG I have played since the first year of Daoc ...not sure what your trying to prove here
I'm not trying to prove anything, not sure what you're trying to prove here though.
He's showing how absurd it is to claim GW2 is not an MMO because it doesn't fit in the same mould as all the same cookie-cutter MMO's released since WoW came out.
If you want gear-based progression, gear-based PvP and Raiding you are more than welcome to play the dozens of games that provide that experience. GW2 set out to from the very beginning as something different for those tired of the same "MMO" mechanics of the past decade.
Never said it wasn't an MMORPG, I said it was a bad one.
It doesn't have to be gear based this and that...but it needs to be rewarding progression, GW2 has no rewarding progression, very little character progression after level 30 and a very small amount of social/community building features considering it's an MMORPG, therefore to me, it is a bad MMO, but it's a fun game nonetheless.
GW2 is a very fun online co-op game, but it's not a good MMORPG to me.
No progression, no sense of accomplishment, no reason to group up with people or talk to anyone outside your guild, it's way to casual and nothing has consequence or purpose.
Been this way in every MMORPG I have played since the first year of Daoc ...not sure what your trying to prove here
I'm not trying to prove anything, not sure what you're trying to prove here though.
He's showing how absurd it is to claim GW2 is not an MMO because it doesn't fit in the same mould as all the same cookie-cutter MMO's released since WoW came out.
If you want gear-based progression, gear-based PvP and Raiding you are more than welcome to play the dozens of games that provide that experience. GW2 set out to from the very beginning as something different for those tired of the same "MMO" mechanics of the past decade.
Never said it wasn't an MMORPG, I said it was a bad one.
It doesn't have to be gear based this and that...but it needs to be rewarding progression, GW2 has no rewarding progression, very little character progression after level 30 and a very small amount of social/community building features considering it's an MMORPG, therefore to me, it is a bad MMO, but it's a fun game nonetheless.
The point was I haven't seen rewarding progression in any game ...and social/community building has been 0 for the last 10 years .In my case I run with a multi-gamming guild ,we have 75 or 80 likeminded folks playing all the games , I'm happy to meet anyone in a game but I don't go looking for anyone . After the years of 40 and 25 man raids I have no interest in meeting and dealing with the elite or the drama queens ...my time is for my enjoyment with folks that play and act like I do.
Approach GW2 as a standard 60$ Action/Adventure Console game (Skyrim) w/online co-op ~ then you'll be pretty satisfied with your purchase and how GW2 caters to that mindset.
IE: Get in, play.. get out, walk away and wait for the next batch of DLC (expansion).
However, if you approach GW2 as an MMO ~ odds are, you'll be disappointed for several reasons.
Standardized Loot / Character Progression / Combat:: 1. Everything is set up so, no one really ever feels powerful. 2. Lack of trinity means, you don't need anyone and are not needed by anyone.
The staples of an MMO are designed around creating a community from the players and promoting them to work together. ~ in this aspect, GW2 fails as an MMO.
Granted people can argue, saying that GW2 is amazing and is better off without the Trinity and having to rely on other players.
They then point to Dynamic events and how you "need" other people to kill mobs like Balthazar, Dragons, ect..
But do you really? are the faceless masses anymore "personal" than having a bunch of henchmen NPC to help you finish the event?
Think about it ~ we don't know the names of other people at those events, because we're not there for them ~ we don't need to talk, we don't need to socialize or even organize ~ we only care about the "chance" at uber loot (perhaps the precursor?) and to farm Karma/Gold.
Since those bosses are nothing more than HP sponges that hit like trucks (no tactics) ~ people just sit back and spam, leaving the few people that agro the mob to be chased by him, while they take pot shots at it and if someone gets low on HP they throw down their AOE heals.
Basically, GW2 tries to mimic the Trinity without creating a "need" for people to do anything more than zerg the content.
This trivializes going back to old content while being "leveled down" in that you see no point as you could "experience" the same content at your own level and at least get appropriate gear/loot.
Even the dungeons are designed this way with their "Corpse run, waypoints".
In all senses of the word "community" ~ it seems that GW2 fails.
This includes the free 24 hour server transfers that shred any hopes of a well built community as well at the ability to join multiple guilds, and yet refuse to put in a multi-chat for each of them, requiring you to "represent" one guild at a time, in order to talk to other members of that guild.
The same goes for World Vs World ~ you cannot see enemy players names.. and there are no scoreboards dedicated to the very skilled or elite of the "leaders" ~ in fact, if you wish to be a "leader" you need only spend 100 gold on a tome to become a commander, there are no other prerequisites or skill based requirements.
IE: No one knows who you are or why you're deserving to be a "leader" ~ they only see an impersonal title.
When I talk to my friends of old, and why they use to play MUD's, Asherons Call and Ultima Online ~ they always talk about the "community" and how back then, those games WERE Facebook. As in, a place for like minded people to gather, socialize and enjoy the craft.
GW2 doesn't do that, and in my opinion is why WoW is still "king" ~ despite their outdated graphics and kung fu panda hijinks..
If you've ever heard someone shout "FOR THE HORDE!" ~ you can see without a shadow of a doubt that the game inspires and promotes a sense of community... for better or worse.
At the end of the day, can you really say that GW2 IS an MMO anymore than League of Legends, Team Fortress 2 or Playing Skyrim while talking to your friends on skype?
Of course it is an mmorpg. I agree with the lady that said saying otherwise is somewhat obtuse.
It is a question of semantics. What is an mmorpg to YOU?
Therefore I wouldn't argue it isn't an mmorpg, because GW2 clearly fits the broad definition.
I would however say, that its a rubbish mmorpg, because it doesn't really tick any of the boxes which are important to me in terms of what makes a good mmo.
I saw a vista on a high mountain and could not find a way to reach it, until I understood that I had to climb up from the other side. So I walked through a tunnel and passed a camp, that I already knew. Only this time there was an attack from underground which led to a boss fight. So I stayed a while and enjoyed the fight.
Afterwards I continued my search for a way to the vista and discovered a cave full with spiders. The first spiders were easy but then there came a bigger one which called for help of its minions. Desperately I just rushed through all spiders to where I assumed to be the exit to the vista and I found it. But there were still the spiders behind me! I jumped over cliffs and stones to get rid of the majority of them and succeeded.
So in the end it was me against big mama and one of her children, it was a long fight and I almost died several times. I had to use all my skills and tactics to survive. When I finally claimed the vista it really felt like the end to an epic adventure!
No other MMO on the market gives me the same excitement.
A-Frikking-Men!
This is why GW2 is the best MMO on the market, screw scripted encounters.
But of course the haters will say shit like "what did you gain" or "was there any phat loot". IMO only a narrow minded individual is in it for the loot. The fun and enjoyment of adventures like the one you described is why I play.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
I saw a vista on a high mountain and could not find a way to reach it, until I understood that I had to climb up from the other side. So I walked through a tunnel and passed a camp, that I already knew. Only this time there was an attack from underground which led to a boss fight. So I stayed a while and enjoyed the fight.
Afterwards I continued my search for a way to the vista and discovered a cave full with spiders. The first spiders were easy but then there came a bigger one which called for help of its minions. Desperately I just rushed through all spiders to where I assumed to be the exit to the vista and I found it. But there were still the spiders behind me! I jumped over cliffs and stones to get rid of the majority of them and succeeded.
So in the end it was me against big mama and one of her children, it was a long fight and I almost died several times. I had to use all my skills and tactics to survive. When I finally claimed the vista it really felt like the end to an epic adventure!
No other MMO on the market gives me the same excitement.
A-Frikking-Men!
This is why GW2 is the best MMO on the market, screw scripted encounters.
But of course the haters will say shit like "what did you gain" or "was there any phat loot". IMO only a narrow minded individual is in it for the loot. The fun and enjoyment of adventures like the one you described is why I play.
I love loot. I love rewards whether cosmetic or otherwise. What is with this generalisations? can't make a point without putting labels?
Comments
Yeah, Diablo in an MMO environment would definately be on par with other MMORPGs. Conversely, most MMORPGs without the MMO would be questionable, as RPGs.
The context changes things. In the case of MMOs, it means cutting slack all over the place, because making an MMO is so monumentally difficult or somesuch, I dunno.
Just look at WoW, even that's considered an MMORPG.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
I can do all of those things in WoW. So, I guess by your logic WoW is now an action game.
Actually Diablo is referred as hack& slash and sometimes as action rpg.
It is not referred as just rpg or crpg. At least not more often than it is referred as mmorpg or not more often than LoL is described as mmorpg. (yes I actually saw people describe it like that).
Nice job proving his point. Skyrim is a great game but there's no way I would classify it a sandbox, and neither would any of my friends (the only way I could see that argument is if we're talking about additional mods, but I'll assume we're talking about the standalone game here.) OUR definition of sandbox would imply that we can create persistent objects in the game world and even terraform to at least some extent, hence being like "a kid in a sandbox".
So by your own example there, you prove that we all have our own subjective definitions for these words, and for you to believe that GW2 is in a "classification that everyone agrees on" is just plain asinine. I personally know numerous people who think of GW2 as more of a console/action rpg with mmo elements, rather than a conventional mmorpg, and I happen to agree with them.
You're calling peoples' opinions stupid, while asserting your own as if it's fact. Do we see the irony here?
Yeah, I could see people arguing that GW2 is an action rpg. But it is most definitely an rpg, not really up for debate.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
Wow... people are still arguing over whether GW2 is an 'MMORPG'?! Seriously!?
You guys do realize that if you were to somehow rationalize GW2 NOT being an MMORPG, then you would also have to accept that nearly every other MMO ever made would also have to 'not be an MMORPG'.
I really hope that some of you don't categorize videogames for a living, or I could see people buying games like Uncharted, expecting Call of Duty. It's one thing to dislike a game. It's an entirely different thing to attempt to change it's label to rationalize disliking it.
Yes, thank you lol
.
so many people here seem to think that "fanbois" like me will just jump down their throats if they say anything negative about the game.
but come the freak on. This has nothing to do with GW2 this is about trying to deny the fact that an rpg game is an rpg, and somehow believing that gw2 is more like god of war (action) than it is like wow (rpg).
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
I am kinda dissapointed with GW2 and been a few days since I logged in.
Mostly what made me dissapointed was all the hand holding and everything almost giving to you with no sweat.
- Only humanoid mobs have any real sense of danger the rest are all easy as hell even could solo veterans and champions on my mesmer because the ai is dumb.
- Dynamic events are nice and all but way too repetitive, bring some REAL consequences! some that last more than a couple of minutes/hours, make them tougher!! There's no sense of danger or worryness while losing any dynamic event because after a couple of minutes you have a chance to win it back.
- Dungeons are also a farce with some vet mobs harder than bosses!! Arah dungeon's event getting stuck every week for the whole weekend then starts working again on monday's server's restart.
- Defeating a boss and in the chest that spawns you get 95% of the times pure crap that sells very cheaply. (Even on world event bosses)
- Story quest should have added every dungeon in the game or at least some of them to prepare people for the last part of the storyline, nothing frustrated me more than seeing people joining arah exp not story with lvl 40s armour, c'mon man? then they whine because they keep on dying on every vet..
- The game spoonfed too much and some people get to 80 and seem like retards even if you explain what they have to do they do not follow.
- Lack of any interaction apart of ty for ress someone or they ress you.
There's other stuff too but it's getting long anyway and I'm sure this will get ignored so why bother.
I've gotta agree with you on the handholding.
For a majority of the game, the challenge seems to come more from trying to get other people to pay attention, then from being challenged yourself. There are still a few fights that still seem challenging, but most of them I think I've just gotten the hang of. This is to be expected though, even with amazing games like Shadow of the Colossus, once you figure out the boss fights they kind of become 2nd hand, and sometimes even trivial.
What sucks about GW2, though, is that a lot of people's first instict is to cry about something they can't do / get, rather than trying to figure out how to do it themselves. Such a privilaged mindset absolutely destroys these kinds of games, and is largely responsible for a lot of MMOs being as lackluster as they now feel.
The people I've met ingame that actually make the effort to enjoy it themselves, seem to have a much more pleasant experience overall, than the people who are expecting to just cakewalk through everything.
I am still enjoying the game though, and have found challenge in other aspects. I've been doing a lot of build experimentation, and working w/ the guild to get them more formidable in WvW. We've been having a lot of fun in PvP trying out new strategies, and learning how to overcome seemingly unbeatable odds through superior tactics & cooperation.
GW2 is a very fun online co-op game, but it's not a good MMORPG to me.
No progression, no sense of accomplishment, no reason to group up with people or talk to anyone outside your guild, it's way to casual and nothing has consequence or purpose.
I played for 2 hours during pre-launch, haven't been back, didn't grab me. I may make it back to try....It is free, once ya own it...
I did not like the classes I played, and probably didn't help playing during the zerg rush of new people...The latest posts on it have not help make me want to go play it again though...As I like mmos with depth, not ADD, I can play for 10 to 30 minute systems.
I did like the news on EQN, maybe it will have some depth, but it is a long way off.
I would say a very stripped down MMO, more like MMO lite.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
I expected dynamic events to be truley dynamic like they claimed, with towns/settlements to be taken over and events I never seen before to keep popping up, but instead I see the same events getting repeated.
I expected good WvWvW, like DAoC, with one WvWvW zone like DAoC, but instead I see 3 copies of the same WvWvW map and 1 central map, all 4 are seperate from the others, and WvWvW is dominated by ranged. You have almost all ranged going at it back and forth, so if you prefer melee, you'll be slaughtered before you even get to the enemy lines.
So basically, the two features that got me interested in this game weren't any fun for me past a the newness phase, so I left. I won't call GW2 a bad game, just not the game I was expecting or the game for me.
Been this way in every MMORPG I have played since the first year of Daoc ...not sure what your trying to prove here
I'm not trying to prove anything, not sure what you're trying to prove here though.
He's showing how absurd it is to claim GW2 is not an MMO because it doesn't fit in the same mould as all the same cookie-cutter MMO's released since WoW came out.
If you want gear-based progression, gear-based PvP and Raiding you are more than welcome to play the dozens of games that provide that experience. GW2 set out to from the very beginning as something different for those tired of the same "MMO" mechanics of the past decade.
― Terry Pratchett, Making Money
Never said it wasn't an MMORPG, I said it was a bad one.
It doesn't have to be gear based this and that...but it needs to be rewarding progression, GW2 has no rewarding progression, very little character progression after level 30 and a very small amount of social/community building features considering it's an MMORPG, therefore to me, it is a bad MMO, but it's a fun game nonetheless.
The point was I haven't seen rewarding progression in any game ...and social/community building has been 0 for the last 10 years .In my case I run with a multi-gamming guild ,we have 75 or 80 likeminded folks playing all the games , I'm happy to meet anyone in a game but I don't go looking for anyone . After the years of 40 and 25 man raids I have no interest in meeting and dealing with the elite or the drama queens ...my time is for my enjoyment with folks that play and act like I do.
Honestly?
Approach GW2 as a standard 60$ Action/Adventure Console
game (Skyrim) w/online co-op ~ then you'll be pretty
satisfied with your purchase and how GW2 caters to
that mindset.
IE: Get in, play.. get out, walk away and wait for the
next batch of DLC (expansion).
However, if you approach GW2 as an MMO ~ odds are, you'll
be disappointed for several reasons.
Standardized Loot / Character Progression / Combat::
1. Everything is set up so, no one really ever feels powerful.
2. Lack of trinity means, you don't need anyone and are not needed by anyone.
The staples of an MMO are designed around creating a
community from the players and promoting them to work
together. ~ in this aspect, GW2 fails as an MMO.
Granted people can argue, saying that GW2 is amazing and
is better off without the Trinity and having to rely on
other players.
They then point to Dynamic events and how you "need"
other people to kill mobs like Balthazar, Dragons, ect..
But do you really? are the faceless masses anymore "personal"
than having a bunch of henchmen NPC to help you finish the event?
Think about it ~ we don't know the names of other people
at those events, because we're not there for them ~ we
don't need to talk, we don't need to socialize or even
organize ~ we only care about the "chance" at uber loot
(perhaps the precursor?) and to farm Karma/Gold.
Since those bosses are nothing more than HP sponges that
hit like trucks (no tactics) ~ people just sit back and
spam, leaving the few people that agro the mob to be
chased by him, while they take pot shots at it and if
someone gets low on HP they throw down their AOE heals.
Basically, GW2 tries to mimic the Trinity without creating
a "need" for people to do anything more than zerg the content.
This trivializes going back to old content while being
"leveled down" in that you see no point as you could
"experience" the same content at your own level and
at least get appropriate gear/loot.
Even the dungeons are designed this way with their
"Corpse run, waypoints".
In all senses of the word "community" ~ it seems that GW2 fails.
This includes the free 24 hour server transfers that shred
any hopes of a well built community as well at the ability
to join multiple guilds, and yet refuse to put in a multi-chat
for each of them, requiring you to "represent" one guild at a
time, in order to talk to other members of that guild.
The same goes for World Vs World ~ you cannot see enemy
players names.. and there are no scoreboards dedicated
to the very skilled or elite of the "leaders" ~ in fact,
if you wish to be a "leader" you need only spend 100 gold
on a tome to become a commander, there are no other prerequisites
or skill based requirements.
IE: No one knows who you are or why you're deserving to be
a "leader" ~ they only see an impersonal title.
When I talk to my friends of old, and why they use to play
MUD's, Asherons Call and Ultima Online ~ they always talk
about the "community" and how back then, those games WERE
Facebook. As in, a place for like minded people to gather,
socialize and enjoy the craft.
GW2 doesn't do that, and in my opinion is why WoW is still
"king" ~ despite their outdated graphics and kung fu panda
hijinks..
If you've ever heard someone shout "FOR THE HORDE!" ~ you
can see without a shadow of a doubt that the game inspires
and promotes a sense of community... for better or worse.
At the end of the day, can you really say that GW2 IS an
MMO anymore than League of Legends, Team Fortress 2 or
Playing Skyrim while talking to your friends on skype?
Guildwars 2 best mmo to date, you may not like it, john may not like it, but in the end the inovation and love Anet put into this mmo is unmatched.
Sorry you dint like it but we do.
Of course it is an mmorpg. I agree with the lady that said saying otherwise is somewhat obtuse.
It is a question of semantics. What is an mmorpg to YOU?
Therefore I wouldn't argue it isn't an mmorpg, because GW2 clearly fits the broad definition.
I would however say, that its a rubbish mmorpg, because it doesn't really tick any of the boxes which are important to me in terms of what makes a good mmo.
So I consider it a decent enough game.
But a poor mmorpg.
A-Frikking-Men!
This is why GW2 is the best MMO on the market, screw scripted encounters.
But of course the haters will say shit like "what did you gain" or "was there any phat loot". IMO only a narrow minded individual is in it for the loot. The fun and enjoyment of adventures like the one you described is why I play.
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
I love loot. I love rewards whether cosmetic or otherwise. What is with this generalisations? can't make a point without putting labels?