Developers can fix this, if they dare go against popular thinking.
In general, the idea that time invested equals success (seniority based promotion) is a tried and true measure of real life unions and other pension management organizations.
In online games, the same challenges, perceptions, and results exist.
ex. Players invest in the grind so they can get their pension (end game content) only to find out it wasn't worth it.
I'd argue it cant possibly be worth it... ever.
There are too many games, too many carrots.
I think Eve (a game I dislike but still respect) had a good idea with their time based skill requirement. No grind is required to get your reward. You just have to log in periodically.
I think once we get past this grind component and focus more on fun activity only, using external time constraints for progression, then we can get what most mmo players truly need, Social interaction + Concentrated Fun.
Developers can fix this, if they dare go against popular thinking.
In general, the idea that time invested equals success (seniority based promotion) is a tried and true measure of real life unions and other pension management organizations.
In online games, the same challenges, perceptions, and results exist.
ex. Players invest in the grind so they can get their pension (end game content) only to find out it wasn't worth it.
I'd argue it cant possibly be worth it... ever.
There are too many games, too many carrots.
I think Eve (a game I dislike but still respect) had a good idea with their time based skill requirement. No grind is required to get your reward. You just have to log in periodically.
I think once we get past this grind component and focus more on fun activity only, using external time constraints for progression, then we can get what most mmo players truly need, Social interaction + Concentrated Fun.
-WL
Sorry, no. Games are social because the players are social, not because the game forces it. If you force people to be social, does not make the game better.
It has to do with gamers, because they obsess more about my armor is better than you, will farm and grind the same mob incessantly for one drop. Your post above, the underlined part, is part of the problem. Unions are part of the past, just because you put the time in, does not make one better at playing a game than others. This is a fallacy that the gamer community wants to foster and is an anathema to playing games in general. This attitude comes from the gamers who will play 10 hrs a day non-stop.
Developers can fix this, if they dare go against popular thinking.
In general, the idea that time invested equals success (seniority based promotion) is a tried and true measure of real life unions and other pension management organizations.
In online games, the same challenges, perceptions, and results exist.
ex. Players invest in the grind so they can get their pension (end game content) only to find out it wasn't worth it.
I'd argue it cant possibly be worth it... ever.
There are too many games, too many carrots.
I think Eve (a game I dislike but still respect) had a good idea with their time based skill requirement. No grind is required to get your reward. You just have to log in periodically.
I think once we get past this grind component and focus more on fun activity only, using external time constraints for progression, then we can get what most mmo players truly need, Social interaction + Concentrated Fun.
-WL
Regarding the time = success. This is not a tried and true statement and is one of the biggest flaws, and gripes about unions.
Just because someone has been doing something a long time does not mean they are doing it right, efficiently or well. It should mean they know what they are doing, but there are many many many examples of that not being the case, and many many many examples of companies having to promote people and increase wages simply because they are there longer, not because they are any good.
Skill and efficiency (in whatever ways you measure that) should be the measures of success far more than longevity in both RL and Games. (thats why most companies these days have performance reviews).
In a game the person who is better because of skill, efficiency or better problem solving should be more successful than the guy who was there longer.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Just curious here; would expectation of originality (from a sequel) be terribly reasonable?
I was referring to game design and not the setting. If you followed FF14's development the original version was quite different than the current. Their new lead developer has mentioned on numerous occasions that they are going in the WOW direction. If SE is willing to take an established IP and throw it upside down, then I don't see any other large developer ever trying something different.
Recall, if you saw that article a few months back, that when Smedley pulled in his team and announced that EQ Next was going to redesign itself as a sandbox, people stood up and clapped and cheered. I think some of those devs are finally being let out of their cages. We can only hope this turns out well.
It has always been pitched as a heavily sandbox-focused MMO.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I wouldn't call them horrible, but I would agree that many people look back at those old games with rose-colored glasses. I still believe that if most of those games were to reskin & get re-released today, they wouldn't be successful. Even if they released under the same name.
I don't think people realize just how much the MMO climate has changed in the passed 10-15 years.
I would call them horrible games.
Camping 6 hours in L Guk is horribly non-fun compared to any modern MMO LFD dungeon runs, for me of course.
I am very glad that the MMO climate has changed. Otherwise, i won't be here, and won't be playing any MMOs at all.
Comments
Developers can fix this, if they dare go against popular thinking.
In general, the idea that time invested equals success (seniority based promotion) is a tried and true measure of real life unions and other pension management organizations.
In online games, the same challenges, perceptions, and results exist.
ex. Players invest in the grind so they can get their pension (end game content) only to find out it wasn't worth it.
I'd argue it cant possibly be worth it... ever.
There are too many games, too many carrots.
I think Eve (a game I dislike but still respect) had a good idea with their time based skill requirement. No grind is required to get your reward. You just have to log in periodically.
I think once we get past this grind component and focus more on fun activity only, using external time constraints for progression, then we can get what most mmo players truly need, Social interaction + Concentrated Fun.
-WL
Werewolf Online(R) - Lead Developer
Sorry, no. Games are social because the players are social, not because the game forces it. If you force people to be social, does not make the game better.
It has to do with gamers, because they obsess more about my armor is better than you, will farm and grind the same mob incessantly for one drop. Your post above, the underlined part, is part of the problem. Unions are part of the past, just because you put the time in, does not make one better at playing a game than others. This is a fallacy that the gamer community wants to foster and is an anathema to playing games in general. This attitude comes from the gamers who will play 10 hrs a day non-stop.
Regarding the time = success. This is not a tried and true statement and is one of the biggest flaws, and gripes about unions.
Just because someone has been doing something a long time does not mean they are doing it right, efficiently or well. It should mean they know what they are doing, but there are many many many examples of that not being the case, and many many many examples of companies having to promote people and increase wages simply because they are there longer, not because they are any good.
Skill and efficiency (in whatever ways you measure that) should be the measures of success far more than longevity in both RL and Games. (thats why most companies these days have performance reviews).
In a game the person who is better because of skill, efficiency or better problem solving should be more successful than the guy who was there longer.
There it is again, where is this coming from?
Anybody? Sample of the reasoning?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I was referring to game design and not the setting. If you followed FF14's development the original version was quite different than the current. Their new lead developer has mentioned on numerous occasions that they are going in the WOW direction. If SE is willing to take an established IP and throw it upside down, then I don't see any other large developer ever trying something different.
It has always been pitched as a heavily sandbox-focused MMO.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I would call them horrible games.
Camping 6 hours in L Guk is horribly non-fun compared to any modern MMO LFD dungeon runs, for me of course.
I am very glad that the MMO climate has changed. Otherwise, i won't be here, and won't be playing any MMOs at all.