Judging a game developper is just as hard as judging an actor or a film composer, you never know what comes from them or the person directing them.
What's pretty obvious is that the decision makers mostly suck, but those aren't always the developpers. Usually they're business majors who know nothing about gaming and even less about designing games.
Originally posted by Aeolyn Just wondering, how many of you have actually read the whole article this thread refers to? "I’m not saying that because I think I’m so brilliant. What I’m saying is, I think most game designers really just suck, and I think there’s a reason why.”
It's actually an interesting critique of the dynamics of a large company. His argument is basically that because it's harder to objectively measure good design skill over good coding skill, people who are good at a specialized technical role (art, coding, etc) are increasingly pidgeon-holed into those roles over their careers, leaving behind a pool of people for design that are basically the people who didn't fit anywhere else, whether or not they are actually good at it.
It's hard to make that sort of general argument about group dynamics without each individual designer feeling personally slapped across the face.
Originally posted by Aeolyn Just wondering, how many of you have actually read the whole article this thread refers to? "I’m not saying that because I think I’m so brilliant. What I’m saying is, I think most game designers really just suck, and I think there’s a reason why.”
It's actually an interesting critique of the dynamics of a large company. His argument is basically that because it's harder to objectively measure good design skill over good coding skill, people who are good at a specialized technical role (art, coding, etc) are increasingly pidgeon-holed into those roles over their careers, leaving behind a pool of people for design that are basically the people who didn't fit anywhere else, whether or not they are actually good at it.
It's hard to make that sort of general argument about group dynamics without each individual designer feeling personally slapped across the face.
There is a saying in my and other professions: "Those that do...do...those that cannot do....teach"
I think the same thing applies here. Those that program or do art...do...those that cannot do (as well)....game design.
Originally posted by Aeolyn Just wondering, how many of you have actually read the whole article this thread refers to? "I’m not saying that because I think I’m so brilliant. What I’m saying is, I think most game designers really just suck, and I think there’s a reason why.”
It's actually an interesting critique of the dynamics of a large company. His argument is basically that because it's harder to objectively measure good design skill over good coding skill, people who are good at a specialized technical role (art, coding, etc) are increasingly pidgeon-holed into those roles over their careers, leaving behind a pool of people for design that are basically the people who didn't fit anywhere else, whether or not they are actually good at it.
It's hard to make that sort of general argument about group dynamics without each individual designer feeling personally slapped across the face.
That's basically what I took from it too, as well as the reinforcement that creative types tend to be at least slightly self-absorbed and therefore not as empathetic as one would hope for.
Originally posted by Aeolyn Just wondering, how many of you have actually read the whole article this thread refers to? "I’m not saying that because I think I’m so brilliant. What I’m saying is, I think most game designers really just suck, and I think there’s a reason why.”
It's actually an interesting critique of the dynamics of a large company. His argument is basically that because it's harder to objectively measure good design skill over good coding skill, people who are good at a specialized technical role (art, coding, etc) are increasingly pidgeon-holed into those roles over their careers, leaving behind a pool of people for design that are basically the people who didn't fit anywhere else, whether or not they are actually good at it.
It's hard to make that sort of general argument about group dynamics without each individual designer feeling personally slapped across the face.
There is a saying in my and other professions: "Those that do...do...those that cannot do....teach"
I think the same thing applies here. Those that program or do art...do...those that cannot do (as well)....game design.
Or "those who cannot even design badmouth others and hope to get people to pay before even building a game".
Did you read on why Tabula Rasa failed and that Richard Garriot sued NCsoft for 28 million and won over his departure from Tabula Rasa?
I wouldn't want a publisher after that and do a kick starter instead.
If i won 28 million in a lawsuit i wouldnt be going to kickstarter to fund a game....
$28 million is nothing when it comes to making an MMO, the decent ones start somewhere around $100 million to develop.
Yeah I don't know why is everyone giving Tabula Rasa shit.
It is NOT a terrible game. The problem was not gameplay. It was actually more advertising and the fact that the publisher no longer wants to maintain it.
A lot of games dies this way. Even some decent ones (like Earth & Beyond)
Originally posted by BahamutKaiser Regardless of who he is... I kinda agree. I just choose not to ridicule without cause.
I will however make allowances for the difficulty of funding modern games, investor tampering, corporate money mongering and political problems as other serious obstacles to the improvement of games, its hard to say if its the designers fault, or just circumstances...
Being in the field, you are close, but designers fault most of the time NO, I'm a gamer and become a Game Designer because I disliked what I saw, but after working in the industry, you have all these brick walls in your way and big ones most not your fault, One Gamers need to stop buying games that dislike, this would stop one brick wall for designers, that way Investors wouldn't be so scared to try something new, which most investor see a new idea and say NOPE that won't work its never been done and run for it... This is a major issue in the industry , so its partly our fault as the Gamer.... They prolly don't even know it, but it is..
Investors will give money for one reason to make money if they see games like WOW, making money or a WOW clone and if you have idea like it and the work to show what you can do, they will go for it, ideas like Xsyon, DARKfall, Mortal online, are different type of game and not money makers , they could be, but lack experince and backing so that's why they never do as well as they could... Indies can do a great job because Software is being more affordable for indies which I think it's great and will open more doors, but sadly alot of people refuse to make MMORPG's as much, because you can make something better small scale and with little money, so why make an MMO???/? I love them more than the next guy they call me MR MMO, at school and work, because I played so many, plus I have worked on some, but would I work on them again, yes and No, people complain to much and always blame the DEVS, they have little to no say.... I wish for once all Gamers would get an education in Game Production so they could see what I mean, I did and I was the same as everyone else before I did so .....
The reason he is going to kickstarter is because innovation in the MMO market is dead projects tommorow's themepark games are gonna be influenced by indie projects that are succesful.
Because GW2 (no trinity, not heavily gearbased), TSW (modern setting, puzzle/mystery solving gameplay, skill wheel), and TERA (action oriented combat) are all standard games? people that think everything is still WoW clones are blind to whats going on around them. okay, TERA maybe be 'poor quality WoW with action combat", but the other two games are far, far from WoW clonish. And of course games like PS2, Defiance and EoN (if it releases0 that are crossgenre games.
There is plenty of innovation out there.
The real question is why is a millionaire who can spend 30 million to go to space asking for crowd funding?
yep GW2 is innovative and its why i play it, as far as the TSW goes pretty standard themepark, ya its a different setting that has not been done before but to me that is minor and has very little to do with actuall gameplay, how many games out there have we seen that are just WoW with a couple of tweaks...the majority of games in the industry you can't define a industry by a couple of titles. If you look at the console market there is way more innovation then the MMO industry , mostly because the games cost less , the creative people are not the problem its the financial side that has made so many clones out there.
hence why kickstarter is becoming so popular, becauase there are tons of gamers like myself who are sick of the same old themepark games with one or two minor tweaks. Yes we are starting to see 'some' inovation in the MMO industry but its very little and only because the last couple of big budget wow copies fell flat on their face, but for years it was the only thing being made and its still the majority. Besides when a game starts with a subscription model and quickly moves to F2P its because the game flopped.
So you think because a game does from Sub to F2P it flops??? Please for the love of god talk to people in the industry , you have no idea what your talking about,
PS: This is a hint, look how fast they turn it into F2P, you know why? Because they tool it for F2P because they know what the market is like before they make it Sub, some companys want to see if it will work, if it doesn't so what, Example LOTR, DDo.
The market now see's teh issue with F2P, and now using B2P, with Micro's, you will see more of this , the market seems F2P flaws, I know about this since I study it for a living... So please do a little research..
The amazing things about threads about Garriot is in variably like 50% of people are under the misguided apprehension that his main contribution was to MMORPGs.
No Garriot is one of the top 5 FOUNDERS of the CRPG as a genre this includes all MMORPGs and everygame you have played or seen with RPG attached to it that is not a pen and paper game.
Without Ultima 4 there would be no Fable1-3. Without Ultima Underworld 1&2 the action RPG genre would barely exist. I don't even need to mention Ultima Online even though it was the first major MMORPG and still has some of the deepest game design in the MMORPG genre. Every single MMORPG every made is so heavily influenced by the single player Ultima series that it pointless to even bother.
You think games like Everuquest had the depth they did because of Brad McQuaid? I mean yeah he did legwork on it, but many of those ideas got fleshed out in Ultima 4 and adopted by later CRPGs. Even games like Nethack were very much influenced by the sheer depth of Ultima 4 and the cascading consequences of actions.
Criticisze him all you like for not being a great business man (although don't bothering citing Tabula Rasa, that was complete clusterfuck absolutely no one could have made that work out well). But seriously people need to realize UO was the tip of the iceberg.
The amazing things about threads about Garriot is in variably like 50% of people are under the misguided apprehension that his main contribution was to MMORPGs.
No Garriot is one of the top 5 FOUNDERS of the CRPG as a genre this includes all MMORPGs and everygame you have played or seen with RPG attached to it that is not a pen and paper game.
Without Ultima 4 there would be no Fable1-3. Without Ultima Underworld 1&2 the action RPG genre would barely exist. I don't even need to mention Ultima Online even though it was the first major MMORPG and still has some of the deepest game design in the MMORPG genre. Every single MMORPG every made is so heavily influenced by the single player Ultima series that it pointless to even bother.
You think games like Everuquest had the depth they did because of Brad McQuaid? I mean yeah he did legwork on it, but many of those ideas got fleshed out in Ultima 4 and adopted by later CRPGs. Even games like Nethack were very much influenced by the sheer depth of Ultima 4 and the cascading consequences of actions.
Criticisze him all you like for not being a great business man (although don't bothering citing Tabula Rasa, that was complete clusterfuck absolutely no one could have made that work out well). But seriously people need to realize UO was the tip of the iceberg.
QFT.
Ultima 4 was the first computer rpg that has actual dynamic dialog in terms if how you ask an NPC question, instead if just choosing response.
Ultima 6 was the first computer rpg that allows you to manipulate and combine objects to make other objects in the game world.
Ultima Underworld was the first dungeon hack action rpg that actually lets you move like an fps Wolfenstein style.
Space Rogue was the first space sci-fi rpg that actually lets you walk around a space station AND control a space ship as well AND have quest for both.
Knights of Legend was the first RPG that has realistic combat elements (in terms of caculating equipment weight vs combat effectiveness, fatigue, reading enemy moves, etc.)
The list goes on and on.
Origin pioneered crpg more than any other gaming company in the field.
Ultima 4 was the first computer rpg that has actual dynamic dialog in terms if how you ask an NPC question, instead if just choosing response.
Ultima 6 was the first computer rpg that allows you to manipulate and combine objects to make other objects in the game world.
Ultima Underworld was the first dungeon hack action rpg that actually lets you move like an fps Wolfenstein style.
Space Rogue was the first space sci-fi rpg that actually lets you walk around a space station AND control a space ship as well AND have quest for both.
Knights of Legend was the first RPG that has realistic combat elements (in terms of caculating equipment weight vs combat effectiveness, fatigue, reading enemy moves, etc.)
The list goes on and on.
Origin pioneered crpg more than any other gaming company in the field.
Problem is, Garriott doesn't limit his statement to RPGs. He directs it at the industry as a whole. While I don't think many would argue the significance of Ultima to video games, Garriott is hardly the only major contributing factor towards gaming. To turn around and condemn everyone but Will Wright and the people who helped him design Ultima is extremely arrogant. Heck, most of the great games ever made did not come from those guys. They didn't make mario, or any of the early final fantasies, or zelda. He didn't make shadow of the collosus, or mega man. Heck Valve and Naughty Dog are two extremely impressive game studios, that have nothing to do with those guys. The author of the article throws him a life line by insinuating that he respects Bethesda, but it would've come across much better if he just came out and gave props where props are due.
If his point was to say that he thinks design schools are spitting out too many mediocre designers, then he really should've phrased his statement as such. I don't think many would actually disagree with that notion. But he didn't.
I say that for years. Most of us say at least similar things. So ALL HAIL TO LORD BRITISH for saying how it is, I say!
Some developers just need to put in a sack and beaten with a stick, and you'll hardly do injustice if you put any assortment of random game developers into it!
My fav is DANIEL I KNOW IT ALL BETTER ERICKSON.
Oh the hubris. Sometimes I wished the ground would open below them and swallow them whole, like in the Old Testament stories, just as an example to the next TEN GENERATIONS of Game Designers that THOU SHALT NOT SUCK AT GAME DESIGNING!
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
In my opinion, he is absolutely correct. But its seems no one is making a great game these days and only making a game were they can make a quick buck then move on to their next project.
Origin pioneered crpg more than any other gaming company in the field.
I like those games too but that happened way back in the past.
Kodak pioneered photography too. What happened to them lately? Roberta Williams pioneered graphics point & click adventure games. She didn't make a game for a long time.
So what if origin pioneered CRPG. It does not even exist today. And LB is just a part, and not all of it.
Origin pioneered crpg more than any other gaming company in the field.
I like those games too but that happened way back in the past.
Kodak pioneered photography too. What happened to them lately? Roberta Williams pioneered graphics point & click adventure games. She didn't make a game for a long time.
So what if origin pioneered CRPG. It does not even exist today. And LB is just a part, and not all of it.
As for it happening way in the past, so? I'd rather trust someone who basically founded the type of gameplay I enjoy, not to mention my all-time favourite online world, than those who mostly just follow someone else's path/work and then proclaim the resulting product as the "new" saviours of the gaming world.
It really is pretty much just that marketing and research that some of you keep trying to say is telling us mmorpgs as we've known them are dead. Of course if you want to sell something new you're going to want it to sound better than what came before... duh, but that doesn't mean it is.
As for it happening way in the past, so? I'd rather trust someone who basically founded the type of gameplay I enjoy, not to mention my all-time favourite online world, than those who mostly just follow someone else's path/work and then proclaim the resulting product as the "new" saviours of the gaming world.
So .. a has been who has not done anything worthwhile for more than 10 years is trusted enough to get your money on a promise? And that "fav online world" are already out-of-date, and are old ideas by now.
Feel free to support LB .. any celebrity always have some supporters. And if he did produce a game with your money, all the better. It may even be decent enough for me to buy. Better you risk your money on him than me.
As for it happening way in the past, so? I'd rather trust someone who basically founded the type of gameplay I enjoy, not to mention my all-time favourite online world, than those who mostly just follow someone else's path/work and then proclaim the resulting product as the "new" saviours of the gaming world.
So .. a has been who has not done anything worthwhile for more than 10 years is trusted enough to get your money on a promise? And that "fav online world" are already out-of-date, and are old ideas by now.
Feel free to support LB .. any celebrity always have some supporters. And if he did produce a game with your money, all the better. It may even be decent enough for me to buy. Better you risk your money on him than me.
Hmm a has been? Who's being pompous now? Aren't all pre-orders just a promise? As for you actually paying for a game, that alone is worth me investing in one to see(runs to see if the KS is still accepting "donations").
Hmm a has been? Who's being pompous now? Aren't all pre-orders just a promise? As for you actually paying for a game, that alone is worth me investing in one to see(runs to see if the KS is still accepting "donations").
has-been is defined by old sucess and no new success ... isn't that what he is. Tell me, what is his recent success. Anything?
Pre-orders is not just a promise because a) you can cancel it, and b) you don't have to pay a dime. There is no financial risk to pre-order.
No you are not paying for a game. You are paying for a possibility of a game. There is a huge difference. There is no guarantee. In fact, let me illustrate it. Pay me $10. I may be paying you back $11, or $9 or not at all. That is the deal you are making. .
Hmm a has been? Who's being pompous now? Aren't all pre-orders just a promise? As for you actually paying for a game, that alone is worth me investing in one to see(runs to see if the KS is still accepting "donations").
has-been is defined by old sucess and no new success ... isn't that what he is. Tell me, what is his recent success. Anything?
Pre-orders is not just a promise because a) you can cancel it, and b) you don't have to pay a dime. There is no financial risk to pre-order.
No you are not paying for a game. You are paying for a possibility of a game. There is a huge difference. There is no guarantee. In fact, let me illustrate it. Pay me $10. I may be paying you back $11, or $9 or not at all. That is the deal you are making. .
Haha, but the difference is that I don't trust you as much as I trust someone who has already given me what I wanted, albeit in the distant past. At least I know that that someone knows what I want, whereas you may or may not and from your post history, really don't care either way.
Re his recent success, well I suppose you could call pulling off the KS campaign in such short order pretty successful and it's not like he's doing it all alone, there are a few other well-knowns with their names and reps on the line too.
As for cancelling preorders, yea, if done in cash at the store will almost always be in the form of a credit, seldom do you get your cash back so unless you do it online and then cancel your form of payment it's the same as KS where until the end of the KS campaign you're supporting, you are able to cancel your pledge(KS is very upfront about the possibility that it may end up giving nothing but otoh, if all works out, you do get some reward that those who chose not to support it won't, ever.)
Comments
That is ... IF he actually makes a complete game first. We will see if that happens.
Judging a game developper is just as hard as judging an actor or a film composer, you never know what comes from them or the person directing them.
What's pretty obvious is that the decision makers mostly suck, but those aren't always the developpers. Usually they're business majors who know nothing about gaming and even less about designing games.
It's actually an interesting critique of the dynamics of a large company. His argument is basically that because it's harder to objectively measure good design skill over good coding skill, people who are good at a specialized technical role (art, coding, etc) are increasingly pidgeon-holed into those roles over their careers, leaving behind a pool of people for design that are basically the people who didn't fit anywhere else, whether or not they are actually good at it.
It's hard to make that sort of general argument about group dynamics without each individual designer feeling personally slapped across the face.
There is a saying in my and other professions: "Those that do...do...those that cannot do....teach"
I think the same thing applies here. Those that program or do art...do...those that cannot do (as well)....game design.
That's basically what I took from it too, as well as the reinforcement that creative types tend to be at least slightly self-absorbed and therefore not as empathetic as one would hope for.
Or "those who cannot even design badmouth others and hope to get people to pay before even building a game".
Yea, like none of the other games on the market, from Mario to WoW didn't have financial backing from somewhere....
$28 million is nothing when it comes to making an MMO, the decent ones start somewhere around $100 million to develop.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Yeah I don't know why is everyone giving Tabula Rasa shit.
It is NOT a terrible game. The problem was not gameplay. It was actually more advertising and the fact that the publisher no longer wants to maintain it.
A lot of games dies this way. Even some decent ones (like Earth & Beyond)
Being in the field, you are close, but designers fault most of the time NO, I'm a gamer and become a Game Designer because I disliked what I saw, but after working in the industry, you have all these brick walls in your way and big ones most not your fault, One Gamers need to stop buying games that dislike, this would stop one brick wall for designers, that way Investors wouldn't be so scared to try something new, which most investor see a new idea and say NOPE that won't work its never been done and run for it... This is a major issue in the industry , so its partly our fault as the Gamer.... They prolly don't even know it, but it is..
Investors will give money for one reason to make money if they see games like WOW, making money or a WOW clone and if you have idea like it and the work to show what you can do, they will go for it, ideas like Xsyon, DARKfall, Mortal online, are different type of game and not money makers , they could be, but lack experince and backing so that's why they never do as well as they could... Indies can do a great job because Software is being more affordable for indies which I think it's great and will open more doors, but sadly alot of people refuse to make MMORPG's as much, because you can make something better small scale and with little money, so why make an MMO???/? I love them more than the next guy they call me MR MMO, at school and work, because I played so many, plus I have worked on some, but would I work on them again, yes and No, people complain to much and always blame the DEVS, they have little to no say.... I wish for once all Gamers would get an education in Game Production so they could see what I mean, I did and I was the same as everyone else before I did so .....
So you think because a game does from Sub to F2P it flops??? Please for the love of god talk to people in the industry , you have no idea what your talking about,
PS: This is a hint, look how fast they turn it into F2P, you know why? Because they tool it for F2P because they know what the market is like before they make it Sub, some companys want to see if it will work, if it doesn't so what, Example LOTR, DDo.
The market now see's teh issue with F2P, and now using B2P, with Micro's, you will see more of this , the market seems F2P flaws, I know about this since I study it for a living... So please do a little research..
Last i heard mmos dont have offline mode, which this one is suposed to have, unless i missed some kind of memo.
The amazing things about threads about Garriot is in variably like 50% of people are under the misguided apprehension that his main contribution was to MMORPGs.
No Garriot is one of the top 5 FOUNDERS of the CRPG as a genre this includes all MMORPGs and everygame you have played or seen with RPG attached to it that is not a pen and paper game.
Without Ultima 4 there would be no Fable1-3. Without Ultima Underworld 1&2 the action RPG genre would barely exist. I don't even need to mention Ultima Online even though it was the first major MMORPG and still has some of the deepest game design in the MMORPG genre. Every single MMORPG every made is so heavily influenced by the single player Ultima series that it pointless to even bother.
You think games like Everuquest had the depth they did because of Brad McQuaid? I mean yeah he did legwork on it, but many of those ideas got fleshed out in Ultima 4 and adopted by later CRPGs. Even games like Nethack were very much influenced by the sheer depth of Ultima 4 and the cascading consequences of actions.
Criticisze him all you like for not being a great business man (although don't bothering citing Tabula Rasa, that was complete clusterfuck absolutely no one could have made that work out well). But seriously people need to realize UO was the tip of the iceberg.
QFT.
Ultima 4 was the first computer rpg that has actual dynamic dialog in terms if how you ask an NPC question, instead if just choosing response.
Ultima 6 was the first computer rpg that allows you to manipulate and combine objects to make other objects in the game world.
Ultima Underworld was the first dungeon hack action rpg that actually lets you move like an fps Wolfenstein style.
Space Rogue was the first space sci-fi rpg that actually lets you walk around a space station AND control a space ship as well AND have quest for both.
Knights of Legend was the first RPG that has realistic combat elements (in terms of caculating equipment weight vs combat effectiveness, fatigue, reading enemy moves, etc.)
The list goes on and on.
Origin pioneered crpg more than any other gaming company in the field.
Problem is, Garriott doesn't limit his statement to RPGs. He directs it at the industry as a whole. While I don't think many would argue the significance of Ultima to video games, Garriott is hardly the only major contributing factor towards gaming. To turn around and condemn everyone but Will Wright and the people who helped him design Ultima is extremely arrogant. Heck, most of the great games ever made did not come from those guys. They didn't make mario, or any of the early final fantasies, or zelda. He didn't make shadow of the collosus, or mega man. Heck Valve and Naughty Dog are two extremely impressive game studios, that have nothing to do with those guys. The author of the article throws him a life line by insinuating that he respects Bethesda, but it would've come across much better if he just came out and gave props where props are due.
If his point was to say that he thinks design schools are spitting out too many mediocre designers, then he really should've phrased his statement as such. I don't think many would actually disagree with that notion. But he didn't.
I say that for years. Most of us say at least similar things. So ALL HAIL TO LORD BRITISH for saying how it is, I say!
Some developers just need to put in a sack and beaten with a stick, and you'll hardly do injustice if you put any assortment of random game developers into it!
My fav is DANIEL I KNOW IT ALL BETTER ERICKSON.
Oh the hubris. Sometimes I wished the ground would open below them and swallow them whole, like in the Old Testament stories, just as an example to the next TEN GENERATIONS of Game Designers that THOU SHALT NOT SUCK AT GAME DESIGNING!
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Age of Conan supports offline leveling but admittadly thats not the same thing
http://massively.joystiq.com/2010/04/27/age-of-conan-unveals-offline-leveling/
Age of Wushu has an offline mechanic
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/loadNews/27030/Offline-Play-Revealed
EQ2 fan sites
I like those games too but that happened way back in the past.
Kodak pioneered photography too. What happened to them lately? Roberta Williams pioneered graphics point & click adventure games. She didn't make a game for a long time.
So what if origin pioneered CRPG. It does not even exist today. And LB is just a part, and not all of it.
http://www.nytimes.com/1997/10/20/business/the-ultimate-obsession-what-will-people-pay-to-enter-his-world.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
Worth a quick read, note the date.
As for it happening way in the past, so? I'd rather trust someone who basically founded the type of gameplay I enjoy, not to mention my all-time favourite online world, than those who mostly just follow someone else's path/work and then proclaim the resulting product as the "new" saviours of the gaming world.
It really is pretty much just that marketing and research that some of you keep trying to say is telling us mmorpgs as we've known them are dead. Of course if you want to sell something new you're going to want it to sound better than what came before... duh, but that doesn't mean it is.
So .. a has been who has not done anything worthwhile for more than 10 years is trusted enough to get your money on a promise? And that "fav online world" are already out-of-date, and are old ideas by now.
Feel free to support LB .. any celebrity always have some supporters. And if he did produce a game with your money, all the better. It may even be decent enough for me to buy. Better you risk your money on him than me.
Hmm a has been? Who's being pompous now? Aren't all pre-orders just a promise? As for you actually paying for a game, that alone is worth me investing in one to see(runs to see if the KS is still accepting "donations").
has-been is defined by old sucess and no new success ... isn't that what he is. Tell me, what is his recent success. Anything?
Pre-orders is not just a promise because a) you can cancel it, and b) you don't have to pay a dime. There is no financial risk to pre-order.
No you are not paying for a game. You are paying for a possibility of a game. There is a huge difference. There is no guarantee. In fact, let me illustrate it. Pay me $10. I may be paying you back $11, or $9 or not at all. That is the deal you are making. .
Haha, but the difference is that I don't trust you as much as I trust someone who has already given me what I wanted, albeit in the distant past. At least I know that that someone knows what I want, whereas you may or may not and from your post history, really don't care either way.
Re his recent success, well I suppose you could call pulling off the KS campaign in such short order pretty successful and it's not like he's doing it all alone, there are a few other well-knowns with their names and reps on the line too.
As for cancelling preorders, yea, if done in cash at the store will almost always be in the form of a credit, seldom do you get your cash back so unless you do it online and then cancel your form of payment it's the same as KS where until the end of the KS campaign you're supporting, you are able to cancel your pledge(KS is very upfront about the possibility that it may end up giving nothing but otoh, if all works out, you do get some reward that those who chose not to support it won't, ever.)