"Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever." - Noam Chomsky
He just said in the live stream that the game will be something you can play with people that are your friends or single. Doesn't sound like a true mmo, more of a single player with a multi player option from what I can gather. I would have preferred UO 2. Oh well, enough kickstarters out anyways. This isn't for me.
I'm 100% sure they'll meet and exceed their funding goals. $70k in the first 40 minutes. I'll follow the project but I'm still going to hold my money for now.
Single player game with multiplayer addon. No thanks, if i want to play a single player rpg i play Skyrim. Wasted. After the delusion of Darkfall, my hopes for a new pseudo-UO faded away again.
This actually looks like something I'd want to play... a lot. There's no way I'm donating to the kickstarter though. If he can piss away millions riding around in a rocket ship, he doesn't need my money. I work for a living. Never mind the fact that there's a good chance that this game will be another disaster.
This actually looks like something I'd want to play... a lot. There's no way I'm donating to the kickstarter though. If he can piss away millions riding around in a rocket ship, he doesn't need my money. I work for a living. Never mind the fact that there's a good chance that this game will be another disaster.
Fingers are crossed though.
he got a lot of suckers paying him money though. I wonder if that is going towards his next space trip.
Yep. Anyone who has grown up playing the Ultima series and regard it as one, if not the best series made, must be a sucker. Anyone who thinks his vision of this game sounds good, must be a sucker. Anyone who is not jealous of other peoples successes and are excited to see people accomplish a life long dream (ie going to space) must be a sucker.
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Wow only 150k to go. If I wanted anyone to do the next Ultima thing I'd rather have the man who handle it!
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Originally posted by Sephros Yep. Anyone who has grown up playing the Ultima series and regard it as one, if not the best series made, must be a sucker. Anyone who thinks his vision of this game sounds good, must be a sucker. Anyone who is not jealous of other peoples successes and are excited to see people accomplish a life long dream (ie going to space) must be a sucker.
Anyone who would pay money to someon who has a track record of creating a disaster in gaming, and place his own personal goals (yes, going to space) above work is a sucker.
So what he made the ultima series. I was a fan then. I have no confidence he will do it again.
Plus, if he is so good, convince some investors or use his own money. Letting other to risk your money is a sucker. If he has a good game, i will buy it after release, not before.
Care to elborate on this disasterous track record? Please I'm curious. I can not for the life of me come up with one game he had complete control of that was a disaster?
And everyone's personal goals should come before work should they not? Is not the idea of work to make money to obtain things in your personal life? Wow its backwards wednesday or something.
You say if he is so good convice some investors. So because these investors are people and not corporations we must be suckers. I like your logic.
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Care to elborate on this disasterous track record? Please I'm curious. I can not for the life of me come up with one game he had complete control of that was a disaster?
U8 is panned.
U9 is a disaster.
Tabula Rasa is a disaster.
He has done no good games after U7. That is like 20 years ago. Feel free to find excuses for him. A man who has no successful game for the past 20 years won't get my money .. and whoever gives it to him .. is a sucker in my eyes.
Care to elborate on this disasterous track record? Please I'm curious. I can not for the life of me come up with one game he had complete control of that was a disaster?
U8 is panned.
U9 is a disaster.
Tabula Rasa is a disaster.
He has done no good games after U7. That is like 20 years ago. Feel free to find excuses for him. A man who has no successful game for the past 20 years won't get my money .. and whoever gives it to him .. is a sucker in my eyes.
Tabula Rasa wasn't a bad game though. NC axed that because they didn't get along. TR was as good as most games out now. Ultima 9 wasn't a very good game, but then that's one out of how many? I think you're vastly overstating things.
Besides I thought you said you don't pay for your gaming. It's sort of out of line to call people suckers. I'm not one to support KS projects either, but I'm not passing judgements on others and derogatorily labeling them because I don't agree with them. You shouldn't either.
At least he has some concept material produced. The KS project worth more scrutiny is Mark Jacob's CU. That guy has contributed to some really poor design decisions, has no working proof of concept, and comes to these forums spouting a bunch of rhetoric pandering to angsty disgruntled gamers. If that's not a recipe for trouble down the road...
Tabula Rasa is a financial disaster. Whether it is "bad" or not, is up to personal preference. I bet even some people like Daikatakana. Let me put it this way .. has LB done any successful game in the past 20 years after U7 .. the answer is NO. (That is if you count UO as Ralph Koster's .. if you count that .. it would be 18 years).
The reason there aren't many failure is that he did not even try to produce games. A person with no experience in the past 10 years to produce a successful game is out of touch with current technology.
And i only don't pay for MMOs .. certainly i still have to pay for SP games. And if suckers sound too strong for you .. let me try this "people are being scammed by LB past glory". I will have no part in it.
In fact, i don't believe in KS at all. I will take a look at the games when they are released. I don't pay for concepts.
Care to elborate on this disasterous track record? Please I'm curious. I can not for the life of me come up with one game he had complete control of that was a disaster?
U8 is panned.
U9 is a disaster.
Tabula Rasa is a disaster.
He has done no good games after U7. That is like 20 years ago. Feel free to find excuses for him. A man who has no successful game for the past 20 years won't get my money .. and whoever gives it to him .. is a sucker in my eyes.
Tabula Rasa wasn't a bad game though. NC axed that because they didn't get along. TR was as good as most games out now. Ultima 9 wasn't a very good game, but then that's one out of how many? I think you're vastly overstating things.
Besides I thought you said you don't pay for your gaming. It's sort of out of line to call people suckers. I'm not one to support KS projects either, but I'm not passing judgements on others and derogatorily labeling them because I don't agree with them. You shouldn't either.
At least he has some concept material produced. The KS project worth more scrutiny is Mark Jacob's CU. That guy has contributed to some really poor design decisions, has no working proof of concept, and comes to these forums spouting a bunch of rhetoric pandering to angsty disgruntled gamers. If that's not a recipe for trouble down the road...
Tabula Rasa is a financial disaster. Whether it is "bad" or not, is up to personal preference. I bet even some people like Daikatakana. Let me put it this way .. has LB done any successful game in the past 20 years after U7 .. the answer is NO. (That is if you count UO as Ralph Koster's .. if you count that .. it would be 18 years).
The reason there aren't many failure is that he did not even try to produce games. A person with no experience in the past 10 years to produce a successful game is out of touch with current technology.
And i only don't pay for MMOs .. certainly i still have to pay for SP games. And if suckers sound too strong for you .. let me try this "people are being scammed by LB past glory". I will have no part in it.
In fact, i don't believe in KS at all. I will take a look at the games when they are released. I don't pay for concepts.
Well if we are going to use games he was not in complete control over to demonize him, then you have to use other games he wasn't in complete control as well.
Lineage - Huge success
Lineage II - Big success
City of Heroes - Successful for a long time
Raph Koster was indeed a very important part of UO's early successes, but thats it. He was a part, not his project. So by your standard CoH came out in 2004. Guess thats 9 years sinse a successful game, with TR in there. And lets be honest here. Most developers who have created a game in the last year are out of touch. [mod edit]
Whether the game is successful or not will be seen soon no doubt. There are currently 13,010 backers..[mod edit]
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I recall playing the original Ultima on my old... which was it, the Commodore 64 or the 8088? I forget... it was awhile ago. I may watch this simply for nostalgia's sake.
Well if we are going to use games he was not in complete control over to demonize him, then you have to use other games he wasn't in complete control as well.
Lineage - Huge success
Lineage II - Big success
City of Heroes - Successful for a long time
Raph Koster was indeed a very important part of UO's early successes, but thats it. He was a part, not his project. So by your standard CoH came out in 2004. Guess thats 9 years sense a successful game, with TR in there. And lets be honest here. Most developers who have created a game in the last year are out of touch. [mod edit]
Whether the game is successful or not will be seen soon no doubt. There are currently 13,010 backers.. [mod edit]
"complete control" .. well..if a guy cannot control games with HIS NAME on it .. it is his fault. Lineage, L2, CoH .. don't have LB's name plaster all over them, do they?
[mod edit] We will see if LB is swindling people one more time, or is he actually can produce a decent game. But i am not going to spend MY money to find out.
Originally posted by CalmOceans Tabula Rasa means he will never get funding again.
If that were true, then NCsoft would never have found another company foolish enough to have them as a publisher, especially after City of Heros/Villians... ^^ Both sides made major mistakes in terms of Tabula Rasa. I fault the high level suits at NCsoft for making it a political foootball (their antics eventually ended up costing them $32 million), and I also fault RG for his focus on going to space, rather than on his game.
Originally posted by Sephros Yep. Anyone who has grown up playing the Ultima series and regard it as one, if not the best series made, must be a sucker. Anyone who thinks his vision of this game sounds good, must be a sucker. Anyone who is not jealous of other peoples successes and are excited to see people accomplish a life long dream (ie going to space) must be a sucker.
Let me start by saying this: I grew up with the Ultima series. I started with Ultima 2 when I was in the third grade and played every installment -- even 9 -- through to its finish. I learned to build computers just to be able to play the latest installment. In high school, I filled six marble notepads with material for my Britannia-set D&D campaign. I can still read runescript without referencing a manual. I reflexively compare every CRPG I have ever played to this series. These games have had a profound effect on me in terms of my personal values and my love of fantasy. I even met my wife in UO.
I want Shroud of the Avatar to succeed. You have no idea how much I'm looking forward to playing it. But I'm still not shelling out a dime until I read a review. In part, it's because I question whether RG really needs my money. It's not jealousy -- I think he deserves his success. But I just don't believe that this game's future hangs on fan donations.
I've also grown increasingly uncomfortable with the whole concept of crowdfunding: we're asked to give money to a for-profit venture, for which we receive no ownership stake. It's not an investment, and it's not charity... it's buying a thing that does not exist -- a box full of promises and thin air. As a consumer, I just can't justify it to myself.
Lastly -- and this really hurts to say -- I'm not confident that RG can deliver. Yes, the failings of his more recent games are attributable to problems with NCSoft and EA. But even so, I haven't seen any evidence that he knows how to develop a modern game. I'll say it again: I want this game to succeed. I want it to make enough money to send RG to the moon and build ten castles. Most of all, I want to play it. But wanting something and believing it's possible are two different things. Right now, I have plenty of hope but not much belief -- and it'll take more than either to get me to buy an empty box.
Originally posted by Sephros Yep. Anyone who has grown up playing the Ultima series and regard it as one, if not the best series made, must be a sucker. Anyone who thinks his vision of this game sounds good, must be a sucker. Anyone who is not jealous of other peoples successes and are excited to see people accomplish a life long dream (ie going to space) must be a sucker.
Let me start by saying this: I grew up with the Ultima series. I started with Ultima 2 when I was in the third grade and played every installment -- even 9 -- through to its finish. I learned to build computers just to be able to play the latest installment. In high school, I filled six marble notepads with material for my Britannia-set D&D campaign. I can still read runescript without referencing a manual. I reflexively compare every CRPG I have ever played to this series. These games have had a profound effect on me in terms of my personal values and my love of fantasy. I even met my wife in UO.
I want Shroud of the Avatar to succeed. You have no idea how much I'm looking forward to playing it. But I'm still not shelling out a dime until I read a review. In part, it's because I question whether RG really needs my money. It's not jealousy -- I think he deserves his success. But I just don't believe that this game's future hangs on fan donations.
I've also grown increasingly uncomfortable with the whole concept of crowdfunding: we're asked to give money to a for-profit venture, for which we receive no ownership stake. It's not an investment, and it's not charity... it's buying a thing that does not exist -- a box full of promises and thin air. As a consumer, I just can't justify it to myself.
Lastly -- and this really hurts to say -- I'm not confident that RG can deliver. Yes, the failings of his more recent games are attributable to problems with NCSoft and EA. But even so, I haven't seen any evidence that he knows how to develop a modern game. I'll say it again: I want this game to succeed. I want it to make enough money to send RG to the moon and build ten castles. Most of all, I want to play it. But wanting something and believing it's possible are two different things. Right now, I have plenty of hope but not much belief -- and it'll take more than either to get me to buy an empty box.
Thankfully there's alot of gamers who feel the same way and are willing to spend a bit to prove it thus making the chance of success a little greater. My biggest reservation with it is the overland travel, I was really hoping for the kind of ingame travel that UO has. Either way, it looks promising that the funding will succeed and then it's up to him and his team to deliver the goods. Niche or not, I will give it a try.
Let me start by saying this: I grew up with the Ultima series. I started with Ultima 2 when I was in the third grade and played every installment -- even 9 -- through to its finish. I learned to build computers just to be able to play the latest installment. In high school, I filled six marble notepads with material for my Britannia-set D&D campaign. I can still read runescript without referencing a manual. I reflexively compare every CRPG I have ever played to this series. These games have had a profound effect on me in terms of my personal values and my love of fantasy. I even met my wife in UO.
Are you older than me? My first RPG is U3 but i think i was in high school then.
I want Shroud of the Avatar to succeed. You have no idea how much I'm looking forward to playing it. But I'm still not shelling out a dime until I read a review. In part, it's because I question whether RG really needs my money. It's not jealousy -- I think he deserves his success. But I just don't believe that this game's future hangs on fan donations.
At this point, i don't care if he succeed or not. Don't get me wrong, if he makes a good games, i will play. But a) I don't have high hopes, and b) i am not funding any of his endeavors.
I've also grown increasingly uncomfortable with the whole concept of crowdfunding: we're asked to give money to a for-profit venture, for which we receive no ownership stake. It's not an investment, and it's not charity... it's buying a thing that does not exist -- a box full of promises and thin air. As a consumer, I just can't justify it to myself.
100% agreed. I don't believe in KS at all. If someone else want to buy wishful thinking, it is their money. But i won't chip in a dime.
Lastly -- and this really hurts to say -- I'm not confident that RG can deliver. Yes, the failings of his more recent games are attributable to problems with NCSoft and EA. But even so, I haven't seen any evidence that he knows how to develop a modern game. I'll say it again: I want this game to succeed. I want it to make enough money to send RG to the moon and build ten castles. Most of all, I want to play it. But wanting something and believing it's possible are two different things. Right now, I have plenty of hope but not much belief -- and it'll take more than either to get me to buy an empty box.
Exactly. People are making excuse for him. If a game has his name on it, he better make sure it is successful. If not, take the name off, or do his magic and make it works. He is not a newbie by the time he worked with EA and NCSoft. He has no excuse.
Are you older than me? My first RPG is U3 but i think i was in high school then.
Assuming you bought U3 new, I'd guess you have about 5 years on me.
100% agreed. I don't believe in KS at all. If someone else want to buy wishful thinking, it is their money. But i won't chip in a dime.
KS would feel better to me if backers received some kind of stake in the project, even a small one. Hmmmm.... If only there was a way to do that... some kind of market where companies could sell tiny pieces of themselves to raise capital. The companies could use that money for big projects just like with Kickstarter and -- if they make a profit -- they could pay a share of that profit back to the people who gave them money. That'd be nuts!
Oh! And people coud exchange their shares between one other. So if I buy a share of a company and I decide I'd rather have a t-shirt or a taco, I could sell my share to someone else -- and they could pay me however much they think my share is worth, based on how well the company is doing!!
Okay, now I'm talking crazy. Sorry about that. I'll go back to ranting about video games now.
Thankfully there's alot of gamers who feel the same way and are willing to spend a bit to prove it thus making the chance of success a little greater.
It's not about proving anything. Brand loyalty is a bad foundation for identity. I donate to a lot of things that I believe in: autism research, public radio, war veterans, my local food bank. I'm a fan of Richard Garriot's past work, but that does not make him into a charity.
Capitalistic ventures are not philanthropic causes, no matter how much you or I want what they're (potentially) selling. Admittedly, the crowdfunding movement has made some worthy projects possible, but I'm very uncomfortable with giving away money to be used by others to build for-profit companies. If KS adpoted a microfinance model instead of its current donation-based model, I'd be all over it. As it is, the whole thing smells like consumer exploitation to me.
The crowdfunding movement is destined for scandal. You heard it here first.
Are you older than me? My first RPG is U3 but i think i was in high school then.
Assuming you bought U3 new, I'd guess you have about 5 years on me.
100% agreed. I don't believe in KS at all. If someone else want to buy wishful thinking, it is their money. But i won't chip in a dime.
KS would feel better to me if backers received some kind of stake in the project, even a small one. Hmmmm.... If only there was a way to do that... some kind of market where companies could sell tiny pieces of themselves to raise capital. The companies could use that money for big projects just like with Kickstarter and -- if they make a profit -- they could pay a share of that profit back to the people who gave them money. That'd be nuts!
Oh! And people coud exchange their shares between one other. So if I buy a share of a company and I decide I'd rather have a t-shirt or a taco, I could sell my share to someone else -- and they could pay me however much they think my share is worth, based on how well the company is doing!!
Okay, now I'm talking crazy. Sorry about that. I'll go back to ranting about video games now.
Exactly. KS is asking you to invest with NO share of the upside. No investor will take such a deal.
Note that whoever pays takes all the risk. If the business fail for whatever reason, they lose all the money they pay out.
This is a worse scam than Wall Street. At least if you invest in wall street, you get some of the upside, if it happens.
Are you older than me? My first RPG is U3 but i think i was in high school then.
Assuming you bought U3 new, I'd guess you have about 5 years on me.
100% agreed. I don't believe in KS at all. If someone else want to buy wishful thinking, it is their money. But i won't chip in a dime.
KS would feel better to me if backers received some kind of stake in the project, even a small one. Hmmmm.... If only there was a way to do that... some kind of market where companies could sell tiny pieces of themselves to raise capital. The companies could use that money for big projects just like with Kickstarter and -- if they make a profit -- they could pay a share of that profit back to the people who gave them money. That'd be nuts!
Oh! And people coud exchange their shares between one other. So if I buy a share of a company and I decide I'd rather have a t-shirt or a taco, I could sell my share to someone else -- and they could pay me however much they think my share is worth, based on how well the company is doing!!
Okay, now I'm talking crazy. Sorry about that. I'll go back to ranting about video games now.
Exactly. KS is asking you to invest with NO share of the upside. No investor will take such a deal.
Note that whoever pays takes all the risk. If the business fail for whatever reason, they lose all the money they pay out.
This is a worse scam than Wall Street. At least if you invest in wall street, you get some of the upside, if it happens.
You only get charged if the project reaches its goal.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Comments
Well. I am certainly interested. Just because it promises a lot of the old school features that modern games skip over.
Think I will jump on that limited 25 dollar one...
I'm interested but skeptical.
"Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever." - Noam Chomsky
I'm 100% sure they'll meet and exceed their funding goals. $70k in the first 40 minutes. I'll follow the project but I'm still going to hold my money for now.
Single player game with multiplayer addon. No thanks, if i want to play a single player rpg i play Skyrim.
Wasted. After the delusion of Darkfall, my hopes for a new pseudo-UO faded away again.
This actually looks like something I'd want to play... a lot. There's no way I'm donating to the kickstarter though. If he can piss away millions riding around in a rocket ship, he doesn't need my money. I work for a living. Never mind the fact that there's a good chance that this game will be another disaster.
Fingers are crossed though.
he got a lot of suckers paying him money though. I wonder if that is going towards his next space trip.
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Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Anyone who would pay money to someon who has a track record of creating a disaster in gaming, and place his own personal goals (yes, going to space) above work is a sucker.
So what he made the ultima series. I was a fan then. I have no confidence he will do it again.
Plus, if he is so good, convince some investors or use his own money. Letting other to risk your money is a sucker. If he has a good game, i will buy it after release, not before.
Are you a sucker?
Care to elborate on this disasterous track record? Please I'm curious. I can not for the life of me come up with one game he had complete control of that was a disaster?
And everyone's personal goals should come before work should they not? Is not the idea of work to make money to obtain things in your personal life? Wow its backwards wednesday or something.
You say if he is so good convice some investors. So because these investors are people and not corporations we must be suckers. I like your logic.
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U8 is panned.
U9 is a disaster.
Tabula Rasa is a disaster.
He has done no good games after U7. That is like 20 years ago. Feel free to find excuses for him. A man who has no successful game for the past 20 years won't get my money .. and whoever gives it to him .. is a sucker in my eyes.
Tabula Rasa is a financial disaster. Whether it is "bad" or not, is up to personal preference. I bet even some people like Daikatakana. Let me put it this way .. has LB done any successful game in the past 20 years after U7 .. the answer is NO. (That is if you count UO as Ralph Koster's .. if you count that .. it would be 18 years).
The reason there aren't many failure is that he did not even try to produce games. A person with no experience in the past 10 years to produce a successful game is out of touch with current technology.
And i only don't pay for MMOs .. certainly i still have to pay for SP games. And if suckers sound too strong for you .. let me try this "people are being scammed by LB past glory". I will have no part in it.
In fact, i don't believe in KS at all. I will take a look at the games when they are released. I don't pay for concepts.
Well if we are going to use games he was not in complete control over to demonize him, then you have to use other games he wasn't in complete control as well.
Lineage - Huge success
Lineage II - Big success
City of Heroes - Successful for a long time
Raph Koster was indeed a very important part of UO's early successes, but thats it. He was a part, not his project. So by your standard CoH came out in 2004. Guess thats 9 years sinse a successful game, with TR in there. And lets be honest here. Most developers who have created a game in the last year are out of touch. [mod edit]
Whether the game is successful or not will be seen soon no doubt. There are currently 13,010 backers..[mod edit]
Error: No Keyboard Detected!
Press F1 to continue......
Oderint, dum metuant.
"complete control" .. well..if a guy cannot control games with HIS NAME on it .. it is his fault. Lineage, L2, CoH .. don't have LB's name plaster all over them, do they?
[mod edit] We will see if LB is swindling people one more time, or is he actually can produce a decent game. But i am not going to spend MY money to find out.
If that were true, then NCsoft would never have found another company foolish enough to have them as a publisher, especially after City of Heros/Villians... ^^ Both sides made major mistakes in terms of Tabula Rasa. I fault the high level suits at NCsoft for making it a political foootball (their antics eventually ended up costing them $32 million), and I also fault RG for his focus on going to space, rather than on his game.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCsoft#Richard_Garriott_termination
I'm looking forward to seeing what he does with Shroud.
Let me start by saying this: I grew up with the Ultima series. I started with Ultima 2 when I was in the third grade and played every installment -- even 9 -- through to its finish. I learned to build computers just to be able to play the latest installment. In high school, I filled six marble notepads with material for my Britannia-set D&D campaign. I can still read runescript without referencing a manual. I reflexively compare every CRPG I have ever played to this series. These games have had a profound effect on me in terms of my personal values and my love of fantasy. I even met my wife in UO.
I want Shroud of the Avatar to succeed. You have no idea how much I'm looking forward to playing it. But I'm still not shelling out a dime until I read a review. In part, it's because I question whether RG really needs my money. It's not jealousy -- I think he deserves his success. But I just don't believe that this game's future hangs on fan donations.
I've also grown increasingly uncomfortable with the whole concept of crowdfunding: we're asked to give money to a for-profit venture, for which we receive no ownership stake. It's not an investment, and it's not charity... it's buying a thing that does not exist -- a box full of promises and thin air. As a consumer, I just can't justify it to myself.
Lastly -- and this really hurts to say -- I'm not confident that RG can deliver. Yes, the failings of his more recent games are attributable to problems with NCSoft and EA. But even so, I haven't seen any evidence that he knows how to develop a modern game. I'll say it again: I want this game to succeed. I want it to make enough money to send RG to the moon and build ten castles. Most of all, I want to play it. But wanting something and believing it's possible are two different things. Right now, I have plenty of hope but not much belief -- and it'll take more than either to get me to buy an empty box.
Thankfully there's alot of gamers who feel the same way and are willing to spend a bit to prove it thus making the chance of success a little greater. My biggest reservation with it is the overland travel, I was really hoping for the kind of ingame travel that UO has. Either way, it looks promising that the funding will succeed and then it's up to him and his team to deliver the goods. Niche or not, I will give it a try.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/portalarium/shroud-of-the-avatar-forsaken-virtues-0
Assuming you bought U3 new, I'd guess you have about 5 years on me.
KS would feel better to me if backers received some kind of stake in the project, even a small one. Hmmmm.... If only there was a way to do that... some kind of market where companies could sell tiny pieces of themselves to raise capital. The companies could use that money for big projects just like with Kickstarter and -- if they make a profit -- they could pay a share of that profit back to the people who gave them money. That'd be nuts!
Oh! And people coud exchange their shares between one other. So if I buy a share of a company and I decide I'd rather have a t-shirt or a taco, I could sell my share to someone else -- and they could pay me however much they think my share is worth, based on how well the company is doing!!
Okay, now I'm talking crazy. Sorry about that. I'll go back to ranting about video games now.
It's not about proving anything. Brand loyalty is a bad foundation for identity. I donate to a lot of things that I believe in: autism research, public radio, war veterans, my local food bank. I'm a fan of Richard Garriot's past work, but that does not make him into a charity.
Capitalistic ventures are not philanthropic causes, no matter how much you or I want what they're (potentially) selling. Admittedly, the crowdfunding movement has made some worthy projects possible, but I'm very uncomfortable with giving away money to be used by others to build for-profit companies. If KS adpoted a microfinance model instead of its current donation-based model, I'd be all over it. As it is, the whole thing smells like consumer exploitation to me.
The crowdfunding movement is destined for scandal. You heard it here first.
Exactly. KS is asking you to invest with NO share of the upside. No investor will take such a deal.
Note that whoever pays takes all the risk. If the business fail for whatever reason, they lose all the money they pay out.
This is a worse scam than Wall Street. At least if you invest in wall street, you get some of the upside, if it happens.
You only get charged if the project reaches its goal.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!