I would pay an extra 20$ With my box (digital box is a scam) cost to skip WS and ESO tutorials. Seriously, I'm not gonna make it though wildstar's tutorial, it's a damn shame. I'm not kill my vibe on that shit. I'm stuck with my same crummy character in ESO's beta, because I refuse to do that starter stuff again until lauch.
Wildstars tutorial is like 10 min long tops, then your dropped into the action, ive seen both sides on mmorpg's, livestream of the game.
20$ for 10 min of a little backstory?
It's more than 10 minutes to get off the Destiny (Dominion) mothership.
FIne then its 20 minutes, regardless its very very fast, if it takes you longer than your the type of player who needs the intro quests.
Exactly. Speaking about newbies to the game/genre. They need time to adjust to the whole game and the way things are presented so it takes a bit of time to get off the ship.
That bit of time is more than enough for many to simply give up on the game. It needs to grab them right off the bat.
Do not dismiss the complaints. I can just imagine it, when the gates open and the masses try the game.
I'm in Ellevar and really enjoying myself. We need to get people to come that far.
If you quit a game because you cant invest more than 30 minutes moving forward than you shouldnt be playing a game. The amount of time the starting area takes is irrelevant if you actually enjoy the game. It leads to people wanting things fast and faster and before you know it your selling instant 90's, and cheapening the rest of the experience. How does a game grab someone if it doesnt present any sort of story in the beginning, or introduce you to movement etc.. I could see it being a lot more frustrating to get thrown into a zone with a bunch of abilities, and 0 direction.
By the way, I have one more key if you're interested.
I would pay an extra 20$ With my box (digital box is a scam) cost to skip WS and ESO tutorials. Seriously, I'm not gonna make it though wildstar's tutorial, it's a damn shame. I'm not kill my vibe on that shit. I'm stuck with my same crummy character in ESO's beta, because I refuse to do that starter stuff again until lauch.
Wildstars tutorial is like 10 min long tops, then your dropped into the action, ive seen both sides on mmorpg's, livestream of the game.
20$ for 10 min of a little backstory?
It's more than 10 minutes to get off the Destiny (Dominion) mothership.
FIne then its 20 minutes, regardless its very very fast, if it takes you longer than your the type of player who needs the intro quests.
Exactly. Speaking about newbies to the game/genre. They need time to adjust to the whole game and the way things are presented so it takes a bit of time to get off the ship.
That bit of time is more than enough for many to simply give up on the game. It needs to grab them right off the bat.
Do not dismiss the complaints. I can just imagine it, when the gates open and the masses try the game.
I'm in Ellevar and really enjoying myself. We need to get people to come that far.
If you quit a game because you cant invest more than 30 minutes moving forward than you shouldnt be playing a game. The amount of time the starting area takes is irrelevant if you actually enjoy the game. It leads to people wanting things fast and faster and before you know it your selling instant 90's, and cheapening the rest of the experience. How does a game grab someone if it doesnt present any sort of story in the beginning, or introduce you to movement etc.. I could see it being a lot more frustrating to get thrown into a zone with a bunch of abilities, and 0 direction.
By the way, I have one more key if you're interested.
:P if its a real one it would be awesome, but I was lucky enough to get the past couple weekend keys .
I would pay an extra 20$ With my box (digital box is a scam) cost to skip WS and ESO tutorials. Seriously, I'm not gonna make it though wildstar's tutorial, it's a damn shame. I'm not kill my vibe on that shit. I'm stuck with my same crummy character in ESO's beta, because I refuse to do that starter stuff again until lauch.
Wildstars tutorial is like 10 min long tops, then your dropped into the action, ive seen both sides on mmorpg's, livestream of the game.
20$ for 10 min of a little backstory?
It's more than 10 minutes to get off the Destiny (Dominion) mothership.
FIne then its 20 minutes, regardless its very very fast, if it takes you longer than your the type of player who needs the intro quests.
Exactly. Speaking about newbies to the game/genre. They need time to adjust to the whole game and the way things are presented so it takes a bit of time to get off the ship.
That bit of time is more than enough for many to simply give up on the game. It needs to grab them right off the bat.
Do not dismiss the complaints. I can just imagine it, when the gates open and the masses try the game.
I'm in Ellevar and really enjoying myself. We need to get people to come that far.
If you quit a game because you cant invest more than 30 minutes moving forward than you shouldnt be playing a game. The amount of time the starting area takes is irrelevant if you actually enjoy the game. It leads to people wanting things fast and faster and before you know it your selling instant 90's, and cheapening the rest of the experience. How does a game grab someone if it doesnt present any sort of story in the beginning, or introduce you to movement etc.. I could see it being a lot more frustrating to get thrown into a zone with a bunch of abilities, and 0 direction.
By the way, I have one more key if you're interested.
:P if its a real one it would be awesome, but I was lucky enough to get the past couple weekend keys .
Im so sick of seeing these MMO's where you have to go through 10 fetch quests, and kill a bunch of pointless mobs just to get into the core game world. Watching the Angry Joe review of Wildstar where he spends the first 20 minutes of the game picking up books and talking to floating cambots, I just thought "enoughs enough", these are pointless narrative building quests that only slow down he intro to a hopeless crawl.
Just do it like WoW did, have a 15sec intro cinematic that also sprawls through the opener zone, and then bam! Release the character into the opener zone and let them travel openly to anywhere the player likes.
Does anyone else find these modern MMO starter zones to be boring and shallow?
Yeah i agree wow did a great job.
That's why it's successful all these years.
It's the little things that most developers seem to ignore and they fail miserably
For the guys that are tired of the intros and initial grind (I am too after the first run though) there is an easy fix I to hope the devs implement. Just allow a new player or an alt to skip the initial newbie area.
However they also said that as the EQN story progresses new players will be dropped right into whatever the current Rally Call is.
I would pay an extra 20$ With my box (digital box is a scam) cost to skip WS and ESO tutorials. Seriously, I'm not gonna make it though wildstar's tutorial, it's a damn shame. I'm not kill my vibe on that shit. I'm stuck with my same crummy character in ESO's beta, because I refuse to do that starter stuff again until lauch.
Wildstars tutorial is like 10 min long tops, then your dropped into the action, ive seen both sides on mmorpg's, livestream of the game.
20$ for 10 min of a little backstory?
Someone else told me 5 minutes. 1 hour 2 log outs, I'm still in a confined station, with small hallways, doing some forced singular questline. I hope that's still the tutorial, and not the real game...
A tutorial killed defiance, turned thousands of people away from Wushu, had people saying ESO sucked. Has people saying the same about Wildstar.
I bought Gloria Victus lastnight. 10$ for the pre-alpha. Sever tech is still horrible, no bells and whistles. I made my character, and they dropped me in this town. I didn't even have a "!" anywhere. What did I do? I looked at my key binds, and started to run around. I ended up playing this pre-alpha for about 1 1/2 hours. Dying, grouping with other people who were dying, and laughing my ass off. There wasn't even a map!
For a minute I thought you were talking about the introductory cut scenes. For some games that's the best part.
I would like the option for a very fast tutorial over the scripted, story tutorial. Only an option though. Sometimes the story warrants getting through at least once just to see how it goes.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I think that the way ESO starts is horrible. If you're a quester it just seems like the start of the journey but if you're not a quester and can't wait to get out into the real world and play then it's horrid.
I almost didn't get through it... when I saw a post that said that ESO opens up after level 10 then I forced myself to get there.
If ESO opened up after about the first 15 minutes then I think it would have been very enjoyable.
Actually I think that you should have three choices... You can start out in the tutorial, start out in a head start for experienced gamers, or start out without a tutorial altogether for people who have played the game before.
I actually liked the days when you didn't start in one set location but wherever your race's home city was like back in Everquest. It took some time and effort at low levels to get to somewhere else in the world and you learned about your own area not other race's areas. Plus it allowed you to mess yourself up with factions based on your beginning hunting -- like killing those chicks and then finding out their angry parents were on the same faction and are aggro to you.
My point being; there are new players coming along all the time. You assume everyone is a skilled MMO player, but the most important customer to an MMO is the player that is trying MMOs for the first time. And they are joining the genre everyday. If the devs turn those people off, they don't get a second chance.
New people don't need that either. People who agreed with OP had an excellent first experienced without all that crap.
Why would you assume new people need that today?
Kinda from experiance seeing what type of questions pop up in ingame chats around almost any MMORPG I have played and sad thing it even happens with games that have tutorials. As a helpfull player I do try helping those with questions, but I often think to myself why didn't that person just do the tutorial and about 75% of most questions in chat could have been answered already by just playing the game.
I am like OP that I want to be dropped into the world and figure things out myself. But I am not that selfish to asume everyone wants that or even can play such way.
Only way for me as a experianced gamer to judge a MMORPG is to Judge the game after I have finished the tutorial or starters area because for me that's when . I mean whats a few or some hours when it comes to time spend in a MMORPG.
Lol now that you mention it, it's annoying, it's true. My friends call me insane when I compare current mmos with EQ, but at least soe had the right idea about the MMO spirit: throw your players in your world and let them play. All those cartoon games out there, that takes you by the hand, order you to loot your baby formula and your binky, and have you swing your make believe sword around, I feel really really old.
World of Warcraft studied this and found they were losing players before they hit 5th level because the game was too hard. A developer would be an idiot to listen to the OP.
Difficulty should ALWAYS be loaded in the back end - not at the start if you want a popular game. I liked EQs hard at first style, as well, but it cost them about 10x the audience. WoW with its easy to play hard to master system hit 4-6 million US/EU players. EQ with its get owned at first and then grind style hit 500k.
Why the heck would they listen to the OP? I sure wouldn't. Don't confuse what you like with what is good for business.
World of Warcraft studied this and found they were losing players before they hit 5th level because the game was too hard. A developer would be an idiot to listen to the OP.
Difficulty should ALWAYS be loaded in the back end - not at the start if you want a popular game. I liked EQs hard at first style, as well, but it cost them about 10x the audience. WoW with its easy to play hard to master system hit 4-6 million US/EU players. EQ with its get owned at first and then grind style hit 500k.
Why the heck would they listen to the OP? I sure wouldn't. Don't confuse what you like with what is good for business.
Ugh, you reminded me of something I read a while ago.
"Majority of Gamers Today Can’t Finish Level 1 in Super Mario Bros."
"So, as a stockholder, you should be relieved to know that our games are easier in order to attract a wider audience. As a gamer, you might feel a little sad, and you should be. It is quite sad."
World of Warcraft studied this and found they were losing players before they hit 5th level because the game was too hard. A developer would be an idiot to listen to the OP.
Difficulty should ALWAYS be loaded in the back end - not at the start if you want a popular game. I liked EQs hard at first style, as well, but it cost them about 10x the audience. WoW with its easy to play hard to master system hit 4-6 million US/EU players. EQ with its get owned at first and then grind style hit 500k.
Why the heck would they listen to the OP? I sure wouldn't. Don't confuse what you like with what is good for business.
Aaaand right after that "study" came Catalysm. A brand new world with "improved new player experience!"
5 million lost players later... That study is exactly what they cited in reasoning behind doing the Cata revamp. It was basically a NGE for WoW.
Aaaand right after that "study" came Catalysm. A brand new world with "improved new player experience!"
5 million lost players later... That study is exactly what they cited in reasoning behind doing the Cata revamp. It was basically a NGE for WoW.
Correlation/causation.
Cata's changes were a mix of good and bad. Some of the zone alterations are outright annoying (especially the ones that leave parts of zones unoccupied unless you do the whole zone chain), others are alright by my estimation. There is a -significant- amount of lore available in the revamped zones though. One can debate just how important story is to an MMO compared to strict gameplay, but for my money I'll take 1,000 terrible story-loving players to one expert strict gameplay-lover in anything but the most recent, difficult content.
I don't think tutorials are quite so necessary, but starter zones with tips? Definitely. And while I know veterans hate that feeling of needing to gain 20 levels to see things -really- start picking up, I can't help but think that it is because they have completely forgotten that it was the rush of levelling up and gaining new abilities that helped hook them into the genre in the first place -- experiences that don't come quite as quickly or as meaningfully without the early levels. If you don't cater to the new blood, eventually you'll have no blood at all because attrition, change, time, and available commitment.
"So, as a stockholder, you should be relieved to know that our games are easier in order to attract a wider audience. As a gamer, you might feel a little sad, and you should be. It is quite sad."
Not at all. It is a good thing that players are not spending hours to train patterns on a mere video game. That is my definition of a waste of time.
World of Warcraft studied this and found they were losing players before they hit 5th level because the game was too hard. A developer would be an idiot to listen to the OP.
Difficulty should ALWAYS be loaded in the back end - not at the start if you want a popular game. I liked EQs hard at first style, as well, but it cost them about 10x the audience. WoW with its easy to play hard to master system hit 4-6 million US/EU players. EQ with its get owned at first and then grind style hit 500k.
Why the heck would they listen to the OP? I sure wouldn't. Don't confuse what you like with what is good for business.
Ugh, you reminded me of something I read a while ago.
"Majority of Gamers Today Can’t Finish Level 1 in Super Mario Bros."
"So, as a stockholder, you should be relieved to know that our games are easier in order to attract a wider audience. As a gamer, you might feel a little sad, and you should be. It is quite sad."
That was a funny read.
"Around 70 percent died to the first Goomba".
The real kicker was, "hey also wanted a deeper storyline and voice acting".
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
World of Warcraft studied this and found they were losing players before they hit 5th level because the game was too hard. A developer would be an idiot to listen to the OP.
Difficulty should ALWAYS be loaded in the back end - not at the start if you want a popular game. I liked EQs hard at first style, as well, but it cost them about 10x the audience. WoW with its easy to play hard to master system hit 4-6 million US/EU players. EQ with its get owned at first and then grind style hit 500k.
Why the heck would they listen to the OP? I sure wouldn't. Don't confuse what you like with what is good for business.
Aaaand right after that "study" came Catalysm. A brand new world with "improved new player experience!"
5 million lost players later... That study is exactly what they cited in reasoning behind doing the Cata revamp. It was basically a NGE for WoW.
Players didn't like Cata for a number of reasons not usually mentioned:
1. Having gotten the Loremaster achieve before Cata (a mind numbing achievement of doing a set amount of quests in EVERY zone in WoW), it was removed and they had to REDO IT ALL OVER AGAIN. o.O People came back and found they had zero credit for all the zones they did complete for the achieve, too. Enraging is an understatement.
2. 2hr interior dungeons that required CC. It was so bad for some classes (paladins especially), that Blizzard had to add more CC abilities for players so they could even CC (6 second stuns on 30 sec CDs wouldnt do it). Which led to what MoP became -- World of Stuncraft.
3. Old world was completely destroyed in some areas (Ashenvale and Barrens for example), for no other reason than a storyline. Areas that folks used to goto for fun (Southshore for example) doesn't even exist anymore to go back too. So all those memories were shot (nostalgia is important for WoW, the whole reason it exists...it's a MMO version of WC1-3).
4. Healing changes after 4.0.1. My first day in Cata dungeons people were lamenting they had to give up their healer mains due to the changes.
5. The nail in the coffin: Ghostcrawlers infamous "l2p" blog post, which the very next day started the mass exodus.
The questing and leveling ease in itself wasn't a major concern for those at 85 then (people did at least level a 1-85 toon to see the changes, with the Worgen/Goblin new races), it was the whole package together that made Cata a let down, especially after the rich story and game mechanics of WotLK (game mechanics were the fast burst type in WotLK, not the slow CC type in Cata). Plus, who can't forget ICC...the last hand tuned WoW raid (Ghostcrawler mentioned that Blizzard doesn't want to hand tune raids anymore, which is how they got the Holy paladin to heal so well then, which in turn had everyone but their dead uncle raiding as paladins are the most popular class in WoW. 12 million were playing for many reasons).
Had no problems healing on my priest. CC also took little time, so dungeons went pretty fast. The real trouble was people being used to Wrath and spamming AoE heal while watching TV. Fortunately they're making healing and dungeons more challenging in Warlords of Draenor to address those concerns, as lots of players are finding the gameplay too boring without meaningful. Ghostcrawler's L2P post was very appropriate, and since subs continued dropping after the nerfs, AoE spamfest dungeons and easy mode healing just made a different player group leave. A mistake they seek to avoid repeating.
Making both normal and heroic dungeons tailored to a single player group (the facerollers) at the expense of the player group heroic dungeons were originally made for is a huge mistake they are planning on not repeating in WoD. You want to appeal to multiple player groups - not just one.
I really see no point in starter zones anymore. I assume most players try to get the hell out of them as fast as possible so it seems like wasted resources to me.
An opening cinematic should be more than enough to set the stage. Plop me in the world and let me figure it out.
My views exactly. Hell, I usually just skip the cinematic too, if I can, because when you've seen 10 or 20 cinematics they just become a chore.
Comments
By the way, I have one more key if you're interested.
:P if its a real one it would be awesome, but I was lucky enough to get the past couple weekend keys
.
It's for this one only, I'm afraid
Yeah i agree wow did a great job.
That's why it's successful all these years.
It's the little things that most developers seem to ignore and they fail miserably
For the guys that are tired of the intros and initial grind (I am too after the first run though) there is an easy fix I to hope the devs implement. Just allow a new player or an alt to skip the initial newbie area.
However they also said that as the EQN story progresses new players will be dropped right into whatever the current Rally Call is.
Someone else told me 5 minutes. 1 hour 2 log outs, I'm still in a confined station, with small hallways, doing some forced singular questline. I hope that's still the tutorial, and not the real game...
A tutorial killed defiance, turned thousands of people away from Wushu, had people saying ESO sucked. Has people saying the same about Wildstar.
I bought Gloria Victus lastnight. 10$ for the pre-alpha. Sever tech is still horrible, no bells and whistles. I made my character, and they dropped me in this town. I didn't even have a "!" anywhere. What did I do? I looked at my key binds, and started to run around. I ended up playing this pre-alpha for about 1 1/2 hours. Dying, grouping with other people who were dying, and laughing my ass off. There wasn't even a map!
The option to skip it would be nice. But not including any tutorial would turn off players new to the genre.
I can sacrifice 10-30 minutes of my time if it helps people new to MMOs get a grasp of the mechanics.
For a minute I thought you were talking about the introductory cut scenes. For some games that's the best part.
I would like the option for a very fast tutorial over the scripted, story tutorial. Only an option though. Sometimes the story warrants getting through at least once just to see how it goes.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Who told you this? Tutorials in general are relatively new to the genre. A development of the last 4 years.
I will go as far to say that the tutorials of the last 4 years play a large part in the failings recent mmorpgs.
I don't mind an optional starter zone tutorial.
I think that the way ESO starts is horrible. If you're a quester it just seems like the start of the journey but if you're not a quester and can't wait to get out into the real world and play then it's horrid.
I almost didn't get through it... when I saw a post that said that ESO opens up after level 10 then I forced myself to get there.
If ESO opened up after about the first 15 minutes then I think it would have been very enjoyable.
Palazious <The Vindicators> Darkfall
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Poppa Reaver bugged at rank15
Actually I think that you should have three choices... You can start out in the tutorial, start out in a head start for experienced gamers, or start out without a tutorial altogether for people who have played the game before.
I actually liked the days when you didn't start in one set location but wherever your race's home city was like back in Everquest. It took some time and effort at low levels to get to somewhere else in the world and you learned about your own area not other race's areas. Plus it allowed you to mess yourself up with factions based on your beginning hunting -- like killing those chicks and then finding out their angry parents were on the same faction and are aggro to you.
Kinda from experiance seeing what type of questions pop up in ingame chats around almost any MMORPG I have played and sad thing it even happens with games that have tutorials. As a helpfull player I do try helping those with questions, but I often think to myself why didn't that person just do the tutorial and about 75% of most questions in chat could have been answered already by just playing the game.
I am like OP that I want to be dropped into the world and figure things out myself. But I am not that selfish to asume everyone wants that or even can play such way.
Only way for me as a experianced gamer to judge a MMORPG is to Judge the game after I have finished the tutorial or starters area because for me that's when . I mean whats a few or some hours when it comes to time spend in a MMORPG.
World of Warcraft studied this and found they were losing players before they hit 5th level because the game was too hard. A developer would be an idiot to listen to the OP.
Difficulty should ALWAYS be loaded in the back end - not at the start if you want a popular game. I liked EQs hard at first style, as well, but it cost them about 10x the audience. WoW with its easy to play hard to master system hit 4-6 million US/EU players. EQ with its get owned at first and then grind style hit 500k.
Why the heck would they listen to the OP? I sure wouldn't. Don't confuse what you like with what is good for business.
Ugh, you reminded me of something I read a while ago.
"Majority of Gamers Today Can’t Finish Level 1 in Super Mario Bros."
http://www.p4rgaming.com/majority-of-gamers-today-cant-finish-level-1-in-super-mario-bros/
"So, as a stockholder, you should be relieved to know that our games are easier in order to attract a wider audience. As a gamer, you might feel a little sad, and you should be. It is quite sad."
Aaaand right after that "study" came Catalysm. A brand new world with "improved new player experience!"
5 million lost players later... That study is exactly what they cited in reasoning behind doing the Cata revamp. It was basically a NGE for WoW.
Correlation/causation.
Cata's changes were a mix of good and bad. Some of the zone alterations are outright annoying (especially the ones that leave parts of zones unoccupied unless you do the whole zone chain), others are alright by my estimation. There is a -significant- amount of lore available in the revamped zones though. One can debate just how important story is to an MMO compared to strict gameplay, but for my money I'll take 1,000 terrible story-loving players to one expert strict gameplay-lover in anything but the most recent, difficult content.
I don't think tutorials are quite so necessary, but starter zones with tips? Definitely. And while I know veterans hate that feeling of needing to gain 20 levels to see things -really- start picking up, I can't help but think that it is because they have completely forgotten that it was the rush of levelling up and gaining new abilities that helped hook them into the genre in the first place -- experiences that don't come quite as quickly or as meaningfully without the early levels. If you don't cater to the new blood, eventually you'll have no blood at all because attrition, change, time, and available commitment.
Not at all. It is a good thing that players are not spending hours to train patterns on a mere video game. That is my definition of a waste of time.
That was a funny read.
"Around 70 percent died to the first Goomba".
The real kicker was, "hey also wanted a deeper storyline and voice acting".
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
Players didn't like Cata for a number of reasons not usually mentioned:
1. Having gotten the Loremaster achieve before Cata (a mind numbing achievement of doing a set amount of quests in EVERY zone in WoW), it was removed and they had to REDO IT ALL OVER AGAIN. o.O People came back and found they had zero credit for all the zones they did complete for the achieve, too. Enraging is an understatement.
2. 2hr interior dungeons that required CC. It was so bad for some classes (paladins especially), that Blizzard had to add more CC abilities for players so they could even CC (6 second stuns on 30 sec CDs wouldnt do it). Which led to what MoP became -- World of Stuncraft.
3. Old world was completely destroyed in some areas (Ashenvale and Barrens for example), for no other reason than a storyline. Areas that folks used to goto for fun (Southshore for example) doesn't even exist anymore to go back too. So all those memories were shot (nostalgia is important for WoW, the whole reason it exists...it's a MMO version of WC1-3).
4. Healing changes after 4.0.1. My first day in Cata dungeons people were lamenting they had to give up their healer mains due to the changes.
5. The nail in the coffin: Ghostcrawlers infamous "l2p" blog post, which the very next day started the mass exodus.
The questing and leveling ease in itself wasn't a major concern for those at 85 then (people did at least level a 1-85 toon to see the changes, with the Worgen/Goblin new races), it was the whole package together that made Cata a let down, especially after the rich story and game mechanics of WotLK (game mechanics were the fast burst type in WotLK, not the slow CC type in Cata). Plus, who can't forget ICC...the last hand tuned WoW raid (Ghostcrawler mentioned that Blizzard doesn't want to hand tune raids anymore, which is how they got the Holy paladin to heal so well then, which in turn had everyone but their dead uncle raiding as paladins are the most popular class in WoW. 12 million were playing for many reasons).
.:| Kevyne@Shandris - Armory |:. - When WoW was #1 - .:| I AM A HOLY PALADIN - Guild Theme |:.
Had no problems healing on my priest. CC also took little time, so dungeons went pretty fast. The real trouble was people being used to Wrath and spamming AoE heal while watching TV. Fortunately they're making healing and dungeons more challenging in Warlords of Draenor to address those concerns, as lots of players are finding the gameplay too boring without meaningful. Ghostcrawler's L2P post was very appropriate, and since subs continued dropping after the nerfs, AoE spamfest dungeons and easy mode healing just made a different player group leave. A mistake they seek to avoid repeating.
Making both normal and heroic dungeons tailored to a single player group (the facerollers) at the expense of the player group heroic dungeons were originally made for is a huge mistake they are planning on not repeating in WoD. You want to appeal to multiple player groups - not just one.
My views exactly. Hell, I usually just skip the cinematic too, if I can, because when you've seen 10 or 20 cinematics they just become a chore.
The Fact that ESO just made Starter Zones optional has solidified the companys massive turn arund with this game, for the fans and the testers.
So happy someone is listening!!