Hmm, for both you and BC Bully how would your performance in combat be effected by 350ms ping and slower reflexes?
Would it be as cool then or would it be painful?
Not having played for more than an hour in beta I have no idea but would like to know.
I'll disregard the ping part of the question.. because i find that high ping will hurt combat regardless of the mmo you are playing....
but in regard to reflexes... I don't think slow reflexes matter much in the scheme of things.. it's more about quick thinking than reflexes. The only time reflex may become a critical part is if you make use of the roll dodge.. I find that most ppl do not use it and prefer to block instead. in fact I use the night blade skill path of darkness and with its movement speed buff there is mostly no need to either block or dodge.. I just run circles around the mobs.
back on topic though...although it is action combat the pacing of the combat isn't frantic. Don't get me wrong, it can be.. but that is mostly when you are solo and you are fighting large numbers of mobs. The game still comes down to skill choice and skill usage/managing resource pools.
Actually you are wrong many combat systems are not substantially impacted by pings times of that order: Rift, EQ,EQ2 and even WoW are in that category.
So again how do you feel ESO would be effected by ping times of 350ms?
lol.. guy I'm no number cruncher.... The combat is different fun... and tactical.. all those things you are talking about has more to do with coding and the technical side of the servers/game than the actual combat itself.
maybe BC could respond if he thinks it's an interesting enough question. personally idc.
How nice of you. This is a very real question for anyone playing from Australia, New Zealand and the rest of Oceania.
From what you are saying I guess the answer is combat is not innovative, just optimized for the under 25's living in the US.
lol.... it may be a real question.. but i never concern myself with such things.. which is why i said someone else may be able to answer... and no offense lag and reflex have nothing to do with one another ... so as i said.. your comment about ppl under 25 is unnecessary considering .. it is extremely off topic... physical ability has more to do with lifestyle than just age..
So "ground breaking MMO combat" is adding a weapon swap to Neverwinter Online's combat?
ESO and NWO both have soft target tab target combat systems. They hide the tab target base well but it is there.
You guys are funny.. let's say you are right.. It still isn't the same old same old... and it isn't the same combat as NWO.. It may be similar.. but it is definitely not the same. I've played both. I love how on these forums ppl complain and deny.. but none of you guys have given examples of good combat... except for the guy that mentioned Darkfall.. seeing as i have never played that idk and can't deny his reasoning.. darkfall may be better.. but that still doesn't take away from the OP... it is still one of the best systems in the game (meaning mmo combat systems)
Do not get me wrong, Darkfall had its flaws, you only missed out if you love ganking and insane grind, mixed with rampant exploits and haxing.
DFO was better combat, was... I would not touch DFUW with a 10 foot stick if you paid me to, but that's a poll in another thread.
And yes, DFO ability pools drew on Elder Scrolls ability pools, yet the implementation was far more dynamic in practice.
i've seen a couple of videos.. it seems interesting.. but I am both a pvp and pve player so i wouldn't be able to get into darkfall. my fav combat of all time is AOW... but i think ESO is the first.. (that i know of) to directly link attacks to the mouse button.
NWO doesn't count because it isn't nearly as dynamic as eso.. all you do is hold the mouse button down and it continuously attacks. In eso you have to continually click the mouse button to attack and holding it makes your character do heavy attacks.. its completely different.
Hmm, for both you and BC Bully how would your performance in combat be effected by 350ms ping and slower reflexes?
Would it be as cool then or would it be painful?
Not having played for more than an hour in beta I have no idea but would like to know.
I'll disregard the ping part of the question.. because i find that high ping will hurt combat regardless of the mmo you are playing....
but in regard to reflexes... I don't think slow reflexes matter much in the scheme of things.. it's more about quick thinking than reflexes. The only time reflex may become a critical part is if you make use of the roll dodge.. I find that most ppl do not use it and prefer to block instead. in fact I use the night blade skill path of darkness and with its movement speed buff there is mostly no need to either block or dodge.. I just run circles around the mobs.
back on topic though...although it is action combat the pacing of the combat isn't frantic. Don't get me wrong, it can be.. but that is mostly when you are solo and you are fighting large numbers of mobs. The game still comes down to skill choice and skill usage/managing resource pools.
Actually you are wrong many combat systems are not substantially impacted by pings times of that order: Rift, EQ,EQ2 and even WoW are in that category.
So again how do you feel ESO would be effected by ping times of 350ms?
lol.. guy I'm no number cruncher.... The combat is different fun... and tactical.. all those things you are talking about has more to do with coding and the technical side of the servers/game than the actual combat itself.
maybe BC could respond if he thinks it's an interesting enough question. personally idc.
Woha, lets get real here. In an FPS game, 350ms is weak, although you might get an advantage from other players not knowing just how lagged out you are and aiming in the wrong spot. In a tab target game like EVE, 350ms is nothing, as the server runs on 1000ms ticks. So, yes the design of the combat experience and gameplay is crucial, even primal in determining the effect of netlag. Server backend stuff has little to do with it, as there is no real way to compensate for really bad lag, other than slowing down the pace of combat.
That is what i thought as well.. because i've experienced crazy lag in AOW and it didn't make me lose a fight.... but i don't keep track of it in eso so i had no idea if it would affect combat or not.. but as i said before eso combat isn't crazy fast... some bosses have fast attacks.. but most mobs attack fairly slowly...
but as i was saying.. that lag that is super bad has more to do with the technical aspect of the game... not necessarily the game itself.. but the internet.. and networks.. I wouldn't blame the game for such horrible lag.. especially if you are outside of the service area.. as he indeed said he was...
So "ground breaking MMO combat" is adding a weapon swap to Neverwinter Online's combat?
ESO and NWO both have soft target tab target combat systems. They hide the tab target base well but it is there.
You guys are funny.. let's say you are right.. It still isn't the same old same old... and it isn't the same combat as NWO.. It may be similar.. but it is definitely not the same. I've played both. I love how on these forums ppl complain and deny.. but none of you guys have given examples of good combat... except for the guy that mentioned Darkfall.. seeing as i have never played that idk and can't deny his reasoning.. darkfall may be better.. but that still doesn't take away from the OP... it is still one of the best systems in the game (meaning mmo combat systems)
Do not get me wrong, Darkfall had its flaws, you only missed out if you love ganking and insane grind, mixed with rampant exploits and haxing.
DFO was better combat, was... I would not touch DFUW with a 10 foot stick if you paid me to, but that's a poll in another thread.
And yes, DFO ability pools drew on Elder Scrolls ability pools, yet the implementation was far more dynamic in practice.
i've seen a couple of videos.. it seems interesting.. but I am both a pvp and pve player so i wouldn't be able to get into darkfall. my fav combat of all time is AOW... but i think ESO is the first.. (that i know of) to directly link attacks to the mouse button.
NWO doesn't count because it isn't nearly as dynamic as eso.. all you do is hold the mouse button down and it continuously attacks. In eso you have to continually click the mouse button to attack and holding it makes your character do heavy attacks.. its completely different.
Yea, the only other game I ever found that had you hold the mouse button down, and time your swings, was Disneys Pirates of the Caribbean, which was a very poorly implemented game aimed at the kiddie market.
For that matter, I think what I dislike about ESO melee, is that it's so damn slow feeling. DFO was hecktic, even if it was shallow. What made DFO melee hard was that you had a delay between when you click, and when the attack takes place, this led to two things: 1. you had to predict where the target would be, and 2. everyone ran in circles while sprinting, which while fast paced, was comical.
DFUW made the attack register on mousedown, which just killed the skill ceiling in an already shallow melee combat system.
I'm surprised no one has mention how non responsive the combat is. The one thing an MMO must do is have an action happen when a key is pressed. Anyone who has tried to weapon swap, heal, weapon swap knows it fails often enough to adversely effect game play.
You can't trust an action to happen just because you hit a key. Latency, animations, and action priority lists make flowing actions together, or reacting to a situation unworkable.
The ideas the OP mentioned at the start would be great, if a game implements them well. ESO does not. There is plenty to like in ESO, but combat is not one of them.
The ability to change what is an auto attack in the games above into a player controlled system is brilliant. The player is in charge of how hard he swings, how fast he swings, when he swings, and the direction of the swing. Couple that with being able to block incoming attacks, interrupt and even stun W/O ever using a skill on your skill bar is ground breaking. The blood, the impact, the creativity has left me saying HELL YEAH many a night. I even once heard someone yelling "WARGASIM" after a huge 100 v 100 push, and I knew what he meant.
The flip side is that there is a steep learning curve. 2 months in with countless hours played and with all my past mmorpg experience, I feel that I have just began to approach the skill cap of my class. Combat in ESO is harsh and challenging. It's enough to keep me, a sandbox pvpr interested in this quest centric thempark mmorpg.
Nice post once again, BC.
The people who say otherwise are those who probably didn't explore the combat in depth or typical trolls who haunt this forum... you can vary the strength of the attack by holding the left mouse button for varying lengths of time.. It took me a lil over a month to realize that it DOES matter how long you hold it.. the reason i didn't notice is because i'm typically obsessed with attack speed over power and just tried to get as many attacks out as fast as possible. so i rarely used heavy attacks.
I also believe ppl cringe and whine simply because its different... ppl clamor for change but they really only want the changes that they themselves suggest. The combat is awesome... I may not like the choice of skill design.. but the combat mechanics are the definitely the best in the genre... the only game that i might find better is AOW. but for typical high fantasy combat... ESO can't be beat.
Hmm, for both you and BC Bully how would your performance in combat be effected by 350ms ping and slower reflexes?
Would it be as cool then or would it be painful?
Not having played for more than an hour in beta I have no idea but would like to know.
Ping doesn't seem to play the roll that it does in a game like Wushu. I haven't resubbed to battle ping or wtfast. I haven't ever felt like I've been "out pinged".
The combat is one thing that the game got right. I loved the different combinations I could use with my DK Fire Mage. They just should have made the mobs tougher with better AI and gave you more then 5 skills on your bar. Its the best combat I have ever played in a mmo.
Originally posted by reeereee While I wouldn't go as far as the OP did, you have to give ESO some credit for going with a resource driven combat rather than the cooldown driven combat that every developer desperately trying to copy WoW goes for.
How did I miss that? This here is huge. There are no CDs in ESO. No "whack-a-mole" skill bar play.
ESO just uses generic tab target with a soft target on some abilities.
How is this moving the genre forward?
No offense, it really is just tab target, with some abilities free aiming on things, that's very similar to WoW or Rift or Aion, and a little similar to GW2.
I'd say GW2 does more for it's combat to push the envelope.
Originally posted by reeereee While I wouldn't go as far as the OP did, you have to give ESO some credit for going with a resource driven combat rather than the cooldown driven combat that every developer desperately trying to copy WoW goes for.
How did I miss that? This here is huge. There are no CDs in ESO. No "whack-a-mole" skill bar play.
Not sure if they fixed this but the combat system can be broken very easily, certainly not ground breaking if you can easily break combat.
I like the combat. All my abilities fit nicely on my mouse. It was hard in games like WoW using all 12 buttons on my Razer Naga in conjunction with shift and alt. I can also set it up so that other buttons do things like interrupt, which is nice as well. I hated having to hit both buttons to interrupt. You are in control of your character, which I love. Maybe I'm weird though, I liked the combat in SWTOR as well, because of no auto-attack
I didnt mind ESo combat much , but didnt feel like anything new or special at all to me , but then again ESO failed to deliver in many ways for me ...
And another note , didnt the OP say that Wushu had the best combat ever bout 5-6 months ago..
I did and for some of the same reasons, like being able to block. Wushu's 3d movement is simply amazing, couple that with the free form skill system equaled me playing for 15 months.
ESO separates itself from Wushu with it's skill-less combat system along with gripping visuals and raw sound. They combat eye and ear candy is so sweet in ESO. This is coming from a guy who in general believes the developer's quest for better graphics have hurt gameplay in many mmorpgs.
The basic idea of ESO combat of dodging, swinging your weapon and blocking theoretically is really good but in practice the game simply doesn't deliver.
I stopped playing after the end of the first month but back then the combat was really clunky, unresponsive, unbalanced, buggy, , attacks wouldn't connect when they should, you name it.
Saying ESO has the best combat on the market is delusional at best. I wish it was the best on the market, but it isn't.
I agree that ESO's combat could have been the best when it comes to action combat in mmos. Unfortunately, Zenimax completely ruined it by adding the target tagging mechanic from traditional tab target mmos. That takes all the "action" away from the combat, all you have to do is highlight a target and bam, your range attacks will magically chase your target and your sword swings will unrealistically clip through every monster that is not highlighted. Good job, Zeni...... not.
EDIT: with that said, i do hope ESO's combat move the genre forward. But the next game that iterates on that combat must not use target tagging in a game that is not supossed to be tab target.
ESO has the most innovative and visceral combat on the market, action combat. The non skill combat system is what sets ESO apart from WoW, GW2, and WS.
The ability to change what is an auto attack in the games above into a player controlled system is brilliant. The player is in charge of how hard he swings, how fast he swings, when he swings, and the direction of the swing. Couple that with being able to block incoming attacks, interrupt and even stun W/O ever using a skill on your skill bar is ground breaking. The blood, the impact, the creativity has left me saying HELL YEAH many a night. I even once heard someone yelling "WARGASIM" after a huge 100 v 100 push, and I knew what he meant.
The flip side is that there is a steep learning curve. 2 months in with countless hours played and with all my past mmorpg experience, I feel that I have just began to approach the skill cap of my class. Combat in ESO is harsh and challenging. It's enough to keep me, a sandbox pvpr interested in this quest centric thempark mmorpg.
The Combat, The skill system and Cyrodiil are worth the price of admission. If you love pvp like I do, and have not played, you are missing the party of the year.
Lol I love PVP and think ESO is another failure in the MMORPG department. Cyrodiil is the biggest flop of a PVP i have ever seen. But thats my opinion. I don't know who enjoys hundreds of players going HAM on each other. You literally have no idea if your skills are landing or not? Or if you got the killing blow or someone else did. I like satisfaction during PVP. Knowing i just smashed someone with my latest skill.
The scale of cyrodiil isn't the problem. The problem is if you are not in a group of 20+ you are dead. So anyone wanting to do PVP on a smaller scale won't ever get a chance to. Unless they wanna get stomped by 100 people running directly at you. I disagree with everything you've said. But again thats my opinion. Same with my entire clan who has quit LOL. I will stick to offline Elder scrolls games.
Originally posted by SavageHorizon Fact is that ESO has a tab targeting system, soft targeting is just a cover phrase. It's not a action combat mmo. Go play games like Dark Souls or mount and blade and you will soon realise that ESO is not action combat.
Tera and NWNO does it better.
Have a box of tissues on me OP lol.
i rarely tab target in this game unless i am focusing on a certain mob that is in the background. you don't need to tab target, you can aim at a target and attack it.
it has more of a hybrid action/auto target combat. if i was to label it something. its not tab targeting like wow has for example when you absolutely have to either click onto your target or tab target.
personally, i wouldn't say eso's combat is ground breaking like the OP but it is better than most mmo's to date IMO
my only gripe is i wish it could be sped up a little bit. its a little slow and clunky and could use some fine tuning.
Originally posted by rojo6934 I agree that ESO's combat could have been the best when it comes to action combat in mmos. Unfortunately, Zenimax completely ruined it by adding the target tagging mechanic from traditional tab target mmos. That takes all the "action" away from the combat, all you have to do is highlight a target and bam, your range attacks will magically chase your target and your sword swings will unrealistically clip through every monster that is not highlighted. Good job, Zeni...... not. EDIT: with that said, i do hope ESO's combat move the genre forward. But the next game that iterates on that combat must not use target tagging in a game that is not supossed to be tab target.
do you think skyrim combat could have worked in this mmo? or any mmo for that matter? if the answer is yes then i don't think you and anyone else that agrees is being very realistic.
Originally posted by rojo6934 I agree that ESO's combat could have been the best when it comes to action combat in mmos. Unfortunately, Zenimax completely ruined it by adding the target tagging mechanic from traditional tab target mmos. That takes all the "action" away from the combat, all you have to do is highlight a target and bam, your range attacks will magically chase your target and your sword swings will unrealistically clip through every monster that is not highlighted. Good job, Zeni...... not.
EDIT: with that said, i do hope ESO's combat move the genre forward. But the next game that iterates on that combat must not use target tagging in a game that is not supossed to be tab target.
do you think skyrim combat could have worked in this mmo? or any mmo for that matter? if the answer is yes then i don't think you and anyone else that agrees is being very realistic.
I'm still waiting on Planetside2 the fantasy mmorpg too I think there are real issue concerning arrow/bullet physics, character detail/graphics, large scale battles and performance. Planetside is able to pull of physics awesomness due to very little character detail. I don't think that will fly in a mmorpg. Maybe in the future 2017 EQN? What ESO has done is a really nice bridge to that possible future.
Originally posted by rojo6934 I agree that ESO's combat could have been the best when it comes to action combat in mmos. Unfortunately, Zenimax completely ruined it by adding the target tagging mechanic from traditional tab target mmos. That takes all the "action" away from the combat, all you have to do is highlight a target and bam, your range attacks will magically chase your target and your sword swings will unrealistically clip through every monster that is not highlighted. Good job, Zeni...... not.
EDIT: with that said, i do hope ESO's combat move the genre forward. But the next game that iterates on that combat must not use target tagging in a game that is not supossed to be tab target.
do you think skyrim combat could have worked in this mmo? or any mmo for that matter? if the answer is yes then i don't think you and anyone else that agrees is being very realistic.
actually i didnt have Skyrim in mind. ESO's combat is fine, but the targetting system is from a tab target mmo. What mmo did not have targetting system at all? TERA. I didnt like the animation locks in TERA, but the targetless combat was fantastic, you can hit anything that stands in your way without having a single target. That targetless combat is what Zenimax had to implement to make ESO's combat the number one in action combat mmos. TERA is a very limited mmo compared to ESO, and still they managed to pull off a smooth targetless combat.
I too stated in another thread that teso combat is just simply fantastic, it's gives that feel your actually kicking an npc or players ass (at least to me). Not many mmo's can pull it off for me, but TERA came pretty close as well. Then again, I usually play a tank role in all my mmo's.
Tanking is nuts. You can even tank in PvP. I've heard raid leaders call tanks up front to body block breeches and protect the people behind them.
Yeah, I had to do a right respect and get acquainted with the mechanics, but once I got it down, that's all she wrote.
Tanking in PvP is off the hook, as long as you got someone watching your back. But smacking the poor folks in front of me, is pretty damn fun. Back in the days of my DAOC years and Shadowbane, I do get some of that old feeling again. However DAOC and SB, were definitely fantastic in their version of the combat system.
On another note, one of the other posters mentioned Vindictus, I never tried that game, I may have to try it out.
Originally posted by Yamota Not sure what the OP is talking about. PvE has nice combat but in PvP I die in 3 seconds, even though I am a Dragonknight tank.
You might want to respec asap, were pretty op, but then again, it's all about how you like to play your dk tank.
The ability to change what is an auto attack in the games above into a player controlled system is brilliant. The player is in charge of how hard he swings, how fast he swings, when he swings, and the direction of the swing. Couple that with being able to block incoming attacks, interrupt and even stun W/O ever using a skill on your skill bar is ground breaking. The blood, the impact, the creativity has left me saying HELL YEAH many a night. I even once heard someone yelling "WARGASIM" after a huge 100 v 100 push, and I knew what he meant.
The flip side is that there is a steep learning curve. 2 months in with countless hours played and with all my past mmorpg experience, I feel that I have just began to approach the skill cap of my class. Combat in ESO is harsh and challenging. It's enough to keep me, a sandbox pvpr interested in this quest centric thempark mmorpg.
Nice post once again, BC.
The people who say otherwise are those who probably didn't explore the combat in depth or typical trolls who haunt this forum... you can vary the strength of the attack by holding the left mouse button for varying lengths of time.. It took me a lil over a month to realize that it DOES matter how long you hold it.. the reason i didn't notice is because i'm typically obsessed with attack speed over power and just tried to get as many attacks out as fast as possible. so i rarely used heavy attacks.
I also believe ppl cringe and whine simply because its different... ppl clamor for change but they really only want the changes that they themselves suggest. The combat is awesome... I may not like the choice of skill design.. but the combat mechanics are the definitely the best in the genre... the only game that i might find better is AOW. but for typical high fantasy combat... ESO can't be beat.
Hmm, for both you and BC Bully how would your performance in combat be effected by 350ms ping and slower reflexes?
Would it be as cool then or would it be painful?
Not having played for more than an hour in beta I have no idea but would like to know.
Craftseeker - I have aussie ping also, and the reflexes of a sloth swimming in molasses - and I'm fine with ESO (at level 30).
Funnily enough though, I played some darksouls this morning and when I came back to ESO my DK was parrying better.
I've decided to call my gameplay therapy now, as a way of maintaining whats left of my reflexes. Maybe my sub should be a tax deduction
Playing: Darkfall New Dawn (and planning to play Fallout 76) Favourite games have included: UO, Lineage2, Darkfall, Lotro, Baldur's Gate, SSX, FF7 and yes the original Wizardry on an Apple IIe
Comments
lol.... it may be a real question.. but i never concern myself with such things.. which is why i said someone else may be able to answer... and no offense lag and reflex have nothing to do with one another ... so as i said.. your comment about ppl under 25 is unnecessary considering .. it is extremely off topic... physical ability has more to do with lifestyle than just age..
i've seen a couple of videos.. it seems interesting.. but I am both a pvp and pve player so i wouldn't be able to get into darkfall. my fav combat of all time is AOW... but i think ESO is the first.. (that i know of) to directly link attacks to the mouse button.
NWO doesn't count because it isn't nearly as dynamic as eso.. all you do is hold the mouse button down and it continuously attacks. In eso you have to continually click the mouse button to attack and holding it makes your character do heavy attacks.. its completely different.
That is what i thought as well.. because i've experienced crazy lag in AOW and it didn't make me lose a fight.... but i don't keep track of it in eso so i had no idea if it would affect combat or not.. but as i said before eso combat isn't crazy fast... some bosses have fast attacks.. but most mobs attack fairly slowly...
but as i was saying.. that lag that is super bad has more to do with the technical aspect of the game... not necessarily the game itself.. but the internet.. and networks.. I wouldn't blame the game for such horrible lag.. especially if you are outside of the service area.. as he indeed said he was...
Yea, the only other game I ever found that had you hold the mouse button down, and time your swings, was Disneys Pirates of the Caribbean, which was a very poorly implemented game aimed at the kiddie market.
For that matter, I think what I dislike about ESO melee, is that it's so damn slow feeling. DFO was hecktic, even if it was shallow. What made DFO melee hard was that you had a delay between when you click, and when the attack takes place, this led to two things: 1. you had to predict where the target would be, and 2. everyone ran in circles while sprinting, which while fast paced, was comical.
DFUW made the attack register on mousedown, which just killed the skill ceiling in an already shallow melee combat system.
I'm surprised no one has mention how non responsive the combat is. The one thing an MMO must do is have an action happen when a key is pressed. Anyone who has tried to weapon swap, heal, weapon swap knows it fails often enough to adversely effect game play.
You can't trust an action to happen just because you hit a key. Latency, animations, and action priority lists make flowing actions together, or reacting to a situation unworkable.
The ideas the OP mentioned at the start would be great, if a game implements them well. ESO does not. There is plenty to like in ESO, but combat is not one of them.
Ping doesn't seem to play the roll that it does in a game like Wushu. I haven't resubbed to battle ping or wtfast. I haven't ever felt like I've been "out pinged".
The combat is one thing that the game got right. I loved the different combinations I could use with my DK Fire Mage. They just should have made the mobs tougher with better AI and gave you more then 5 skills on your bar. Its the best combat I have ever played in a mmo.
How did I miss that? This here is huge. There are no CDs in ESO. No "whack-a-mole" skill bar play.
ESO just uses generic tab target with a soft target on some abilities.
How is this moving the genre forward?
No offense, it really is just tab target, with some abilities free aiming on things, that's very similar to WoW or Rift or Aion, and a little similar to GW2.
I'd say GW2 does more for it's combat to push the envelope.
I didnt mind ESo combat much , but didnt feel like anything new or special at all to me , but then again ESO failed to deliver in many ways for me ...
And another note , didnt the OP say that Wushu had the best combat ever bout 5-6 months ago..
Not sure if they fixed this but the combat system can be broken very easily, certainly not ground breaking if you can easily break combat.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/85594/major-combat-flaw-animation-canceling-damage-stacking-devs-please-look-here
I did and for some of the same reasons, like being able to block. Wushu's 3d movement is simply amazing, couple that with the free form skill system equaled me playing for 15 months.
ESO separates itself from Wushu with it's skill-less combat system along with gripping visuals and raw sound. They combat eye and ear candy is so sweet in ESO. This is coming from a guy who in general believes the developer's quest for better graphics have hurt gameplay in many mmorpgs.
The basic idea of ESO combat of dodging, swinging your weapon and blocking theoretically is really good but in practice the game simply doesn't deliver.
I stopped playing after the end of the first month but back then the combat was really clunky, unresponsive, unbalanced, buggy, , attacks wouldn't connect when they should, you name it.
Saying ESO has the best combat on the market is delusional at best. I wish it was the best on the market, but it isn't.
I agree that ESO's combat could have been the best when it comes to action combat in mmos. Unfortunately, Zenimax completely ruined it by adding the target tagging mechanic from traditional tab target mmos. That takes all the "action" away from the combat, all you have to do is highlight a target and bam, your range attacks will magically chase your target and your sword swings will unrealistically clip through every monster that is not highlighted. Good job, Zeni...... not.
EDIT: with that said, i do hope ESO's combat move the genre forward. But the next game that iterates on that combat must not use target tagging in a game that is not supossed to be tab target.
Lol I love PVP and think ESO is another failure in the MMORPG department. Cyrodiil is the biggest flop of a PVP i have ever seen. But thats my opinion. I don't know who enjoys hundreds of players going HAM on each other. You literally have no idea if your skills are landing or not? Or if you got the killing blow or someone else did. I like satisfaction during PVP. Knowing i just smashed someone with my latest skill.
The scale of cyrodiil isn't the problem. The problem is if you are not in a group of 20+ you are dead. So anyone wanting to do PVP on a smaller scale won't ever get a chance to. Unless they wanna get stomped by 100 people running directly at you. I disagree with everything you've said. But again thats my opinion. Same with my entire clan who has quit LOL. I will stick to offline Elder scrolls games.
i rarely tab target in this game unless i am focusing on a certain mob that is in the background. you don't need to tab target, you can aim at a target and attack it.
it has more of a hybrid action/auto target combat. if i was to label it something. its not tab targeting like wow has for example when you absolutely have to either click onto your target or tab target.
personally, i wouldn't say eso's combat is ground breaking like the OP but it is better than most mmo's to date IMO
my only gripe is i wish it could be sped up a little bit. its a little slow and clunky and could use some fine tuning.
do you think skyrim combat could have worked in this mmo? or any mmo for that matter? if the answer is yes then i don't think you and anyone else that agrees is being very realistic.
OP was serious?
c'mon man....
I'm still waiting on Planetside2 the fantasy mmorpg too
I think there are real issue concerning arrow/bullet physics, character detail/graphics, large scale battles and performance. Planetside is able to pull of physics awesomness due to very little character detail. I don't think that will fly in a mmorpg. Maybe in the future 2017 EQN? What ESO has done is a really nice bridge to that possible future.
actually i didnt have Skyrim in mind. ESO's combat is fine, but the targetting system is from a tab target mmo. What mmo did not have targetting system at all? TERA. I didnt like the animation locks in TERA, but the targetless combat was fantastic, you can hit anything that stands in your way without having a single target. That targetless combat is what Zenimax had to implement to make ESO's combat the number one in action combat mmos. TERA is a very limited mmo compared to ESO, and still they managed to pull off a smooth targetless combat.
Yeah, I had to do a right respect and get acquainted with the mechanics, but once I got it down, that's all she wrote.
Tanking in PvP is off the hook, as long as you got someone watching your back. But smacking the poor folks in front of me, is pretty damn fun. Back in the days of my DAOC years and Shadowbane, I do get some of that old feeling again. However DAOC and SB, were definitely fantastic in their version of the combat system.
On another note, one of the other posters mentioned Vindictus, I never tried that game, I may have to try it out.
You might want to respec asap, were pretty op, but then again, it's all about how you like to play your dk tank.
Craftseeker - I have aussie ping also, and the reflexes of a sloth swimming in molasses - and I'm fine with ESO (at level 30).
Funnily enough though, I played some darksouls this morning and when I came back to ESO my DK was parrying better.
I've decided to call my gameplay therapy now, as a way of maintaining whats left of my reflexes. Maybe my sub should be a tax deduction
Playing: Darkfall New Dawn (and planning to play Fallout 76)
Favourite games have included: UO, Lineage2, Darkfall, Lotro, Baldur's Gate, SSX, FF7 and yes the original Wizardry on an Apple IIe
-Prior story writer for MMORPG.com