We are talking about FPS MMO's that don't suck. Stay on topic.
Who's this "We", kemosabi?
And what does your opinion of FE have to do with anything?
Try again, this time after you actually have a clue what the topic was.
To be fair, you did use FE as an example of an FPS MMO already inexistence, which was a horrid game. If you knew the genre, you'd have known that only DF1 has offered a decent MMOFPS, but both are indie games, one sucks, one didn't being the difference.
See, this is the BS. Someone points out FE and now that you claim FE sucks it can't be valid game to bring up. As everyone knows, tastes are different AND you can bring up the fail card on that basis for most games.
I haven't seen a valid explanation for what is innovative about this game.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Originally posted by Darkholme Not to mention Firefall, Global Agenda, Planetside 2, etc are all shooter MMOs... Plus there have been at least a few MMOs that are multiple platform games. Defiance is hardly innovative in those aspects.
Reading is important. OP is talking about innovation in terms of first MMo to be tied in with a TV series.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.' -Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid." -Luke McKinney
I haven't seen a valid explanation for what is innovative about this game.
The scope is what is innovative - PC, Playstation, Xbox + TV show . I can't say anything within the game is innovative particularly, but then I haven't seen any innovation in a game for a long time. Just the same old stuff repackaged in a different way.
We are talking about FPS MMO's that don't suck. Stay on topic.
Who's this "We", kemosabi?
And what does your opinion of FE have to do with anything?
Try again, this time after you actually have a clue what the topic was.
To be fair, you did use FE as an example of an FPS MMO already inexistence, which was a horrid game. If you knew the genre, you'd have known that only DF1 has offered a decent MMOFPS, but both are indie games, one sucks, one didn't being the difference.
See, this is the BS. Someone points out FE and now that you claim FE sucks it can't be valid game to bring up. As everyone knows, tastes are different AND you can bring up the fail card on that basis for most games.
I haven't seen a valid explanation for what is innovative about this game.
FE had tab target elements, that alone dismisses it.
So what is innovative is that it doesn't have tab targetting. Oh wait, this isn't the first game without it therefore not innovative. Since you failed to list anything else, your point is over.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Originally posted by waynejr2 So what is innovative is that it doesn't have tab targetting. Oh wait, this isn't the first game without it therefore not innovative. Since you failed to list anything else, your point is over.
Again the innovation is in scope not the game. I haven't seen innovation in a game in years, if anything some of the decisions that are being made seem to be turning the clock backwards. Defiance in itself is a pretty solid third person shooter with MMO elements. Has a reasonable open world feel and the start of some interesting lore. Which hopefully will be expanded by the TV series, DLC etc.
To my mind evolution of the MMO has taken a tiny step forward, not massive by any means. A baby step forward at a rather testing time. The new generation of consoles are around the corner I imagine the success of this undertaking will have a significant impact on their roadmap for the future. If this does well we can expect more projects like this in the future. If this fails dramatically MMO's will probably stay PC based.
Originally posted by waynejr2 So what is innovative is that it doesn't have tab targetting. Oh wait, this isn't the first game without it therefore not innovative. Since you failed to list anything else, your point is over.
It's the first AAA company to step away from tab-targetting in their MMO's from what i know of, which is like a ray of sunshine in a dull repeative genre, that has lazy developers repeating tab-target/instanced clones.
Hopefully if its successful, others will follow suit and were finally see the death of dull combat in MMO's.
At last the genre has taken a step forward - here we have an MMO releasing on all major gaming platforms and coinciding with a TV series release. The scope of what is trying to be achieved here is massive compared to what has been done recently.
I am playing the beta on Xbox and loving it, no major issues apart from a bit of lag during an Arkfall event. All things considered it's a top game. Of course PC players might feel short changed to the technology limitations of the current batch of consoles. And the game in itself is a typical MMO - but really its kudos to Trion and Syfy for the convergence of the technologies and media.
Next step should be an MMO with cross platform integration - but I doubt that will ever happen. Perhaps it's not a bad thing to keep console and PC players apart.
Well the only innovation about this game is that fact that somehow its tied into the TV.. not that we have seen how that works out yet.. Other than that its a pretty average MMO and nothing really new.
Well the only innovation about this game is that fact that somehow its tied into the TV.. not that we have seen how that works out yet.. Other than that its a pretty average MMO and nothing really new.
The innovation is with regards to the connection between the multimedia platforms. In essence its just expanding the options and adding broader appeal, especially with a console release. To all intents and purposes this is all launching around the same time. Which is a first and innovative.
Now that i think of it, Defiance is releasing at the doorstep of the Next Gen consoles. If the game is successful enough that Trion take it to the Next Gen consoles then i will buy it for next gen. Until then, ill just wait for that information to come out before buying anything.
I was going to get it on PC later on for the superior graphics but the PC version dont have great graphics either so why bother with the pc version if the full visual potential isnt there.
Now that i think of it, Defiance is releasing at the doorstep of the Next Gen consoles. If the game is successful enough that Trion take it to the Next Gen consoles then i will buy it for next gen. Until then, ill just wait for that information to come out before buying anything.
I was going to get it on PC later on for the superior graphics but the PC version dont have great graphics either so why bother with the pc version if the full visual potential isnt there.
I can't see them going next gen, just due to the development costs with regards to new consoles. I suppose it all depends on what sort of backwards compatibility the next consoles might have overall. But it wouldn't surprise me if there is none. If that's the case I doubt they would they launch Defiance on those boxes just considering the average graphics. Defiance 2 perhaps on next gen and PC. I think it depends how well Defiance does on the current batch of consoles and PC. This to me comes across a little like testing the water for future product development and direction. If this bombs on console I think console MMO's are dead.
Now that i think of it, Defiance is releasing at the doorstep of the Next Gen consoles. If the game is successful enough that Trion take it to the Next Gen consoles then i will buy it for next gen. Until then, ill just wait for that information to come out before buying anything.
I was going to get it on PC later on for the superior graphics but the PC version dont have great graphics either so why bother with the pc version if the full visual potential isnt there.
Heres part of the larger picture that i think the pc mmorpg'ers here miss 100%. This game is more of a cool thing for the consol players than it is for the PC gamers who are use to this type of game.
I think even if the PC version is destined for obscurity with a niche crowd, the PS3/Xbox side of the game are going to be very popular.
I know theres a trend with the PC gamer getting enraged when a PC game tries to do both, and i think its a silly reason to get worked up, even if the menu system seems to function better on a game pad...its a small thing.
I should point out the defiance official forums are quite the eye opener. Check out the PC and then the PS3 and Xbox forums. Its actually quite funny. When they announce servers going down, or there is some issue...you have the PC gamers up in arms, asking for refunds, all upset and worked up. Mosey over to the consol forums and you see reactions to the same stuff with a lot of thank you's for fixing the issue, or thanks for the heads up. Certainly not what the PC gamers make the consol crowd out to be. Its embarassing to be with the PC crowd some times...well most i guess.
Next step should be an MMO with cross platform integration - but I doubt that will ever happen. Perhaps it's not a bad thing to keep console and PC players apart.
This happened over a decade ago. Not only cross-platform, but cross region/dual language.
Originally posted by waynejr2 So what is innovative is that it doesn't have tab targetting. Oh wait, this isn't the first game without it therefore not innovative. Since you failed to list anything else, your point is over.
It's the first AAA company to step away from tab-targetting in their MMO's from what i know of, which is like a ray of sunshine in a dull repeative genre, that has lazy developers repeating tab-target/instanced clones.
Hopefully if its successful, others will follow suit and were finally see the death of dull combat in MMO's.
Its a shooter, so it uses shooter mechanics. this is hardly innovative, and has been around for at least a decade (not sure if Planetside was the first MMOFPS or not). Oh, and Planetside was a AAA devloper...
Originally posted by waynejr2 So what is innovative is that it doesn't have tab targetting. Oh wait, this isn't the first game without it therefore not innovative. Since you failed to list anything else, your point is over.
It's the first AAA company to step away from tab-targetting in their MMO's from what i know of, which is like a ray of sunshine in a dull repeative genre, that has lazy developers repeating tab-target/instanced clones.
Hopefully if its successful, others will follow suit and were finally see the death of dull combat in MMO's.
Its a shooter, so it uses shooter mechanics. this is hardly innovative, and has been around for at least a decade (not sure if Planetside was the first MMOFPS or not). Oh, and Planetside was a AAA devloper...
Good try, but PlanetSide has no PvE. It's basically BF3 with really, really big persistent maps.
Like I said, you could say the game somewhat resembles Tabula Rasa or FireFall, but it's different enough on its own to warrant the innovation nod.
Originally posted by Darkholme Not to mention Firefall, Global Agenda, Planetside 2, etc are all shooter MMOs... Plus there have been at least a few MMOs that are multiple platform games. Defiance is hardly innovative in those aspects.
Not in those aspects, I agree. But most certainly in other aspects. They have achieved something really great with Defiance.
If you take the time to understand the systems and mechanics, I think most will find a fun progression TPS. I've been in Alpha for months. It's certainly been through some sweeping changes and all for the better. My point is that they have worked real hard to 1) Make it work and 2) Make it fun. Personally, I think they've succeeded.
I get that some people just want to hate on it. Maybe because they didn't like Rift, I don't know (and don't care tbh).
Anyone looking for something different or looking for this style of game should certainly give it an honest go.
It's a fun game and I do love the tie in with the tv series. Movie/TV inspired games almost always suck, just cheap crap put out to make a little money for the parent i.p., but Defiance, the game, seems to be a very solid title all around.
Trion has been pulling back a bit from the MMORPG label and I can definitely see why after playing it for several hours so far this weekend. It's more an MMOAG, (Action Game), with a solid story and Quest (mission) driven content, than an RPG. I'd love to see a developer take a game like this and make it a full MMORPG, but given the time constraints dictated by the debut of the tv series and the need to keep pace with the show, this was really the only format that would make sense in this case.
Personally, I enjoy the combat. Some of the AI is great and I love the pacing/difficulty/design of most of the missions I've played. Arkfall Events are a lot more fun than Rift Events in Rift or Open World Boss Battles in Guild Wars 2. However, for me, the story is the main reason I'll be buying the game. I love the cut-scenes. IMO some of the best voice acting in any MMO, though I wish the lipsync and the ability of the face to emote were a lot better. (GW2 is the gold standard now for cut-scene lipsync/facial expressions, but the GW2 voice over work just is not nearly as good, in most cases, as in Defiant).
It's clearly a next gen MMOFPS/Action title with some RPG elements, so kudos as an innovator on those counts, but the game clearly falls too far short on a number of MMORPG counts to be considered an innovation for the MMORPG genre. There are things about the game that could and should inform future MMORPG design, but Defiance doesn't offer any where near a complete blueprint for a full on contemporary MMORPG.
You really didnt say that voice actiong was good.It was really bad,none of the chars werent even interesting.I played the game whole weekend,Experience was mediocre at best.if this game was f2p,i kinda see myself playing it.But at the full price,hell no.
Originally posted by Darkholme Not to mention Firefall, Global Agenda, Planetside 2, etc are all shooter MMOs... Plus there have been at least a few MMOs that are multiple platform games. Defiance is hardly innovative in those aspects.
Not in those aspects, I agree. But most certainly in other aspects. They have achieved something really great with Defiance.
If you take the time to understand the systems and mechanics, I think most will find a fun progression TPS. I've been in Alpha for months. It's certainly been through some sweeping changes and all for the better. My point is that they have worked real hard to 1) Make it work and 2) Make it fun. Personally, I think they've succeeded.
I get that some people just want to hate on it. Maybe because they didn't like Rift, I don't know (and don't care tbh).
Anyone looking for something different or looking for this style of game should certainly give it an honest go.
For people that want to "give it an honest go" they can for free with a trial or could have by now. But why throw down full price without trying it, and why not just wait a month or two for the price to crash? $60 + the $40 season pass is very steep for what amounts to a single player shooter in shared space.
Some advice for people that want to talk up this game, or any game for that matter
1. Avoid hyperbole. "FINALLY SOME INNOVATION" What, like GW2 trying a game without the trinity, TSW having a modern setting and mystery/puzzle based quests, or even SoE using motion capture software so you can control your characters facial expression. Just because it is innovation you dont like, doesnt mean there isnt innovation happeneing
2. Avoid nonsense points. Oh, first game for ps3, xbox and PC! big deal. PS3/PC was done 2 years ago with DCUO. Xbox/PC was done 10 years ago with FFXI. by mentioning something like this it makes your argument seem weak that you even have to mention it
3. Discuss the actual gameplay/systems within the game beyond its genre. We know its a shooter with MMO elements....some people may not know what those elements on them...expand on them. Id be curious about important things like group mechanics, dungeons, crafting, social activities, etc.
3. Discuss the actual gameplay/systems within the game beyond its genre. We know its a shooter with MMO elements....some people may not know what those elements on them...expand on them. Id be curious about important things like group mechanics, dungeons, crafting, social activities, etc.
They don't mention that stuff, because there really isn't any. Hell, on the PC version chat barely works.
I think it's great that the MMOTPS sub genre is ont he rise and hope they do well as variety is a good thing and all MMO gamers have had for the last decade is 99% MMORPGs.I tjhink the gnere needs to diversify to match it's singleplayer cousin in terms of breadth of experiences.
However I do not want Defiance's proposed success(It's a good game but as flawed as most MMO releases) to mean that the genre is again dominated by one type of game.
There is room for action MMORPGs,Traditional MMORPGs,MMOFPS,MMOTPS,MMORTS and more.There's room for sandbox and themeparks in all subgenres,for PvP or PvE focused games.
This conciet of peopel ont hese boards that there is only one way to make a good MMO and it's their way has always been baffling to me,as is any extremist attitude.
Originally posted by Darkholme Not to mention Firefall, Global Agenda, Planetside 2, etc are all shooter MMOs... Plus there have been at least a few MMOs that are multiple platform games. Defiance is hardly innovative in those aspects.
Not in those aspects, I agree. But most certainly in other aspects. They have achieved something really great with Defiance.
If you take the time to understand the systems and mechanics, I think most will find a fun progression TPS. I've been in Alpha for months. It's certainly been through some sweeping changes and all for the better. My point is that they have worked real hard to 1) Make it work and 2) Make it fun. Personally, I think they've succeeded.
I get that some people just want to hate on it. Maybe because they didn't like Rift, I don't know (and don't care tbh).
Anyone looking for something different or looking for this style of game should certainly give it an honest go.
For people that want to "give it an honest go" they can for free with a trial or could have by now. But why throw down full price without trying it, and why not just wait a month or two for the price to crash? $60 + the $40 season pass is very steep for what amounts to a single player shooter in shared space.
I didn't tell anyone to go pre-order the game. Whether you buy into it now, play around in a Beta or wait a couple of months, I was just simply stating my opinion on the game itself and encouraging others to give it a shot. I wasn't telling people to go pre-pay in order to get in-game novelties and such ~ So I am not sure why your reply was bent that way.
Comments
See, this is the BS. Someone points out FE and now that you claim FE sucks it can't be valid game to bring up. As everyone knows, tastes are different AND you can bring up the fail card on that basis for most games.
I haven't seen a valid explanation for what is innovative about this game.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Reading is important. OP is talking about innovation in terms of first MMo to be tied in with a TV series.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney
The scope is what is innovative - PC, Playstation, Xbox + TV show . I can't say anything within the game is innovative particularly, but then I haven't seen any innovation in a game for a long time. Just the same old stuff repackaged in a different way.
FE had tab target elements, that alone dismisses it.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Again the innovation is in scope not the game. I haven't seen innovation in a game in years, if anything some of the decisions that are being made seem to be turning the clock backwards. Defiance in itself is a pretty solid third person shooter with MMO elements. Has a reasonable open world feel and the start of some interesting lore. Which hopefully will be expanded by the TV series, DLC etc.
To my mind evolution of the MMO has taken a tiny step forward, not massive by any means. A baby step forward at a rather testing time. The new generation of consoles are around the corner I imagine the success of this undertaking will have a significant impact on their roadmap for the future. If this does well we can expect more projects like this in the future. If this fails dramatically MMO's will probably stay PC based.
It's the first AAA company to step away from tab-targetting in their MMO's from what i know of, which is like a ray of sunshine in a dull repeative genre, that has lazy developers repeating tab-target/instanced clones.
Hopefully if its successful, others will follow suit and were finally see the death of dull combat in MMO's.
Well the only innovation about this game is that fact that somehow its tied into the TV.. not that we have seen how that works out yet.. Other than that its a pretty average MMO and nothing really new.
The innovation is with regards to the connection between the multimedia platforms. In essence its just expanding the options and adding broader appeal, especially with a console release. To all intents and purposes this is all launching around the same time. Which is a first and innovative.
Now that i think of it, Defiance is releasing at the doorstep of the Next Gen consoles. If the game is successful enough that Trion take it to the Next Gen consoles then i will buy it for next gen. Until then, ill just wait for that information to come out before buying anything.
I was going to get it on PC later on for the superior graphics but the PC version dont have great graphics either so why bother with the pc version if the full visual potential isnt there.
I can't see them going next gen, just due to the development costs with regards to new consoles. I suppose it all depends on what sort of backwards compatibility the next consoles might have overall. But it wouldn't surprise me if there is none. If that's the case I doubt they would they launch Defiance on those boxes just considering the average graphics. Defiance 2 perhaps on next gen and PC. I think it depends how well Defiance does on the current batch of consoles and PC. This to me comes across a little like testing the water for future product development and direction. If this bombs on console I think console MMO's are dead.
Heres part of the larger picture that i think the pc mmorpg'ers here miss 100%. This game is more of a cool thing for the consol players than it is for the PC gamers who are use to this type of game.
I think even if the PC version is destined for obscurity with a niche crowd, the PS3/Xbox side of the game are going to be very popular.
I know theres a trend with the PC gamer getting enraged when a PC game tries to do both, and i think its a silly reason to get worked up, even if the menu system seems to function better on a game pad...its a small thing.
I should point out the defiance official forums are quite the eye opener. Check out the PC and then the PS3 and Xbox forums. Its actually quite funny. When they announce servers going down, or there is some issue...you have the PC gamers up in arms, asking for refunds, all upset and worked up. Mosey over to the consol forums and you see reactions to the same stuff with a lot of thank you's for fixing the issue, or thanks for the heads up. Certainly not what the PC gamers make the consol crowd out to be. Its embarassing to be with the PC crowd some times...well most i guess.
This happened over a decade ago. Not only cross-platform, but cross region/dual language.
Its a shooter, so it uses shooter mechanics. this is hardly innovative, and has been around for at least a decade (not sure if Planetside was the first MMOFPS or not). Oh, and Planetside was a AAA devloper...
If we call GW's 2 recycled dynamic events innovative, then we can afford the same courtesy for the first AAA PvE MMO shooter with a pararell TV show.
The only game I can think of that comes even close is Firefall, and they couldn't feel more different.
Good try, but PlanetSide has no PvE. It's basically BF3 with really, really big persistent maps.
Like I said, you could say the game somewhat resembles Tabula Rasa or FireFall, but it's different enough on its own to warrant the innovation nod.
Not in those aspects, I agree. But most certainly in other aspects. They have achieved something really great with Defiance.
If you take the time to understand the systems and mechanics, I think most will find a fun progression TPS. I've been in Alpha for months. It's certainly been through some sweeping changes and all for the better. My point is that they have worked real hard to 1) Make it work and 2) Make it fun. Personally, I think they've succeeded.
I get that some people just want to hate on it. Maybe because they didn't like Rift, I don't know (and don't care tbh).
Anyone looking for something different or looking for this style of game should certainly give it an honest go.
You really didnt say that voice actiong was good.It was really bad,none of the chars werent even interesting.I played the game whole weekend,Experience was mediocre at best.if this game was f2p,i kinda see myself playing it.But at the full price,hell no.
Not in those aspects, I agree. But most certainly in other aspects. They have achieved something really great with Defiance.
If you take the time to understand the systems and mechanics, I think most will find a fun progression TPS. I've been in Alpha for months. It's certainly been through some sweeping changes and all for the better. My point is that they have worked real hard to 1) Make it work and 2) Make it fun. Personally, I think they've succeeded.
I get that some people just want to hate on it. Maybe because they didn't like Rift, I don't know (and don't care tbh).
Anyone looking for something different or looking for this style of game should certainly give it an honest go.
For people that want to "give it an honest go" they can for free with a trial or could have by now. But why throw down full price without trying it, and why not just wait a month or two for the price to crash? $60 + the $40 season pass is very steep for what amounts to a single player shooter in shared space.Some advice for people that want to talk up this game, or any game for that matter
1. Avoid hyperbole. "FINALLY SOME INNOVATION" What, like GW2 trying a game without the trinity, TSW having a modern setting and mystery/puzzle based quests, or even SoE using motion capture software so you can control your characters facial expression. Just because it is innovation you dont like, doesnt mean there isnt innovation happeneing
2. Avoid nonsense points. Oh, first game for ps3, xbox and PC! big deal. PS3/PC was done 2 years ago with DCUO. Xbox/PC was done 10 years ago with FFXI. by mentioning something like this it makes your argument seem weak that you even have to mention it
3. Discuss the actual gameplay/systems within the game beyond its genre. We know its a shooter with MMO elements....some people may not know what those elements on them...expand on them. Id be curious about important things like group mechanics, dungeons, crafting, social activities, etc.
They don't mention that stuff, because there really isn't any. Hell, on the PC version chat barely works.i did not read all the replies but this was already accomplished 10 years ago with FFXI Online
players from PC, PS2, XBOX could all play together on the same server
doubt sharing servers will happen again
- primarily because Microsoft and SONY no longer have interest in cross platform sharing the same servers
EQ2 fan sites
I think it's great that the MMOTPS sub genre is ont he rise and hope they do well as variety is a good thing and all MMO gamers have had for the last decade is 99% MMORPGs.I tjhink the gnere needs to diversify to match it's singleplayer cousin in terms of breadth of experiences.
However I do not want Defiance's proposed success(It's a good game but as flawed as most MMO releases) to mean that the genre is again dominated by one type of game.
There is room for action MMORPGs,Traditional MMORPGs,MMOFPS,MMOTPS,MMORTS and more.There's room for sandbox and themeparks in all subgenres,for PvP or PvE focused games.
This conciet of peopel ont hese boards that there is only one way to make a good MMO and it's their way has always been baffling to me,as is any extremist attitude.
I didn't tell anyone to go pre-order the game. Whether you buy into it now, play around in a Beta or wait a couple of months, I was just simply stating my opinion on the game itself and encouraging others to give it a shot. I wasn't telling people to go pre-pay in order to get in-game novelties and such ~ So I am not sure why your reply was bent that way.