I came over to this article via a link from another website so just treat what I'm going to say as an outsider opinion please.
First of all thank you for the article. It has the most detailed information so far as to what is in or not in the patch.
I have to say that this article has some bias though. Your research is good, but I feel you do not accomplish remaining neutral and the title is also just sensationalist. I have no idea if this is always your style or if it's just oversight, but an article that focuses on providing the readers with 1st rate info should have no place for such opinions. You might think "get a load of this, a critic criticizing a critic", but no I'm just a reader and it should not be abnormal for a reader to criticize a critic No harsh feelings.
So here I go with a couple of quotes from your article:
- There was more good news about PvP gear. “PvP gear is only earned in PvP. We wanted to make sure that PvPers only have to do PvP to earn the gear they need. We want players to play the way they want to play, in the systems they want to engage in while playing Wildstar.”
- Another forum poster highlighted this imaginative use of game mechanics, combining a double-jump and dodge to create a “Super Dodge”.Luckily, Frost isn’t in a hurry to remove it. “You know how we say ‘The Devs are Listening?’ Well, we'll see how people use/hate/love/abuse this ability and react accordingly.”
You could simply just omit the words I've underlined above (it won't even mess up the sentences, the information you provide still gets across).
Again, please don't misunderstand me I'm not flaming you for this. All I wanted to do was note how some readers who have different opinions on those matters which are highly debateable could feel alienated when reading your article. It would be a shame for them to not get the intended enjoyment out of your article just because of ill feelings they develop against you.
Thanks for the feedback. Definitely no harsh feelings I'll try to clarify a couple of points.
Usually, articles are split into two categories: news (including interviews) and opinion (previews, reviews, columns etc). News remains very neutral , while opinion pieces will, naturally, use more opinionated language to reflect the author's opinion. It's actually a great thing if the reader disagrees, as that can inspire debate and discussion.
Sometimes there's a bit of a grey area, where you're reporting some new information but trying to provide your own opinion about it at the same time in order to put it in context. That's what I did in this case, as I'm only repeating quotes from what had already been published in the AMA thread (and linked to it so people could read them in full). If I was writing something as the primary source, my language would likely have been different. If I'd done a plain news article then I'd definitely have used different language but, as this is a column, I went with more opinion. There's definitely room on both sides though.
Finally, article titles (as is common across many, many outlets) are an editorial decision
Player of games, smither of words, former of opinions, and masher of keys. WildStar Columnist Currently playing: WildStar, Guild Wars 2, EVE Online, Vain Glory.
My vote is for big breasts. I just do not understand why fantasy/sci-fi gamers would want to play characters that look like normal people. The whole idea is to be someone better (or worse in the case of SWTOR). I want a fantasy world that is full of beautiful people (at least physically).
I am sure that many believe that big breasts really mean nothing in an MMO. They should look at the studies (don't have one at the top of my head but a search should find them easily) that show that better looking people do better economically in the real world. In the MMO world if I have to look at flat chested females my entire game session then instead of a 10 for the game it will get a 9.
I came over to this article via a link from another website so just treat what I'm going to say as an outsider opinion please.
First of all thank you for the article. It has the most detailed information so far as to what is in or not in the patch.
I have to say that this article has some bias though. Your research is good, but I feel you do not accomplish remaining neutral and the title is also just sensationalist. I have no idea if this is always your style or if it's just oversight, but an article that focuses on providing the readers with 1st rate info should have no place for such opinions. You might think "get a load of this, a critic criticizing a critic", but no I'm just a reader and it should not be abnormal for a reader to criticize a critic No harsh feelings.
So here I go with a couple of quotes from your article:
- There was more good news about PvP gear. “PvP gear is only earned in PvP. We wanted to make sure that PvPers only have to do PvP to earn the gear they need. We want players to play the way they want to play, in the systems they want to engage in while playing Wildstar.”
- Another forum poster highlighted this imaginative use of game mechanics, combining a double-jump and dodge to create a “Super Dodge”.Luckily, Frost isn’t in a hurry to remove it. “You know how we say ‘The Devs are Listening?’ Well, we'll see how people use/hate/love/abuse this ability and react accordingly.”
You could simply just omit the words I've underlined above (it won't even mess up the sentences, the information you provide still gets across).
Again, please don't misunderstand me I'm not flaming you for this. All I wanted to do was note how some readers who have different opinions on those matters which are highly debateable could feel alienated when reading your article. It would be a shame for them to not get the intended enjoyment out of your article just because of ill feelings they develop against you.
Thanks for the feedback. Definitely no harsh feelings I'll try to clarify a couple of points.
Usually, articles are split into two categories: news (including interviews) and opinion (previews, reviews, columns etc). News remains very neutral , while opinion pieces will, naturally, use more opinionated language to reflect the author's opinion. It's actually a great thing if the reader disagrees, as that can inspire debate and discussion.
Sometimes there's a bit of a grey area, where you're reporting some new information but trying to provide your own opinion about it at the same time in order to put it in context. That's what I did in this case, as I'm only repeating quotes from what had already been published in the AMA thread (and linked to it so people could read them in full). If I was writing something as the primary source, my language would likely have been different. If I'd done a plain news article then I'd definitely have used different language but, as this is a column, I went with more opinion. There's definitely room on both sides though.
Finally, article titles (as is common across many, many outlets) are an editorial decision
Thank you for the response.
Your answer is fair. Perhaps I'm unintentionally at fault here because this article was posted elsewhere as a "info on the new beta patch" thing. I should have looked further and saw this was a [Column] as it says on the title. It does seem ironic to me that an opinion article provides more concise info than news, though I suppose you can take that as a compliment.
It was an animation tech issue for a majority of that decision. Rigs and clipping were issues with sliders, and we didn't have the time to address those issues and get the game out at the appropriate time. We'll see in the future, though!
So basically we will never see it... It's one feature I really like about the Asian games. I like feeling I have some extra uniqueness. I'm surprised they had a hard time with it considering how many games have it these days.
Second, you're the only one remotely taking the position that Carbine has somehow gone ogre with their community over one Massively artilce. Eliot (the writer of the Nexus Telegraph) has been highly critical of WildStar regarding several decisions, especially the payment model. If Carbine suddenly made kneejerk reacitons based on Massively (or any media) articles, certainly they wouldn't have used breast size as the one issue to go "o jesus, we need to fix naow!"
Uhh, no. He's not the only one. I don't even care that much about boob size in Wildstar, but Carbine pandering to vocal minorities sets a very bad precedent. And after the forums explode on the hot issue, going full on Stanley Woo DING DONG BANNU RINE ENDS HERE deleting posts, locking threads, very ominous. Remember: The devs are listening. But only if you're a minority like feminist that aren't even going to play your game.
Funny how out of all that huge article, the breast size reduction is the one being talked about the most...gents you should probably focus less on MMOs and more on Hentai games? God knows those devs cater to your needs. Kudos to Carbine if they introduce this idea and publicize it just to get rid of all the kids yelling "BIG B00BZ!!". Otherwise, at long as it looks more realistic/reasonable now, I'll call it a good decision.
Wildstar is shaping up into an interesting game. However, I'm a bit surprised at the...lack...of information released. I get a feeling that the game is still 4-5 months away.
Might as well just remove female body out of the game out together just put girl hair on the guys. and girl faces opiton.
Should be opiton change breast size. So what girl gets jealous at avatar have bigger breast. That only reason girl gets upset there Jealous. Girl get jealous if there girl wear the same clothes there wearing
Hope I don't cause discomfort to some people, but we're joking. Do you honestly think that people care about breast sizes. Come on people, it's a joke! Smile! or don't!. A lot of us in the west take things too seriously and as a culture need to lighten up. Enjoy life, be grateful for what we have. Live let live!
Let's make more of a mountain of this mole hill...
I'm more convinced than ever that people will justify ANYTHING to be able to complain zealously about something...
So, everything else about the game was PERFECT - but now; with this news - you may as well burn the building down and start over right?
Get some perspective people. This is NOT an issue.
I kind of find this thread funny for this reason. I can understand why people don't like change, but this is out of hand. Oh well, I guess they are helping lower the hype of this game. We all know (at least I think we do...) how hyped games end up.
Might as well just remove female body out of the game out together just put girl hair on the guys. and girl faces opiton.
Should be opiton change breast size. So what girl gets jealous at avatar have bigger breast. That only reason girl gets upset there Jealous. Girl get jealous if there girl wear the same clothes there wearing
i thin saints row 4 is the game for you.
Any way i never really cared for the two volleyballs on a broomstick look that the Aurin had, and any attempt to make them a tad bit less disproportionate is welcome. Can´t at the moment remember how the human models looks (the curse of not being in the beta) but seeing as everything else having Super hero proportions i am sure it did not hurt.
I honestly don´t see what the fuzz is all about... But i guess some people feel that their "boy´s club" is in danger of becoming a modern and less sexist all access club instead... And that scares them, Because i am sure we would not see at all that much anger if they did it the opther way around and that is... well... scary if you have even a few points of cultural studies.
Originally posted by Shana77 As a large breasted woman I feel offended.
Why does that matter? There were probably small and/or average breasted women who were offended by the original model. Basing decisions on trying to avoid offending people is stupid, because no matter what you do, somebody is going to end up offended.
Obviously the best thing to do is add a slider. If that isn't in the cards for launch, determining and aiming at "average" size probably makes more sense than aiming at large or small, because unless they also give the characters large hips/butts, average will lead to a more proportional character, which tends to be a more attractive aesthetic. The first number and the last number in the chest/waist/hips measurements should ideally be identical, and both some amount larger than the waist.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
Second, you're the only one remotely taking the position that Carbine has somehow gone ogre with their community over one Massively artilce. Eliot (the writer of the Nexus Telegraph) has been highly critical of WildStar regarding several decisions, especially the payment model. If Carbine suddenly made kneejerk reacitons based on Massively (or any media) articles, certainly they wouldn't have used breast size as the one issue to go "o jesus, we need to fix naow!"
Uhh, no. He's not the only one. I don't even care that much about boob size in Wildstar, but Carbine pandering to vocal minorities sets a very bad precedent. And after the forums explode on the hot issue, going full on Stanley Woo DING DONG BANNU RINE ENDS HERE deleting posts, locking threads, very ominous. Remember: The devs are listening. But only if you're a minority like feminist that aren't even going to play your game.
First, I'm honored that you would choose your first post ever on MMORPG to discuss my point. Welcome to the forums.
Second, based on Carbine's track record there is no evidence that they have changed their overall approach to listening to beta testers and making changes, which is exactly what happened here. I like the fact that the majority doesn't always win - not just in gaming, but in life. If Henry Ford would have given people what they asked for, he would have given them a faster horse. The point is that regardless of who you are, if your idea has merit, it's considered. I think this is a plus for a developer. This proves that Carbine hasn't changed a bit.
If in 1982 we played with the current mentality, we would have burned down all the pac man games since the red ghost was clearly OP. Instead we just got better at the game.
fairly lame for bowing in to a vocal minority. but hey, want to appeal to a large audience? add in sliders then. then folks can customize bust, hips, etc. the initial offense doesn't make sense to me. mmo characters have been what I would call 'idealized' for at least the last 10 years. /shrug
WoW i was really considering giving this game a shot over eso until now. It's not the fact that they reduced the breast size, but the fact that they are banning people for talking about it on the forums is ridiculous. That just doesn't make any sense. I mean other companies like blizzard and anet might do what they want and not listen to the communities at all most of the time, but at least they are not banning people for giving an opinion on something when they are testing it and expected to give an opinion.
Remember everyone, having big breasts is sexist and oppressive these days. If this is how you're going to run your game then sorry but I've genuinely lost all interest in it, it's a shame because I really was interested in it, but I can't support this forced social justice "everyone must be average or it's sexist" crap. I hope you realize how ridiculous this is in the future but until then I'm done following WildStar.
Nah, but seriously, I don't understand why Carbine thinks that big breasts are off putting to all female gamers.
Have any of you played TERA? I have and I can tell you all that there were a ton of women playing it, I was in a big guild and we all used ventrilo. There was a ton of girls on it, most played Elin, but others played as humans and high elves, and the chests of those races were HUGE.
My point was the big chests on female characters didn't make them not want to play.
Originally posted by XilentStorm Should at least give a choice. Screw dumb feminists. I personally like normal sized ones but others may like it bigger so the option should stand.
Thing is, unless/until they add a slider, there are no options, there is just the way things are. In that situation, it's about picking one size and sticking with it, and average seems like a smarter choice than huge.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
Comments
Thanks for the feedback. Definitely no harsh feelings
I'll try to clarify a couple of points.
Usually, articles are split into two categories: news (including interviews) and opinion (previews, reviews, columns etc). News remains very neutral , while opinion pieces will, naturally, use more opinionated language to reflect the author's opinion. It's actually a great thing if the reader disagrees, as that can inspire debate and discussion.
Sometimes there's a bit of a grey area, where you're reporting some new information but trying to provide your own opinion about it at the same time in order to put it in context. That's what I did in this case, as I'm only repeating quotes from what had already been published in the AMA thread (and linked to it so people could read them in full). If I was writing something as the primary source, my language would likely have been different. If I'd done a plain news article then I'd definitely have used different language but, as this is a column, I went with more opinion. There's definitely room on both sides though.
Finally, article titles (as is common across many, many outlets) are an editorial decision
Currently playing: WildStar, Guild Wars 2, EVE Online, Vain Glory.
My vote is for big breasts. I just do not understand why fantasy/sci-fi gamers would want to play characters that look like normal people. The whole idea is to be someone better (or worse in the case of SWTOR). I want a fantasy world that is full of beautiful people (at least physically).
I am sure that many believe that big breasts really mean nothing in an MMO. They should look at the studies (don't have one at the top of my head but a search should find them easily) that show that better looking people do better economically in the real world. In the MMO world if I have to look at flat chested females my entire game session then instead of a 10 for the game it will get a 9.
Thank you for the response.
Your answer is fair. Perhaps I'm unintentionally at fault here because this article was posted elsewhere as a "info on the new beta patch" thing. I should have looked further and saw this was a [Column] as it says on the title. It does seem ironic to me that an opinion article provides more concise info than news, though I suppose you can take that as a compliment.
So basically we will never see it... It's one feature I really like about the Asian games. I like feeling I have some extra uniqueness. I'm surprised they had a hard time with it considering how many games have it these days.
QFEx25
Uhh, no. He's not the only one. I don't even care that much about boob size in Wildstar, but Carbine pandering to vocal minorities sets a very bad precedent. And after the forums explode on the hot issue, going full on Stanley Woo DING DONG BANNU RINE ENDS HERE deleting posts, locking threads, very ominous. Remember: The devs are listening. But only if you're a minority like feminist that aren't even going to play your game.
Funny how out of all that huge article, the breast size reduction is the one being talked about the most...gents you should probably focus less on MMOs and more on Hentai games? God knows those devs cater to your needs. Kudos to Carbine if they introduce this idea and publicize it just to get rid of all the kids yelling "BIG B00BZ!!". Otherwise, at long as it looks more realistic/reasonable now, I'll call it a good decision.
Wildstar is shaping up into an interesting game. However, I'm a bit surprised at the...lack...of information released. I get a feeling that the game is still 4-5 months away.
Might as well just remove female body out of the game out together just put girl hair on the guys. and girl faces opiton.
Should be opiton change breast size. So what girl gets jealous at avatar have bigger breast. That only reason girl gets upset there Jealous. Girl get jealous if there girl wear the same clothes there wearing
There was never a choice with breast size. In fact this is more choice as they added chua medic...
I kind of find this thread funny for this reason. I can understand why people don't like change, but this is out of hand. Oh well, I guess they are helping lower the hype of this game. We all know (at least I think we do...) how hyped games end up.
i thin saints row 4 is the game for you.
Any way i never really cared for the two volleyballs on a broomstick look that the Aurin had, and any attempt to make them a tad bit less disproportionate is welcome. Can´t at the moment remember how the human models looks (the curse of not being in the beta) but seeing as everything else having Super hero proportions i am sure it did not hurt.
I honestly don´t see what the fuzz is all about... But i guess some people feel that their "boy´s club" is in danger of becoming a modern and less sexist all access club instead... And that scares them, Because i am sure we would not see at all that much anger if they did it the opther way around and that is... well... scary if you have even a few points of cultural studies.
This have been a good conversation
Why does that matter? There were probably small and/or average breasted women who were offended by the original model. Basing decisions on trying to avoid offending people is stupid, because no matter what you do, somebody is going to end up offended.
Obviously the best thing to do is add a slider. If that isn't in the cards for launch, determining and aiming at "average" size probably makes more sense than aiming at large or small, because unless they also give the characters large hips/butts, average will lead to a more proportional character, which tends to be a more attractive aesthetic. The first number and the last number in the chest/waist/hips measurements should ideally be identical, and both some amount larger than the waist.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
First, I'm honored that you would choose your first post ever on MMORPG to discuss my point. Welcome to the forums.
Second, based on Carbine's track record there is no evidence that they have changed their overall approach to listening to beta testers and making changes, which is exactly what happened here. I like the fact that the majority doesn't always win - not just in gaming, but in life. If Henry Ford would have given people what they asked for, he would have given them a faster horse. The point is that regardless of who you are, if your idea has merit, it's considered. I think this is a plus for a developer. This proves that Carbine hasn't changed a bit.
If in 1982 we played with the current mentality, we would have burned down all the pac man games since the red ghost was clearly OP. Instead we just got better at the game.
fairly lame for bowing in to a vocal minority. but hey, want to appeal to a large audience? add in sliders then. then folks can customize bust, hips, etc. the initial offense doesn't make sense to me. mmo characters have been what I would call 'idealized' for at least the last 10 years. /shrug
My husband will be very sad for sure. Me I do not care either way but yumping yellybean is this an issue really ?
so say we all
"YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA~!"
Nah, but seriously, I don't understand why Carbine thinks that big breasts are off putting to all female gamers.
Have any of you played TERA? I have and I can tell you all that there were a ton of women playing it, I was in a big guild and we all used ventrilo. There was a ton of girls on it, most played Elin, but others played as humans and high elves, and the chests of those races were HUGE.
My point was the big chests on female characters didn't make them not want to play.
Thing is, unless/until they add a slider, there are no options, there is just the way things are. In that situation, it's about picking one size and sticking with it, and average seems like a smarter choice than huge.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.