Originally posted by Cephus404 It is a tool that allows me to interact with the game, no different than a car that I control in a racing game or a flipper that I control when I'm playing pinball. I do not extend any feelings or emotions toward that tool, it exists to facilitate my enjoyment of the game, nothing more.
+1
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
Originally posted by tkreep Just an heroic character I control no different from me controlling Solid Snake or Lara Croft
Exactly.
This is usually how I seem them too. I've been using the same names for my characters in all games, and I just sort of view it as different episodes or adventures or something. Sort of like how Matel does to Barbie and all her outfits.
"Middle Earth Adventures Raice"
"Star Wars Smuggler Raice"
"Warcraft Warlock Raice"
"Age of Barbarian Raice"
"Dovakin Raice"
It's all the same dude... just in different games and settings.
I suppose when I was younger and I was in my depressed years, I thought of them more as myself. But... I think the games lent themselves more to a traditional role-playing experience that isn't very prominent anymore.
Just a minion/hireling. I've played WAYYYYYY to many tabletop and computer RPG games over the decades to think of a game character as "me". I might have done in the very early days, but not any more.
I am still searching for a game where it can be A like it was id EQ and DAoC, but nowerdays these MMos make me end with a B.
So far i blame the games for not being immersive enough.
dude, give it up already and move on its like dragging along with your first date for years and years after broke up.
immersion from these old games? lots of empty landscapes to cover yea.
for the topic minion of fantasy / imaginary me in another dimension, something im not in this world. and thats how you should play fantasy and not with tight ass " this is really me who i am in real life aswell , look same mustache aswell " comon people...
I didn't vote because I do both. When I used to play City of Heroes, I RP'd a lot and my characters had backstories.
I don't really dig on the fantasy setting, so I tend to just "play" those games. I also find it hard to "get into character" when you have hardly any character customization.
I had never considered playing a female character and always found it just a little weird even though most fem characters are males. (Although any mercenaries I hire in EQ are of course hot fems.)
.....
Just remove "little" from above sentence and it is what I found. :-))
Have tried once or twice to create female alt just to see options ... but never played a sec. To much weird feeling would be.
When I was younger, I used to make characters that were my visual representation in the world. At the time, I was even trying to make them to my actual likeness.
I'm not sure about the timing, but at some point, I got detached from the characters and I'm now more of a benevolent spirit, influencing the characters in the world they play and watching their actions like one would watch a movie unfold. A movie you could influence, that is.
The transition also marked a complete change of avatar selection. From pure males to now pure females to any game, mmo or single player. I find myself empathising better to the plights of a female protagonist as opposed to a male one. Plus, they look a lot more appealing to the eye.
Having said all the above, I still have difficulty picking non humanoid races as my playable character.
Originally posted by tkreep Just an heroic character I control no different from me controlling Solid Snake or Lara Croft
Pretty much this.
I'll elaborate a bit:
I know i'm playing a game and nothing more. The avatar I control is just that..something I control. So, it might be an extension of my skill and knowledge of the game (or lack of..). But it never represents who I am in real life.
To delve slightly deeper into this conversation: when the very popular thread 'We don't want games, we want worlds' was floating around, I really disagreed with a lot of the users in that thread. I simple want games, not a second life.
I take playing an avatar of myself an additional step as I always, and have always, played a minimum of two characters, one who exhibits my idealistic nature and one who exhibits my realist nature in every game I play.
I once asked a guy why he played a female character and he told me it was because he'd rather stare at a female arse all day rather than a male one.
I can't roll like that. Cause if I'm looking at it for that reason then I have to deduce that others are also, and that makes me feel like I'm trying to live as a female, and no offense to those who choose that path, but that's not why I play.
I did roll up a really cool version of The Bride from Kill Bill for COH one time. Yellow Bruce Lee tracksuit and all. I enjoyed playing her, and for the exact reason that she was smoking hot to look at and the power set really suited her. It didn't last though. After staring at that thing for a couple of hours every time, I'd find myself logging off and harassing my real life woman for the goods :P
It's neither, but it's closer to the second thing.
For me, they are fictional characters. It's like writing a story or a screenplay and deciding what a character says and does. You are not that character, although i suppose all characters are an extension of the author in some way.
That's as far as in-character interaction goes. As far as out of character, i trust that when my female Ogre tells people about the hot blond girl i took to the movies, they understand that it wasn't an ACTUAL female ogre, that it was the human male behind the keyboard.
This is pretty much how I do things too. I make what you could call 'concept characters' which might have a certain persona or background story I quickly wrote in my head, or write as I'm playing.
It wouldn't be 'role-playing' if there wasn't something about who I really am animating the decisions the character makes, maybe an attitude I find myself in or some slice of my actual personality composes the character. But I certainly do not *identify* with my characters, and never have. The closest I've come is making a main character in a game that vaguely resembles me and whom acts as my full personality dictates - but that is still quite different from acting as though I *am* the character.
Since it seems like the issue of avatar gender is a concern of some people, like the OP, I'll address that too. I have zero problem with playing female characters - I can be completely comfortable doing so - and it's not because I completely disassociate myself from my character, thinking of them as merely polygons/sprites or for some stupid reason like "I'd rather look at a female behind" - which was invented by people who sought an easy excuse to get out of talking about identity issues with their virtual avatars...
The logic that "I self-designate as a male irl, therefore I must play as a 'male' character if I ever place myself in the position of my avatar while role-playing" seems to hinge on a grievous misunderstanding of gender...but I won't start a rant - the point is there is no reason to be apprehensive about playing an avatar of any 'gender'.
The logic that "I self-designate as a male irl, therefore I must play as a 'male' character if I ever place myself in the position of my avatar while role-playing" seems to hinge on a grievous misunderstanding of gender...
Not to jump on you dude, or derail, but you have to admit, a lot of MMO's are mostly populated by horny 20 somethings (paired up or not), horny teenagers (mostly non-paired), and outright dirty old men (paired but not digging it so much). Do you really expect to find a deep understanding of gender in those demographics?
A dude see's a female character and he wants there to be a female on the other side. That's why so many dudes rolled female characters in the beginning in order to bilk the unsuspecting out of their stuff, which they would give away freely at the mere idea that they were talking to an actual girl.
Trying to apply real-life understanding of gender to this environment then is a little reaching in my honest opinion.
The logic that "I self-designate as a male irl, therefore I must play as a 'male' character if I ever place myself in the position of my avatar while role-playing" seems to hinge on a grievous misunderstanding of gender...
Not to jump on you dude, or derail, but you have to admit, a lot of MMO's are mostly populated by horny 20 somethings (paired up or not), horny teenagers (mostly non-paired), and outright dirty old men (paired but not digging it so much). Do you really expect to find a deep understanding of gender in those demographics?
No, I don't expect to find it among such groups, but I see that way of thinking in this very thread and when confronted with it, I see no reason not to respond, as long as I am going to post at all. The OP himself seems unsure of how to think about such things, and I took it upon myself to encourage that certain misunderstandings that lead to such anxieties be dispelled.
Trying to apply real-life understanding of gender to this environment then is a little reaching in my honest opinion.
I'm not sure what you mean by this. I was only ever responding to how people think of gender 'in real life' - like some posters on this thread admit to doing. Whether people take advantage of the naivete of others in game environments was not my concern.
That role is not me (no 'extension of you'), in fact it is often as different from me as I can comfortably imagine.
'Minion that I control' is also inaccurate, since each one (ideally) develops an individual 'personality' and reacts individually (again, hopefully very differently than I would).
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I see it pretty much like a character in a story I'm writing.
If I can write a story with a female protagonist, I can play a female character in an MMO.
Or dancing naked on a table to mess with nerd's sexuality? You bet.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
when it comes to MMORPGs i like to consider the character as an extension of myself and when it comes to games that force me to play as someone else (Lara Croft, Joel,) and such frankly i dont pay attention or dont care (about the character) since i cant have a choice in the story line im forced through good example, the rewarded game called "the walking dead" i hated the MC (Lee) the freedom of choice was just an illusion i would've dissed that kid from the get go. also there was other choices i couldnt make or wasnt allowed to. well i understand that there had to be a limit somewhere to make the game work.
btw i called after the first 20 minutes of gameplay that the kid will get me killed and oh boy was i right or what?
oops little of topic there...
and players who say "im going to spend hours on gameplay so i would rather stare at female ass" or something along those lines are just hyper sensitive about being branded with a tag of "Homo" "Gay" "gayish" or something along those lines (mostly in their minds) (or just perverts or fetishists for pixel girls) well its not my business and dont care, do what you want
No NO this is turning into a rant ......have to stop...... before the demon takes over.....Ö_Ö..........( *_* ) ....
as an extension i mean "I do this" "I go do that" whats so nerdy about that? rather than "lets walk her there" "he needs a healer" "lets take her clothes off". projecting your behaviour and personality to the character rather than role playing as some one else or controlling a minion
I play games to escape my life for a little while so my avatars tend to be as far from being me as the game will allow. When I want to be me I go out and do something in the real world.
I have a life outside of games. My avatars are in no way an extension of myself. I don't play games to meet social needs, because life already supplies me with far more social activity than my needs require. My characters in-game are just minions that I like to play with. That's why female chars rock! What straight guy likes to look at a male 3d character model while they are playing games? Lol. The only game where my avatar was more of an extension of myself than a minion was EVE, because my ships were my minions. And you hardly ever see your avatar in EVE.
Originally posted by Scot Avatars are an extension of you, so I do not play babes, but I do play Dwarves, Bhami, Elves and the like. Not sure what that says about any of us?
Funny idea, never thougt about. Would never play female char as I'm male ... but on the other side have no problems playing any race and color ... as long as it is male. Lol.
Comments
+1
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
This is usually how I seem them too. I've been using the same names for my characters in all games, and I just sort of view it as different episodes or adventures or something. Sort of like how Matel does to Barbie and all her outfits.
"Middle Earth Adventures Raice"
"Star Wars Smuggler Raice"
"Warcraft Warlock Raice"
"Age of Barbarian Raice"
"Dovakin Raice"
It's all the same dude... just in different games and settings.
I suppose when I was younger and I was in my depressed years, I thought of them more as myself. But... I think the games lent themselves more to a traditional role-playing experience that isn't very prominent anymore.
I am still searching for a game where it can be A like it was id EQ and DAoC, but nowerdays these MMos make me end with a B.
So far i blame the games for not being immersive enough.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
dude, give it up already and move on its like dragging along with your first date for years and years after broke up.
immersion from these old games? lots of empty landscapes to cover yea.
for the topic minion of fantasy / imaginary me in another dimension, something im not in this world. and thats how you should play fantasy and not with tight ass " this is really me who i am in real life aswell , look same mustache aswell " comon people...
I didn't vote because I do both. When I used to play City of Heroes, I RP'd a lot and my characters had backstories.
I don't really dig on the fantasy setting, so I tend to just "play" those games. I also find it hard to "get into character" when you have hardly any character customization.
Just remove "little" from above sentence and it is what I found. :-))
Have tried once or twice to create female alt just to see options ... but never played a sec. To much weird feeling would be.
When I was younger, I used to make characters that were my visual representation in the world. At the time, I was even trying to make them to my actual likeness.
I'm not sure about the timing, but at some point, I got detached from the characters and I'm now more of a benevolent spirit, influencing the characters in the world they play and watching their actions like one would watch a movie unfold. A movie you could influence, that is.
The transition also marked a complete change of avatar selection. From pure males to now pure females to any game, mmo or single player. I find myself empathising better to the plights of a female protagonist as opposed to a male one. Plus, they look a lot more appealing to the eye.
Having said all the above, I still have difficulty picking non humanoid races as my playable character.
Pretty much this.
I'll elaborate a bit:
I know i'm playing a game and nothing more. The avatar I control is just that..something I control. So, it might be an extension of my skill and knowledge of the game (or lack of..). But it never represents who I am in real life.
To delve slightly deeper into this conversation: when the very popular thread 'We don't want games, we want worlds' was floating around, I really disagreed with a lot of the users in that thread. I simple want games, not a second life.
I take playing an avatar of myself an additional step as I always, and have always, played a minimum of two characters, one who exhibits my idealistic nature and one who exhibits my realist nature in every game I play.
I once asked a guy why he played a female character and he told me it was because he'd rather stare at a female arse all day rather than a male one.
I can't roll like that. Cause if I'm looking at it for that reason then I have to deduce that others are also, and that makes me feel like I'm trying to live as a female, and no offense to those who choose that path, but that's not why I play.
I did roll up a really cool version of The Bride from Kill Bill for COH one time. Yellow Bruce Lee tracksuit and all. I enjoyed playing her, and for the exact reason that she was smoking hot to look at and the power set really suited her. It didn't last though. After staring at that thing for a couple of hours every time, I'd find myself logging off and harassing my real life woman for the goods :P
She made me delete it.
This is pretty much how I do things too. I make what you could call 'concept characters' which might have a certain persona or background story I quickly wrote in my head, or write as I'm playing.
It wouldn't be 'role-playing' if there wasn't something about who I really am animating the decisions the character makes, maybe an attitude I find myself in or some slice of my actual personality composes the character. But I certainly do not *identify* with my characters, and never have. The closest I've come is making a main character in a game that vaguely resembles me and whom acts as my full personality dictates - but that is still quite different from acting as though I *am* the character.
Since it seems like the issue of avatar gender is a concern of some people, like the OP, I'll address that too. I have zero problem with playing female characters - I can be completely comfortable doing so - and it's not because I completely disassociate myself from my character, thinking of them as merely polygons/sprites or for some stupid reason like "I'd rather look at a female behind" - which was invented by people who sought an easy excuse to get out of talking about identity issues with their virtual avatars...
The logic that "I self-designate as a male irl, therefore I must play as a 'male' character if I ever place myself in the position of my avatar while role-playing" seems to hinge on a grievous misunderstanding of gender...but I won't start a rant - the point is there is no reason to be apprehensive about playing an avatar of any 'gender'.
Not to jump on you dude, or derail, but you have to admit, a lot of MMO's are mostly populated by horny 20 somethings (paired up or not), horny teenagers (mostly non-paired), and outright dirty old men (paired but not digging it so much). Do you really expect to find a deep understanding of gender in those demographics?
A dude see's a female character and he wants there to be a female on the other side. That's why so many dudes rolled female characters in the beginning in order to bilk the unsuspecting out of their stuff, which they would give away freely at the mere idea that they were talking to an actual girl.
Trying to apply real-life understanding of gender to this environment then is a little reaching in my honest opinion.
Neither. My avatar is a character that I play.
That role is not me (no 'extension of you'), in fact it is often as different from me as I can comfortably imagine.'Minion that I control' is also inaccurate, since each one (ideally) develops an individual 'personality' and reacts individually (again, hopefully very differently than I would).
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I see it pretty much like a character in a story I'm writing.
If I can write a story with a female protagonist, I can play a female character in an MMO.
^This. Except I sometimes have more than one "minion".
My "me" is typically my RP character and always male. My "minions" are either.
I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil
Or dancing naked on a table to mess with nerd's sexuality? You bet.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
when it comes to MMORPGs i like to consider the character as an extension of myself and when it comes to games that force me to play as someone else (Lara Croft, Joel,) and such frankly i dont pay attention or dont care (about the character) since i cant have a choice in the story line im forced through good example, the rewarded game called "the walking dead" i hated the MC (Lee) the freedom of choice was just an illusion i would've dissed that kid from the get go. also there was other choices i couldnt make or wasnt allowed to. well i understand that there had to be a limit somewhere to make the game work.
btw i called after the first 20 minutes of gameplay that the kid will get me killed and oh boy was i right or what?
oops little of topic there...
and players who say "im going to spend hours on gameplay so i would rather stare at female ass" or something along those lines are just hyper sensitive about being branded with a tag of "Homo" "Gay" "gayish" or something along those lines (mostly in their minds) (or just perverts or fetishists for pixel girls) well its not my business and dont care, do what you want
No NO this is turning into a rant ......have to stop...... before the demon takes over.....Ö_Ö..........( *_* ) ....
as an extension i mean "I do this" "I go do that" whats so nerdy about that? rather than "lets walk her there" "he needs a healer" "lets take her clothes off". projecting your behaviour and personality to the character rather than role playing as some one else or controlling a minion
I play games to escape my life for a little while so my avatars tend to be as far from being me as the game will allow. When I want to be me I go out and do something in the real world.
Bren
while(horse==dead)
{
beat();
}
Funny idea, never thougt about. Would never play female char as I'm male ... but on the other side have no problems playing any race and color ... as long as it is male. Lol.