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Old school MMOers could really dig this, just some nit picky questions
WellzyC
Member UncommonPosts: 599
I havent played the beta, but after reading all the impresisons and watching the Yoggcast gameplay, this has a lot of machanics that us old timers could really get on board with. Non of the super annoying trends of todays mmos that have made me stop playing mmos, IE: two button action combat, linear solo story modes, fast travel everywhere ect.
I just have some final questions before I completely commit myself.
Death pentaly?: I know when you die and are not rezzed you spawn back at the town that you are bound in, and im pretty sure you take durability loss, and get a timer debuff, but do you lose exp? (finally a game with a death penatly again, this is so refreshing)
Looting?: I can't get a read on this from the videos and no article really touches on it. But loot copying has been a really anoying trend for me and Im hoping this game doesn't have it (loot copying: when you loot a boss corpse everyone gets a copy of the loot specific to them) This sounds all nice but it really aggrivates me. I love the politics and drama that comes from having to manage the loot across the entire group, and it is far more thrilling and rewarding when you actualy get the peice you wanted. Loot copying just kills the fun for me, also I love using the DKP system. So, what is the loot rules in ff14?
Seems group focused, But how much?: Grouping should always be the best exp.. period. The solo story mmo trend drives me nuts. I dont mind a little story for some ambiance and context, but an mmo should be about grouping up with others. how neccissary is it to group in this game? Can you solo to 50 (blah) or do you need to group to get the good exp and loot?
How interactive is the world?: This is a touchy subject for me, you would think that the better technology gets the more this would improve, but it has done the exact opposite. Worlds are getting less immersive (cough swtor chairs). I noticed that doors open when you walk near them, which is cool, but how interactive is the world? Can I sit in chairs? Can i drop items on the ground? Can I hand and item to another player for god sakes? (looking at you gw2).
Thanks for any responses these questions.
Honerable mentions: love that you get around by chocobo, and you can only fast travel between cities using the crystals. Holy trinity grouping is AWESOME. And the flexibal class system rocks.
ok, Wellzy out.
The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.
The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, solo Questing, Cut-Scenes...
www.CeaselessGuild.com
Comments
Death Penalty - No XP loss - and I am not sure about a debuff.
Looting - looting from what I saw in dungeons was a standard 'need/greed/pass' system ala WoW.
Force Grouping - you are forced to do 3 dungeons early in the main story (level 15-17 or so) to progress the main story, and these dungeons are 4 person "light party."
There are going to be 16-18 dungeons at launch for leveling up, plus level 50 "hard modes" of each with new bosses at times and no paths open and such, not just tougher mobs. Also two raids and I think up to like 4-6 Primal boss fights (which are single boss, no trash encounters.)
I think you are forced into other dungeons and some early primal battles as part of the main story too.
There are also Guildhests, which are kind of like training instances for group content starting at level 10.
So you can solo your way to cap, if you don't do any of the main story after level 14 or so. So you'd pretty much be grinding 90% of the time on mobs/guildleves.
It is definitely a party oriented game.
End-game will have anywhere from 4 person stuff to 24 person raids, also 8 person.
Interactive world - I haven't noticed any chairs you can sit in, but I was mostly testing mechanics and game "feel" not really spending too much time wandering/exploring/smelling roses, and most doors do auto-open. You can trade with players directly. You can't drop items on the ground.
Other - chocobo are lots of final fantasy fun, have to quest for them (so you will never own a chocobo if you don't do the personal story including the forced-group dungeons).
You do get a teleport spell that allows you to teleport to the Crystals you've been to for a price.
It is very Holy Trinity and even though you could probably get your first class to 50 in two weeks of fairly solid play, to do raiding and hard mode stuff you are going to need multiple jobs/classes leveled for cross-class skills, and either crafting professions (or crafter friends) to slot Materia into your armor/weapons for you (like Enchanting kind of, but to slot Materia into Level 50 Heavy Armor you will need a Level 50 Armorsmith to do it for you) kind of thing.
You can sit on any chair, not by clicking on them, by going near them and doing the /sit emote
Awesome, Thanks Bspock, that is all music to my ears!
The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.
The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, solo Questing, Cut-Scenes...
www.CeaselessGuild.com
Old school MMO'ers prefer and are playing XI.
While I've personally moved on from XI and actually enjoy XIV, i don't think old school players will enjoy this anywhere near as much as the previous.
Mind. Blown.
I don’t mean specifically ff11, I just mean pre wow era ala EQ and UO, or early wow era players.
The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.
The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, solo Questing, Cut-Scenes...
www.CeaselessGuild.com
I knew what you meant. XI sits right there with EQ as far as old school is concerned. I don't think those players will find much to be excited about in XIV.
One thing I'll add about leveling up - you didnt' ask, but I think it's extremely imporant. You could probably level to 50 in a few weeks if you focused on one class and one class only. People will do it, but they will end up gimped and they will not be able to do the hard mode dungeons or bosses.
Just like FFXI had subjobs - and you had to have a subjob to be useful at all - in XIV, you can utilize skills from other classes. As a Pugilist, you can use skills from Lancer, Conjurer, etc. This will basically act as your subjob, but much more flexible. When you get into "Jobs" - the FFXIV equivilent to advanced jobs from XI - you have to have at least one other class advanced as well. So to be a Bard, you need Archer to 30 and Conjurer to 15 to do the Bard quest. Once you are a Bard, you have access to all archer skills, and a few Conjurer (ie, cure, protect, raise) and a few Lancer (the Slow skill and a couple more) automatically. Plus, you will be still able to choose more skills from any other job.
So leveling one class to 50 will be almost meaningless - maybe not as much as in FFXI, but pretty close. Pretty much all the non-casting DPS classes will need to level up all the classes. All the casters will level up all caster jobs. Hell, I'll level Conjuere for cure and Pugilist for Second Wind, no matter what my job - just to have it for solo fights.
So there will be those that go berserk to get to 50 first, but they'll not really have much when they get there. They'll still have to go back. That's good stuff and one of the only games that creates that kind of dynamic.
Being from that "era", played EQ/UO religiously. I can't really agree with FFXIV being a game that calls to "old school" players. It's a very safe, linear game that will appeal to people who are looking for something "new" (give or take).
There is a rez penalty, a debuff for a minute or two. There is no debuff if you just respawn though. The durability hit takes place no matter what, and gear durability is a somewhat significant effect. In the open world, this is whatever crystal you are bound to, in a dungeon it's the start of the dungeon; and that is a point of contention right now, as it makes it somewhat better to respawn and run back than to accept a rez in a dungeon at the moment. I know several people have discussed it and hopefully it gets fixed soon.
You autoloot and auto-distribute/share most non-rare items: tradeskill items, gil, potions, etc. Any rare items get rolled on by the group: the system defaults to a NBG dice roll system, but that can be changed by the group leader. People who are not classed to be able to use the item are locked out of Need rolls by default (again, selectable by the group leader). There is no "loot copying".
Grouping is the best exp, period. A "light party" of 4, in my experience, will generate xp anywhere from 2-3x faster than solo, depending on what you are doing. Story quests are huge XP boosts when you do them, but they are solo, and only can be done once (presumably to get your main class leveled up fast enough to be able to get out into the world). To level classes 2-4 you can do alternate city area quests and do OK solo, until you run out of area-specific quests. Past that, your basically down to doing solo grinds, FATEs, a limited number of solo leves (based on your allocation) and group content (dungeons/leves/etc), and particularly once you hit this point group xp is far, far better than solo xp.
You can sit in chairs. You can lay down on beds. You can log out by going to sleep in the inn (and wake up in the inn the next time you log in). You cannot drop items on the ground. You do get a retainer, who is a physical NPC, who holds you items and sells them on the market for you (not just a generic "bank account" or "Auction Window"). You can trade items. You chocobo, which is your transportation, can also act as a battle pet. You can dress up your chocobo (bardings). The music fades in and out at appropriate moments (battle music, weather-related music, day/night themes for areas, etc). There is a day/night cycle, with weather. Your character will "look" at who you have targeted (lalafells will look up to everyone, it's funny). Grass blows in the wind. There are a million other small things that really draw you in. It's pretty darn good in this respect.
thanks Rid, that all sounds fantasitc!
The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.
The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, solo Questing, Cut-Scenes...
www.CeaselessGuild.com
I dont mean specifically ff11, I just mean pre wow era ala EQ and UO, or early wow era players.
Being from that "era", played EQ/UO religiously. I can't really agree with FFXIV being a game that calls to "old school" players. It's a very safe, linear game that will appeal to people who are looking for something "new" (give or take).
When you say 'linear' it's because the game doesn't give many options to do or just because it's a themepark?I think some people are overreacting for ARR(and yes im hyped as f**k myself ; >)
Is ARR oldschool mmo? yes and no at same time.
Leveling - 1st and probably 2nd class leveling will be really fast(i dont see any reason to not cap 1st class in less then week) but from their most effective way of leveling would be grinding fates with full party - so here you have first example of how game make it oldschool and modern(kinda oposit of wow where your 1st character is slow and alts are ultra fast for leveling)
This is only example and im sure we can find more things like that.
Um, because this is a Final Fantasy game? FF games were always about story. Clearly you want sandbox. Enjoy. This isn't your game. Not that this game feels like a single player game, as socializing, crafting, grouping, etc. are huge parts of this game, but so is the story. It remains to be seen what happens at 50 as far as story, but yes you do story quests every 5 levels or so.
To me it's a more accessible version of FFXI which is a good thing in my opinion. XI was just a bit too hardcore for me to ever really get into. I didn't have the dedication to sit around for a group all day and then grind.