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RIFT End Game
So after about 5 days levelling from 50- 60 I get to the end game ( again )
What's new I think ?
Well the first thing is my old gear from raiding is now crap at level 60 .
So I figured ok Ill just do some dungeons and gear up . But wait what ? I need 900str 300 toughness and 300 hit to enter expert dungeons .
So I find a vendor selling world gear which seems to be entry level to dungeons , But they cost currency and to get that currency you do daily quests ( once the carnage quests are farmed out ) .
So yep you guessed it I can't do dungeons until X amount of days doing daily quests .
I guess there is a weekly lock on raids too ? <sigh>
Comments
Yeah not sure how he missed that step.
Normal -> Expert -> Raids.
in 7 days you can just buy all the dungeon gear
Rift's end game has pretty much always been "meet requirement X and go raid or f*ck off", aka get entry gear+rep to run the mill to get more gear.
That is the heritage of Trion shamelessly copy+pasting about every concept WoW had to offer.
Oh, and in before "but you can do puzzles!! have you explored all of the map, collected all artefacts?" and "seems like MMOs aren't for you".
Rifts endgame is huge compared to most other MMOs on the market.
I'm really not sure this is true. People love raiding, and being in guilds that are raiding. Not everyone its true, but raiding isn't this dead game mechanic you make it to be. In fact when looking at a game like Rift its pretty safe to say Raiding is the reason it did so well, and in the end is suffering because its pacing and quality in SL just isn't there, I seen many raiding guilds die because of this in Rift, or maybe thats the other way around. Maybe I'm wrong?
I hope they do well with FTP as its obvious something happened internally that caused a lot of issues, and I had some great times Raiding in that game.
It isn't dead - but it has been proven to be an extreme minority of mmo players. Games die out because the majority get bored, run outa things to do and go play the newest thing on the block. Variety is key. Covering all playstyles to at least some degree is key.
I'm really not sure this is true. People love raiding, and being in guilds that are raiding. Not everyone its true, but raiding isn't this dead game mechanic you make it to be. In fact when looking at a game like Rift its pretty safe to say Raiding is the reason it did so well, and in the end is suffering because its pacing and quality in SL just isn't there, I seen many raiding guilds die because of this in Rift, or maybe thats the other way around. Maybe I'm wrong?
I hope they do well with FTP as its obvious something happened internally that caused a lot of issues, and I had some great times Raiding in that game.
It isn't dead - but it has been proven to be an extreme minority of mmo players. Games die out because the majority get bored, run outa things to do and go play the newest thing on the block. Variety is key. Covering all playstyles to at least some degree is key.
Proven where and by whom?I guess if you consider a majority of MMO players are probably transient than this is true. I am not sure that long term players of one game are sick of raiding. WoW and Rift are popular MMOs and they both have Raiding and a lot of people that Raid from what I understand. I think SWTOR has a large raiding pop.
--John Ruskin
I'm really not sure this is true. People love raiding, and being in guilds that are raiding. Not everyone its true, but raiding isn't this dead game mechanic you make it to be. In fact when looking at a game like Rift its pretty safe to say Raiding is the reason it did so well, and in the end is suffering because its pacing and quality in SL just isn't there, I seen many raiding guilds die because of this in Rift, or maybe thats the other way around. Maybe I'm wrong?
I hope they do well with FTP as its obvious something happened internally that caused a lot of issues, and I had some great times Raiding in that game.
It isn't dead - but it has been proven to be an extreme minority of mmo players. Games die out because the majority get bored, run outa things to do and go play the newest thing on the block. Variety is key. Covering all playstyles to at least some degree is key.
Proven where and by whom? I guess if you consider a majority of MMO players are probably transient than this is true. I am not sure that long term players of one game are sick of raiding. WoW and Rift are popular MMOs and they both have Raiding and a lot of people that Raid from what I understand. I think SWTOR has a large raiding pop.Rift didn't have a large enough raiding population to keep the game sub-locked. That tells me that the raiding community isn't big enough to sustain a subscription only game now.
People put up with raiding because they want to progress their characters. A lot of people like to run dungeons. A lot of people will raid because they have to or their characters stagnate. They don't raid because they want to. If they could get that progression outside of raiding they would.
Scripted raiding is one of the design scourges of the genre. It hogs the entire progression system. It limits what can be done with the entire rest of the game.
Is that so. I was unaware that you spoke for all MMO players. Anywho....I don't know if a game going FTP proves much of anything when a vast majority of the games out there are FTP.--John Ruskin
Weird when I think about what really turned me off of RIFT when I did. It was after I found out about all the macro'ing that you are able to do.
Once I messed around with that I found that it kind of takes away from the PVP side of things when I was into RIFT. Just made things really faceroll once you start to figure out proper macro'ing techniques.
Other than that I never really had any issues with RIFT that seriously turned me off of the game. I still think of coming back from time to time.
PM before you report at least or you could just block.
All this is saying is what you think about raiding, I for one love raiding, in fact I have the complete opposite idea of raiding in this genre, and feel like it hasn't been given enough design time.
Also you are incorrect about Rift as well like I stated previously. SL launched, huge buzz in the community with the majority there looking for the 2 raids announced, the most hardcore raced to defeat them, and encountered a lot of bugs, but in the end beat them pretty quickly and the sense of competition was not really looked after, balance was way messed up, some devs where fired it was so bad- rumored, and the pacing of the next raids given the quality and the challenge of the 2 SL 20mans had a bad effect on the confidence the raiding community had in Trion. FTP is announced after an already long drought of anything of substance but worse than that, the raiding community put the dots together that, if the 10 man and open world update in 2.3 was next, it would be 4-5mnths before the next 20man, and who knows what the quality would be, and even more guilds left.
IMO and I don't know all the facts Trion tried to expand with some new games, and both went pretty bad, creating a pretty bad financial situation for them, and all of a sudden the cash cow was suffering quality and pacing, leaving them to re-evaluate the payment structure for Rift.
I think they have an awesome game, and they can easily rebuild under the casual FTP umbrella, but competitive and challenging raiding in that game is all but dead.
People have this idea about raiding, that no one likes it, that its such a terrible headache grind, its wierd to me cause its the opposite I have seen being a part of a raiding guild in every game I play, I find people love raiding, and even the people who don't raid like to be in guilds with players who know their stuff and play well. So the groups striving to pull off endgame raiding facilitate some really vibrant casual communities.
Time will tell I guess.
It's easy to find peanut lovers at a peanut lover convention. But on a grand scale I raiding has driven away or reduced ethusiasm for most people I know. I cna think of 2 people in my rpg circles of hundreds who enjoy raiding and gear treadmills. Not to say you can't apease these guys, but put them in a small box that doesnt effect the rest of the game.
Yeh I see what your saying, and you are making an example yourself of the same thing, I try top just speak from what I know/have seen myself. I guess my point is, there wouldn't be a convention without the lovers. There is a lot of raiding guilds, especially in Rift, I haven't looked recently but the recruitment threads were almost always dominated by raiding guilds. People trying to get together in Rift were doing so almost exclusively to beat that content. And its worth it, I think its fun content, especially HM Gelidra. There are deffinately people still in Rift raiding, some which are still progressing on the first raid even.
And I can understand someone not being into raiding, or not having the time, or not wanting to put what time they have into doing that, but thats not really my point. I'm specifically talking about Rift and the truths within that contradict the idea that raiding is not good/terrible waste of design space and time.
For me, I like to get into a group of people with mostly the same goal, we hang and play together doing things that will in the end help us achieve that goal together, and when/if we achieve our goals we share that accomplishment as a team.
There is other ways than raiding to put this into a game, and make it as epic I'm not denying that, I look forward to developers doing new things, but I don't think anyone has put forth anything even close to as refined as scripted raid bosses, for this specific element.
Instance raiding that is
You can join zone events raiding with no gear on at all.
Hey, where are these zone events in wow that Trion copied from Blizz?
Stop spreading lies
Rift