If you want a valid comparison, I could come up with a list that asked for money up front, gave an estimate, didn't deliver, and then asked for more money. This money, however, is not going to speed up the delayed game. Instead, the money will serve to expand a game that still hasn't fulfilled original promises, thus delaying the game again. Would you like that list?
So, what game company do you work for? Or maybe there is just some other game you're rooting for and you're just hating on this game because you think it might be competition. I only ask because I can't see why someone would waste their time like you're doing on these forums.
I'll tell you one thing.. you're not half as smart as you think you are. To any rationally thinking person, it's pretty clear you've got an agenda.
Even though kickstarter requires you to give an estimate.. you're just running with that as if this game has been delayed.. it hasn't as no actual release date has ever been set... fact.
Some of you act like kickstarter is to set a games budget... What? Maybe you guys should take the time to actually learn what things are before making things up that fit into your doom and gloom scenarios. The original kickstarter was never intended to be this games budget... it was to help them get things that could help with development... or to hire outside people for things.. like artwork. But they raised a whole 50K, you say?... yea I know.. it's so much I couldn't possibly see how that wouldn't last till the game released... It's apparent that some of you have no idea how much it costs or what goes into making an MMO. But that sure doesn't stop you from preaching your ignorance.
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
There's a lot of lengthy posts on that subject already but a the cliff notes version is:
- Bioware used a version of Hero Engine that was not meant to be licensed. It was basically the alpha version of the engine used for Hero's Journey that they wanted to license to reduce development time. It had some pretty serious problems. For example, they had issues with keeping everyone connected and editing together so had to break into teams of 25 people with their separate builds, which isn't something they anticipated. Those issues were smoothed out over time.
- The current version of Hero Engine has gone through many, many patches since that point. It has a completely new renderer, along with many other features that were not present in the version that Bioware licensed.
- For MMOs the engine isn't just referring to the renderer, and I think that's a common misconception. Players are used to the engine meaning the graphics. Hero Engine's renderer can be replaced. It's largest strength isn't in it's rendering (which is sufficient but not cutting edge), it is in its networking, FX, Seamless support, Spatial Awareness, Spec System, etc. It handles all the under the hood systems which are often very MMO specific things. IMO for a general purpose MMO engine it's the best solution on the market. As a rendering engine there's certainly better options out there.
- The engine does not make the game. The engine didn't make TOR a theme park game, nor did it cause it to run poorly in Ilum, two common complaints that get brought up when discussing it. Those are design decisions that were made by Bioware based on their vision for the game. The engine itself is pretty low level and you build on top of it. They made decisions which they felt were right for their audience, but those decisions contributed to Ilum running poorly (because the game was designed as solo or small group game and had a lot of customization in armor looks). They choose the theme park story driven gameplay because they felt that was what the majority of players wanted. Unfortunately for them the timing may have been bad. Add on top of that the shut down of SWG had a lot of players rooting for the game to fail, and who had expectations that didn't necessarily coincide with Bioware's own.
Right. The gullible never cease to amaze me. People never seem to learn.
How about they just release the game as originally promised and then use that money to add more? Then, at least, people will have some idea whether this company has ANY competence whatsoever. All they have now is promises, from a company with no history.
Not free to play system, which will gouge you any chance it gets, since it is the only way to make money(aside from endless kickstarters, which gives them free money).
I agree with you.
Coming back begging for seconds instead of working with what they got from the first one is shady enough. If they needed more from the first kickstarter they should have put it up for more. People are so gullible to go back and give them more. I don't give a crap that their staff is underpaid, and they're working with their own money, that's what they signed up for when they started the game, so I have no sympathy for them, they stand to make hundreds of thousands to millions depending on the suckers that use their cash shop and backed them anyways when they release.
Why do you keep coming back to their forum and posting negative stuff if you don't care? Obviously you are interested or something because you guys keep coming back. You jealous of them or something? Looks like it. Or are you "B" trolling, which is against the forum rules here. Let these guys be, worry about your games that you are interested in playing, obviously it's not this one so move on. Look at the topic^^^^^ it's for people who want to play the game to discuss. You'd be better off making Repopulation vodoo dolls and stabbing them to death. If you are trying to make this a contest you will lose, they have a very big following and their fans are just going to tear you apart in the long run.
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
It's quite well known, I think at least, that BioWare got their hands on the Hero engine early on, and further on modified it heavily to fit their, uh, needs.
I wouldn't condemn a game for using it without first trying it. And certainly I don't have enough technical know-how to even know if the Hero engine will always play out like SWTOR. I sincerely doubt it though ^^
I want to like this game. Yet the pvp focus has me shaking my head and asking why. The decision to force players in to pvp if they want to be part of a player city to run their shop is a game play option that keeps me away . I was told once that they were looking in to this and were trying to come up with other options and have yet to see any changes.
Is it asking to much for us non combat guys to get a game once with as much focus on us as a game from 2003?
You will be able to set up player stalls else where in the world. Player cities are also defacto safe zones outside a siege setting from my understanding.
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
I highly doubt the hero engine will cause the issues you all seem to think it will. Bioware didn't make an MMO with it, they made a co-op RPG. The issues they had with lag and latency was caused by other problems which, AFAIK, Biowear has fixed.
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
I highly doubt the hero engine will cause the issues you all seem to think it will. Bioware didn't make an MMO with it, they made a co-op RPG. The issues they had with lag and latency was caused by other problems which, AFAIK, Biowear has fixed.
And that was supposed to be vort3x I agreed with lol
And since only one MMO has been made with the HERO Engine and it had to be tweaked a lot for it to even run a MMO we'll see...
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
I highly doubt the hero engine will cause the issues you all seem to think it will. Bioware didn't make an MMO with it, they made a co-op RPG. The issues they had with lag and latency was caused by other problems which, AFAIK, Biowear has fixed.
And that was supposed to be vort3x I agreed with lol
And since only one MMO has been made with the HERO Engine and it had to be tweaked a lot for it to even run a MMO we'll see...
STOR used Hero before Hero was finished though. Biowear they didn't even ATTEMPT to build an MMO with it either. Tje entire game's base was designed as a co-op RPG from the ground up. That's why SWTOR failed. That's my only point. We'll see when alpha 3 and beta 1 launch, but I doubt it'll be a problem.
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
I believe ESO is also going to be using the HERO engine...and it is full of zones... Any serious attempt to do something new in the genre should be in a massive zoneless world like Asheron's Call or (I think) Darkfall.
I think they will pull it off but I think where they will hit roadblocks is with Rubber-banning and server pop size. What I mean is, they will have a hell of a time trying to get server stability for the pop sizes they predict they can hold. I think they will be in for a rude awakening. Besides that I think they will pull it all off and we will have smaller pop servers which is not what they planned.
"The King and the Pawn return to the same box at the end of the game"
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
I believe ESO is also going to be using the HERO engine...and it is full of zones... Any serious attempt to do something new in the genre should be in a massive zoneless world like Asheron's Call or (I think) Darkfall.
ESO used the hero engine for a tech demo, afaik they have a different engine for the game itself. There is however very clear evidence that the hero engine IS one of the biggest factors in SW;TOR for its early problems, and why they had to drop open world PVP, because it couldn't handle more than a few dozen players at a time, and while the game has improved since then, there has been no attempt to reinstate the OW PvP. There has been no evidence to suggest that the Hero Engine can handle anything beyond small numbers of players per zone in an MMO, beyond anecdotal claims to the contrary, which frankly, need something more substantial to back them up. If the Repopulation is able to utilise the Hero Engine in such a way that they can prove the Hero Engine is up to it then all well and good, but frankly, seeing is believing, and as yet there is no evidence to support they can. imo, it would definitely be in the intersts of the developers of the Hero Engine, to support the Repopulation as much as they can, as imo, their own reputation perhaps even their credibility is pretty much on the line here.
If you want a comparable list, you'd need to have the same parameters to your own. You can't ask for numbers that are literally completely irrelevant to your situation. So, do you want a list of those MMOS that asked for 2 kickstarters, exaggerated the date, pushed it back under the same premise of having your hand out a second time?
As you well know Kickstarter has only come into fruition over the past two years, we were one of the early Kickstarter MMOs. Considering the MMO development cycle, it's a loaded question. We were the only of those titles that did Kickstart that was already mid-development. The others were in the concept phase and as a result set dates which have not yet passed. That having been said, as has already been pointed out multiple times we never had a firm launch date, just the estimated date that Kickstarter required. You know this of course. A good bounce back question would be what other MMO has Kickstarted and had a projected launch date that has not yet passed? Or better yet how many MMOs actually launch on their original projection date? In most cases MMOs launch when the publisher decides that it's time to ship them, not when the developer feels its ready.
That having been said, there have been multiple titles that have run multiple crowd funding campaigns. If you want to restrict it to MMOs there haven't been many successful MMO kickstarters. Of those that have Pathfinder and Divergence have both have two Kickstarter/IndieGogo campaigns. The bulk of Kickstarted MMOs turn to an on-site store, however which is the exact same thing except without the time limit. The most successful of those are of course Star Citizen and Shroud of the Avatar. Running an on-site store for a year is no different than running twelve 30 day Kickstarters back to back. It's more convenient for the developers, and they give up a smaller cut. In our case though we wanted the short window to lock down features. You also already know this. So while the first part of your question is loaded (for one the game wasn't technically delayed it just missed a projection made 19 months ago, and for two there isn't a single other Kickstarted MMO to my knowledge which had a launch projection in 2013), just in this above paragraph you have four names that have double dipped. Of course I had already given similar information before, and you would have already known the answer. We aren't afraid to answer anyone's questions. Though at this point it's only feeding the troll so unless there is a legitimate question in there I'm done with your posts.
Your asking me to answer a loaded question, but I have been able to give you an answer. I asked you what should be a very easy one, considering you feel this game won't be out until 2016 and that it's taken so long to come to market. Which MMOs were announced after the Repopulation which have already shipped? Rather than answer that you gave me back a loaded question. Now I've answered your loaded question, but you never answered mine. I won't hold you to answering this, as it's probably time for this dialog to end. Let's just say that if there has been a game that fits that criteria it would be obscure and rare and that Repop's development cycle hasn't been anything out of the ordinary.
I want to like this game. Yet the pvp focus has me shaking my head and asking why. The decision to force players in to pvp if they want to be part of a player city to run their shop is a game play option that keeps me away . I was told once that they were looking in to this and were trying to come up with other options and have yet to see any changes.
Is it asking to much for us non combat guys to get a game once with as much focus on us as a game from 2003?
Not true. Taken from their new KS campaign..
"Traveling Shop
You can take the show on the road and become your own traveling shop. As long as you are logged in you can setup shop and sell your own goods from your inventory. A special marker will indicate that you are open for shop. Traveling shops will also have some rules and taxation options applied if they setup shops in player cities if desired by that city. This perk will be added to the one time purchase Platinum Membership."
Although they haven't reached that stretch goal at least they are making progress to do it, so you can't say they aren't trying as you do in every thread about this game.
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
I believe ESO is also going to be using the HERO engine...and it is full of zones... Any serious attempt to do something new in the genre should be in a massive zoneless world like Asheron's Call or (I think) Darkfall.
ESO used the hero engine for a tech demo, afaik they have a different engine for the game itself. There is however very clear evidence that the hero engine IS one of the biggest factors in SW;TOR for its early problems, and why they had to drop open world PVP, because it couldn't handle more than a few dozen players at a time, and while the game has improved since then, there has been no attempt to reinstate the OW PvP. There has been no evidence to suggest that the Hero Engine can handle anything beyond small numbers of players per zone in an MMO, beyond anecdotal claims to the contrary, which frankly, need something more substantial to back them up. If the Repopulation is able to utilise the Hero Engine in such a way that they can prove the Hero Engine is up to it then all well and good, but frankly, seeing is believing, and as yet there is no evidence to support they can. imo, it would definitely be in the intersts of the developers of the Hero Engine, to support the Repopulation as much as they can, as imo, their own reputation perhaps even their credibility is pretty much on the line here.
I dont buy that argument considering the game was designed, from the ground up, to be a co-op RPG not an MMO. I believe they said that tech limitations as an excuse. There's no reason to believe the engine can't be used for what they are intending. Look at what Unity can pull off
I think the above post is pretty accurate regarding TOR and Ilum. TOR's performance issues in Ilum were related to design decisions. It wasn't an open world PvP game. They were cinematic heavy and it was mainly a solo or 5 man group game. So for that design it made sense for them to do what they did. They used higher than normal polygon counts, and they offered a ton of different outfit looks. If they had been a PvP centric game they probably would have went for less outfits and the game would have performed much better in large scale combat, though it would have sacrificed in the other areas.
It's a balancing act that each game needs to make on its own. And it's not an easy choice. Players want the customization, but they also want performance. From my standpoint TOR was performant until you started getting to those large scenes.
A quick graphics primer for anyone interested on why the customization hurts. In a single player game characters are using one preset model generally, where in an MMO you have many parts, and those parts can have different texture variations. That means that if you have 5 different visible parts + your face that's a lot of different state changes to render a single character. But where it really becomes an issue is when it comes to large scale battles. Not only does each character now require more texture memory and more draw calls/state changes... but you can't batch render them all. Batch/instanced rendering is much faster, but MMOs with any type of customization can't perform those optimizations.
The more customization you have the worst it gets, because it's less likely two players will be wearing the same outfits, not to mention the escalating texture memory and bandwidth costs. So it's a tough spot for developers. There's no perfect solution. TOR choose a solution which generally worked well for their game. But it failed in the large scale PvP task, yet it gets chastised quite often for that failing, which is unfair imo. I think if they felt open world PvP was a larger part of the game they would have made different design choices. But at launch Ilum was incomplete. It was one of those things I think they likely decided they needed to have because players were requesting it. But it wasn't a core design feature.
I want to like this game. Yet the pvp focus has me shaking my head and asking why. The decision to force players in to pvp if they want to be part of a player city to run their shop is a game play option that keeps me away . I was told once that they were looking in to this and were trying to come up with other options and have yet to see any changes.
Is it asking to much for us non combat guys to get a game once with as much focus on us as a game from 2003?
But it doesn't even have any kind of player looting, this isn't Darkfall...
I want to like this game. Yet the pvp focus has me shaking my head and asking why. The decision to force players in to pvp if they want to be part of a player city to run their shop is a game play option that keeps me away . I was told once that they were looking in to this and were trying to come up with other options and have yet to see any changes.
Is it asking to much for us non combat guys to get a game once with as much focus on us as a game from 2003?
But it doesn't even have any kind of player looting, this isn't Darkfall...
repop does has playerlooting.. and hopefully full loot.. but i think its still for debat..
this is only for the hardcore server..
There is a carebear server aswell.. called pve server.. so both parties will be happy hopfully
Comments
So, what game company do you work for? Or maybe there is just some other game you're rooting for and you're just hating on this game because you think it might be competition. I only ask because I can't see why someone would waste their time like you're doing on these forums.
I'll tell you one thing.. you're not half as smart as you think you are. To any rationally thinking person, it's pretty clear you've got an agenda.
Even though kickstarter requires you to give an estimate.. you're just running with that as if this game has been delayed.. it hasn't as no actual release date has ever been set... fact.
Some of you act like kickstarter is to set a games budget... What? Maybe you guys should take the time to actually learn what things are before making things up that fit into your doom and gloom scenarios. The original kickstarter was never intended to be this games budget... it was to help them get things that could help with development... or to hire outside people for things.. like artwork. But they raised a whole 50K, you say?... yea I know.. it's so much I couldn't possibly see how that wouldn't last till the game released... It's apparent that some of you have no idea how much it costs or what goes into making an MMO. But that sure doesn't stop you from preaching your ignorance.
I've been excited about this game up until the point when I saw that it's using the same engine as SWTOR...
Probably the worst AAA MMORPG engine ever created, unless they can make much much better use of it than BioWare did.
There's a lot of lengthy posts on that subject already but a the cliff notes version is:
- Bioware used a version of Hero Engine that was not meant to be licensed. It was basically the alpha version of the engine used for Hero's Journey that they wanted to license to reduce development time. It had some pretty serious problems. For example, they had issues with keeping everyone connected and editing together so had to break into teams of 25 people with their separate builds, which isn't something they anticipated. Those issues were smoothed out over time.
- The current version of Hero Engine has gone through many, many patches since that point. It has a completely new renderer, along with many other features that were not present in the version that Bioware licensed.
- For MMOs the engine isn't just referring to the renderer, and I think that's a common misconception. Players are used to the engine meaning the graphics. Hero Engine's renderer can be replaced. It's largest strength isn't in it's rendering (which is sufficient but not cutting edge), it is in its networking, FX, Seamless support, Spatial Awareness, Spec System, etc. It handles all the under the hood systems which are often very MMO specific things. IMO for a general purpose MMO engine it's the best solution on the market. As a rendering engine there's certainly better options out there.
- The engine does not make the game. The engine didn't make TOR a theme park game, nor did it cause it to run poorly in Ilum, two common complaints that get brought up when discussing it. Those are design decisions that were made by Bioware based on their vision for the game. The engine itself is pretty low level and you build on top of it. They made decisions which they felt were right for their audience, but those decisions contributed to Ilum running poorly (because the game was designed as solo or small group game and had a lot of customization in armor looks). They choose the theme park story driven gameplay because they felt that was what the majority of players wanted. Unfortunately for them the timing may have been bad. Add on top of that the shut down of SWG had a lot of players rooting for the game to fail, and who had expectations that didn't necessarily coincide with Bioware's own.
https://www.therepopulation.com - Sci Fi Sandbox.
Why do you keep coming back to their forum and posting negative stuff if you don't care? Obviously you are interested or something because you guys keep coming back. You jealous of them or something? Looks like it. Or are you "B" trolling, which is against the forum rules here. Let these guys be, worry about your games that you are interested in playing, obviously it's not this one so move on. Look at the topic^^^^^ it's for people who want to play the game to discuss. You'd be better off making Repopulation vodoo dolls and stabbing them to death. If you are trying to make this a contest you will lose, they have a very big following and their fans are just going to tear you apart in the long run.
It's quite well known, I think at least, that BioWare got their hands on the Hero engine early on, and further on modified it heavily to fit their, uh, needs.
I wouldn't condemn a game for using it without first trying it. And certainly I don't have enough technical know-how to even know if the Hero engine will always play out like SWTOR. I sincerely doubt it though ^^
You will be able to set up player stalls else where in the world. Player cities are also defacto safe zones outside a siege setting from my understanding.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Biowear made a co-op RPG and charged people money to play an MMORPG. That's why the game failed IMO.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
I actually agree with xpiher... It makes me nervous that they are using the HERO Engine because let's be honest, the HERO Engine is more or less for single player games and I've never seen it used in an MMO without having problems like there being lag when there are more than 10 players on the screen.
I want the Repopuulation to do well but it does worry me that the HERO Engine is being used...
Smile
I highly doubt the hero engine will cause the issues you all seem to think it will. Bioware didn't make an MMO with it, they made a co-op RPG. The issues they had with lag and latency was caused by other problems which, AFAIK, Biowear has fixed.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
And that was supposed to be vort3x I agreed with lol
And since only one MMO has been made with the HERO Engine and it had to be tweaked a lot for it to even run a MMO we'll see...
Smile
STOR used Hero before Hero was finished though. Biowear they didn't even ATTEMPT to build an MMO with it either. Tje entire game's base was designed as a co-op RPG from the ground up. That's why SWTOR failed. That's my only point. We'll see when alpha 3 and beta 1 launch, but I doubt it'll be a problem.
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
I believe ESO is also going to be using the HERO engine...and it is full of zones... Any serious attempt to do something new in the genre should be in a massive zoneless world like Asheron's Call or (I think) Darkfall.
ESO used the hero engine for a tech demo, afaik they have a different engine for the game itself. There is however very clear evidence that the hero engine IS one of the biggest factors in SW;TOR for its early problems, and why they had to drop open world PVP, because it couldn't handle more than a few dozen players at a time, and while the game has improved since then, there has been no attempt to reinstate the OW PvP. There has been no evidence to suggest that the Hero Engine can handle anything beyond small numbers of players per zone in an MMO, beyond anecdotal claims to the contrary, which frankly, need something more substantial to back them up. If the Repopulation is able to utilise the Hero Engine in such a way that they can prove the Hero Engine is up to it then all well and good, but frankly, seeing is believing, and as yet there is no evidence to support they can. imo, it would definitely be in the intersts of the developers of the Hero Engine, to support the Repopulation as much as they can, as imo, their own reputation perhaps even their credibility is pretty much on the line here.
As you well know Kickstarter has only come into fruition over the past two years, we were one of the early Kickstarter MMOs. Considering the MMO development cycle, it's a loaded question. We were the only of those titles that did Kickstart that was already mid-development. The others were in the concept phase and as a result set dates which have not yet passed. That having been said, as has already been pointed out multiple times we never had a firm launch date, just the estimated date that Kickstarter required. You know this of course. A good bounce back question would be what other MMO has Kickstarted and had a projected launch date that has not yet passed? Or better yet how many MMOs actually launch on their original projection date? In most cases MMOs launch when the publisher decides that it's time to ship them, not when the developer feels its ready.
That having been said, there have been multiple titles that have run multiple crowd funding campaigns. If you want to restrict it to MMOs there haven't been many successful MMO kickstarters. Of those that have Pathfinder and Divergence have both have two Kickstarter/IndieGogo campaigns. The bulk of Kickstarted MMOs turn to an on-site store, however which is the exact same thing except without the time limit. The most successful of those are of course Star Citizen and Shroud of the Avatar. Running an on-site store for a year is no different than running twelve 30 day Kickstarters back to back. It's more convenient for the developers, and they give up a smaller cut. In our case though we wanted the short window to lock down features. You also already know this. So while the first part of your question is loaded (for one the game wasn't technically delayed it just missed a projection made 19 months ago, and for two there isn't a single other Kickstarted MMO to my knowledge which had a launch projection in 2013), just in this above paragraph you have four names that have double dipped. Of course I had already given similar information before, and you would have already known the answer. We aren't afraid to answer anyone's questions. Though at this point it's only feeding the troll so unless there is a legitimate question in there I'm done with your posts.
Your asking me to answer a loaded question, but I have been able to give you an answer. I asked you what should be a very easy one, considering you feel this game won't be out until 2016 and that it's taken so long to come to market. Which MMOs were announced after the Repopulation which have already shipped? Rather than answer that you gave me back a loaded question. Now I've answered your loaded question, but you never answered mine. I won't hold you to answering this, as it's probably time for this dialog to end. Let's just say that if there has been a game that fits that criteria it would be obscure and rare and that Repop's development cycle hasn't been anything out of the ordinary.
https://www.therepopulation.com - Sci Fi Sandbox.
Not true. Taken from their new KS campaign..
"Traveling Shop
You can take the show on the road and become your own traveling shop. As long as you are logged in you can setup shop and sell your own goods from your inventory. A special marker will indicate that you are open for shop. Traveling shops will also have some rules and taxation options applied if they setup shops in player cities if desired by that city. This perk will be added to the one time purchase Platinum Membership."
Although they haven't reached that stretch goal at least they are making progress to do it, so you can't say they aren't trying as you do in every thread about this game.
I dont buy that argument considering the game was designed, from the ground up, to be a co-op RPG not an MMO. I believe they said that tech limitations as an excuse. There's no reason to believe the engine can't be used for what they are intending. Look at what Unity can pull off
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
I think the above post is pretty accurate regarding TOR and Ilum. TOR's performance issues in Ilum were related to design decisions. It wasn't an open world PvP game. They were cinematic heavy and it was mainly a solo or 5 man group game. So for that design it made sense for them to do what they did. They used higher than normal polygon counts, and they offered a ton of different outfit looks. If they had been a PvP centric game they probably would have went for less outfits and the game would have performed much better in large scale combat, though it would have sacrificed in the other areas.
It's a balancing act that each game needs to make on its own. And it's not an easy choice. Players want the customization, but they also want performance. From my standpoint TOR was performant until you started getting to those large scenes.
A quick graphics primer for anyone interested on why the customization hurts. In a single player game characters are using one preset model generally, where in an MMO you have many parts, and those parts can have different texture variations. That means that if you have 5 different visible parts + your face that's a lot of different state changes to render a single character. But where it really becomes an issue is when it comes to large scale battles. Not only does each character now require more texture memory and more draw calls/state changes... but you can't batch render them all. Batch/instanced rendering is much faster, but MMOs with any type of customization can't perform those optimizations.
The more customization you have the worst it gets, because it's less likely two players will be wearing the same outfits, not to mention the escalating texture memory and bandwidth costs. So it's a tough spot for developers. There's no perfect solution. TOR choose a solution which generally worked well for their game. But it failed in the large scale PvP task, yet it gets chastised quite often for that failing, which is unfair imo. I think if they felt open world PvP was a larger part of the game they would have made different design choices. But at launch Ilum was incomplete. It was one of those things I think they likely decided they needed to have because players were requesting it. But it wasn't a core design feature.
https://www.therepopulation.com - Sci Fi Sandbox.
But it doesn't even have any kind of player looting, this isn't Darkfall...
repop does has playerlooting.. and hopefully full loot.. but i think its still for debat..
this is only for the hardcore server..
There is a carebear server aswell.. called pve server.. so both parties will be happy hopfully
to the op...
We are all due for a next gen sandbox mmorpg, I am very excited as well.
The developers say Ultima and SWG inspirations into this game has gotten my vote and then some..