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Already complaints of difficulty.
kabitoshin
Member UncommonPosts: 854
This makes me sick people just can't handle a small challenge these days. There's people complaining about the lvl 15 city story line quest and guarantee they aren't using consumables. This is not that hard of a quest I used 2 hi pots and 2 antidotes and completed it as a thaum. I hope SE just bypass those threads and pay no mind to them, if they make it easy I don't know if I'll want this game. I won't mind if they add difficulty scaling like with levequests that I can handle.
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an interesting tid-bit that i am sure a lot of new players are going to overlook....
at level 10, you can unlock other classes to level...then utilizing the armory system, you can combine several skills to make life easier. I.E. if you level a gladiator to 15 and find difficulty doing something, then unlock conjurer. Level conjurer enough to get Cure and maybe Protect. Then you can equip those skills on your gladiator and viola...you have a pseudo-paladin. Wanna take it further? unlock Pugilist and level high enough to get second wind...then you can have a cast heal and an instant heal as well as protect, lol.
This is not an attack on you OP, just an observation that people will cry about things and "difficulty" without thinking outside the box or utilizing mechanics built into a game...lol
Oh yea i thought that level 15 quest was hard, then i released i had my level 1 gear on still from an alt...
I didn't think any of it was particularity hard, the boss fights in afew of the dungeons id say were "intermediate" i wasn't expecting to see stuff like a boss fight that requires interaction with the terrain to kill or ones that require you do be in the correct position or you die, but prior MMO knowledge.
SKYeXile
TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.
Yeah that's the best part about classes is the ability to use other class skills. People have overlooked that classes are for mainly solo play.
Just got lucky and received a key 6hrs before beta went live.
legacy from the previous game.
This is why we cant have nice things..
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
not to mention they tend to overlook the concept of group play, these days, lol.
So is it really set up where Classes are really meant for solo play and Jobs are meant for Party play?
Like if I'm in the 30's and am tackling open world content in the 30's, let's say I've got Gladiator (Class) at 30 and Paladin (Job) at 30.
Better off solo using my Gladiator?
How are you then "supposed" to level up the party-centric Jobs?
FATE, dungeons, leve-quests in a party, etc.?
Or are they "OK" for solo questing too?
For the record - I love the idea of having to mix/match skills from leveling different classes/jobs to be more efficient and tackle more challenging content. I actually love the idea of "forced" grouping - as long as there are outlets for solo play as well.
I'm just unsure of the specific mechanics. Thanks!
it is sometimes easier to solo with the classes as you can mix and match more sklls.
lvling your jobs main class also lvls your job for ex: if your gladiator is lvl 30 you paladin is lvl 30.
also lvling as either pld or gld lvls both
I love how the story lines down levels you if you're too high. Makes them feel more epic when you finish them. Finished the level 17 limsa lominsa story duty and first time I failed because I didn't bring the one thing Yoshi just said in an interview to always have on you.
An antidote lol.
Wait, so to become a Paladin I think you have to have Gladiator 30 and Thaumaturge at 15 right?
Then once I unlock Paladin, it starts at 30? And then if I switch to Gladiator and level to 40 my Paladin Job will be 40?
What if I switch to Paladin and then level to 40, my Gladiator will be 40?
I'm confused. I know switching jobs/classes is based on equipped weapon - but if they use the same like Glad/Pal?
Does the Job replace the Class?
thats why im thinking of lvling alchemy. potions and such are gonna play a much larger role in this game
Yup having an antidote will greatly help.
yes you will be a lvl 30 pld when you unlock the job. think of it like this: your are essentially still a gld when you unlock pld you just become a more specialized gld. so whether your lvling as the base gld or the specialized gld your gaining gld lvls. you can always remove you job stone to become the base class.
The way jobs work you get a soul crystal after completing a job quest, and believe you level it from 30-50.
You equip the job stone that you get in a quest which unlocks the job, that switches you to the job. Class is dependent on weapon. Anyone with a sword is a gladiator, but if you do the Paladin quest at30 (and have 30 gla/15cnj) then you can play as PLD.
Personally I played jobs in both party/solo. Many jobs are harder to solo than classes, but I don't care once you go job you don't go back!
As for difficulty, people will complain both ways. The game is too hard, the leveling dungeons are too easy. Balance will continue, ultimately many people will still still struggle with certain content that others think is simple and "dumbed down".
Leveling dungeons are not meant to be a huge challenge. As long as everyone plays their role you are meant to maybe wipe to a boss or interesting mechanic if you have never encountered it before and can't adapt quickly. But overall these are meant to be done with a duty finder, with random pugs and are for EXP. Like EXP activities in all games (including XI and EQ1) if you are a veteran player it isn't really about a huge challenge unless you are "punching above your weight class".
They want people to LEARN how to play the game properly while leveling, that is the purpose of guildhest/leveling dungeons, because later on at endgame there will be some very tough fights where people can't always simply be carried.
So even if veterans find it on the easy side, it is in my opinion far and above what a lot of other modern MMO's offer in that at least it is meant to teach you proper MMO group play (and not just through the expectations of an "elitist" community like we did in XI/EQ/etc). People will always complain, always have complained since alpha on both sides of the difficulty scale, I trust in the director (Yoshida) to strike a balance that still achieves his goal of educating the masses how to stop sucking.
Edit: oh and to bring a little culture into it, Japanese culture is very hostile to "hand holding" over-explanations, and "easy mode". I remember at one of my first jobs where we were being trained to do business with Japanese people they told us not to do give information etc. that Japanese people could find out on their own as this is considered an insult (like "what do you think I'm stupid"). Of course this is just a general cultural thing, and if you read the JP forums you can find people there also complaining about certain things being too hard (so no need to stereotype, even though your typical JP pickup tends to be able to complete content 10x faster than your average NA/EU pickup and even most organized groups based on my experiences in both XI and XIV 1.0).
But in general being a Japanese MMO probably does somewhat mean we will always have challenge in content (if they want the game to succeed long term in Japan). Of course it is also is likely a part of why we got 1.x in the state it was because Tanaka thought everyone would just "deal with it", and Yoshida definitely doesn't want to exclude anyone he doesn't have to he has stated many times he wants content for both casuals and hardcore, and for even casuals to eventually experience all content (through the eventual ramping down of difficulty in outdated content through some means, and moving a lot of content to more accessible venues like FATE once it has been passed on by the more "hardcore" community).
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This confused me at first as well, but it's really quite straight-forward.
Gladiator is your base Class. Paladin is a specialization of that class, which SE refers to as a Job. A Paladin is still technically a Gladiator, just one "specialized" into a specific role, with unique skills, etc.
Say you were a Carpenter in real life. That would be your Class. However, though you're skilled as an all-around Carpenter, you've specialized in making furniture, using tools and techniques specific to that task.
Your Class would be 'Carpenter'. Your "Job" would be 'Furniture Maker'.
You don't cease being one to become the other.
So, bringing it back to FFXIV, as you level up Paladin, you're leveling Gladiator up along with it... because you still are a Gladiator.
I hope I did a good job explaining that lol. It's one of those things that's straight forward once you understand it, but can be confusing to explain.
The idea behind the Class and Job system is basically this:
Classes are intended more for solo or perhaps small group play. For this reason, they're given far more versatility, with the ability to equip and use skills from other Classes you've already leveled (ie. a Gladiator using 'Heal' from a Conjurer or 'Second Wind' from a Pugilist). This allows players to be better rounded and able to find a setup that best suits their individual playstyle.
Jobs are, again, specializations, and are more intended for traditional group roles. Jobs gain skills specific to the role they're intended for, typically quite definitive ones, at that. They also get access to job specific gear, in the spirit of the classic FF jobs.
Here's the full Dragoon armor set, for example, courtesy of my own character). Yes, shameless self-promotion. I regret nothing
. Dragoon is the Job specialization of the Lancer Class.
The trade-off is that, as your Job, you lose the ability to use skills from other Classes. You don't lose access to them all. Your pickings are just a lot more restricted.
Honestly, I did everything as DRG... solo and group. I'm sure it was more challenging for some fights, not having skills from other classes to rely on, but that's okay. I enjoy a challenge. It helps you learn what your character is really capable of... and it's fun!
Back on topic..
As for the complaints of difficulty... It's to be expected. There's laziness mixed in there as well. There were people asking where certain mobs are, and the game *tells* you where they are. All you have to do is open the Quest journal and click on "Map", or open the Hunter's Log (if it's for that) and mouse-over the creatures you're after. After that you just have to be able to use a map.
But yeah... some people are just that lazy. (warning: slight hyperbole incoming) If playing a MMO only required people to press a red "Win" button, there would still be complaints about how pushing the button requires too much effort and needs to be easier.