Originally posted by joejccva71Some of you just don't get it. Please go here and skip to 12:35 and listen very carefully.You will be able to collect ALL the classes and be a master at all of them. You can swap to each of them outside of combat. So basically, every single player in the game (eventually) will be able to be EVERY SINGLE CLASS IN THE GAME. It does not matter what class you pick at the start because you can collect them all. This is separate from just multi-classing because you can swap to them."The Freedom of Choice.."For the love of god....also notice at 13:58 where the panel asked if being able to get points in one class to distribute to another class was "exciting", and maybe 5 people clapped....
I dont think anyone here doesnt know that. We know we can mqster every class in the game. So? In eve I can learn every skill and train into every ship BUT I can only fly one ship per character at a time. I have to choose which ship is active out of the multitude of roles for any given figjt before it happens. So in EQ it is the same I must choose what abilities and therefore what role I want to play before hand for any engagement.
I for one think this is awesome
How is this any different than GW2 + RIFT? Because it's a combination of both.
They also don't want dedicated healers and tanks in the game, if you keep watching the video. They are steering away from that which means that if there are no dedicated tanks and healers, then everyone will be able to...right? Unless that's not what "we dont want dedicated tanks and healers" means... please correct me if i didn't hear him correctly in the video.
What i haven't heard mentioned is this will mess up pvp.
At least in gw2 you were locked to skills your class can do. Here we have a situation where now when people pvp, everyone will start using the FOTM build because they will know it will be effective. Until someone can counter it then everyone will copy paste again.
A good example of this is Darkfall.
It was ridiculous on how many people used the same weapons and spells for pvp because they found what would work between offensive, defensive and healing capabilities. I believe this does give more options but I believe it was a very weak way of doing class balancing.
I hope nothing but the best for this game but I do miss the "trinity" and so do many others. Much like Rift or The Secret World it is great to be able to fill a role that may be needed by switching out, but I hope the game is popular enough to have enough of each class to fill said position.
I mean we all play these games to get a little bit of credibility right? Like "use that guy, he is a beast healer". When everyone can dish out the same specs and builds from other classes then it would be less original. Like ok, we need a tank...dude you need to be the tank since you wear heavy armor..I really wonder how they are going to handle gear with different stats then.. Are you really gonna carry around gear with caster stats to do healing and another set for tanking? and another for dps? I am really curious to how they are going to manage all that...this also really strays away from the traditional EQ premise...but I also do enjoy sandbox games. Maybe this will fill in what Darkfall has left empty for me. We shall see.
If I strictly did healer abilities as a healer, and there was another player with me that multi-classed ..he could potentially (with enough time leveling) be able to tank, hide like rogues can, cast offensive spells from afar and heal just as well as someone that just decided to dedicate themselves as a healer. By just focusing on one spec you are putting yourself at an extreme disadvantage
You are assuming class defining abilities (stealth, big heals, "tanking") will be secondary abilities. If they are weapon locked and in turn class locked, there will be no Warrior+Healing+Stealth. Since classes at this pone have 2 weapon sets with 8 active abilities at a time, I'm having a hard time believing those 8 won't have some of the class defining abilities you seem to worry are going to be up for grabs by any class.
Too early to tell at this point, but they have yet to give us any real detail in to how the system will work beyond the Class Panel and a few other tidbits since.
How is this any different than GW2 + RIFT? Because it's a combination of both.
They also don't want dedicated healers and tanks in the game, if you keep watching the video. They are steering away from that which means that if there are no dedicated tanks and healers, then everyone will be able to...right? Unless that's not what "we dont want dedicated tanks and healers" means... please correct me if i didn't hear him correctly in the video.
They've given MOBAs as an example of what they meant. In a MOBA there are no "healers" or "tanks" but there are still very defensive, offensive, support roles. You can be a meatshield or help support the dps or whatever without being limited to only that role. Everyone is free to be active and engaged in combat while having a unique set of skills.
They've just removed taunting/threat which have no place with enhanced AI (yet to be seen). You can still play a tank or whatever role, just in a different form.
There won't be a need for a player to stand 50 ft back and spam heals on health bars, they can get in the battle and do other thinks as well as heal while having more to do. Spamming taunt, heal, dps 123124123 is not exciting.
As for myself, I prefer people choose a class and stick with it. If you want to be another class, then level up another character. I consider it a 'right of passage' type of thing.
It also takes the entire feel away from the world you are in when things aren't believable (To a certain extent). Take for example ArcheAge and when they put in a race car as a mount. I feel the same way about people being able to randomly switch their class on the whim. "Oh, whats that? You need a caster? Ok, let me just put down my sword and shield and throw on this cloak. BAM, I'M NOW A WIZARD! derp" Just doesn't bring anything to the table when setting a stage.
What i haven't heard mentioned is this will mess up pvp.
At least in gw2 you were locked to skills your class can do. Here we have a situation where now when people pvp, everyone will start using the FOTM build because they will know it will be effective. Until someone can counter it then everyone will copy paste again.
A good example of this is Darkfall.
It was ridiculous on how many people used the same weapons and spells for pvp because they found what would work between offensive, defensive and healing capabilities. I believe this does give more options but I believe it was a very weak way of doing class balancing.
I hope nothing but the best for this game but I do miss the "trinity" and so do many others. Much like Rift or The Secret World it is great to be able to fill a role that may be needed by switching out, but I hope the game is popular enough to have enough of each class to fill said position.
I mean we all play these games to get a little bit of credibility right? Like "use that guy, he is a beast healer". When everyone can dish out the same specs and builds from other classes then it would be less original. Like ok, we need a tank...dude you need to be the tank since you wear heavy armor..I really wonder how they are going to handle gear with different stats then.. Are you really gonna carry around gear with caster stats to do healing and another set for tanking? and another for dps? I am really curious to how they are going to manage all that...this also really strays away from the traditional EQ premise...but I also do enjoy sandbox games. Maybe this will fill in what Darkfall has left empty for me. We shall see.
Gear won't have "stats" like STR, AGI, INT, etc. More like MOBA stats +% and what not. But I am curious how they will manage it for multiple templates.
A good healer will still be a good healer. Just because I unlocked a Cleric doesn't instantly make me good at it. If I played a Warrior for the last 5 years and someone handed me a maxed out Rogue, I'm not going to be amazing instantly.
There will be 40+ classes with at least 8 class locked abilities. 4 random abilities from other classes aren't going to be that crazy or imbalanced. With so many options, if someone finds a great combo, someone else will find 10 counters. That's what's great, people will be able to tweak their builds and have multiple set ups for whatever they want. You won't be forced into "Tank" "DPS" "Heal" until you go respec or learn a whole new set of skills or whatever. So many options.
Originally posted by joejccva71Some of you just don't get it. Please go here and skip to 12:35 and listen very carefully.You will be able to collect ALL the classes and be a master at all of them. You can swap to each of them outside of combat. So basically, every single player in the game (eventually) will be able to be EVERY SINGLE CLASS IN THE GAME. It does not matter what class you pick at the start because you can collect them all. This is separate from just multi-classing because you can swap to them."The Freedom of Choice.."For the love of god....also notice at 13:58 where the panel asked if being able to get points in one class to distribute to another class was "exciting", and maybe 5 people clapped....
I dont think anyone here doesnt know that. We know we can mqster every class in the game. So? In eve I can learn every skill and train into every ship BUT I can only fly one ship per character at a time. I have to choose which ship is active out of the multitude of roles for any given figjt before it happens. So in EQ it is the same I must choose what abilities and therefore what role I want to play before hand for any engagement.
I for one think this is awesome
How is this any different than GW2 + RIFT? Because it's a combination of both.
They also don't want dedicated healers and tanks in the game, if you keep watching the video. They are steering away from that which means that if there are no dedicated tanks and healers, then everyone will be able to...right? Unless that's not what "we dont want dedicated tanks and healers" means... please correct me if i didn't hear him correctly in the video.
What is stopping anyone from being a dedicated healer though? What is wrong with anyone being able to heal? Its starting to look like you want an exclusive healer only club and anyone who wants to try it can fuck off
As for myself, I prefer people choose a class and stick with it. If you want to be another class, then level up another character. I consider it a 'right of passage' type of thing.
It also takes the entire feel away from the world you are in when things aren't believable (To a certain extent). Take for example ArcheAge and when they put in a race car as a mount. I feel the same way about people being able to randomly switch their class on the whim. "Oh, whats that? You need a caster? Ok, let me just put down my sword and shield and throw on this cloak. BAM, I'M NOW A WIZARD! derp" Just doesn't bring anything to the table when setting a stage.
I respect your skepticism on the immersion breaking of switching classes and instantly becoming something thats like a polar opposite. But the way i look at it you have to train it up anyways like you said with an alt and i feel that is your right of passage. I was a wrestler my whole life but i started boxing in my late teens. Does that make me no eligible to be a boxer or believable because i started that much later? I mean i think its believable and can be immersive because you still must learn the trade so to speak from the beginning you're just doing it later in your characters life. I get you though
Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
Originally posted by MMOGamer71 Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
that would actually be quite bitchin to see in a movie.
Originally posted by MMOGamer71 Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
Originally posted by MMOGamer71 Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
except not really
Or at all....but people can hyperbole the shit out of in on a forum.
Originally posted by DamonVile Originally posted by MyrdynnOriginally posted by MMOGamer71Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
except not reallyOr at all....but people can hyperbole the shit out of in on a forum.
He does have a point though. That's the direction MMO's are going towards. Instead of actually leveling up a separate Mage for example, this system will allow you to take off your plate armor, put away your Polearm of Destruction, take a cloak and staff out of your backpack, put it on and voila, you're now a mage!
Oh wait you don't need a mage, you need a rogue. Hold on for 2 seconds before you pull that mob...let me change into my Assassin real fast...oh and let me hide and sneak behind the mob first before you pull it.
Oh let me throw another curveball at you fine folks.
Let's pretend I'm an Ogre Warrior, and I'm leveling up and going about my business. I also level up my rogue, mage, and cleric on the same character. With me so far?
But I want my mage to be a female high elf! Since they are going to let me be any class and swap them out of combat when I want to, are they going to let me change my race too?
Because I'd like to have:
An Ogre Warrior A High Elf Mage A Halfling Rogue A Dwarf Cleric
on the same character please. I mean why not right? If you're going to let us "Choose what we want to do", then I want to have all the classes and all the races on the same character.
I just watched (for the first time) the EQN Panel on Classes, and I was sorely disappointed when I saw that they were making it so people can basically turn your character into an "all class hybrid" eventually with enough leveling and customization. This is bascially making EQN a mix of Guild Wars 2 and RIFT. Are you kidding?
If when I start an MMO and pick my first class, I pick a Cleric because clearly I am interested in being a HEALER and I enjoy healing, rezzing, and buffing players. Sure maybe I can customize that healer to being more of an "offensive healer" where the heals aren't as good but I get some offensive spells, but still I am a HEALER.
If I wanted that healer to be a stealthy rogue that can hide in shadows, or be a warrior that can leap 50 feet in the air and do a huge whirlwind attack, THEN I WOULD HAVE PICKED THOSE GODDAMN CLASSES FROM THE START.
I just don't understand how these devs work these days.
Is this what the MMO community really wants? They don't want "dedicated healers" or "dedicated wizards" anymore? They want their class to be able to do everything?
This really pisses me off.
I hate it too, its the whole reason I quit Rift, and will probably cause me to walk away from EQN as well.
Basically to me it just broadcasts that this is just one more in the endless number of games designed for the " new gamer " generation. : (((
Oh let me throw another curveball at you fine folks.
Let's pretend I'm an Ogre Warrior, and I'm leveling up and going about my business. I also level up my rogue, mage, and cleric on the same character. With me so far?
But I want my mage to be a female high elf! Since they are going to let me be any class and swap them out of combat when I want to, are they going to let me change my race too?
Because I'd like to have:
An Ogre Warrior A High Elf Mage A Halfling Rogue A Dwarf Cleric
on the same character please. I mean why not right? If you're going to let us "Choose what we want to do", then I want to have all the classes and all the races on the same character.
Very good point....if someone says, "well that's not possible, it ruins immersion." or "well, that's not very realistic." I call BS....since when is a super character realistic or about immersion...making a character is about progression in every facet, story, class, professions, etc...if I can roll a super war-mage-rogue-rogue, why cant I roll a character who can change race and gender...I mean, what is the argument against that but not super classes?
Oh let me throw another curveball at you fine folks.
Let's pretend I'm an Ogre Warrior, and I'm leveling up and going about my business. I also level up my rogue, mage, and cleric on the same character. With me so far?
But I want my mage to be a female high elf! Since they are going to let me be any class and swap them out of combat when I want to, are they going to let me change my race too?
Because I'd like to have:
An Ogre Warrior A High Elf Mage A Halfling Rogue A Dwarf Cleric
on the same character please. I mean why not right? If you're going to let us "Choose what we want to do", then I want to have all the classes and all the races on the same character.
Originally posted by MMOGamer71Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
except not really
Or at all....but people can hyperbole the shit out of in on a forum.
He does have a point though. That's the direction MMO's are going towards. Instead of actually leveling up a separate Mage for example, this system will allow you to take off your plate armor, put away your Polearm of Destruction, take a cloak and staff out of your backpack, put it on and voila, you're now a mage!
Oh wait you don't need a mage, you need a rogue. Hold on for 2 seconds before you pull that mob...let me change into my Assassin real fast...oh and let me hide and sneak behind the mob first before you pull it.
So much for goddamn immersion. lol
I addressed this fair point and what i feel justifies it wether anyone agrees or not is their perogative. Point is you do stil need to ovo that mage just think 8f it as a human in real life switching combat sports disciplines later in life. Wrestler learning to box later on. You stioo need to work that mage facet up of uour character before you can just whip it out at wioo but since that wrestler learned boxing he should be able to use it as he sees fit. Think of it as later in life trainingon the same character.
Originally posted by MMOGamer71Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
except not really
Or at all....but people can hyperbole the shit out of in on a forum.
He does have a point though. That's the direction MMO's are going towards. Instead of actually leveling up a separate Mage for example, this system will allow you to take off your plate armor, put away your Polearm of Destruction, take a cloak and staff out of your backpack, put it on and voila, you're now a mage!
Oh wait you don't need a mage, you need a rogue. Hold on for 2 seconds before you pull that mob...let me change into my Assassin real fast...oh and let me hide and sneak behind the mob first before you pull it.
So much for goddamn immersion. lol
lol kinda reminds me of my first paper and pencil d&d character 1000 years ago. We didn't play encumberance so anything I found I picked up and drew it onto my character sketch. By the end of the year I was just a big pile of baggage with 100 swords. staffs. daggers. and wands all sticking out in every direction and 2 legs sticking out the bottom.
Oh let me throw another curveball at you fine folks.
Let's pretend I'm an Ogre Warrior, and I'm leveling up and going about my business. I also level up my rogue, mage, and cleric on the same character. With me so far?
But I want my mage to be a female high elf! Since they are going to let me be any class and swap them out of combat when I want to, are they going to let me change my race too?
Because I'd like to have:
An Ogre Warrior A High Elf Mage A Halfling Rogue A Dwarf Cleric
on the same character please. I mean why not right? If you're going to let us "Choose what we want to do", then I want to have all the classes and all the races on the same character.
At this point if I wanted to roleplay an entirely new racial chqracter I would just reroll a new character and make him or her whatever I wanted him or her to be
I'll just go ahead and say it, I love classes, and those classes to have roles. Don't get my wrong. I've played my share of Sandboxes and no classes games, but I like the idea that each class has a role as well. This is what killed it for me in GW2. I got into some dungeons and everyone is just zerging the dungeon with no real strategy except where it's necessary. I like the Trinity, it has always work, and always will work. The problem with modern MMOs isn't the trinity, it isn't classes. The more you try to please everybody, you end up pleasing nobody. This is the main problem I have with EQN. They're touting it to be the MMO for everyone. I don't want an MMO for everyone, I want an MMO for me
I remember in Rift when people played Rogues they were constantly forced to play Bard some and stuff in dungeons. But hardly any of the Rogues liked it because they rolled a Rogue for melee dps pretty much. And if somebody logs on and doesnt have fun playing the game then they will quit. But the groups would force them to play a class they hate and dont enjoy playing because of this system. If i roll a certain type of class, i want to play that class, not be forced into some garbage i dont want to play. I hate this idea. I do think ESO though is doing a better job of it than Rift but dont know the details of how EQN will work, i just saw the topic pop up on the home page and wanted to respond.
Originally posted by Gravarg I'll just go ahead and say it, I love classes, and those classes to have roles. Don't get my wrong. I've played my share of Sandboxes and no classes games, but I like the idea that each class has a role as well. This is what killed it for me in GW2. I got into some dungeons and everyone is just zerging the dungeon with no real strategy except where it's necessary. I like the Trinity, it has always work, and always will work. The problem with modern MMOs isn't the trinity, it isn't classes. The more you try to please everybody, you end up pleasing nobody. This is the main problem I have with EQN. They're touting it to be the MMO for everyone. I don't want an MMO for everyone, I want an MMO for me
On the other hand what is immersion breaking to me is picking up weapons I cant use because my cookie cutter class says so. If Isee a mace I want to use it I dont car3 ill train and learn it who is to tell me no? I hqt3 being told how I must play a clwss or game. I want to decide how my ccharacter looks, what they equip and how they fight not someone else because thats the strict template. Drives me nuts! Different strokes for different folks I guess. I wouldnt rage thata game was made this way hough id just go play a different game and accept it.
Edit, im typing on a tablet at work so excuse the horrid spelling grammar
Originally posted by MMOGamer71 Welcome to the world of hiding in shadows, back stabbing shield wielding mages in plate armor casting healing spells while preparing a fireball as he readies his bow and places a trap.
...because that's exactly what happens in UO and EVE.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Comments
How is this any different than GW2 + RIFT? Because it's a combination of both.
They also don't want dedicated healers and tanks in the game, if you keep watching the video. They are steering away from that which means that if there are no dedicated tanks and healers, then everyone will be able to...right? Unless that's not what "we dont want dedicated tanks and healers" means... please correct me if i didn't hear him correctly in the video.
What i haven't heard mentioned is this will mess up pvp.
At least in gw2 you were locked to skills your class can do. Here we have a situation where now when people pvp, everyone will start using the FOTM build because they will know it will be effective. Until someone can counter it then everyone will copy paste again.
A good example of this is Darkfall.
It was ridiculous on how many people used the same weapons and spells for pvp because they found what would work between offensive, defensive and healing capabilities. I believe this does give more options but I believe it was a very weak way of doing class balancing.
I hope nothing but the best for this game but I do miss the "trinity" and so do many others. Much like Rift or The Secret World it is great to be able to fill a role that may be needed by switching out, but I hope the game is popular enough to have enough of each class to fill said position.
I mean we all play these games to get a little bit of credibility right? Like "use that guy, he is a beast healer". When everyone can dish out the same specs and builds from other classes then it would be less original. Like ok, we need a tank...dude you need to be the tank since you wear heavy armor..I really wonder how they are going to handle gear with different stats then.. Are you really gonna carry around gear with caster stats to do healing and another set for tanking? and another for dps? I am really curious to how they are going to manage all that...this also really strays away from the traditional EQ premise...but I also do enjoy sandbox games. Maybe this will fill in what Darkfall has left empty for me. We shall see.
You are assuming class defining abilities (stealth, big heals, "tanking") will be secondary abilities. If they are weapon locked and in turn class locked, there will be no Warrior+Healing+Stealth. Since classes at this pone have 2 weapon sets with 8 active abilities at a time, I'm having a hard time believing those 8 won't have some of the class defining abilities you seem to worry are going to be up for grabs by any class.
Too early to tell at this point, but they have yet to give us any real detail in to how the system will work beyond the Class Panel and a few other tidbits since.
They've given MOBAs as an example of what they meant. In a MOBA there are no "healers" or "tanks" but there are still very defensive, offensive, support roles. You can be a meatshield or help support the dps or whatever without being limited to only that role. Everyone is free to be active and engaged in combat while having a unique set of skills.
They've just removed taunting/threat which have no place with enhanced AI (yet to be seen). You can still play a tank or whatever role, just in a different form.
There won't be a need for a player to stand 50 ft back and spam heals on health bars, they can get in the battle and do other thinks as well as heal while having more to do. Spamming taunt, heal, dps 123124123 is not exciting.
Each has its merit.
As for myself, I prefer people choose a class and stick with it. If you want to be another class, then level up another character. I consider it a 'right of passage' type of thing.
It also takes the entire feel away from the world you are in when things aren't believable (To a certain extent). Take for example ArcheAge and when they put in a race car as a mount. I feel the same way about people being able to randomly switch their class on the whim. "Oh, whats that? You need a caster? Ok, let me just put down my sword and shield and throw on this cloak. BAM, I'M NOW A WIZARD! derp" Just doesn't bring anything to the table when setting a stage.
Gear won't have "stats" like STR, AGI, INT, etc. More like MOBA stats +% and what not. But I am curious how they will manage it for multiple templates.
A good healer will still be a good healer. Just because I unlocked a Cleric doesn't instantly make me good at it. If I played a Warrior for the last 5 years and someone handed me a maxed out Rogue, I'm not going to be amazing instantly.
There will be 40+ classes with at least 8 class locked abilities. 4 random abilities from other classes aren't going to be that crazy or imbalanced. With so many options, if someone finds a great combo, someone else will find 10 counters. That's what's great, people will be able to tweak their builds and have multiple set ups for whatever they want. You won't be forced into "Tank" "DPS" "Heal" until you go respec or learn a whole new set of skills or whatever. So many options.
What is stopping anyone from being a dedicated healer though? What is wrong with anyone being able to heal? Its starting to look like you want an exclusive healer only club and anyone who wants to try it can fuck off
I respect your skepticism on the immersion breaking of switching classes and instantly becoming something thats like a polar opposite. But the way i look at it you have to train it up anyways like you said with an alt and i feel that is your right of passage. I was a wrestler my whole life but i started boxing in my late teens. Does that make me no eligible to be a boxer or believable because i started that much later? I mean i think its believable and can be immersive because you still must learn the trade so to speak from the beginning you're just doing it later in your characters life. I get you though
that would actually be quite bitchin to see in a movie.
except not really
Or at all....but people can hyperbole the shit out of in on a forum.
Or at all....but people can hyperbole the shit out of in on a forum.
He does have a point though. That's the direction MMO's are going towards. Instead of actually leveling up a separate Mage for example, this system will allow you to take off your plate armor, put away your Polearm of Destruction, take a cloak and staff out of your backpack, put it on and voila, you're now a mage!
Oh wait you don't need a mage, you need a rogue. Hold on for 2 seconds before you pull that mob...let me change into my Assassin real fast...oh and let me hide and sneak behind the mob first before you pull it.
So much for goddamn immersion.
lol
Oh let me throw another curveball at you fine folks.
Let's pretend I'm an Ogre Warrior, and I'm leveling up and going about my business. I also level up my rogue, mage, and cleric on the same character. With me so far?
But I want my mage to be a female high elf! Since they are going to let me be any class and swap them out of combat when I want to, are they going to let me change my race too?
Because I'd like to have:
An Ogre Warrior
A High Elf Mage
A Halfling Rogue
A Dwarf Cleric
on the same character please.
I mean why not right? If you're going to let us "Choose what we want to do", then I want to have all the classes and all the races on the same character.
I hate it too, its the whole reason I quit Rift, and will probably cause me to walk away from EQN as well.
Basically to me it just broadcasts that this is just one more in the endless number of games designed for the " new gamer " generation. : (((
Very good point....if someone says, "well that's not possible, it ruins immersion." or "well, that's not very realistic." I call BS....since when is a super character realistic or about immersion...making a character is about progression in every facet, story, class, professions, etc...if I can roll a super war-mage-rogue-rogue, why cant I roll a character who can change race and gender...I mean, what is the argument against that but not super classes?
"Those who stay will be champions"
oops didnt see the sex was already there lol
I addressed this fair point and what i feel justifies it wether anyone agrees or not is their perogative. Point is you do stil need to ovo that mage just think 8f it as a human in real life switching combat sports disciplines later in life. Wrestler learning to box later on. You stioo need to work that mage facet up of uour character before you can just whip it out at wioo but since that wrestler learned boxing he should be able to use it as he sees fit. Think of it as later in life trainingon the same character.
lol kinda reminds me of my first paper and pencil d&d character 1000 years ago. We didn't play encumberance so anything I found I picked up and drew it onto my character sketch. By the end of the year I was just a big pile of baggage with 100 swords. staffs. daggers. and wands all sticking out in every direction and 2 legs sticking out the bottom.
At this point if I wanted to roleplay an entirely new racial chqracter I would just reroll a new character and make him or her whatever I wanted him or her to be
Agreed.
"Those who stay will be champions"
On the other hand what is immersion breaking to me is picking up weapons I cant use because my cookie cutter class says so. If Isee a mace I want to use it I dont car3 ill train and learn it who is to tell me no? I hqt3 being told how I must play a clwss or game. I want to decide how my ccharacter looks, what they equip and how they fight not someone else because thats the strict template. Drives me nuts! Different strokes for different folks I guess. I wouldnt rage thata game was made this way hough id just go play a different game and accept it.
Edit, im typing on a tablet at work so excuse the horrid spelling grammar
...because that's exactly what happens in UO and EVE.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre