Planetside 2 is not pay to win. All guns can be earned in game except them gold plated ones which are EXACTLY the same as the normal guns except they are gold.
People who sub progress faster. Sure. What's wrong with that? Are they supposed to make a game for free? Should free loaders get exactly the same things as paying members? Compared to other games, at least as a f2p player you have access to the whole game.
I will agree SOE has had its issues. But as far a company, they have had all of most favorite games. SWG, DCUO, Planeside 2
I've have a station account for 11 years. if they brought SWG back, as it was at end, I would resub immediately.
How can you not like a company that makes all the best games?
Played:SWG(pre NGE/CU sucked)Yep its true, anyone who quit SWG because of the NGE/CU missed out on a much better combat system. DCUO, Fallen Earth, STO, The Secret World. Battlefield series. Planetside 2. Still playing SWG.
Originally posted by goldtoof Planetside 2 is not pay to win. All guns can be earned in game except them gold plated ones which are EXACTLY the same as the normal guns except they are gold.
People who sub progress faster. Sure. What's wrong with that? Are they supposed to make a game for free? Should free loaders get exactly the same things as paying members? Compared to other games, at least as a f2p player you have access to the whole game.
while the claim of it not being P2W is not that strong, after all, there are a vast number of weapons that give a huge advantage, that cost a fortune in cert points, sure, you could save them up eventually, but for some of them it would take literally weeks of playing to achieve, Take heavies, mine is equipped with either a TMG 50, or one of the SMG's with an annihilator (totally wasted money on the annihilator ) and have a pistol, which i also bought in the cash shop.. commissioner.. at close range it will out damage just about every other weapon out there. i probably could have got them with certs, but it would have taken a very long time, months most likely.. and in the meantime i would have had to forget about getting things like, better shield or armour, scopes for weapons, or vehicle certs.. any vehicle certs.. so.. P2W .. maybe.. maybe not.. but Pay to compete.. without a shred of doubt, hell yes.
Originally posted by goldtoof Planetside 2 is not pay to win. All guns can be earned in game except them gold plated ones which are EXACTLY the same as the normal guns except they are gold.
People who sub progress faster. Sure. What's wrong with that? Are they supposed to make a game for free? Should free loaders get exactly the same things as paying members? Compared to other games, at least as a f2p player you have access to the whole game.
Sure you can unlock the guns if you grind for months whereas someone can pay $60 and have all of that progress instantly and have massive advantages in terms of equipment. How is that not pay 2 win? Are you trying to tell me buying rocket pods for my mosquito on day 1 isn't pay 2 win? Free players are just fodder for everyone else.
And the releasing of OP items for RMT then nerfing them a week later is extremely unethical. The guns also had nearly identical skins, so all they had to do was change the name and some stats then re-sell the same item practically.
Obviously they need to make money, that is why you sell the game for a box price then use RMT for stuff that doesn't effect game balance like cosmetics.
SOE's FTP business is akin to selling drugs - get people hooked with a little taste, then force them to keep spending more and more by nerfing the stuff they have and releasing stronger stuff they don't have. The TR AV weapons for the first few months are a case in point. I had to buy a new launcher 3 times because the current one got nerfed. They also waited to release key items like the striker until well after release just to get people to spend.
My main point in all this is that the moment EQ Next starts selling gear and skills and uses buffs and nerfs as a way to stimulate sales the game will begin to die.
All the real upgrades like better armour, ammo, shields, scopes etc.. must be earned in game.
The guns in the shop aren't better, they're just different. All splashing that $60 let you do is play more roles, it doesn't let you play a single role any better.
E.g. you buy an assault rifle for an infiltrator, you can now play it as an advanced infiltration class as well as a sniper (but you can't play both at one due to the limited load out). It hasn't bought you more raw power, its bought you horizontal progression faster than a guy not using the shop.
My only issue with EQ was the grind. EQ has always drawn me in and I'm looking forward to EQN to draw me in. EQN looks to be friendly to the casual folks out there. Can't wait to try it.
SOE hasn't done anything good since the original SWG...and we all know what SOE did to that game. My problem with SOE is that they seem to come out with a great game (hopefully), but then due to lack of development or greed, they ruin the game. Vanguard is a good example. It could have been a great game, but SOE just let it sit there and die. They fixed some bugs, but left many things buggy. I played it for a long time, but finally got fed up with SOE, and haven't been back since. The same goes for DCUO. They promised really fast updates and such, but that didn't happen until they saw $$ by selling what most games give away for free.
One thing I've learned in my 25+ years of online gaming is that listening to the players too much is a 100% sure recipe for total disaster for your game.
There's a good reason why there are people called "developers", "designers", "artists". Because they know better than a player how to make a good game.
Players are like the guy who empties the trashcans in the NASA facilities and then would suddenly think they know better than the scientists working there how to design and launch a space ship.
You players are consumers. You buy and play games, you buy and eat bread. The baker still makes bread much better than most of you would be able to. You buy cars, but most of you wouldn't be able to build you own car. Same for video games. That's what professionals are for. Just because you drive a car (or play a game) doesn't mean you can design a good one. Just because you read a book doesn't mean you have the ability to write an equally good one.
i don't believe i want to even think about that. just gonna wait and see what happens with Landmark first.
"There are at least two kinds of games. One could be called finite, the other infinite. A finite game is played for the purpose of winning, an infinite game for the purpose of continuing play." Finite and Infinite Games, James Carse
PS2 wasn't that bad in terms of gameplay, but I agree the performance issues should have been addressed sooner.
its moreso the FTP business model that I am worried about. PS2 nickel and dimed the player for everything and was very much Pay2Win. People who paid a 6 month sub progressed up to 300% faster than free players.
OP Guns were released so everybody bought them then they were nerfed a little while later. suddenly a new OP gun was released that everyone now had to buy and rinse repeat.
I have serious concerns about SOE's ability to create a non-pay to win game. I think they are more interested in creating an addictive slot machine than they are in selling a game that people buy based on its merits.
If you think PS2 is pay-to-win then you were either bad at the game or misinformed (have you actually played it?) I haven't spent a cent and my K/D is edging towards 5/1. I spend most of my time sniping/pistoling and other times supporting w/armor, particularly providing anti-air support with a skyguard.
Never once have I felt that paying players have any advantage over me, except for the very, very beginning of my character. Get a few certs together, specialize, 1 decent gun. Good to go. Lot of misinformed posts about PS2 on this thread I find.
Pay-to-win only applies when players who spend money have access to gameplay advantages that other players do not. Leveling up is not important in this game.
I think it is way too early to call this game some sort of a failure. For a free game, you get great value, the game is still very much alive and kicking, especially when it goes cross-platform, it will boom.
After subscribing for 8 Years of playing SWG accumulating virtual wealth and many friendships and then having SOE pull the plug without any sort of reward or backup of your personal data maybe to plug it in a private server I will never give any more money to SOE why would you invested money and time in something that SOE will steal everything you achieved.
ASROCK Z97 E-ITX Intel i7 4790k @ 4.5Ghz+KrakenX41 Gigabyte 1070 8GB Mini OC 16GB Crucial 1333mhz 1.3V SWG 8 Year Vet, WW2OL 8 Year Vet. Aka Darksparrow Rancorheart(tempest/farstar), Fxmkorp
After subscribing for 8 Years of playing SWG accumulating virtual wealth and many friendships and then having SOE pull the plug without any sort of reward or backup of your personal data maybe to plug it in a private server I will never give any more money to SOE why would you invested money and time in something that SOE will steal everything you achieved.
Have a nice life then. I doubt your protest will effect SOE in any way. Oh btw you do realize the ip owners told sony to pull the plug right. You might as well go scream at the mouse
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
After subscribing for 8 Years of playing SWG accumulating virtual wealth and many friendships and then having SOE pull the plug without any sort of reward or backup of your personal data maybe to plug it in a private server I will never give any more money to SOE why would you invested money and time in something that SOE will steal everything you achieved.
Everything has an end in this world, and it was just a game...
At least they didn't pull the plug just after releasing a paying expansion, like Turbine did with AC2.
Eventually. No matter how stubborn a thing is, it will eventually wear down and learn to adapt, learn, improve and change.
The question is WHEN. We will only get the answer when EQN goes into closed beta (which may be already too late to make changes to any core game rules, unless SOE wants to scrap EQN again like what they did to ex-EQN)
The possibility of the universe collapsing into a singularity is higher than the birth of a perfect MMORPG.
Originally posted by goldtoof Didn't Lucas arts pull the plug on swg, not Sony?
Basicly because they'd sold the rights to EA.
We simple players can only know if either side gives an official statement on who is responsible for unplugging SWG. (And perhaps there is, just that the statement is lost in space and players get clueless again).
The possibility of the universe collapsing into a singularity is higher than the birth of a perfect MMORPG.
so tell me you really think devs learned anything for the last decade? they only care is is get better graphics and make graphic novels not games, a lot of games out there are pretty much that graphic novels, we also ahve devs who think they games should have options to skip all form of combat to anyone who want it, so they are telling us gameplay is NOT they main concern, they care only about graphics and story.
so I ask you really think they can learn anything after so many flops? if they could learn anything they would never repeat this many flops one after another
Comments
All guns can be earned in game except them gold plated ones which are EXACTLY the same as the normal guns except they are gold.
People who sub progress faster. Sure. What's wrong with that? Are they supposed to make a game for free? Should free loaders get exactly the same things as paying members? Compared to other games, at least as a f2p player you have access to the whole game.
I will agree SOE has had its issues. But as far a company, they have had all of most favorite games. SWG, DCUO, Planeside 2
I've have a station account for 11 years. if they brought SWG back, as it was at end, I would resub immediately.
How can you not like a company that makes all the best games?
Played:SWG(pre NGE/CU sucked)Yep its true, anyone who quit SWG because of the NGE/CU missed out on a much better combat system. DCUO, Fallen Earth, STO, The Secret World. Battlefield series. Planetside 2. Still playing SWG.
while the claim of it not being P2W is not that strong, after all, there are a vast number of weapons that give a huge advantage, that cost a fortune in cert points, sure, you could save them up eventually, but for some of them it would take literally weeks of playing to achieve, Take heavies, mine is equipped with either a TMG 50, or one of the SMG's with an annihilator (totally wasted money on the annihilator
) and have a pistol, which i also bought in the cash shop.. commissioner.. at close range it will out damage just about every other weapon out there. i probably could have got them with certs, but it would have taken a very long time, months most likely.. and in the meantime i would have had to forget about getting things like, better shield or armour, scopes for weapons, or vehicle certs.. any vehicle certs.. so.. P2W .. maybe.. maybe not.. but Pay to compete.. without a shred of doubt, hell yes. 
Sure you can unlock the guns if you grind for months whereas someone can pay $60 and have all of that progress instantly and have massive advantages in terms of equipment. How is that not pay 2 win? Are you trying to tell me buying rocket pods for my mosquito on day 1 isn't pay 2 win? Free players are just fodder for everyone else.
And the releasing of OP items for RMT then nerfing them a week later is extremely unethical. The guns also had nearly identical skins, so all they had to do was change the name and some stats then re-sell the same item practically.
Obviously they need to make money, that is why you sell the game for a box price then use RMT for stuff that doesn't effect game balance like cosmetics.
SOE's FTP business is akin to selling drugs - get people hooked with a little taste, then force them to keep spending more and more by nerfing the stuff they have and releasing stronger stuff they don't have. The TR AV weapons for the first few months are a case in point. I had to buy a new launcher 3 times because the current one got nerfed. They also waited to release key items like the striker until well after release just to get people to spend.
My main point in all this is that the moment EQ Next starts selling gear and skills and uses buffs and nerfs as a way to stimulate sales the game will begin to die.
All the real upgrades like better armour, ammo, shields, scopes etc.. must be earned in game.
The guns in the shop aren't better, they're just different. All splashing that $60 let you do is play more roles, it doesn't let you play a single role any better.
E.g. you buy an assault rifle for an infiltrator, you can now play it as an advanced infiltration class as well as a sniper (but you can't play both at one due to the limited load out). It hasn't bought you more raw power, its bought you horizontal progression faster than a guy not using the shop.
I would say yes.
I haven't seen mention of working with Lucas Arts.
"Everything is mine and your woman too"
One thing I've learned in my 25+ years of online gaming is that listening to the players too much is a 100% sure recipe for total disaster for your game.
There's a good reason why there are people called "developers", "designers", "artists". Because they know better than a player how to make a good game.
Players are like the guy who empties the trashcans in the NASA facilities and then would suddenly think they know better than the scientists working there how to design and launch a space ship.
You players are consumers. You buy and play games, you buy and eat bread. The baker still makes bread much better than most of you would be able to. You buy cars, but most of you wouldn't be able to build you own car. Same for video games. That's what professionals are for. Just because you drive a car (or play a game) doesn't mean you can design a good one. Just because you read a book doesn't mean you have the ability to write an equally good one.
My computer is better than yours.
Yeah I agree, its my main worry with games like ESO, too many cooks spoiling the broth
"There are at least two kinds of games.
One could be called finite, the other infinite.
A finite game is played for the purpose of winning,
an infinite game for the purpose of continuing play."
Finite and Infinite Games, James Carse
If you think PS2 is pay-to-win then you were either bad at the game or misinformed (have you actually played it?) I haven't spent a cent and my K/D is edging towards 5/1. I spend most of my time sniping/pistoling and other times supporting w/armor, particularly providing anti-air support with a skyguard.
Never once have I felt that paying players have any advantage over me, except for the very, very beginning of my character. Get a few certs together, specialize, 1 decent gun. Good to go. Lot of misinformed posts about PS2 on this thread I find.
Pay-to-win only applies when players who spend money have access to gameplay advantages that other players do not. Leveling up is not important in this game.
I think it is way too early to call this game some sort of a failure. For a free game, you get great value, the game is still very much alive and kicking, especially when it goes cross-platform, it will boom.
O_o o_O
SOE hasn't learned on/with any of their previous games, why should this be any different?
It is already going to be a stripped down, dumbed down, cartoony, made-for-console mess, so what haven't they screwed up out of the gate?
After subscribing for 8 Years of playing SWG accumulating virtual wealth and many friendships and then having SOE pull the plug without any sort of reward or backup of your personal data maybe to plug it in a private server I will never give any more money to SOE why would you invested money and time in something that SOE will steal everything you achieved.
ASROCK Z97 E-ITX
Intel i7 4790k @ 4.5Ghz+KrakenX41
Gigabyte 1070 8GB Mini OC
16GB Crucial 1333mhz 1.3V
SWG 8 Year Vet, WW2OL 8 Year Vet.
Aka Darksparrow Rancorheart(tempest/farstar), Fxmkorp
Have a nice life then. I doubt your protest will effect SOE in any way. Oh btw you do realize the ip owners told sony to pull the plug right. You might as well go scream at the mouse
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
Everything has an end in this world, and it was just a game...
At least they didn't pull the plug just after releasing a paying expansion, like Turbine did with AC2.
My computer is better than yours.
Eventually. No matter how stubborn a thing is, it will eventually wear down and learn to adapt, learn, improve and change.
The question is WHEN. We will only get the answer when EQN goes into closed beta (which may be already too late to make changes to any core game rules, unless SOE wants to scrap EQN again like what they did to ex-EQN)
The possibility of the universe collapsing into a singularity is higher than the birth of a perfect MMORPG.
I've learned my lesson from SOE, I simply don't give them any money to play their games.
(I can't, their almost all F2P)
The above is my personal opinion. Anyone displaying a view contrary to my opinion is obviously WRONG and should STHU. (neener neener)
-The MMO Forum Community
Basicly because they'd sold the rights to EA.
We simple players can only know if either side gives an official statement on who is responsible for unplugging SWG. (And perhaps there is, just that the statement is lost in space and players get clueless again).
The possibility of the universe collapsing into a singularity is higher than the birth of a perfect MMORPG.
so tell me you really think devs learned anything for the last decade? they only care is is get better graphics and make graphic novels not games, a lot of games out there are pretty much that graphic novels, we also ahve devs who think they games should have options to skip all form of combat to anyone who want it, so they are telling us gameplay is NOT they main concern, they care only about graphics and story.
so I ask you really think they can learn anything after so many flops? if they could learn anything they would never repeat this many flops one after another