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The worst melee combat ever.
Ridrith
Member RarePosts: 859
TESO. I've been in the beta and playing since mid-2013 and have had a lot of experience playing through the beta, different classes, races, starting areas when given the chance and more. My main problem with this game, and damn is it a big issue for me since it involves the type of character that I play in almost every MMO/RPG is that the melee combat is HORRIBLE. Truly one of the most boring, unengaging experiences I've ever had in a MMO. What's the issue with melee combat? First and foremost the animations are uninteresting and boring, combat feels like a chore when you're doing the same two animations over and over. What truly seals the deal however is the impact of melee attacks, as a geared out dragon knight when I charge forward and swing a massive great-sword at somebody's face and it connects I expect to know it. I want to see them stagger, to make a MOVE, to let me know that they we've been hit. The only thing you get is seeing their HP bar go down. There is no impact, no force behind melee combat. They don't stagger, they don't move, they aren't being thrown around by powerful attacks that would cleave a normal man in half. It's just bad, and it's boring and uninteresting enough for me to not want to play or pay for this game.
Next SWTOR incoming.
Comments
Have you ever blocked a heavy attack and retaliated with your own heavy attack?
It's pretty awesome
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
But but that requires player skill, i need a hotbar block counter button.
have to agree.
the first char i made was a melee user. tried to hit a few mobs and it was like hitting air. you can't tell if you've hit anything unless you look at your enemy's hp bar. very very bland and incredibly "floaty". the last time i've seen such crappy melee was in Fallen Earth first person combat.
i almost immediately switched to a Nightblade bow user and then started laughing my head off when i realized how lame the aiming is with the bow. Still at least i didn't have to suffer the melee horridness.
The feel of combat is really not a strong point of this game.
SWTOR had actually good melee pvp, I remember very well how difficult it was to scucceed with a melee character in pvp with the need to manage 30 skills. But the gameworld, questing and pvp areas did actually suck in swtor. Questing isnt the wholy grail in EOS aswell but overall ESO is in my opinion a better game than Swtor. Swtor was one of the worst blockbuster mmos I have ever played.
What I miss in ESO pve melee is collision and more combat feedback i.e. the feel you hold a heavy 2H, better sound and the lack of collision, animations could need some improvements aswell.
I am not looking for an "action mmo" in ESO, that would not fit in this game. But melee pve combat could need some improvements.
ESO is in general not a game for "Power Gamer" who are looking for "Action Combat".
I only played the last beta, but I enjoyed my Templar Melee play. I used a combo of range Magicka using skills and Melee skills along with the block, interrupt and dodge. It was fun IMO. I didn't have a lot of issues with the feel of Melee overall. I did block a lot and have a sword and board, so maybe that made a difference.
On an alt, I tried to 2H Melee, and that was a lot slower and had some issues, but again, I would go back and forth from Magicka and Stamina skills so I didn't run out and could use skills that did make an impact as far as a stun or knockdown type of thing. I enjoyed it, so it seems fine for me. But we all look for different things while playing.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?
R.A.Salvatore
What? Just because you choose not to use the ability to stagger, interrupt, stun, and knock back enemies in melee doesn't mean the option doesn't exist. You can stagger enemies in melee and in fact it's required in a lot of fights to stop them from doing big damage attacks. I found the melee to be enjoyable, not the best system in the world but enjoyable all the same. And as for Vindictus style combat, no not in a TES game. I don't dislike games like that but it would just feel wrong in a game like ESO where combat is more measured. Some of the Skyrim style finishers would be interesting but still really not required.
Your criticism seems based around animation/feel. But are the RPG mechanics of the melee combat actually bad as well? I understand what you are saying about Fallen Earth (although from videos TESO is not as bad) but for me that doesn't bother me as much as some, rather I care much more about whether the abilities they design actually work well as in a system as a whole.
Hopefully melee feel is improved.
I will say however that this was not an issue for me what so ever ... I played a caster. The very odd thing about this game is that melee maybe in need of some serious love with regards to feel but casting magic is exactly the opposite. As a mage build ESO gave me possibly the best feel for a mage of any mmo I have ever played.
While others complained about melee from the get go I simply played my caster and enjoyed every minute of it.
This allowed me to focus on other areas of the game which gave me concerns but those things always seem far less important as long as you enjoy the class build you are playing.
You stay sassy!
lol, yeah I agree with you.
And it's NOT the worst combat ever. That doesn't mean what he is saying is necessarily untrue.
There really isn't a feeling of connection during melee combat though there is some. It used to be worse but it's a bit better.
Quite frankly I really enjoy the melee combat though "sure" I wish there was more feeling of impact, of hitting and being hitting.
I do wish it was more like tera in that you could intercept an arrow or completely dodge and attack but with the soft targeting that is not always the case.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Many maybe mistaking 'Worst combat ever' for just a different approach from usual batch of production line MMO's.
Too many shy away from change.
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the biggest problem with melee is the fact that there is no collision detection. i was really disappointed with this. combat will always be floaty without collision detection.
as far as mechanics go there is absolutely no way to know until you get all your abilities and go do some serious pvp or group pve. only then will you be able to say if any of the skills are balanced and work reliably 100% of the time. as far as i could tell, aiming aside, there weren't any huge problems with the mechanics. i do say "aiming aside" because aiming was incredibly lax, but lets keep in mind that this type of combat is centered around aiming. when aiming is 50% of combat, and that aiming is very "loose", you've got problems.
I spent a lot of time in both 1st and 3rd person trying to get a feel for the combat. I think 1st person actually plays pretty good but 3rd person is more typical of a MMO experience. It's not the best system out there but It's no worse than 90% of the other games either. 1st person however is really where this games combat seems to shine.
Yes you are right, and there are more than a few reviewers who have said the same thing.
But I guess, in my mind, I buried these as serious gripes because I know the tradeoffs they are making and I can't see how they can achieve various other aspects of the game performance and still have those things. Collision detection is a major thing both design wise and in how it limit the implementation of things like combat feel. But it has a lot of other technical consequences as well some of them quite hairy.
And in the end its an RPG with action elements. Its not a real action game per se. For me as long time RPG player, while its obviously not my ideal I will favor good RPG side and when I know the technical aspects I just kind of shrug and say "Yeah that is a tough problem".
Now that the NDA is lifted I'm happy other have noticed the lackluster melee system.
I agree it feels bad and being a person who hates ranged I was quite disappointed. The first person view also doesn't work half the time with no collision which should have been implemented at least on AI this is lazy.
There's also the huge problem in weapon choices. They took the idea of Skyrim's sword axe mace and dagger and made it so bad I don't even know why.
All weapons mimic skyrim's second effect like swords higher chance to crit etc BUT all weapons have the same attack speed, I might what? A dagger has the same speed of a mace? It looks so slow swinging a dagger I put it away instantly.
I checked all melee weapons just to be clear to see how they animated and what it was their attack speed and that right there is another negative for me.
I really hate the guild wars 2 type of combat equipment.... I really hoped they didn't go the same route with multiple weapons equipped but ultimately if you don't have a ranged weapon you will be left behind.
Let's just put this to bed right now. The starting areas are not gonna change in any substantive way and neither is combat feel.
There is simply no way that a game in the later stages of Beta with its NDA lifted and a hard release deadline can do this without risking completely destroying their game with bugs.
Better than Tera? i completely disagree.
Unless in your opinion awkward animations and sluggish combat is 'better'.
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When my skill bars where filled I really enjoy'd melee as a nightblade. Sure the starter area was rather "informative" for new players. But as said in my own topic those intro's are meaningless to me with MMORPG's and a MMO starts for me after a starters area else I just can not be fair to meself to jugde a MMO.
I really liked 1st person and found myself in it more often than not.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
"no impact, no force behind melee combat"
We've all been saying that since beta first started, and they still haven't done enough to fix it
Why even bother comparing to Tera? Its like saying Dark Souls combat is superior to Tekken. They are too different to bother comparing.