Strange game. I started playing only 5/6 months ago. I got the impression they could have done with someone who actually played these types of games involved in the decisions. For example, I really enjoyed getting to level ten on the newbie island, got off it, and found just about everything in my inventory had vanished. By design. Now I appeared to be starting a new game. Very weird and it did contribute to me giving the game up pretty quick afterwards. Also, their free to play model was just stupid, not competitive in any way with the games peers.
It felt like one of those games that had great visions, but with a really mucked up implementation and poor current management.
This is going to be one of those everyone is sad to see it go but no one was actually playing it. ( obviously a few were )
It ran a hell of a lot longer than I ever thought it would.
Yep, this is what happens when people don't put their money where their mouth is. Everyone talks about wanting oldschool, but people don't support that.
It is sad for those who actually did play and pay. It always is.
SOE never took this game seriously. Why would you expect players to?
If SoE never took it seriously why did they spend so much time trying to get it playable? Why toss away so much $$ into something you arent serious about?
People have this very incorrect recollection of what happened. Game launched -> awful sales due to word of mouth/beta state -> quickly dropped below 50k -> SoE spends 18 months debugging, fixing, adding content -> subs down even further, below 25k -> SoE finally gives up until they tried it f2p years later
There was nothing to indicate to SoE "hey if you actively develop the game more people will come!". In fact there was 18 months of evidence against it.
First you say this RED
And then follow it up with this ORANGE.
Anyone else see the complete fail in this? Cherry picking facts to support your view is a misrepresentation of the truth. Do more research then get back to us.
How is this a misrepresentation? Its actually pretty black and white what happened.
Game sucked -> SoE tried to fix it while adding content -> no one came back, even more people left -> game was dead and and losing SoE lots of money -> SoE stopped development for several years
there is nothing dishonest or misleading about that. What is misleading, and actually a flat out lie, is people that say "Vanguard was dead because SoE didn't do anything with it". Did they lose people because they stopped development? of course. but the game was unquestionably dead by that point.
Now if you want to say SoE did a poor or inefficient job at the content additions and bug fixing thats a different discussion. My personal belief is that it was a simple case of 'you can't polish a turd', but maybe a different team could have done better. I seriously doubt any other team would have tried though.
Originally posted by Panther2103 Vanguard is one of the games that people really loved, but the people that loved it didn't play it.
Yup. Too many people go on and on about how great the game was, but if that was really the case, then why did so few people play it.
Vanguard: Saga of Heroes, the greatest game that no-one played.
Yes and no. I'm sure most VG-fans have played and paid for the game. You can't expect people to keep paying for abandonware year after year just to show support. SOE did nothing for years and years, so of course some of the players got frustrated with nothing being fixed or added.
How many years should people be paying SOE for doing absolutely nothing according to you then? It's like they decided to bleed it dry.. They didn't actively kill it, they just ignored the bleeding until it died on its own.
Bang on post. As and ex player (well, just come back for a bit of nostalgia before the death) I would have been happy to carry on with a sub, but back then they were having a laugh by taking the money and leaving the game to rot. No decent patches or game updates. It was a shame that Sony did not show the game more love.
Also an ex player. I started playing this game upon release. An extremely fun and challenging MMO! Sure, there were bugs but you looked passed them and just kept on playing.
A month prior to the announcement of shutdown I came back and restarted from scratch. The game had suffered some dumbing down in difficulty (easier mobs) but was somewhat challenging at times. But, once the announcement came there was no point in continuing anymore. I would be forced to quit anyway.
So, I hope one day I will see a challenging MMO again, but, somehow I doubt it. Challenge is apparently not part of this generation of gamers.
Copy paste of every shut down SoE game... I feel bad for the fans. You're not going to find a replacement any time soon.
Sadly no replacement indeed. VG was one of it's kind and it's real sad that $O€ kinda screwed it up like they did. This was the title they should have made F2P right after EQ2 went F2P and not convert it last and shut down half a year later...
Sadly no replacement indeed. VG was one of it's kind and it's real sad that $O€ kinda screwed it up like they did. This was the title they should have made F2P right after EQ2 went F2P and not convert it last and shut down half a year later...
Vanguard went f2p Aug 2012
Vanguard was f2p for 2 years before it was shut down
I'm not the sanest person in the world and I realize that, which is why I'm perfectly comfortable stating the following:
If there was any closing/closed MMO that I wished I had the money to buy and keep running, Vanguard is that MMO. With all that it does and all that it has the potential to be, I'm really going to miss this game.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Originally posted by centkin Someone should make a flash game that is the vanguard diplomacy thing for player vs player. I loved that aspect of vanguard.
+1
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
this game coulda been soo much but fell soo short..its a shame and the release of this game was a total wreck
they could re-release this game again and slap a new name on it and it would stick in the mmo community but its a shame INDEED
This makes me wonder how many closed MMOs - with the devs knowing what they know now about its audience size, strengths and shortcomings - could be updated, reopened, remarketed and run with a healthy population and at a profitable level.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Amazing how many people still think SoE had anything to do with how this game launched. They were just the ones who bailed it out after the train wreck. Kind of like Matrix Online. I think they might finally be learning they can't revive a bad launch. I wouldn't expect them to bail out any more MMOs, but you never know.
Originally posted by Dreamo84 Amazing how many people still think SoE had anything to do with how this game launched. They were just the ones who bailed it out after the train wreck. Kind of like Matrix Online. I think they might finally be learning they can't revive a bad launch. I wouldn't expect them to bail out any more MMOs, but you never know.
No, this game was launched as a SOE product, microsoft pulled out mid development. So without SOE the game would never have launched.
Originally posted by Dreamo84 Amazing how many people still think SoE had anything to do with how this game launched. They were just the ones who bailed it out after the train wreck. Kind of like Matrix Online. I think they might finally be learning they can't revive a bad launch. I wouldn't expect them to bail out any more MMOs, but you never know.
No, this game was launched as a SOE product, microsoft pulled out mid development. So without SOE the game would never have launched.
Vanguard launched as a Sigil product in Jan 2007 with SOE as the publisher
we own Vanguard and are co-publishing the game with SOE. We are not 'just a developer' like we were when we were under Microsoft -- we now have more control over our game than probably 90%+ of all developers out there (because we already owned the Vanguard IP, and now we are buying the publishing rights to Vanguard from Microsoft).
Originally posted by U-Turn Vanguard should have had a "Do Not Attempt Resuscitation." letter.
Many games could have said the same thing. Guess what, there are people who love this game and other ones that where shut down.
Originally posted by laokoko "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
Although I haven't played Vanguard for years it was 1 of those special games. Yes it had bugs but it was such a huge immersive game where you were free to do what ever where ever. It was an amazing experience.
I remember being on a bridge with my bro and saying look at that tiny dot in the sky i think its moving. Yeah it is, actually its getting closer... Then i hear my bro laugh through teamspeak and release he had taken off on his horse. It was a flying dragon and it swooped down and killed me lol. I was caught up in the lore.
I remember sailing our sloops to our property and building our houses, questing with friends and mining resources, everything about this game was close to perfect. shame the bugs and the need for a powerful pc ruined what could have been the MMO of MMo's
Comments
Strange game. I started playing only 5/6 months ago. I got the impression they could have done with someone who actually played these types of games involved in the decisions. For example, I really enjoyed getting to level ten on the newbie island, got off it, and found just about everything in my inventory had vanished. By design. Now I appeared to be starting a new game. Very weird and it did contribute to me giving the game up pretty quick afterwards. Also, their free to play model was just stupid, not competitive in any way with the games peers.
It felt like one of those games that had great visions, but with a really mucked up implementation and poor current management.
How is this a misrepresentation? Its actually pretty black and white what happened.
Game sucked -> SoE tried to fix it while adding content -> no one came back, even more people left -> game was dead and and losing SoE lots of money -> SoE stopped development for several years
there is nothing dishonest or misleading about that. What is misleading, and actually a flat out lie, is people that say "Vanguard was dead because SoE didn't do anything with it". Did they lose people because they stopped development? of course. but the game was unquestionably dead by that point.
Now if you want to say SoE did a poor or inefficient job at the content additions and bug fixing thats a different discussion. My personal belief is that it was a simple case of 'you can't polish a turd', but maybe a different team could have done better. I seriously doubt any other team would have tried though.
Yes and no. I'm sure most VG-fans have played and paid for the game. You can't expect people to keep paying for abandonware year after year just to show support. SOE did nothing for years and years, so of course some of the players got frustrated with nothing being fixed or added.
How many years should people be paying SOE for doing absolutely nothing according to you then? It's like they decided to bleed it dry.. They didn't actively kill it, they just ignored the bleeding until it died on its own.
Also an ex player. I started playing this game upon release. An extremely fun and challenging MMO! Sure, there were bugs but you looked passed them and just kept on playing.
A month prior to the announcement of shutdown I came back and restarted from scratch. The game had suffered some dumbing down in difficulty (easier mobs) but was somewhat challenging at times. But, once the announcement came there was no point in continuing anymore. I would be forced to quit anyway.
So, I hope one day I will see a challenging MMO again, but, somehow I doubt it. Challenge is apparently not part of this generation of gamers.
Rest in peace, Vanguard!
Memories never die!
Vanguard is together with Asherons Call my alltime favorit game,I will miss thisone.
I dont think we will ever se a game of this caliber again.
Sadly no replacement indeed. VG was one of it's kind and it's real sad that $O€ kinda screwed it up like they did. This was the title they should have made F2P right after EQ2 went F2P and not convert it last and shut down half a year later...
Vanguard went f2p Aug 2012
Vanguard was f2p for 2 years before it was shut down
for context, EQ2 went fully ftp Dec 2011
EQ went f2p March 2012, 6 months earlier than VG
EQ2 fan sites
I'm not the sanest person in the world and I realize that, which is why I'm perfectly comfortable stating the following:
If there was any closing/closed MMO that I wished I had the money to buy and keep running, Vanguard is that MMO. With all that it does and all that it has the potential to be, I'm really going to miss this game.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
+1
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
this game coulda been soo much but fell soo short..its a shame and the release of this game was a total wreck
they could re-release this game again and slap a new name on it and it would stick in the mmo community but its a shame INDEED
This makes me wonder how many closed MMOs - with the devs knowing what they know now about its audience size, strengths and shortcomings - could be updated, reopened, remarketed and run with a healthy population and at a profitable level.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
They would have to do a complete rewrite though.
The old engine was no longer worth supporting, it seems.
Or so they're claiming, anyway.
No, this game was launched as a SOE product, microsoft pulled out mid development. So without SOE the game would never have launched.
Vanguard launched as a Sigil product in Jan 2007 with SOE as the publisher
SOE did not acquire Sigil until May 2007
related clarification from Brad
http://www.silkyvenom.com/pages/devtracker/index.php?go=posts&get=thread&fromsite=1&id=51141&p=1
we own Vanguard and are co-publishing the game with SOE. We are not 'just a developer' like we were when we were under Microsoft -- we now have more control over our game than probably 90%+ of all developers out there (because we already owned the Vanguard IP, and now we are buying the publishing rights to Vanguard from Microsoft).
EQ2 fan sites
Many games could have said the same thing. Guess what, there are people who love this game and other ones that where shut down.
Originally posted by laokoko
"if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
Although I haven't played Vanguard for years it was 1 of those special games. Yes it had bugs but it was such a huge immersive game where you were free to do what ever where ever. It was an amazing experience.
I remember being on a bridge with my bro and saying look at that tiny dot in the sky i think its moving. Yeah it is, actually its getting closer... Then i hear my bro laugh through teamspeak and release he had taken off on his horse. It was a flying dragon and it swooped down and killed me lol. I was caught up in the lore.
I remember sailing our sloops to our property and building our houses, questing with friends and mining resources, everything about this game was close to perfect. shame the bugs and the need for a powerful pc ruined what could have been the MMO of MMo's
I just have a feel that...
O wait.....
Sad for those that enjoyed the game. Always loved the concept of this game.
As for me I left when Smed and SoE entered the picture.