Goodbye Vanguard: Saga of Heroes I shall miss you but it was never to be. I'll remember a fantastic attempt at making a huge vibrant online world that just missed the marque because of the scale they wanted to achieve.
This doom and gloom thread was brought to you by Chin Up the new ultra high caffeine soft drink for gamers who just need that boost of happiness after a long forum session.
I think this is going to be a morbid time for online gaming. Once a major publisher starts mass cancellations, it pushes other publishers to do the same for titles on the margins (to satisfy their investors). The writing is most definitely on the wall; if you aren't giving your publisher a ginormous profit margin, you are just one quarter away from having everything you put in the game taken away from you.
__________________________ "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it." --Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints." --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls." --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Vangaurd never recovered from its troubled birth and wasted years of youth, all its strengths be oversahdowed by that. New Players do not come bcs its old as shit for a game and old Player play it already or feel still burned to much. Rest Well!
Kids games - i do not wonder (Smedley: They spend less Money and do mean stuff to each other).
SWG inspired MMO: If i am not occupied by another MMO and you prove you can do a good SWG inspired game that has deep gameplay and good technic i will forgive you your Sins
"Torquemada... do not implore him for compassion. Torquemada... do not beg him for forgiveness. Torquemada... do not ask him for mercy. Let's face it, you can't Torquemada anything!"
Originally posted by jpaprocki EQ and EQ2 fans better be looking over their shoulders! The axeman cometh for you next. Long live EQN and EQN: Landmark...NOT. RIP sony! 0/
Delusional at best, SOE closing down EQ or EQ2 is the day SOE closes down themselves. You have to be pretty silly to think that SOE has put all it's eggs into EQN&EQL.
Goodbye VG. Sooooo many good memories, and an explorable danger filled world of wonder still yet to be matched in an MMO.
_________________________________ Vic - "Androzzi here" John - "Vic, your case just busted wide open." Vic - "So close it for me!" John - "Looks like your going to have to close it yourself, SHITTY!!!!"
Well, I'm genuinely bummed, I actually played this game. It didn't take up most of my gaming time but was one of the few games where I had a subscription.
bleh.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
It really amazes me how many people on these forums seem to honestly feel like companies have some kind of moral obligation to keep games running no matter how unsuccessful they are.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
Its fairly amusing for people to think that shutting down 4 of 10 online games they run, with 3 on deck, means that SOE is bleeding out.
I would imagine (thats how I phrase my conjecture, rather than pretending I know what SOE is thinking) they are re allocating the dev resources to the games that are doing well/new projects.
EQN and EQ Landmark are massively anticipated and from whats out on them, they should be outstanding additions. Its a shame Vanguard bit the dust, but thats McQuaid's fault, not SOEs.
Originally posted by Beatnik59 I think this is going to be a morbid time for online gaming. Once a major publisher starts mass cancellations, it pushes other publishers to do the same for titles on the margins (to satisfy their investors). The writing is most definitely on the wall; if you aren't giving your publisher a ginormous profit margin, you are just one quarter away from having everything you put in the game taken away from you.
It's all relative. SOE is going to take those resources and put them somewhere else to make more money. If a developer or publisher doesn't have a better alternative than where the resources are being spent now, then they aren't going to shut a game down and replace it with nothing.
Since the Reddit AMA seems to indicate that they are coming out with something to appeal to SWG fans, it seems likely that the resources are going to be directed to that new game, which will make them more money. Doors close, doors open. Things keep moving along.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Originally posted by Beatnik59 I think this is going to be a morbid time for online gaming. Once a major publisher starts mass cancellations, it pushes other publishers to do the same for titles on the margins (to satisfy their investors). The writing is most definitely on the wall; if you aren't giving your publisher a ginormous profit margin, you are just one quarter away from having everything you put in the game taken away from you.
It's all relative. SOE is going to take those resources and put them somewhere else to make more money. If a developer or publisher doesn't have a better alternative than where the resources are being spent now, then they aren't going to shut a game down and replace it with nothing.
Since the Reddit AMA seems to indicate that they are coming out with something to appeal to SWG fans, it seems likely that the resources are going to be directed to that new game, which will make them more money. Doors close, doors open. Things keep moving along.
If the door got slammed on the face of the Pre-CU folks before, what makes the Pre-CU fans think that the door won't get slammed on them again?
Closures and wholesale redesigns don't give people confidence to throw lots of money and time into these things. They only show how MMOs are, ultimately, not worth throwing time and money into.
__________________________ "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it." --Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints." --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls." --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Originally posted by Beatnik59 I think this is going to be a morbid time for online gaming. Once a major publisher starts mass cancellations, it pushes other publishers to do the same for titles on the margins (to satisfy their investors). The writing is most definitely on the wall; if you aren't giving your publisher a ginormous profit margin, you are just one quarter away from having everything you put in the game taken away from you.
This
Players (I will) will be leery of investing their money, time, and energy into a title they aren't certain will be around in the undetermined future.
WHAT?? I'm actually shocked. I can fully understand why VG is passing away but I wouldn't expect FR and the others too at the same time. They are still accepting FR player studio creations. I'd think people that spent a lot of time modeling stuff for that would be kind of pissed. Vanguard was a rough gem but I'm glad I was there for its best times. Somehow in the end I turned a profit selling my characters, everything on the vg exhange. I'm disappointed for the people that wanted to return after the full SOE game membership subscription.
So this is all to cut the fat, the less profitable games, however it also makes their proposed all-game subscription to loose it's appeal. They were discussing the need for different teirs because having kids games as part if this subscription change would be difficult. Well, that sure isn't a problem now.
Originally posted by Beatnik59 I think this is going to be a morbid time for online gaming. Once a major publisher starts mass cancellations, it pushes other publishers to do the same for titles on the margins (to satisfy their investors). The writing is most definitely on the wall; if you aren't giving your publisher a ginormous profit margin, you are just one quarter away from having everything you put in the game taken away from you.
This
Players (I will) will be leery of investing their money, time, and energy into a title they aren't certain will be around in the undetermined future.
The lesson isn't to never play, the lesson is to get in early. Every MMO will have a finite lifespan. Even WoW will likely become more trouble than it is worth at some future date. That doesn't take anything away from the fun you have while the games are here.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
Didn't even know there was an mmo based on the Star Wars: Clone Wars show lol. Can't say I'm surprised, as stated in the details, LucasArts new direction is away from spin-offs like this. I enjoyed this animated show as it is the only cartoon show I've watched since I was a kid, simply because it was Star Wars.
Sad to see any mmo shut down, while I never played Vanguard, those who invested countless hours into it have my sympathies.
Haxus Council Member 21 year MMO veteran PvP Raid Leader Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
That's sad, I had re-installed Vanguard not long ago and was really looking forward to sinking my teeth into it again... now I won't bother except to take screen shots and videos of things I want to remember. The rest, not sure I care, except I thought that FreeRealms was doing pretty good, and I had some fun with it when I tried it out.
------------------------- "Searchers after horror haunt strange, far places..." ~ H.P.Lovecraft, "From Beyond"
I'm not surprised by the list. It doesn't bode well for hardcore gaming though as both Vanguard and Wizardry Online were both considered to be champions for the financial viability of the hardcore MMO.
Originally posted by finnmacool1 Well if there was ever any doubt who the worse mmo publisher/developer in history is, this should put that argument to rest. What is that now, 7 of their games shut down?
At least we no longer have to hear the spin about how SOE "rescued" Vanguard and is solely responsible for it being enjoyable at all.
This is just the inevitability that began when they first purchased the title, they never gave more than a half-assed attempt to do anything with it. They were always killing Vanguard, they just did it as slowly as possibly while attempting to milk as much money as they could from fans' false hopes for its future.
because your savior and hero Mcquaid left it in such great shape when SOE purchased it. how long do you think Vanguard would have survived if SOE didn't pump money into it?
oh but everything is ok right its just big bad SOEs fault for Vanguard going down the drain. no blame at all on the Savior of the MMORPG industry Brad McQuaid for putting out a piece of crap and then ditching it?
and you guys are giving this guy money why?!?! this is like having a guy that robbed your house sell you "home invasion insurance" and you guys are buying it.
Comments
Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom
I just published a video regarding these developments
http://youtu.be/MKPyhqOjP84
This doom and gloom thread was brought to you by Chin Up the new ultra high caffeine soft drink for gamers who just need that boost of happiness after a long forum session.
I'm not an IT Specialist, Game Developer, or Clairvoyant in real life, but like others on here, I play one on the internet.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Imho SOE made the right decisions this time.
Vangaurd never recovered from its troubled birth and wasted years of youth, all its strengths be oversahdowed by that.
New Players do not come bcs its old as shit for a game and old Player play it already or feel still burned to much.
Rest Well!
Kids games - i do not wonder (Smedley: They spend less Money and do mean stuff to each other).
SWG inspired MMO: If i am not occupied by another MMO and you prove you can do a good SWG inspired game that has deep gameplay and good technic i will forgive you your Sins
"Torquemada... do not implore him for compassion. Torquemada... do not beg him for forgiveness. Torquemada... do not ask him for mercy. Let's face it, you can't Torquemada anything!"
MWO Music Video - What does the Mech say: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FF6HYNqCDLI
Johnny Cash - The Man Comes Around: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0x2iwK0BKM
Noo not vanguard I still subb to it!.
They just sent me a mail saying my new all access supports it.
Current games;
Star treck online
Rift
Eve online
Firefall
Delusional at best, SOE closing down EQ or EQ2 is the day SOE closes down themselves. You have to be pretty silly to think that SOE has put all it's eggs into EQN&EQL.
_________________________________
Vic - "Androzzi here"
John - "Vic, your case just busted wide open."
Vic - "So close it for me!"
John - "Looks like your going to have to close it yourself, SHITTY!!!!"
Main Game: Eldevin (Plat0nic)
2nd Game: Path of Exile (Platonic Hate)
Well, I'm genuinely bummed, I actually played this game. It didn't take up most of my gaming time but was one of the few games where I had a subscription.
bleh.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
Its fairly amusing for people to think that shutting down 4 of 10 online games they run, with 3 on deck, means that SOE is bleeding out.
I would imagine (thats how I phrase my conjecture, rather than pretending I know what SOE is thinking) they are re allocating the dev resources to the games that are doing well/new projects.
EQN and EQ Landmark are massively anticipated and from whats out on them, they should be outstanding additions. Its a shame Vanguard bit the dust, but thats McQuaid's fault, not SOEs.
It's all relative. SOE is going to take those resources and put them somewhere else to make more money. If a developer or publisher doesn't have a better alternative than where the resources are being spent now, then they aren't going to shut a game down and replace it with nothing.
Since the Reddit AMA seems to indicate that they are coming out with something to appeal to SWG fans, it seems likely that the resources are going to be directed to that new game, which will make them more money. Doors close, doors open. Things keep moving along.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
If the door got slammed on the face of the Pre-CU folks before, what makes the Pre-CU fans think that the door won't get slammed on them again?
Closures and wholesale redesigns don't give people confidence to throw lots of money and time into these things. They only show how MMOs are, ultimately, not worth throwing time and money into.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
This
Players (I will) will be leery of investing their money, time, and energy into a title they aren't certain will be around in the undetermined future.
WHAT?? I'm actually shocked. I can fully understand why VG is passing away but I wouldn't expect FR and the others too at the same time. They are still accepting FR player studio creations. I'd think people that spent a lot of time modeling stuff for that would be kind of pissed. Vanguard was a rough gem but I'm glad I was there for its best times. Somehow in the end I turned a profit selling my characters, everything on the vg exhange. I'm disappointed for the people that wanted to return after the full SOE game membership subscription.
So this is all to cut the fat, the less profitable games, however it also makes their proposed all-game subscription to loose it's appeal. They were discussing the need for different teirs because having kids games as part if this subscription change would be difficult. Well, that sure isn't a problem now.
The lesson isn't to never play, the lesson is to get in early. Every MMO will have a finite lifespan. Even WoW will likely become more trouble than it is worth at some future date. That doesn't take anything away from the fun you have while the games are here.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
Didn't even know there was an mmo based on the Star Wars: Clone Wars show lol. Can't say I'm surprised, as stated in the details, LucasArts new direction is away from spin-offs like this. I enjoyed this animated show as it is the only cartoon show I've watched since I was a kid, simply because it was Star Wars.
Sad to see any mmo shut down, while I never played Vanguard, those who invested countless hours into it have my sympathies.
21 year MMO veteran
PvP Raid Leader
Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
-------------------------
"Searchers after horror haunt strange, far places..." ~ H.P.Lovecraft, "From Beyond"
Member Since March 2004
because your savior and hero Mcquaid left it in such great shape when SOE purchased it. how long do you think Vanguard would have survived if SOE didn't pump money into it?
oh but everything is ok right its just big bad SOEs fault for Vanguard going down the drain. no blame at all on the Savior of the MMORPG industry Brad McQuaid for putting out a piece of crap and then ditching it?
and you guys are giving this guy money why?!?! this is like having a guy that robbed your house sell you "home invasion insurance" and you guys are buying it.
MY plans on getting the SoE all access took a hit, was looking forward to playing VG again, once I got it.
Too bad it never could recover from the bad launch.