Think that's long? When DAOC was in it's prime (imo) Purge and other abilities had like 30 minute timers. I miss those days because it really forced you to think about when to use an ability as to not waste it. Now days in DAOC you can get it on a 5 min timer and pop it 2-3 times a fight.
Those are some intense timers. But certain abilities should have long timers. Much like the original timer for Lay on Hands for the Paladin ability in WoW. It had a 1 hour timer and replenished their entire health pool instantly. It really made you think before wasting/using it.
I would add that almost all spells (not just CC) should require casting. Instant spells lower the skill ceiling. Casted spells feel (and are) more powerful / meatier and require more skill to use effectively.
Prime example: DAoC PBAOE (casted, can be easily interrupted, takes skill and good timing to pull it off in PvP, extreme damage, super fun in both PvE and PvP, can obliterate zergs if used right) vs WoW mage PBAOE (instant with GCD, low damage, easy to use but not fun, worthless in PvP)
I was always a fan of the instant stat debuffs in DAOC, if used properly they were huge... Also if both groups used it extended fights longer and really made the fights more tactical.
Could always make those quick cast spells, instead of buff shears though. There are some things where instant spells can work, but limited for sure
FWIW, I'm not a huge fan of most crowd control abilities. Short term roots? Okay. Stuns that just interrupt a character's current action (such as a spell they are casting) are necessary and fun tactically, but shouldn't persist. Maybe some crowd debuffs and crowd buffing skills, but no mezzes or such.
Originally posted by sweetdigs FWIW, I'm not a huge fan of most crowd control abilities. Short term roots? Okay. Stuns that just interrupt a character's current action (such as a spell they are casting) are necessary and fun tactically, but shouldn't persist. Maybe some crowd debuffs and crowd buffing skills, but no mezzes or such.
I don't see anything wrong with not having persisting stuns. This forces players to communicate when using their mez so their teammates do not break it instantly or one second later. If this were the case, I would want all mez abilities (through talents if neccessary) to not break from any prior dot damage that is already rolling right up until the mez is cast. This increases the challenge and certainly makes things much more rewarding when you successfully coordinate and don't break anyone's CC.
Originally posted by Niix_Ozek I think they were low, 15-30 seconds I think depending on debuffs.
Well I have played other games with similar type abilities. I wouldn't be surprised if there were ways to debuff your enemy's stats in CU.
While we are on the subject, I'm curious how players feel about healing debuffs in CU. Do you want to have ways to lower your enemy's healing by debuffing them? If so, how long of a cool down should an ability like that have tacked on to it?
Me personally, I feel that having a class that can weaken your opponent's healing output is a good thing for the concept of roles alone. You would want at least 1 reason to bring a certain class and having a strong or at least more than negligible healing debuff to put on your enemy sounds like it fits in perfectly with this vision. How long of a cool down to place on an ability like this would depend on the length of the battles (and strength of the debuff) and how long they are intended to last. If the average 8v8 battle was say, 3 minutes, I would think the cool down should be right around 2 minutes on an ability like this and when used should last for around 15-30 seconds. Could reduce healing done by 10-25%. Using an ability like this at the proper moment in time could result in great reward.
I don't like healing debuffs that you can just spam and always have up on your opponent. In my opinion that dumbs down the gameplay and does not involve any type of decision making at all.
Originally posted by Niix_Ozek Meh rather not have those, healing is hard enough in an interuptable combat system.. You don't want all the healers having hernias
Well I certainly wouldn't be heart broken if we didn't have them. However, if the people developing this game run out of ideas for class role abilities that define a class and make it desired, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw this implemented.
But if the debuff only lasts 15s or so and has a 2 min or so cool down, I don't foresee this giving healers hernias. As long as abilities like this are class defining and not handed out to everyone of course.
Comments
Ozek - DAOC
Niix - Other games that sucked
Ozek - DAOC
Niix - Other games that sucked
+1 OP
I would add that almost all spells (not just CC) should require casting. Instant spells lower the skill ceiling. Casted spells feel (and are) more powerful / meatier and require more skill to use effectively.
Prime example: DAoC PBAOE (casted, can be easily interrupted, takes skill and good timing to pull it off in PvP, extreme damage, super fun in both PvE and PvP, can obliterate zergs if used right) vs WoW mage PBAOE (instant with GCD, low damage, easy to use but not fun, worthless in PvP)
I was always a fan of the instant stat debuffs in DAOC, if used properly they were huge... Also if both groups used it extended fights longer and really made the fights more tactical.
Could always make those quick cast spells, instead of buff shears though. There are some things where instant spells can work, but limited for sure
Ozek - DAOC
Niix - Other games that sucked
Ozek - DAOC
Niix - Other games that sucked
I don't see anything wrong with not having persisting stuns. This forces players to communicate when using their mez so their teammates do not break it instantly or one second later. If this were the case, I would want all mez abilities (through talents if neccessary) to not break from any prior dot damage that is already rolling right up until the mez is cast. This increases the challenge and certainly makes things much more rewarding when you successfully coordinate and don't break anyone's CC.
Well I have played other games with similar type abilities. I wouldn't be surprised if there were ways to debuff your enemy's stats in CU.
While we are on the subject, I'm curious how players feel about healing debuffs in CU. Do you want to have ways to lower your enemy's healing by debuffing them? If so, how long of a cool down should an ability like that have tacked on to it?
Me personally, I feel that having a class that can weaken your opponent's healing output is a good thing for the concept of roles alone. You would want at least 1 reason to bring a certain class and having a strong or at least more than negligible healing debuff to put on your enemy sounds like it fits in perfectly with this vision. How long of a cool down to place on an ability like this would depend on the length of the battles (and strength of the debuff) and how long they are intended to last. If the average 8v8 battle was say, 3 minutes, I would think the cool down should be right around 2 minutes on an ability like this and when used should last for around 15-30 seconds. Could reduce healing done by 10-25%. Using an ability like this at the proper moment in time could result in great reward.
I don't like healing debuffs that you can just spam and always have up on your opponent. In my opinion that dumbs down the gameplay and does not involve any type of decision making at all.
Thoughts, comments?
Ozek - DAOC
Niix - Other games that sucked
Well I certainly wouldn't be heart broken if we didn't have them. However, if the people developing this game run out of ideas for class role abilities that define a class and make it desired, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw this implemented.