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Being an archer....
kaiser3282
Member UncommonPosts: 2,759
in this game sucks IMO. Not because of the class mechanics itself or anything, I actually quite enjoy it. But damn they really need to do something about the tiny leash (range a mob will travel before running back to its original spot and being invulnerable until it gets back there and resets to full health) on mobs in this game. Its extremely tiny, especially for a game coming out now.
I tend to play the archer / ranger type classes in nearly every game I play in large part for the ranged kiting capabilities they tend to have. In FFXIV, sure you can kite, but due to the ridiculously small leash (reminds me of something from bad F2P games 5+ years ago), "kiting" turns into running around in a small circle trying to stay out of range of a mob. It looks really ridiculous sometimes, but its needed because if you try to run 10 feet away the mob will reset itself. They dont really allow any room for mobility other than running in small circles until stuff dies.
On top of that, the game also seems to be lacking any sort of directional requirements, like you know, actually facing your target. You can just keep running in a circle, facing the complete opposite direction from your target, and still fire off every shot without having to worry about your facing. Again, reminding me of some older poorly designed games. What happened to standard things like having to be looking at least somewhat in the direction of your target to shoot an arrow at them?
Lastly... Is it just me or do mobs seem extremely slow & dumb? Like it takes them a good 2 seconds or so to react to changing directions? Not sure if it is intended or not, but it seems that when kiting mobs (or even when trying to get in positional attacks while soloing as a Pugilist) you tend to be able to go from being directly in front of a mob, circle around it to get behind, and then get in an attack or 2 and the mob is still facing (and often moving) in the original direction. Maybe this is just an issue with the lower tiers of mobs? Played up to 18 on my archer this weekend, so maybe it changes a bit later on, but up to this point they all seem half crippled with a touch of down's or something.
Comments
I fully agree, the extreme short leash mechanisme and the. Extreme slow return are a bad thing,
i still prefer extreme long lashes combined with mobs agroing all and everything on the way back, it should teach players to be aware of their surroundings.
I never understood why after EQ 1 all and everyone abandoned the unleashed mobs and trains incommin to zone exit. Frankly, i want it back.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
On that point in particular: That is somewhat decieving. Movement and positioning, both of yourself as well as mobs, has quite significant latency, meaning what is displayed on your screen isn't exactly what the server actually processes.
Using your example, while it looks on your screen like you're circling around and standing behind a mob for a whole second before it turns, what actually happens is that the server notices you rmovement about half a second later than when you actually start moving, the mob then starts turning, but you only see that another .5 sec later, so on your screen it looks like the mob turns a second late, while the server actually considers you both moving almost at the same time.
This latency is very noticable when you try to hit a mob that is passing you by with a melee skill. The client won't allow you to to trigger the skill until the mob is in range on your client, but when it is, it has actually passed you on the server, so the server then registers the attack as out of range. Another thing where you can see the latency is when moving out of AoE attack circles, quite often it will look on your screen as if you moved out in time, but the attack still hits you because the server actually registered the movement a bit later.
So it's not an AI problem, but a latency/sync problem.
I have to agree. I pretty much defeated the boss at Halitali (?) by myself when party died by running around and keeping poison on it. I wanted to die so we could restart but the party was cheering lol so I kept going. If the mob doesn't resist bind it's even easier.
This does need to be fixed, I abandoned my ARC for a THM and I am loving it. Right now I'm going to the beta forums to make sure this issue is known.
Well, its obvious that you prefer the easy way above the challenging way, nothing wrong with kiting being the domain of certain classes, and mages could have magic to root , snare things and who says that mages should not be allowed to move while casting? Thats really old, and surpassed by time.
But now a question? Did you ever play the true challenging mmos of old? Because if you never felt the excitement of running away for a train then you have no clue what i am talking about and should not bother to understand my opinion, as without ever having felt the thrill of danger....
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Agree with the OP for the most part, but purely out of a convenience factor. Kiting is still very possible as it is now, and once you figure out the general leash range you tend to be ok, until you're facing down several mobs.
As for the unlimited leash... not too sure about that one. Seems far too easy to open it up for player abuse, for example, pulling a bunch of aggro mobs into someone else's AoE and getting them killed.
Dying because of someone else mistake is excitement? And lets be real for a moment. The only kiting that was challenging would probably be EQ Bards, and that was only challenging until you understood it. Song twisting wasn't easy to pick up at first. Took time to master, but it pretty much made everything open field, easy mode. Argument could also be made that it was just a time-sink (at least with games that had exp loss on death like EQ).
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
Only open world mobs have a leash, it was taken off of dungeon and other instanced content. Not sure what they plan to do with FATEs though because they acknowledged it was a possible problem that players could grief others during FATE by dragging a mob outside it's leash range and reset it.
I didn't encounter this when I played.
I wish especially with a zoned world, that mobs would stick aggro like they used to but I realize that isn't a popular opinion and not likely to appear in any AAA MMORPG today.
I guess it doesn't really add much to the game to have aggro stick, but I have a lot of fun memories attached to that particular mechanic. I will say that even though (like in any MMORPG, at least that has raise) dungeon training to certain areas/bosses will still be possible if people really want to, having them remove the leashes from instanced content will greatly reduce this.
http://xivpads.com/?1595680
http://guildwork.com/users/murugan
I also heard they removed having to restock arrows... they just magically reappear outa thin air now I guss. Well with how magical ff games always are I guss it kinda makes since.....
But still kinda sux we can't craft arrows anymore
I miss the old days in FFXI, bring the Malboro all the back to Kahzam and then watching it walk back and destroy everyone in sight. The bogey in the dune was always a good one as well.
So were you not very well liked on whatever XI server you were on? I can still remember the name of many widely hated players who purposely trained zones while people were trying to level from my server.
Maybe I remember you!
http://xivpads.com/?1595680
http://guildwork.com/users/murugan
When you camped hnm pretty much all the time you got used to not being liked. I have no idea what server I was on I stopped playing before the Aht Urhgan patch came out. Still one of the best mmo if not the best mmo i'be played.
You don't even remember your server? I camped HNM a lot, like every day. I was in college and we monopolized the crap out of most of them as often as we could. I still managed to make friends, and didn't give up all hope of having a positive reputation as someone who didn't purposefully go out of their way to grief others for my own cheap amusement.
FFXI had a great community, but it had some bad apples no doubt. I think this game has a good community as well, but I'm sure those bad apples are still lurking >.>
Maybe it is a good thing you aren't given the tools to wreak havoc on the community anymore.
http://xivpads.com/?1595680
http://guildwork.com/users/murugan
Nope i don't remember that was like what ten years ago or something . I've I since got married and have a child. FFXIV will have a better community now you can play on an NA/EU server, I don't see much griefing going on in 2.0 is pretty much pamper mode.Anything of value will drop in an instance.
I think a lot of people you don't remember, from that server you can't remember the name of might be pretty happy you can no longer grief them endlessly while they try to level jobs in their new "pamper mode". I doubt most of them saw the humor you did in your griefing, but then again as you said you are used to not being liked because you "camped HNMs" (which seems irrelevant to me I hope people know we definitely weren't all like that usually just the frustrated under achieving ones with a sizeable chip on their shoulder).
The community will definitely be better off that's for sure.
http://xivpads.com/?1595680
http://guildwork.com/users/murugan
This will have to be the last last post we are off topic and you seem to be getting a little upset that i upset some random people nine or ten years ago on a computer game. Doctor Phil maybe able to help them but who knows.
It isn't off topic, it relates directly to leashing the topic of this thread, and players like you frankly are a huge reason why those of us who enjoyed having permanent aggro in open world zones no longer can have that in a AAA mmorpg.
I guess what upsets me is that as an XI player, and as someone who "camped HNM's" I get dragged through the mud with you by the people you harassed and those who heard stories of your behavior. Why can't you just behave yourself online? Why did players like you have to make us all look bad, because you know that is what led to the "inquisition" to remove all "old school" elements from MMORPG's.
Your antisocial behavior breeds antisocial norms in the overall MMORPG community and discourages people from playing together and wanting to experience game worlds alongside complete strangers. I just don't understand why people like you did what you did back then. The community wasn't forgiving of it, but it almost seems like you revel in their disapproval.
http://xivpads.com/?1595680
http://guildwork.com/users/murugan
^^ *huggles Epic1oots*
I also would love to see the range you can pull a mob before they rest much larger.
Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3
I have to agree the leash seemed a bit to small and in need of a size increase though not to inifinite of course. I did enjoy oldschool EQ and its no leash mechanic back in the day but in todays day and age I just don't see it working out as well as it used to. Trolls training people on purpose back in the day was typically a minor issue and not fairly common but with todays gaming community I can see it being a problem on a rather massive scale sad to say.
When I started my Archer I found myself going back to the good old jumpshot and circlestrafing until much to my amazement I discovered you dont need to actually be looking at your target to shoot at it, indeed you can look in the complete opposite direction as the op mentioned. While it made things easier sure it felt completely wrong and out of place and hope they do fix that in the future, Archer doesn't really need to be any easier than it already is anyways lol.
I hope they dont, as I will be pretty sure archer will be king in pvp because of it and I plan on exploiting that.
Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3
Seriously how hard is it to just run in a circle, the mob wont hit you. Learn to kite other than pressing the "s" key.
Any graphical, audio, or gameplay restrictions not seen in other mmos but found in FFXIV can be blamed on one thing.
PS3