"Best in show" is a subjective value judgement, made by the people involved. Its their *opinion*. If you disagree, thats *your opinion*. Its really as simple as that.
Originally posted by Distopia Originally posted by strangiato2112Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won insteadThe other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...
Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won instead
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...
Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Best in show does not mean the best game on show at E3. Best in show always goes to the game that is currently most hyped on show at E3, hence EQN got it
Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom
Now that we have seen the same stuff as the staff here and at Ten Ton Hammer, I am a bit confused as to how this nabbed best in show at E3. Mainly because none of the footage was actual gameplay. We saw tech demos of the voxel layered world (which is amazing). We saw two players on the screen fighting, jumping, hopping over rocks, falling down holes. We saw some world building tools ala minecraft which is pretty cool too.However, we did not see the following:Zero crafting. No raids, no actual quests or objectives, no rallies, no groups to speak of other than two players. No trade functions, chat functions, no character creation videos. We didnt see 40 classes. We didnt see any dynamic AI. But you were told these things would be in game. You weren't actually shown them. So how exactly did it get best in show? We have not even seen this game working in real time. I actually got too watch people play Assassin's Creed 4, Destiny, and Watch Dogs. Those games I would qualify as being shown. EQNext was 5% substance and 95% concept. I will agree that what we saw was a cool tech demo of the engine. But that was not a game yet. let alone an mmo and even further from what I would even consider a nominee for best in show at E3.If you read Bill Murphy's article, then look at the limited amount of footage, you'll realize that amost everything he is talking about that is so amazing is not really in the game or at least not shown. It was al stuff that he was told would be in it. I mean, I can spin a pretty graphic tale of the perfect mmorpg too. Will that garner me game of the year?So what gives, mmorpg.com?
I'm asking politely as well for you to read everything on EQN, and to understand what best in show means before posting again, please
Most websites have been praising EQN after the reveal this weekend, so its not just MMORPG.com or TTH. Maybe the haters on this forum are the odd ones out?
Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won instead
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...
Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
Destiny showed a tiny level ( EQN showed 2 much bigger), guns and a rocket launcher (EQN showed hammers, spells and a bow), 4 classes (EQN: Mage, warrior, Tempest and idle animation for ranger), 1 enemy and 2 bosses (EQN: 1 ennemy and 1 boss...) it also showed a scripted ship warping in...
Your argument is invalid.
Seriously it's really pedantic to suggest that Destiny wasn't a prototype because it had a health bar on it's screen. EQN showed everything Destiny did except A.I and a U.I.
Also what is Destiny aside from "More instanced Borderlands that looks and plays like Halo". It looks nice but really? Is this the direction you've hoped and dreamed MMOs will go down?
The Eqnext team simply overplayed their hand. They hyped the concepts/vision of EQnext in hopes that it alone would sell people on it. If you saw the class/lore panels then you can clearly detect the amount of bullshit canned PR responses the team spewed at players. They simply do NOT have enough development under their belt to showcase EQnext yet in a substantial fashion. For this reason, I feel like EQnext is 2+ years away. I think that the dev team was hoping to have a demo-able EQ Landmark available at SOE live, but failed to meet the goal. that was what Smed was referring to in his infamous tweets. No way would they have the balls to think their core gamers are dumb enough to consider a polished tech demo as a working, playable version of EQnext.
This whole trend of over-hyping games when they are years away from even playable beta must END imo. I, for one, am sick and tired of hearing these PR suits dodge 99% of important questions with salesman jargen. If I have to sit here and listen to one more game developer start a reply to a question from a press rep with the word "So"....I will explode.
Originally posted by Distopia Originally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by DistopiaOriginally posted by strangiato2112Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won insteadThe other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k. I would hand EQN the innovative award for the voxel engine.
Originally posted by evilastro Most websites have been praising EQN after the reveal this weekend, so its not just MMORPG.com or TTH. Maybe the haters on this forum are the odd ones out?
I'm not a hater. Just trying to look at things as objectively as I can. Maybe I'm the odd one out because of that haha
Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won instead
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.
I would hand EQN the innovative award for the voxel engine.
AFTER it's been proven to work as intended in a massively online environment.
Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won instead
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.
I would hand EQN the innovative award for the voxel engine.
AFTER it's been proven to work as intended in a massively online environment.
E3 is a tech/trade show... nothing being awarded has "proven" itself yet.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Originally posted by Distopia Originally posted by GeezerGamerOriginally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by DistopiaOriginally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by DistopiaOriginally posted by strangiato2112Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won insteadThe other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.I would hand EQN the innovative award for the voxel engine. AFTER it's been proven to work as intended in a massively online environment.E3 is a tech/trade show... nothing being awarded has "proven" itself yet. Actually E3 is more of a press media outlet show. Almost every game there is on the floor and playable. The closed door stuff and presentations make up only a small amount of what goes on during those three days.
I would feel about 10,000 times better about this award if there was a crappy handheld cheap phone video of actual game play from the E3 event, even if it was just Bill Murphy looking over an SOE employees shoulder watching them control a character in the game world.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
I believe the quote was something like "your going to poop your pants". Well he was right actually a lot of people do. Just not for the reasons most of you expected.
Originally posted by remyburkeHeh, I was wondering the exact same thing today. Cool concepts and ideas? You bet!....but if Bill and the Gang saw what we've all seen thus far, then I'm not sure how you can give a game that isn't even a game yet "best in show".
No one has given a reasonable argument as to what MMO should have won instead
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.
I would hand EQN the innovative award for the voxel engine.
AFTER it's been proven to work as intended in a massively online environment.
E3 is a tech/trade show... nothing being awarded has "proven" itself yet.
Actually E3 is more of a press media outlet show. Almost every game there is on the floor and playable. The closed door stuff and presentations make up only a small amount of what goes on during those three days.
I would think that a game should at least be in a playable state at some level. Some sort of alpha stage maybe. But clearly not.
Originally posted by GeezerGamer I would think that a game should at least be in a playable state at some level. Some sort of alpha stage maybe. But clearly not.
For it to be considered a game, definitely. The game engine and ideas can still be groundbreaking on their own merit. And imo they are with EQN. I am giving them all the credit in that dept. But best game? Gotta give to something people were able to play. But thats just my pov.
It got 'Best in Show' at E3 in the same way that SWTOR did two years ago.
By having a well-funded marketing team who went to the E3 organisers and said; 'If you don't recognise us now, we won't spend ten or twenty thousand dollars on a stand next year, get me?'
Originally posted by GeezerGamer I would think that a game should at least be in a playable state at some level. Some sort of alpha stage maybe. But clearly not.
For it to be considered a game, definitely. The game engine and ideas can still be groundbreaking on their own merit. And imo they are with EQN. I am giving them all the credit in that dept. But best game? Gotta give to something people were able to play. But thats just my pov.
Most may be in a playable state but most are not playable by the trade journalists or public,they are played by the devs in front of said people, unless they are close to release.Even when they are in a publicly playable state most often is a very small and focused taste that often turns out not to be representative of the final game sometimes for good and sometimes for bad
Lots of games sites give awards at E3 to games they weren't able to get actual hands on wit in every game genre.
Most may be in a playable state but most are not playable by the trade journalists or public,they are played by the devs in front of said people, unless they are close to release.Even when they are in a publicly playable state most often is a very small and focused taste that often turns out not to be representative of the final game sometimes for good and sometimes for bad
Lots of games sites give awards at E3 to games they weren't able to get actual hands on wit in every game genre.
Two questions about the highlighted statement:
Is there evidence that MMORPG.com staff actually saw the 'game' in action? From everything I've seen of SOELive, there's been no trace of actual in-game play. Did someone see an actual person interact with the game?
If MMORPG.com staff did see a workable game, does their don't-disclose-til-SOELive agreement prohibit them from telling us something about the actual UI, even if it was a mock-up? Or answering questions about the combat system, or PvP or crafting or character creation or any of the dozens of topics that the SOE dev team avoided during SOELive?
From the information I've seen from SOELive and the 'reveal' information here on this site, I'd be hard pressed to believe that EQN is anywhere close to being finished. The technology they are planning to use does seem innovative, but no one outside of SOE has seen anything close to a viable product. Even if the game is in a rough alpha stage, seeing that, even indirectly, would help ease a lot of the community's concerns.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Most may be in a playable state but most are not playable by the trade journalists or public,they are played by the devs in front of said people, unless they are close to release.Even when they are in a publicly playable state most often is a very small and focused taste that often turns out not to be representative of the final game sometimes for good and sometimes for bad
Lots of games sites give awards at E3 to games they weren't able to get actual hands on wit in every game genre.
Two questions about the highlighted statement:
Is there evidence that MMORPG.com staff actually saw the 'game' in action? From everything I've seen of SOELive, there's been no trace of actual in-game play. Did someone see an actual person interact with the game?
If MMORPG.com staff did see a workable game, does their don't-disclose-til-SOELive agreement prohibit them from telling us something about the actual UI, even if it was a mock-up? Or answering questions about the combat system, or PvP or crafting or character creation or any of the dozens of topics that the SOE dev team avoided during SOELive?
From the information I've seen from SOELive and the 'reveal' information here on this site, I'd be hard pressed to believe that EQN is anywhere close to being finished. The technology they are planning to use does seem innovative, but no one outside of SOE has seen anything close to a viable product. Even if the game is in a rough alpha stage, seeing that, even indirectly, would help ease a lot of the community's concerns.
Oh EQN is very far from finished they even said so at one of the panels.No one has any idea what insiders saw behind closed doors at E3,but I'd venture to say it was similar to what we saw,technically playable but focused on showing off what they wanted it to.But the same could be said about Destiny and The Division or a myriad of other games that won acclaim at E3.
Comments
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)...
Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom
I'm asking politely as well for you to read everything on EQN, and to understand what best in show means before posting again, pleaseover 20 years of mmorpg's and counting...
One word;
SPHERE .
Destiny showed a tiny level ( EQN showed 2 much bigger), guns and a rocket launcher (EQN showed hammers, spells and a bow), 4 classes (EQN: Mage, warrior, Tempest and idle animation for ranger), 1 enemy and 2 bosses (EQN: 1 ennemy and 1 boss...) it also showed a scripted ship warping in...
Your argument is invalid.
Seriously it's really pedantic to suggest that Destiny wasn't a prototype because it had a health bar on it's screen. EQN showed everything Destiny did except A.I and a U.I.
Also what is Destiny aside from "More instanced Borderlands that looks and plays like Halo". It looks nice but really? Is this the direction you've hoped and dreamed MMOs will go down?
The Eqnext team simply overplayed their hand. They hyped the concepts/vision of EQnext in hopes that it alone would sell people on it. If you saw the class/lore panels then you can clearly detect the amount of bullshit canned PR responses the team spewed at players. They simply do NOT have enough development under their belt to showcase EQnext yet in a substantial fashion. For this reason, I feel like EQnext is 2+ years away. I think that the dev team was hoping to have a demo-able EQ Landmark available at SOE live, but failed to meet the goal. that was what Smed was referring to in his infamous tweets. No way would they have the balls to think their core gamers are dumb enough to consider a polished tech demo as a working, playable version of EQnext.
This whole trend of over-hyping games when they are years away from even playable beta must END imo. I, for one, am sick and tired of hearing these PR suits dodge 99% of important questions with salesman jargen. If I have to sit here and listen to one more game developer start a reply to a question from a press rep with the word "So"....I will explode.
How did SWTOR get "Game of the Year" when it was out for less then a week before the year was over?
Easy! $
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)... Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.
I would hand EQN the innovative award for the voxel engine.
AFTER it's been proven to work as intended in a massively online environment.
E3 is a tech/trade show... nothing being awarded has "proven" itself yet.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The other options were, console kiddy MMO's, ESO (or omen as is it seems to be judged around here), a medieval game with cars (if AA was at E3 I'm not sure), The return of a failed game (FF)... Note: the wording used is to give off the impression those games receive around here.
I would have picked Destiny as best MMO in show with EQN as most anticipated.
I agree about destiny, yet I'd have given EQN most innovative personally over WH40k.
I would hand EQN the innovative award for the voxel engine.
AFTER it's been proven to work as intended in a massively online environment.
E3 is a tech/trade show... nothing being awarded has "proven" itself yet.
Actually E3 is more of a press media outlet show. Almost every game there is on the floor and playable. The closed door stuff and presentations make up only a small amount of what goes on during those three days.
I would feel about 10,000 times better about this award if there was a crappy handheld cheap phone video of actual game play from the E3 event, even if it was just Bill Murphy looking over an SOE employees shoulder watching them control a character in the game world.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
For the first time ever, I am in agreement with you. It feels strangely odd.......
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
I would think that a game should at least be in a playable state at some level. Some sort of alpha stage maybe. But clearly not.
For it to be considered a game, definitely. The game engine and ideas can still be groundbreaking on their own merit. And imo they are with EQN. I am giving them all the credit in that dept. But best game? Gotta give to something people were able to play. But thats just my pov.
It got 'Best in Show' at E3 in the same way that SWTOR did two years ago.
By having a well-funded marketing team who went to the E3 organisers and said; 'If you don't recognise us now, we won't spend ten or twenty thousand dollars on a stand next year, get me?'
Most may be in a playable state but most are not playable by the trade journalists or public,they are played by the devs in front of said people, unless they are close to release.Even when they are in a publicly playable state most often is a very small and focused taste that often turns out not to be representative of the final game sometimes for good and sometimes for bad
Lots of games sites give awards at E3 to games they weren't able to get actual hands on wit in every game genre.
Two questions about the highlighted statement:
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
Oh EQN is very far from finished they even said so at one of the panels.No one has any idea what insiders saw behind closed doors at E3,but I'd venture to say it was similar to what we saw,technically playable but focused on showing off what they wanted it to.But the same could be said about Destiny and The Division or a myriad of other games that won acclaim at E3.
Man you people are sounding like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5fsWW7U774 over a non-issue.
Well the first part anyway.