The Worst Part About TESO: Phasing

Tibernicuspa

So before I even got in this game, I knew the decision to try to mix singleplayer ES and an MMO would fail miserably. But I never thought THIS miserably.

 

So I tried to play with my friends in the beta today. That was a mistake. Due to the way the game uses phasing, my friend will randomly vanish from sight as he enters a phase to a quest I've already completed, with no obvious way to get to him. The same things happened with MY quests that he didn't have. But all the time I saw his floating grey dot, showing that he was standing next to me.

 

That's one problem. Another is when you can see each other, but the environment you're looking at is totally different, so you're calling out different landmarks that are invisible to each other.

 

ANOTHER problem is seeing other players having things happen to them, being thrown back by invisible fireballs, fighting invisible bosses, invisible encounters that aren't actually impacting the world for anyone but that one person.

 

So let's think about what phasing is supposed to be good for: making you feel like you're impacting the world and immersed. Well, all the things I've already mentioned shatter immersion on a level I've never seen in an MMO. It makes EVERYTHING feel pointless and fake. On top of that, it's not even consistent with itself. So phasing is supposed to make it feel like the world is changing and living right? Well, there's a pile of dead bodies from ONE of my phased missions that are just sitting there, for hours, days after the battle is over. If all these annoyances are there for the sake of making the game world feel immersive, well they've failed.

 

The phasing (not to get started on the instancing) hurts this game in a BIG way, and at the worst of times, makes you unable to play with friends, removes the MM from MMO, and breaks the flimsy illusion the game is trying to sell.

 

If this game survives, it's going to be purely because of the DAOC styled RvR and the skill/crafting system. I wish they had stuck with their original vision to have all big public dungeons, but its very clear that they got shelved for phasing pretty early on, because every "public dungeon" I've seen has been a tiny linear affair with few mobs and a boss that pops into existence at the end. They honestly feel like instanced dungeons with other people. Not the big sprawling scary things public dungeons of old were.

Yamota

I was on the fence if I should get this game but I think your post made me decide not to. Thanks.

vmoped

I agree with what you say with the caveat that it mainly applies to earlier level content.  The public dungeons get larger at higher levels, and they do have sub bosses (even the early ones).  The phasing also becomes less apparent and obnoxious as you level up.  The game will obviously not be enjoyable by all.  Initially I was not very impressed when I first joined the PTS, but it grew on me, and now months of continuous playing I'm very excited to play.  The game does quite a few things very different, and things are getting more intuitive and dynamic as they add content (on the PTS).

A lot of the PTS information is available on Tamriel Foundry  forums if your interested (including patch notes).

Cheers!

edit:  You also get access to group public dungeons at higher levels that are bigger than the solo/duo based public dungeons.

Talemire

Even if you are right, if enough players complain about it, it's gonna be addressed. I honestly wouldn't worry about it too much at this point until much closer to the release date. If the problem isn't fixed by release, then yeah, it'll suck for a lot of people, but I don't doubt something of that magnitude will go far under the radar. I say give it more time.

Ryowulf

I've seen this problem too. It can't just be fixed, its due to how the mega server is set up.  I hope people are right who say its only a problem at low levels.

There is an easy fix. All your friends make characters at the same time, play only with those friends and only when they are online. 

the420kid

your right phasing can hurt but overall its way better for the game it rocks.  Just put your friend on your friend list and u will always be in same phase together its pretty easy

 

Arglebargle

Phasing is a design used to solve some problems, but creates other problems.   Your description does sound bad though.   What level did you get to, or was this issue evident at?   Given the striation of issues, some things that are problems while adventuring at level 5 are not so evident at level 15+, say.  

SlyLoK

They are working at keeping groups together during quest phases. Hopefully it will be worked out before release. It is a problem.

dontadow

I love phasing, I hate phasing that doesnt work. This phasing doesnt work. I want to see changes caused by me, but If i ELECT to play in a group, i want to see things like they see things.  

I am glad i didnt preorder this game yet, until they fix this I just can't imagine buying this. I'm playing with my wife and she keeps either disappearing or i am unable to experience questing with her because she's seeing things I can't and vice versa. The game should work like gw2 instance, if i elect to quest with someone i see what things look like in their pase from their quest. I become  spectator on their quest.  This is really killing our vibe.  It was great last week when we had the same quests but now that we're on different things we're noticing how awful this is. 

Deadlyne

I've experienced exactly this problem far too many times to count.  It's not just for people on different quests or parts of a quest, its even done when you are on the exact same part.  There is no warning of which ones only you are allowed into and which you can actually bring friends into.

As far as it going away as you move away from lower levels that is a total lie.  I've now made it to level 20 and its still happening to me very regularly.  A dungeon is different obviously they are designed specifically for a group to enter.  Tons of quest instances and what I term mini dungeons have this phasing problem going on.

It is extremely annoying and aggravating when grouping for anything other than PvP or a specific dungeon.

dontadow

Originally posted by Deadlyne

I've experienced exactly this problem far too many times to count.  It's not just for people on different quests or parts of a quest, its even done when you are on the exact same part.  There is no warning of which ones only you are allowed into and which you can actually bring friends into.

As far as it going away as you move away from lower levels that is a total lie.  I've now made it to level 20 and its still happening to me very regularly.  A dungeon is different obviously they are designed specifically for a group to enter.  Tons of quest instances and what I term mini dungeons have this phasing problem going on.

It is extremely annoying and aggravating when grouping for anything other than PvP or a specific dungeon.

I just don't understand how you design a game for multiple people and this crap sneaks into pass the beta.  Did they just expect everyone to solo until they got to a dungeon?  Agrevated cause its a really fun game that i am not allowed to play with others. 

Tibernicuspa

Originally posted by Talemire
Even if you are right, if enough players complain about it, it's gonna be addressed. I honestly wouldn't worry about it too much at this point until much closer to the release date. If the problem isn't fixed by release, then yeah, it'll suck for a lot of people, but I don't doubt something of that magnitude will go far under the radar. I say give it more time.

A lot of people have been complaining about it in every phase of the beta. But too many resources have been dumped into this system, they can't afford to change it, and the "mega server" (the source of SO MANY design problems) doesn't really allow it to change.

Tibernicuspa

Originally posted by the420kid

your right phasing can hurt but overall its way better for the game it rocks.

I can't think of a single way that it has improved my gameplay experience. 

I'd much rather have the devs put their resources into quests that impact the game world.

Making me feel like a solo hero in an MMO just doesn't work. I don't feel special. I know everyone else has done it.

 

And in the case of THIS game, the phased quest where I 'defend the city", maybe that'll make me feel good? Well no, because then 10 feet away from the city are the same mobs I Just saved the city from, perpetually fighting NPCs and never dying.

 

dontadow

Originally posted by Deadlyne

I've experienced exactly this problem far too many times to count.  It's not just for people on different quests or parts of a quest, its even done when you are on the exact same part.  There is no warning of which ones only you are allowed into and which you can actually bring friends into.

As far as it going away as you move away from lower levels that is a total lie.  I've now made it to level 20 and its still happening to me very regularly.  A dungeon is different obviously they are designed specifically for a group to enter.  Tons of quest instances and what I term mini dungeons have this phasing problem going on.

It is extremely annoying and aggravating when grouping for anything other than PvP or a specific dungeon.

Something else i have a problem with, mobs should be generate on quest acctivation. i don't mind seeing others mobs, but having them continue to spawn after ive completed the quest and for no reason seems a bit sily to even have phasing.  

RebelScum99

Originally posted by Tibernicuspa

 

If this game survives, it's going to be purely because of the DAOC styled RvR and the skill/crafting system. 

 

It has a bit more going for it than just those two things.  But I agree about the phasing.  It's too overdone in this game.  

Tokken

---

Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
So before I even got in this game, I knew the decision to try to mix singleplayer ES and an MMO would fail miserably. But I never thought THIS miserably. So I tried to play with my friends in the beta today. That was a mistake. Due to the way the game uses phasing, my friend will randomly vanish from sight as he enters a phase to a quest I've already completed, with no obvious way to get to him. The same things happened with MY quests that he didn't have. But all the time I saw his floating grey dot, showing that he was standing next to me. That's one problem. Another is when you can see each other, but the environment you're looking at is totally different, so you're calling out different landmarks that are invisible to each other. ANOTHER problem is seeing other players having things happen to them, being thrown back by invisible fireballs, fighting invisible bosses, invisible encounters that aren't actually impacting the world for anyone but that one person. So let's think about what phasing is supposed to be good for: making you feel like you're impacting the world and immersed. Well, all the things I've already mentioned shatter immersion on a level I've never seen in an MMO. It makes EVERYTHING feel pointless and fake. On top of that, it's not even consistent with itself. So phasing is supposed to make it feel like the world is changing and living right? Well, there's a pile of dead bodies from ONE of my phased missions that are just sitting there, for hours, days after the battle is over. If all these annoyances are there for the sake of making the game world feel immersive, well they've failed. The phasing (not to get started on the instancing) hurts this game in a BIG way, and at the worst of times, makes you unable to play with friends, removes the MM from MMO, and breaks the flimsy illusion the game is trying to sell. If this game survives, it's going to be purely because of the DAOC styled RvR and the skill/crafting system. I wish they had stuck with their original vision to have all big public dungeons, but its very clear that they got shelved for phasing pretty early on, because every "public dungeon" I've seen has been a tiny linear affair with few mobs and a boss that pops into existence at the end. They honestly feel like instanced dungeons with other people. Not the big sprawling scary things public dungeons of old were.

---

Wow, this is a wake-up call for me. I didn't know phasing would work like that. That sucks.
I don't see HOW they can fix this problem before release.....

DrDwarf

They wont fix it.

It will be mad dash to level 50 and see where we are for me.   

ill try run group content over several times but I suspect grouping is going to be a pain in PVe anywhere else..

if things get real bad I will just level in PVP and pick up a soul shard map.

 

 

dontadow

That blows, this is really an issue if you like pve for any type of groupoing, you just don't know when you're not going to be with someone else. AT first I thought it was just certain quests but its so random. 

Mardukk

I agree OP. The pve quuest grinding part of this game is already weak. The game boils down to character building and doac cyro. Huge error on their part, thinking that mmos should be about "stories". It should be a harsh virtual world.

IntheShadows

I had the exact same issue as others here. It was very disappointing. My husband and I kept hitting "travel to friend" button, but it wasn't always reliable and 1 time it even took me away from him for whatever reason. I was seeing quest giver NPCs that he couldn't see. Unless they fix it, it will be a frustrating experience to try and level up with a friend/partner through questing.

lordtwisted

I'm glad other people are finally discussing this, I ave had this concern for the last couple of beta weekends after I learned of the grouping issues.

 

 I am considering buying this game for the PS4 perhaps this issue will be corrected by it's release.

SlyLoK

A solution would be to make the phase that the party leader is in the main one. That way groups stay together and no longer get split by a quest phase. Outside of the quests that do it everything works fine.

GodOfForbiddenFruits

I enjoyed the game, however what you said is COMPLETELY true. I had to make sure both of us had same quest. Even then, for me the quest was bugged, guy was floating in the air beneath the floor, while for my friend it was fine. Tried reloading and restarting nothing helped.

Then I see the quest guy next to me, a messenger, my friend does not. Then we see another quest, he offers quest to me but not my friend. Even though we are same level, etc. And not being able to help a friend because you already completed that quest and you won't see him... And people fighting invisible mobs... And everyone ganging up on "solo" bosses, 1-hiting them. I am not sure if that makes you earn less XP, and/or drops worse items but it still kinda annoying. Its like wherever you go for a quest there tons of people, and everyone will just kill the boss in a second. If I would need help I would group with people or something. This makes it feel like a small world.

FlyByKnight

I "heard" that Wildstar allegedly does this too, and I hate it.

 

People wanted an open world where their decisions make a difference. What other options are available that provides that experience for everyone that plays?

Elikal

SOME FEC phasing at crossroads of a personal story would make sense with phasing. But ESO has WAAAAY overused it. Example: a city in Daggerfall is overrun by Werewolves, you free it. Yes, afterwards you see dead Werewolves and some happy citicens. But you NEVER return to the city anyway. There is no reason to go back. So why do we even need phasing there? It's didn't really heighten my sense of accomplishment more than, say, a short cutscene would have.

I tried to duo and trio with RL friends over the past days, and it was horrible. We were cut apart so often, it was virtually impossible to do anything continually together.

And the irony is: on the other hand ZOS constantly places you with 100 others in some dungeon or area, where I feel like in Walmart sellout day, or like a group of thieves had thoroughly ransacked every house, dungeon and forest before me!

PAL-18

Phasing hotfix v1.0

Its not just about very old friends ,it is a problem for future friends also which player may find while adventuring.

Hear me Zenimax.

Allow people choose their favorite phasing system ,RP ,PvP or PvE.

For example:Who chooses RP ,then this phasing/instancing system tries to fill those phases/instances with RP-minded folks..etc.

PS.wtb chat bubbles.