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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
I dislike this form of definition for a sandbox because all it is, is a complex description of a open world MMO with no content.
in my opinion this is less of a step forwards and more of a lazy design.
I don't understand why people think the term sandbox means that, the term sandbox hasn't even been around for more then a few years and it first really started getting used in applications to games that where about building or changing the world.
but no one is ever going to agree on this subject, which is why I ignore the term when it is applied to games cause even gaming companies cant seem to agree on a set term for what it means and several have started just slapping it on there cause they know it makes gamers rush for it in droves.
people are free to hold their own opinion but I would like people to stop calling others idiots or other such thing cause they don't agree with you, just because someone dose not agree with you dose not mean they are stupid, and stating what you think something means is not concrete proof, of what it is.
F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.
You chose Anarchy Online and Asheron's Call , but not Fallen Earth. This list is all bias. Asking for a sticky while you are not allowed to discuss first what a sandbox is and the OP simply decides what makes the list is laughable.
A sticky would be a list that most of the readers here on these forums would agree about.
All obvious sandbox MMORPGs have some things in common:
freedom - the player is given tools and a general nudge in the right the direction to start but can then basically do whatever they want
open world - limited instancing and walls
massive number of players possible in one logical space
role playing - a general lore or story which sets the background
competition of some form
If this is the criteria than Everquest 1 is a sandbox.
But I think ability for the players to alter the world is a defining sandbox feature.
Some of the stuff on here is not remotely sandbox defining, such as limited walls, number of people, roleplaying, and especially competition.
Yeah and Vanguard and Fallen Earth too. There are a lot of MMO's that fit those criteria. This is the problem with this thread. It always goes back to what people see as a sandbox. Ultima Online , WURM and SWG come closest as far as I've seen. Other's you could debate if they are even RPG's (MMO yes MMORPG no). Some even debate that having no quests means it is a sandbox. Lol.
I think there are only singleplayer/multiplayer sandboxes. Minecraft, Terraria, those kind of games.
I find it interesting that I have only heard of 5 of the games on that list, and played none of them. Having played EQ, EQ2, WoW, Rift, TSW, FFXI, LotRO, and SWTOR, either I'm stuck on a theme park rut, or your sandbox type titles have poor marketing, limited appeal, or mix of both. Not trying to throw spears, but is the niche like appeal of sandbox titles because of the gameplay, or the lack of a quality game meeting the criteria?
Originally posted by Lugors I find it interesting that I have only heard of 5 of the games on that list, and played none of them. Having played EQ, EQ2, WoW, Rift, TSW, FFXI, LotRO, and SWTOR, either I'm stuck on a theme park rut, or your sandbox type titles have poor marketing, limited appeal, or mix of both. Not trying to throw spears, but is the niche like appeal of sandbox titles because of the gameplay, or the lack of a quality game meeting the criteria?
It is rather simple. Up to now just only 3 AAA sandbox mmorpgs have been released, and all of them a long time ago. To name it its UO, SWG and EvE. And from that list EvE did not start as a AAA mmo. SWG was more or less converted into a more themeparkish game and shut down later. So there is indeed a lack of quality in sandbox mmorpgs in the recent years.
But with the sandbox revival thankfully through Minecraft we may soon see a lot more AAA sandbox mmos, and so the picture may change. Like games such as ArcheAge, Everquest Next, World of Darkness and more. But also a lot of indy sandbox games coming like Repopulation, Pathfinder Online and even more.
On the other side this list http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/349518 is most probably the better one. At least i would not consider Anarchy Online nor Asheron Call sandbox games.. they are classic open world games, but not really a lot of tools to change or influence the game world. (or to be exactly no tools at all)
You chose Anarchy Online and Asheron's Call , but not Fallen Earth. This list is all bias. Asking for a sticky while you are not allowed to discuss first what a sandbox is and the OP simply decides what makes the list is laughable.
A sticky would be a list that most of the readers here on these forums would agree about.
Which is why im modifying it based on consensus. I haven't played every game so Im ralying on yall to make a case that something should or shouldn't be on the list.
Originally posted by Lugors I find it interesting that I have only heard of 5 of the games on that list, and played none of them. Having played EQ, EQ2, WoW, Rift, TSW, FFXI, LotRO, and SWTOR, either I'm stuck on a theme park rut, or your sandbox type titles have poor marketing, limited appeal, or mix of both. Not trying to throw spears, but is the niche like appeal of sandbox titles because of the gameplay, or the lack of a quality game meeting the criteria?
They are typically niche games due to their difficulty. They aren't supposed to appeal to everyone like a themepark does. Its the difference between going to an actual themepark, or exploring some city youre new to.
Originally posted by Lugors I find it interesting that I have only heard of 5 of the games on that list, and played none of them. Having played EQ, EQ2, WoW, Rift, TSW, FFXI, LotRO, and SWTOR, either I'm stuck on a theme park rut, or your sandbox type titles have poor marketing, limited appeal, or mix of both. Not trying to throw spears, but is the niche like appeal of sandbox titles because of the gameplay, or the lack of a quality game meeting the criteria?
It is rather simple. Up to now just only 3 AAA sandbox mmorpgs have been released, and all of them a long time ago. To name it its UO, SWG and EvE. And from that list EvE did not start as a AAA mmo. SWG was more or less converted into a more themeparkish game and shut down later. So there is indeed a lack of quality in sandbox mmorpgs in the recent years.
But with the sandbox revival thankfully through Minecraft we may soon see a lot more AAA sandbox mmos, and so the picture may change. Like games such as ArcheAge, Everquest Next, World of Darkness and more. But also a lot of indy sandbox games coming like Repopulation, Pathfinder Online and even more.
On the other side this list http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/349518 is most probably the better one. At least i would not consider Anarchy Online nor Asheron Call sandbox games.. they are classic open world games, but not really a lot of tools to change or influence the game world. (or to be exactly no tools at all)
Again, Im listing sandbox MMORPGs, not just sandboxes. I do not require tools to modify the world. Just the freedom to make youre own entertainment within the general theme. In EVE you can not modify the base of the game, but you have a lot of freedom to place objects, open combat, loot, explore, change the politics of the game. Most of the games Ive listed have the same options.
You know, I think fallen earth is pretty neat, but I never got the sandbox vibe fully. Some of it was there though. The thing that turned me off was the cash shop. And to be quite honest, I don't even know how bad it is (ie; P2W, cosmetics, what? lol)
You know, I think fallen earth is pretty neat, but I never got the sandbox vibe fully. Some of it was there though. The thing that turned me off was the cash shop. And to be quite honest, I don't even know how bad it is (ie; P2W, cosmetics, what? lol)
Anarchy Online has a cash shop you know and in EVE you can even buy ingame currency My point is that it has nothing to do with the game being a sandbox.
As for Fallen Earth. Skillbased, no player classes, huge open world. No handholding. Very elaborate crafting system. It basically fits all the OP's requirement, but it is not on the list because the OP doesn't know it and a few said it shouldn't be on it because it has quests (which are not mandatory). You can just as well start lvling through pvp.
Originally posted by Darhamm No Fallen Earth? I am disappoint.
It has sandbox elements, but its not a Sandbox. Progression is on rails, pvp only in small controlled areas, etc. And I know it, because I played it at beta and for months afterword, and on an off since then. I quit it because it wasn't sandbox enough.
Originally posted by Darhamm No Fallen Earth? I am disappoint.
It has sandbox elements, but its not a Sandbox. Progression is on rails, pvp only in small controlled areas, etc. And I know it, because I played it at beta and for months afterword, and on an off since then. I quit it because it wasn't sandbox enough.
Most of the games in the OP are Open World MMO's and not necessarily Sandbox since most don't have free creation and destruction of world elements available.
"Regard your soldiers as your children, and they will follow you into the deepest valleys. Look on them as your own beloved sons, and they will stand by you even unto death!" - Sun Tzu, the Art of War
Originally posted by Darhamm No Fallen Earth? I am disappoint.
It has sandbox elements, but its not a Sandbox. Progression is on rails, pvp only in small controlled areas, etc. And I know it, because I played it at beta and for months afterword, and on an off since then. I quit it because it wasn't sandbox enough.
Most of the games in the OP are Open World MMO's and not necessarily Sandbox since most don't have free creation and destruction of world elements available.
That's a sandbox element, not what defines a sandbox mmorpg.
Again, Im listing sandbox MMORPGs, not just sandboxes. I do not require tools to modify the world. Just the freedom to make youre own entertainment within the general theme.
Then Guild Wars 2 is a sandbox, according to your requirements to be one. You can log in, do whatever you want and progress, even go back to low level areas and progress, "total freedom".
For instance (again...), both AO and AC1, two games I absolutely loved playing, are no sandboxes. Because if you pretend they are sandboxes, then as I said above, GW2 is a sandbox. Hell, we could even stretch it a bit and put WoW in the sandbox category by using that kind of references.
Your requirements are flawed, man. This is not a sandbox MMO list, this is a list of MMOs which mCalvert thinks (wishes?) are sandboxes.
Comments
If this is the criteria than Everquest 1 is a sandbox.
But I think ability for the players to alter the world is a defining sandbox feature.
Some of the stuff on here is not remotely sandbox defining, such as limited walls, number of people, roleplaying, and especially competition.
True, but we are talking about sandbox MMORPGs.
If you think it qualifies, I can add it. Ive never played it.
Its not. Your criteria allows for it though, which means you need to rethink your criteria. FFXI fits your criteria as well.
If FFXI meets the critera, then I can add it too. It seemed pretty much on rails though.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
I dislike this form of definition for a sandbox because all it is, is a complex description of a open world MMO with no content.
in my opinion this is less of a step forwards and more of a lazy design.
I don't understand why people think the term sandbox means that, the term sandbox hasn't even been around for more then a few years and it first really started getting used in applications to games that where about building or changing the world.
but no one is ever going to agree on this subject, which is why I ignore the term when it is applied to games cause even gaming companies cant seem to agree on a set term for what it means and several have started just slapping it on there cause they know it makes gamers rush for it in droves.
people are free to hold their own opinion but I would like people to stop calling others idiots or other such thing cause they don't agree with you, just because someone dose not agree with you dose not mean they are stupid, and stating what you think something means is not concrete proof, of what it is.
F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.
You chose Anarchy Online and Asheron's Call , but not Fallen Earth. This list is all bias. Asking for a sticky while you are not allowed to discuss first what a sandbox is and the OP simply decides what makes the list is laughable.
A sticky would be a list that most of the readers here on these forums would agree about.
Yeah and Vanguard and Fallen Earth too. There are a lot of MMO's that fit those criteria. This is the problem with this thread. It always goes back to what people see as a sandbox. Ultima Online , WURM and SWG come closest as far as I've seen. Other's you could debate if they are even RPG's (MMO yes MMORPG no). Some even debate that having no quests means it is a sandbox. Lol.
I think there are only singleplayer/multiplayer sandboxes. Minecraft, Terraria, those kind of games.
It is rather simple. Up to now just only 3 AAA sandbox mmorpgs have been released, and all of them a long time ago. To name it its UO, SWG and EvE. And from that list EvE did not start as a AAA mmo. SWG was more or less converted into a more themeparkish game and shut down later. So there is indeed a lack of quality in sandbox mmorpgs in the recent years.
But with the sandbox revival thankfully through Minecraft we may soon see a lot more AAA sandbox mmos, and so the picture may change. Like games such as ArcheAge, Everquest Next, World of Darkness and more. But also a lot of indy sandbox games coming like Repopulation, Pathfinder Online and even more.
On the other side this list http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/349518 is most probably the better one. At least i would not consider Anarchy Online nor Asheron Call sandbox games.. they are classic open world games, but not really a lot of tools to change or influence the game world. (or to be exactly no tools at all)
Which is why im modifying it based on consensus. I haven't played every game so Im ralying on yall to make a case that something should or shouldn't be on the list.
They are typically niche games due to their difficulty. They aren't supposed to appeal to everyone like a themepark does. Its the difference between going to an actual themepark, or exploring some city youre new to.
Again, Im listing sandbox MMORPGs, not just sandboxes. I do not require tools to modify the world. Just the freedom to make youre own entertainment within the general theme. In EVE you can not modify the base of the game, but you have a lot of freedom to place objects, open combat, loot, explore, change the politics of the game. Most of the games Ive listed have the same options.
You know, I think fallen earth is pretty neat, but I never got the sandbox vibe fully. Some of it was there though. The thing that turned me off was the cash shop. And to be quite honest, I don't even know how bad it is (ie; P2W, cosmetics, what? lol)
Anarchy Online has a cash shop you know and in EVE you can even buy ingame currency
My point is that it has nothing to do with the game being a sandbox.
As for Fallen Earth. Skillbased, no player classes, huge open world. No handholding. Very elaborate crafting system. It basically fits all the OP's requirement, but it is not on the list because the OP doesn't know it and a few said it shouldn't be on it because it has quests (which are not mandatory). You can just as well start lvling through pvp.
It has sandbox elements, but its not a Sandbox. Progression is on rails, pvp only in small controlled areas, etc. And I know it, because I played it at beta and for months afterword, and on an off since then. I quit it because it wasn't sandbox enough.
Most of the games in the OP are Open World MMO's and not necessarily Sandbox since most don't have free creation and destruction of world elements available.
"Regard your soldiers as your children, and they will follow you into the deepest valleys. Look on them as your own beloved sons, and they will stand by you even unto death!"
- Sun Tzu, the Art of War
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That's a sandbox element, not what defines a sandbox mmorpg.
As allways my question, where does sandbox stop and themepark start?
99% of all games are hybrids, vanguard for example feels pretty Sandbox, while UO also has some things from themeparks in it.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Then buzz off.