After experiencing the opening weeks of FFXIV:ARR, I'm wondering whether ESO will also be heavily assaulted by an army of goldspammers at launch ?
ESO is ripe for it because it's not an F2P game, where players can buy game currency in the ingame Cash Shop for real money. Progression in ESO also seems a bit slower than most recent MMO's, which will frustrate many impatient players. There will also be a large number of players who'll be wanting to focus on PVP and will be less willing to "grind" PVE for currency.
Node bots will be a serious problem if they appear, because the nodes in ESO are contested. A "real" player won't stand a chance against a teleporting bot.
The resource nodes (and treasure chests) seem to be placed statically, so FFXIV's teleporting, invisible harvesting bots might work in ESO as well. How long before someone builds an auto-lockpicking 3rd-party app ?
I'm not sure why you say ESO is "ripe for it" since it's not a F2P game...F2P games are the worst for third party leaches like gold sellers, due to the fact you can't stop them from coming back after you ban their accounts....they just make another free email address. Since there is no cost to entering the game their cost of doing business is zero, again this leads to massive amounts of macro'ers, gold farmers, gold spammers etc. Only in a pay to play subscription game can you at least ban the credit card associated with the account and insure that each time they get banned that they had to have spent some money to get the game itself.
You're assuming the gold farmer/spamer pays for an account. Why pay for it when you can hack thousands at no cost?
My apologies, when I created this thread, I didn't actually have a clue how ESO's economy was designed. I assumed (wrongly) that it had a "standard design" with a global AH.
I'm quite surprised that there hasn't been a lot more crying on this forum about the economy design. The only place that players can buy and sell (other than person-to-person) is in the shop of whichever guild "occupies" one of the 6 keeps in Cyrodil !
That effectively means that global chat is going to be 24/7 trade spam. The chatbox will be scrolling so fast it will be unusable, lol
It's an interesting design, but it's most likely going to cause a MAJOR amount of complaining right after launch...
I wonder if a player can sell his items at the store of a guild he is not a member of? I would think there would be transaction fees that would go to the owning guild which is fine. If they do it that way then I don't have a problem with this system. If only the owning guilds can sell items then this may cause problems for me.
It will be like any other MMO, there will be bots and there will be goldsellers.
As to the matter how bad it will be is something that players will need to figure out in the coming months after release (and how good the anti cheat/bot protection works), if ZO is doing their jobs they at least make the goldsellers waste their time (in this case time is money) by creating accounts/getting new accounts.
They need some form of player flag system so the botters if there are any can be identified and banned. They should work on a gold tracking system, and some database of item transfers to track delivery/storage accounts.
The only way to beat the RMT is to make adequate tools that allow 1 person to aggregate and understand all the data. Mabye set up a system that flags suspicious accounts to be looked at more closely.
After experiencing the opening weeks of FFXIV:ARR, I'm wondering whether ESO will also be heavily assaulted by an army of goldspammers at launch ?
ESO is ripe for it because it's not an F2P game, where players can buy game currency in the ingame Cash Shop for real money. Progression in ESO also seems a bit slower than most recent MMO's, which will frustrate many impatient players. There will also be a large number of players who'll be wanting to focus on PVP and will be less willing to "grind" PVE for currency.
Node bots will be a serious problem if they appear, because the nodes in ESO are contested. A "real" player won't stand a chance against a teleporting bot.
The resource nodes (and treasure chests) seem to be placed statically, so FFXIV's teleporting, invisible harvesting bots might work in ESO as well. How long before someone builds an auto-lockpicking 3rd-party app ?
With a £50 boxed set minimum and £9 a month sub will there be that many people wanting their account banned for goldselling ingame? I wouldn't have thought so.
Originally posted by Dibdabs Originally posted by SpottyGekkoAfter experiencing the opening weeks of FFXIV:ARR, I'm wondering whether ESO will also be heavily assaulted by an army of goldspammers at launch ?ESO is ripe for it because it's not an F2P game, where players can buy game currency in the ingame Cash Shop for real money. Progression in ESO also seems a bit slower than most recent MMO's, which will frustrate many impatient players. There will also be a large number of players who'll be wanting to focus on PVP and will be less willing to "grind" PVE for currency.Node bots will be a serious problem if they appear, because the nodes in ESO are contested. A "real" player won't stand a chance against a teleporting bot.The resource nodes (and treasure chests) seem to be placed statically, so FFXIV's teleporting, invisible harvesting bots might work in ESO as well. How long before someone builds an auto-lockpicking 3rd-party app ?
With a £50 boxed set minimum and £9 a month sub will there be that many people wanting their account banned for goldselling ingame? I wouldn't have thought so.
Stolen credit card numbers and hacked accounts etc. The box and sub fee won't be a huge problem for them, those accounts are mostly used as mules because they will be taken down very fast but most of the damage is done by then.
My apologies, when I created this thread, I didn't actually have a clue how ESO's economy was designed. I assumed (wrongly) that it had a "standard design" with a global AH.
I'm quite surprised that there hasn't been a lot more crying on this forum about the economy design. The only place that players can buy and sell (other than person-to-person) is in the shop of whichever guild "occupies" one of the 6 keeps in Cyrodil !
That effectively means that global chat is going to be 24/7 trade spam. The chatbox will be scrolling so fast it will be unusable, lol
It's an interesting design, but it's most likely going to cause a MAJOR amount of complaining right after launch...
Got to agree with this...
I love this type of trade system. You actually have to work to accomplish trading. Auctions and traders are easy mode, we have to much easy mode in games today. They store idea makes having a keep worth something.
I love it as well. It places further importance on PvP, and it actually REWARDS players for interacting with other players (rather than an auction interface.)
There are a few things to note here: I'm not 100% sure how the campaigns work, but we may be looking at a LOT more than 6 different stores set up (if there's six stores per campaign or whatever, and people can hop between campaigns... Or if the keeps are universal and the campaigns are something else, I don't know.) Also, the stores are just for the public. You can still access any guild's store that you belong to, where people from your guilds are allowed to put up the wares they want to sell. That means if you're a member of a large faction, it's like a mini auction house for you to trade within. This allows easy avenues for trade, while not providing such a huge avenue that it completely destroys the economy (like auction houses eventually tend to do.) The only reason Eve Online has successfully managed a global auction house is because their economy consists of destruction as much as it does creation (aka destroyed ships/modules/ammo/etc... but ESO doesn't have that so it would not be able to sustain a global economy.)
So you have plenty of ways for the average player to acquire decent gear (though really, you can acquire sufficient gear to get by by simply crafting it yourself, as traited gear isn't -that much- better than non-traited gear.) You have the general trade channels, you have inner-guild trade, and you have the keeps in Cyrodiil. There's no reason for people to be upset. They might have to do a little interacting with players to get the best of the best, but that's the price you pay to destroy gold farmers and make the world that much more interesting (while also giving economic reasons for PvP/ prestige status/whatever.)
might work in ESO as well. How long before someone builds an auto-lockpicking 3rd-party app ?
With a £50 boxed set minimum and £9 a month sub will there be that many people wanting their account banned for goldselling ingame? I wouldn't have thought so.
Stolen credit card numbers and hacked accounts etc. The box and sub fee won't be a huge problem for them, those accounts are mostly used as mules because they will be taken down very fast but most of the damage is done by then.
You have a point, but they'll run out of stolen cards and hacked accounts faster than replacements will become available. Demand will exceed supply.
I noticed above that people say gold can't be swapped between alts and that sales are via guild shops, so maybe this will clamp down on the goldsellers for us all.
Originally posted by Dibdabs Originally posted by -aLpHa-Originally posted by Dibdabsmight work in ESO as well. How long before someone builds an auto-lockpicking 3rd-party app ?
With a £50 boxed set minimum and £9 a month sub will there be that many people wanting their account banned for goldselling ingame? I wouldn't have thought so.Stolen credit card numbers and hacked accounts etc. The box and sub fee won't be a huge problem for them, those accounts are mostly used as mules because they will be taken down very fast but most of the damage is done by then.You have a point, but they'll run out of stolen cards and hacked accounts faster than replacements will become available. Demand will exceed supply.
I noticed above that people say gold can't be swapped between alts and that sales are via guild shops, so maybe this will clamp down on the goldsellers for us all. :)
Just google stolen credit card numbers and your eyes will pop out . Professional credit card frauds sell hundreds of thousands of numbers sometimes even millions.
Probably, the lack of a medium for Goldsellers etc, to exploit, will mean they cannot survive, there is no medium for them to use to exchange goods, and if guilds actively kick them from guilds when found, then they will never be able to sell anything, period. Perhaps this is the real intention of not having in game AH's etc, and limiting trading to guild members, if it is, and it works, then it wouldn't surprise me at all to see something like it spread to other games
might work in ESO as well. How long before someone builds an auto-lockpicking 3rd-party app ?
With a £50 boxed set minimum and £9 a month sub will there be that many people wanting their account banned for goldselling ingame? I wouldn't have thought so.
Stolen credit card numbers and hacked accounts etc. The box and sub fee won't be a huge problem for them, those accounts are mostly used as mules because they will be taken down very fast but most of the damage is done by then.
You have a point, but they'll run out of stolen cards and hacked accounts faster than replacements will become available. Demand will exceed supply.
I noticed above that people say gold can't be swapped between alts and that sales are via guild shops, so maybe this will clamp down on the goldsellers for us all.
Just google stolen credit card numbers and your eyes will pop out . Professional credit card frauds sell hundreds of thousands of numbers sometimes even millions.
Gold sellers: There is a report function. If you have a guild (out of the 5 you can be in) that has a lot of crafters, there is no reason to have a huge amount of gold beyond what you can normally get from regular content.
Bots: There is no follow command, also resource nodes respawns are slightly physically off set also given the economy, bots won't have easy places to dump their mats for quick turn over, even with a guild store at a keep, that can flip... leaving them out in the cold without buyers.
might work in ESO as well. How long before someone builds an auto-lockpicking 3rd-party app ?
With a £50 boxed set minimum and £9 a month sub will there be that many people wanting their account banned for goldselling ingame? I wouldn't have thought so.
Stolen credit card numbers and hacked accounts etc. The box and sub fee won't be a huge problem for them, those accounts are mostly used as mules because they will be taken down very fast but most of the damage is done by then.
You have a point, but they'll run out of stolen cards and hacked accounts faster than replacements will become available. Demand will exceed supply.I noticed above that people say gold can't be swapped between alts and that sales are via guild shops, so maybe this will clamp down on the goldsellers for us all. :)
Guys don't be naive, there is no super recipe to combat gold sellers. You can try and obstruct them but they are humans, they can adapt, especially if they can make big bucks.
Comments
You're assuming the gold farmer/spamer pays for an account. Why pay for it when you can hack thousands at no cost?
I wonder if a player can sell his items at the store of a guild he is not a member of? I would think there would be transaction fees that would go to the owning guild which is fine. If they do it that way then I don't have a problem with this system. If only the owning guilds can sell items then this may cause problems for me.
It will be like any other MMO, there will be bots and there will be goldsellers.
As to the matter how bad it will be is something that players will need to figure out in the coming months after release (and how good the anti cheat/bot protection works), if ZO is doing their jobs they at least make the goldsellers waste their time (in this case time is money) by creating accounts/getting new accounts.
They need some form of player flag system so the botters if there are any can be identified and banned. They should work on a gold tracking system, and some database of item transfers to track delivery/storage accounts.
The only way to beat the RMT is to make adequate tools that allow 1 person to aggregate and understand all the data. Mabye set up a system that flags suspicious accounts to be looked at more closely.
With a £50 boxed set minimum and £9 a month sub will there be that many people wanting their account banned for goldselling ingame? I wouldn't have thought so.
Stolen credit card numbers and hacked accounts etc. The box and sub fee won't be a huge problem for them, those accounts are mostly used as mules because they will be taken down very fast but most of the damage is done by then.
I love it as well. It places further importance on PvP, and it actually REWARDS players for interacting with other players (rather than an auction interface.)
There are a few things to note here: I'm not 100% sure how the campaigns work, but we may be looking at a LOT more than 6 different stores set up (if there's six stores per campaign or whatever, and people can hop between campaigns... Or if the keeps are universal and the campaigns are something else, I don't know.) Also, the stores are just for the public. You can still access any guild's store that you belong to, where people from your guilds are allowed to put up the wares they want to sell. That means if you're a member of a large faction, it's like a mini auction house for you to trade within. This allows easy avenues for trade, while not providing such a huge avenue that it completely destroys the economy (like auction houses eventually tend to do.) The only reason Eve Online has successfully managed a global auction house is because their economy consists of destruction as much as it does creation (aka destroyed ships/modules/ammo/etc... but ESO doesn't have that so it would not be able to sustain a global economy.)
So you have plenty of ways for the average player to acquire decent gear (though really, you can acquire sufficient gear to get by by simply crafting it yourself, as traited gear isn't -that much- better than non-traited gear.) You have the general trade channels, you have inner-guild trade, and you have the keeps in Cyrodiil. There's no reason for people to be upset. They might have to do a little interacting with players to get the best of the best, but that's the price you pay to destroy gold farmers and make the world that much more interesting (while also giving economic reasons for PvP/ prestige status/whatever.)
You have a point, but they'll run out of stolen cards and hacked accounts faster than replacements will become available. Demand will exceed supply.
I noticed above that people say gold can't be swapped between alts and that sales are via guild shops, so maybe this will clamp down on the goldsellers for us all.
Stolen credit card numbers and hacked accounts etc. The box and sub fee won't be a huge problem for them, those accounts are mostly used as mules because they will be taken down very fast but most of the damage is done by then.
You have a point, but they'll run out of stolen cards and hacked accounts faster than replacements will become available. Demand will exceed supply.
I noticed above that people say gold can't be swapped between alts and that sales are via guild shops, so maybe this will clamp down on the goldsellers for us all. :)
Just google stolen credit card numbers and your eyes will pop out
. Professional credit card frauds sell hundreds of thousands of numbers sometimes even millions.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2537995/Many-stores-customer-credit-card-details-stolen-holidays.html <--- this is just the newest one.
The supply of stolen credit card numbers most likely faaaar outstrips demand, lol
Just around last Thanksgiving, 40 million credit and debit card numbers stolen from Target stores in the US:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/dec/20/fury-and-frustration-over-target-data-breach/?page=all
Price of stolen cc data is falling rapidly due to oversupply:
http://business.time.com/2011/12/21/hacker-is-selling-your-personal-data-online-cheap/
Gold sellers: There is a report function. If you have a guild (out of the 5 you can be in) that has a lot of crafters, there is no reason to have a huge amount of gold beyond what you can normally get from regular content.
Bots: There is no follow command, also resource nodes respawns are slightly physically off set also given the economy, bots won't have easy places to dump their mats for quick turn over, even with a guild store at a keep, that can flip... leaving them out in the cold without buyers.
That way my point.
Guys don't be naive, there is no super recipe to combat gold sellers. You can try and obstruct them but they are humans, they can adapt, especially if they can make big bucks.