Trinity systems are designed to work with tightly choreographed fights. It can be really complex and challenging, but it's still choreographed. I suppose, like other posters have said that it's because the AI was pretty stupid. It could be choreographed, but it couldn't be intelligent.
When the AI can be intelligent, you can have fights that are organic, developing as they go. In this scenario, you could still have the trinity, but the dps and the healer people would have to have some sort of damage mitigation equal to a tank's so that when the AI switched to a different person they weren't insta-squished because they weren't the tank. At this point the tank is pretty trivialized. If you're not going to have a dedicated tank, why have a dedicated healer? The healers were there to keep the tank up.
Without the trinity, you can still have individuality and people can still excel at their jobs. They have to do it by being good though, not by picking the right class a month before they really need to use it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I read a whole lot of complaining about a game no one know one knows nothing about. The game isn't even remotely close to releasing and they're just playing with ideas and you're all throwing your arms up in the air saying this game sucks, I need my class and my individuality.
Did you watch the class panel? Do you remember what happened a year or so ago when they scrapped everything? Everything can be changed and chances are will be. They said nothing is set in stone and everything is up for change. So instead of complaining and whining like a little kid on the forums, why don't you post some positive feedback on what you would change and give the reason.
It's because of whiners that the game gets changed for the worse. If they want to try something new, it's their game, let them do it, but help them do it in a constructive manner instead of this nonsense. If you want to an EQ1 experience, go play EQ1, same goes for EQ2, Vanguard, (insert your game here).
Am I excited? I'm not sure. I don't know how the skill system will work. They said you'll have 4+4 abilities, but also mentioned that items have abilities on them as well. Am I familiar with this? Not really, I heard it's along the lines of GW2, but I never got around to playing it. Would I change anything? I would. I would want to the ability to have 8 active skills like they have mentioned, but I'm not sure how the weapon holding 4 skills will work. I would like to have 8 skills that I can pick and that I can completely customize in terms of what the spell does via the Vanguard Bard song creation system to create custom spells (this would be awesome!). But I would also like to be able to change them out in combat like in EQ1 by sitting down or whatever vulnerable state they have when changing skills.
So yea, say what you want to change, not just say, I don't understand individuality because in older games blah blah blah. They are taking aren't taking a step forward because that path has lead into a brick wall. They're simply trying to go around it first, will it work? Who knows, but I'm interested in finding out. They are going a little bit of UO/Darfall with the leveling or lackof leveling system, little bit of Wurm/Vindictus for destructability, GW2/EQ1 for abilities (EQ because of 8 skills), possibly a little bit of DAoC/Shadowbane because of their pvp siege opportunities, throw in the EQ lore and reinvent it to make sure it's not stale, toss in a bit of character development that is unique, a bit of minecraft, hopefully a crafting system that is engaging and not just a time sink, and we might have a game that uses the best from bits of others while throwing in bits of new things and wrap it up with the new AI and that is EQN. Will it work...who knows it's a big goal.
Loopback I was talking about endgame PvE. We levelled up in 2 days, the fact we started new on the PvP server is irrelevant. Good players always need heal / tank alts to compensate for all the bad ones.
EQNext doesn't really allow you to be everything at the same time, it allow you to change archetype if you need to by switching class. You can only be one class at a time and can not switch (you can't even switch weapon) in combat. The 4 classes slots have types that are class dependent as well, so while you can put skills from the other classes, the type has to match. The prime class also dictate what weapons, weapons skills and armor you can use.
This mean that if you are a Warrior, you might be able to slot that one defensive slot with a heal, but that is it. You're not a healer that way. If you want to be a healer you'll have to switch to a class that actually have more defensive slots or heals on weapon skills.
Same goes for everything else, want to be a mobile class that zip-zap everywhere, your prime class will have to be one with a lots of movement slot types. Want to be a tank, you will need more defensive slots type, heavy armor and probably defensive skills on your weapon sets.
I read a whole lot of complaining about a game no one know one knows nothing about. The game isn't even remotely close to releasing and they're just playing with ideas and you're all throwing your arms up in the air saying this game sucks, I need my class and my individuality.
People (well, most people i guess) understand that they don't know exactly what the game is like. So people are assuming.
The all the "complaints" are a good thing. They're a way of signalling to the developers that "if it's like this, we won't consider it fun". SOE specifically asked for people to tell them what we want in EQN. So people are doing that. I'm fairly sure that SOE isn't going to see one random post that says "disney sucks" and think "oh we better scrap the game and redo the graphics". But, hopefully, they will see what the main concerns are and weight them against what THEY know to be true about the game. Then make changes if they feel it makes sense for them and their audience.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
I read a whole lot of complaining about a game no one know one knows nothing about. The game isn't even remotely close to releasing and they're just playing with ideas and you're all throwing your arms up in the air saying this game sucks, I need my class and my individuality.
Did you watch the class panel? Do you remember what happened a year or so ago when they scrapped everything? Everything can be changed and chances are will be. They said nothing is set in stone and everything is up for change. So instead of complaining and whining like a little kid on the forums, why don't you post some positive feedback on what you would change and give the reason.
It's because of whiners that the game gets changed for the worse. If they want to try something new, it's their game, let them do it, but help them do it in a constructive manner instead of this nonsense. If you want to an EQ1 experience, go play EQ1, same goes for EQ2, Vanguard, (insert your game here).
Am I excited? I'm not sure. I don't know how the skill system will work. They said you'll have 4+4 abilities, but also mentioned that items have abilities on them as well. Am I familiar with this? Not really, I heard it's along the lines of GW2, but I never got around to playing it. Would I change anything? I would. I would want to the ability to have 8 active skills like they have mentioned, but I'm not sure how the weapon holding 4 skills will work. I would like to have 8 skills that I can pick and that I can completely customize in terms of what the spell does via the Vanguard Bard song creation system to create custom spells (this would be awesome!). But I would also like to be able to change them out in combat like in EQ1 by sitting down or whatever vulnerable state they have when changing skills.
So yea, say what you want to change, not just say, I don't understand individuality because in older games blah blah blah. They are taking aren't taking a step forward because that path has lead into a brick wall. They're simply trying to go around it first, will it work? Who knows, but I'm interested in finding out. They are going a little bit of UO/Darfall with the leveling or lackof leveling system, little bit of Wurm/Vindictus for destructability, GW2/EQ1 for abilities (EQ because of 8 skills), possibly a little bit of DAoC/Shadowbane because of their pvp siege opportunities, throw in the EQ lore and reinvent it to make sure it's not stale, toss in a bit of character development that is unique, a bit of minecraft, hopefully a crafting system that is engaging and not just a time sink, and we might have a game that uses the best from bits of others while throwing in bits of new things and wrap it up with the new AI and that is EQN. Will it work...who knows it's a big goal.
Since Star Wars is a thorn in the ass that SOE knows all too well, it just makes you wonder how they came to this whole game idea (or lack thereof depending who you talk to).
Star Wars IV, V, VI - Arguably best movies ever made (at least for a good 20+ year run)
Then suddenly it goes backwards into prequels and you get Jar-Jar Binks.
Now you have EQ 1 and EQ 2, which for their time were at or near the top of the MMO lists....
aaaaaand here comes the new EQN, a fully redesigned PREQUEL.
I'm not saying this is gonna be SOE's Jar-Jar, but the character models aren't helping lol!
Pretty sure they stated it's not a sequel or a prequel. It's just going to be a new world in general that is called Norrath with familiar names that you will have heard before. Think same names, different world.
Originally posted by akahdrin Pretty sure they stated it's not a sequel or a prequel. It's just going to be a new world in general that is called Norrath with familiar names that you will have heard before. Think same names, different world.
shhhh... I'm just trying to make this fun. Beats arguing about a game we haven't seen and know next to nothing about like we're all long time professional players of it lol!
Comments
Trinity systems are designed to work with tightly choreographed fights. It can be really complex and challenging, but it's still choreographed. I suppose, like other posters have said that it's because the AI was pretty stupid. It could be choreographed, but it couldn't be intelligent.
When the AI can be intelligent, you can have fights that are organic, developing as they go. In this scenario, you could still have the trinity, but the dps and the healer people would have to have some sort of damage mitigation equal to a tank's so that when the AI switched to a different person they weren't insta-squished because they weren't the tank. At this point the tank is pretty trivialized. If you're not going to have a dedicated tank, why have a dedicated healer? The healers were there to keep the tank up.
Without the trinity, you can still have individuality and people can still excel at their jobs. They have to do it by being good though, not by picking the right class a month before they really need to use it.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I read a whole lot of complaining about a game no one know one knows nothing about. The game isn't even remotely close to releasing and they're just playing with ideas and you're all throwing your arms up in the air saying this game sucks, I need my class and my individuality.
Did you watch the class panel? Do you remember what happened a year or so ago when they scrapped everything? Everything can be changed and chances are will be. They said nothing is set in stone and everything is up for change. So instead of complaining and whining like a little kid on the forums, why don't you post some positive feedback on what you would change and give the reason.
It's because of whiners that the game gets changed for the worse. If they want to try something new, it's their game, let them do it, but help them do it in a constructive manner instead of this nonsense. If you want to an EQ1 experience, go play EQ1, same goes for EQ2, Vanguard, (insert your game here).
Am I excited? I'm not sure. I don't know how the skill system will work. They said you'll have 4+4 abilities, but also mentioned that items have abilities on them as well. Am I familiar with this? Not really, I heard it's along the lines of GW2, but I never got around to playing it. Would I change anything? I would. I would want to the ability to have 8 active skills like they have mentioned, but I'm not sure how the weapon holding 4 skills will work. I would like to have 8 skills that I can pick and that I can completely customize in terms of what the spell does via the Vanguard Bard song creation system to create custom spells (this would be awesome!). But I would also like to be able to change them out in combat like in EQ1 by sitting down or whatever vulnerable state they have when changing skills.
So yea, say what you want to change, not just say, I don't understand individuality because in older games blah blah blah. They are taking aren't taking a step forward because that path has lead into a brick wall. They're simply trying to go around it first, will it work? Who knows, but I'm interested in finding out. They are going a little bit of UO/Darfall with the leveling or lackof leveling system, little bit of Wurm/Vindictus for destructability, GW2/EQ1 for abilities (EQ because of 8 skills), possibly a little bit of DAoC/Shadowbane because of their pvp siege opportunities, throw in the EQ lore and reinvent it to make sure it's not stale, toss in a bit of character development that is unique, a bit of minecraft, hopefully a crafting system that is engaging and not just a time sink, and we might have a game that uses the best from bits of others while throwing in bits of new things and wrap it up with the new AI and that is EQN. Will it work...who knows it's a big goal.
Currently playing Everquest on Project1999
EQNext doesn't really allow you to be everything at the same time, it allow you to change archetype if you need to by switching class. You can only be one class at a time and can not switch (you can't even switch weapon) in combat. The 4 classes slots have types that are class dependent as well, so while you can put skills from the other classes, the type has to match. The prime class also dictate what weapons, weapons skills and armor you can use.
This mean that if you are a Warrior, you might be able to slot that one defensive slot with a heal, but that is it. You're not a healer that way. If you want to be a healer you'll have to switch to a class that actually have more defensive slots or heals on weapon skills.
Same goes for everything else, want to be a mobile class that zip-zap everywhere, your prime class will have to be one with a lots of movement slot types. Want to be a tank, you will need more defensive slots type, heavy armor and probably defensive skills on your weapon sets.
People (well, most people i guess) understand that they don't know exactly what the game is like. So people are assuming.
The all the "complaints" are a good thing. They're a way of signalling to the developers that "if it's like this, we won't consider it fun". SOE specifically asked for people to tell them what we want in EQN. So people are doing that. I'm fairly sure that SOE isn't going to see one random post that says "disney sucks" and think "oh we better scrap the game and redo the graphics". But, hopefully, they will see what the main concerns are and weight them against what THEY know to be true about the game. Then make changes if they feel it makes sense for them and their audience.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
Since Star Wars is a thorn in the ass that SOE knows all too well, it just makes you wonder how they came to this whole game idea (or lack thereof depending who you talk to).
Star Wars IV, V, VI - Arguably best movies ever made (at least for a good 20+ year run)
Then suddenly it goes backwards into prequels and you get Jar-Jar Binks.
Now you have EQ 1 and EQ 2, which for their time were at or near the top of the MMO lists....
aaaaaand here comes the new EQN, a fully redesigned PREQUEL.
I'm not saying this is gonna be SOE's Jar-Jar, but the character models aren't helping lol!
Currently playing Everquest on Project1999
shhhh... I'm just trying to make this fun. Beats arguing about a game we haven't seen and know next to nothing about like we're all long time professional players of it lol!