Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Devs are seeming quite un-trustworthy
Projectseph
Member Posts: 18
Beware.
The developers are seeming to curb some pretty shady marketing strategies.
I am seeing a lot of red flags here.
For starters:
Deleting ANY forum thread on steam that remotely mentions their early access game being too expensive. Or The fact that they delete any thread that draws attention to a negative point about the game should be a red flag.
In fact, I haven't seen a post last more than 10 minutes before it becomes deleted.
This is a quote from the steam LiF page:
"How are you planning on involving the Community in your development process?
*snip*
3. Giving us a morale boost from your kind words or a kick in the pants from constructive criticism "
People saying that they know 4 or 5 people willing to pay $20 for an early access game by unknown devs, and not $40, IS constructive.
It lets you know where the market stands...which is how you factor in your business model success probability. And if direction needs to change or be altered.
Ignoring this fact is silly and shows a poor business model. Or none at all.
Metacritic has a 10/10 review by a person named "HotRise".
http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/life-is-feudal-your-own
Go check out the life is feudal website game info section (and key features section) and notice how similar their 'selling points' are.
http://lifeisfeudal.com/game-info
HotRise's review has no ACTUAL cons.
This is a typical market tactic. Look constructive and modest, yet, have no ACTUAL downside.
The developers aren't well known. And while this DOES NOT mean they shouldn't be trusted, it DOES mean to be careful.
How do we do this?
By monitoring their "First impression" practises.
What are they?:
"WHEN we will get to some playable MMO alpha. So far MMO tests are ceased and if we won't succeed with LiF:YO - we might will have troubles." -Bobik, Life is Feudal Developer, Steam Life is Feudal forum 19 September 2014
A bunch of people who don't understand market trends and values and will charge twice what other more well-established companies charge for an Early Release game without understanding that as an upstart company, where there has been no established trust, that they could probably charge less and sell a lot more.
Why is this important?
To generate a larger "copies sold" statistic. Which in of itself, creates a more trusted statistic for further community backing/sponsorship/sales...and Reputation.
This game 'may' be great.
But right now, the developers seem to be a bunch of guys who haven't much idea about business.
Maybe they can design a game. But it takes more than that to be successful.
I am having a feeling like this company is going to walk out the door with a lot of money and customer faith. As has happened with other development teams/companies in the past.
Maybe..maybe not...and as an avid gamer I very much hope I am wrong here.
But,
>>>When a games own Developer has his doubts about the game's success...<<<
That should be a pretty big red flag.
--Edit--
Please don't misconstrue.
I would absolutely LOVE this game to be what everyone else wants it to be.
Really.
I would buy in a heartbeat for $100 if I knew it was fantastic and was made by a capable and trustworthy team and was a game that would occupy my time for 100's of hours.
I am not a fanboy of Rust or DayZ at all.
Simply pointing out what I am seeing in the early stages of LiF and the way they are treating the community/customers.
Comments
I dont know if you are either mad because you dont have the money and you were expecting to play this game soon or what really. Do you even know what is an indie company?
Are you really comparing this to rust? The game that havent received an update in forever and got totally redone to the point that it isnt even back to what it used to be, a year ago, an alpha?
Edit : Dont get me wrong, i love/d Rust but it has been an alpha/beta since way too long and yes they are getting weekly updates but this is still far too slow for all the money they got... They are what 10 people only on this god damn game?
I havent tried the game yet but i belive i will, i watched few videos with the devs, they seem like nice, dedicated hard working people. As for the price, after ArcheAge, are you seriously gonna hate on a game selling below the average box price? Dude.
Upset?
Believe me I can afford the game.
But sometimes when you aren't a 16 year old impatient kid, you can understand how the world works a little more and refrain from spending $$ on anything.
Why?
Because frivolous spending lets a company think that what they are doing is PLEASING a target consumer base.
You spending money "just because" and without any research shows how damning the current market is to itself.
Being an Indie company does not excuse poor business models/practises.
-And if all you took away from my post was a comparison to Rust (which I only pointed out the cost..never comparing the actual games or saying I favoured them) then it shows you are pretty ignorant.
- (But if we must go there, yes, how bad rust is for wanting to update players 2x a week on progress and constantly provide feedback. Constantly allow negative feedback if that's how people feel. And for remaking a whole game and porting to Unity 5 engine to give people a better quality product at the end of the day.
..for half the price ..
...considering they are more trustworthy/have a lot more to lose by screwing their consumer-demographic over.)
I don't favour them, but these are facts.
Why are people not noticing any of the other points?!
Why are you only commenting on the price aspect?
It was only one of a few points of shady business practises.
Pretty pathetic when you take the time to write up using quotes and links and people only see what they feel they can 'Contest'...and ignore the rest of the info.
In fact, the title of the thread wasn't
"This game is too expensive"
But since we are there, I will rebuttal:
Saying "$40 is the price so there" is stupid.
Attitudes like that are exactly why idiots paid Kojima $60 on release for a Metal Gear game that was demo length (speed run in 6 minutes..average time beaten 1 hour..ONE hour for $60)
You accept it..pay it...provide the developer with ZERO incentive to lower their cost or increase game length/quality.
Attitudes like this are literally the reason why so many gaming companies are slapping you in the face.
If a forum gets littered with "It's too expensive" threads....then maybe, JUST maybe, that's a sign that people aren't happy with the cost.
Ignoring so many complaints is utter stupidity and just reliant on impatient kids who just want what their McDonalds pay-check just afforded them.
Allow negative feedbacks? You havent followed the devlopement of Rust kid. They had the entire comment section totally off for several weeks and yes they may allow critics on their forum but thats only because Garry is a troll and take everything with a grain of salt. They ended up making a blog because otherwise people would get their money back for sure, they went almost 6 month without any update what so ever while the new build wasnt even playable.
More trustworthy? Erm THEY completely redone the game from scratch bro, leaving the old build without update for maybe a year...
Now thats facts.
Ok kids wont be able to buy the game, wait 40 dollars really? Lower than any other box game out there and you mad? So because there is poor kids to consider, they should be selling it for 10 maybe? 20? What about they have a family to freaking feed. That means multiple kids to feed and what, now thats not how life works bro?
40$ is nothing, lower than most alphas and betas out there and i just bought it. At least while i play this game i aint giving Trion any cent, them scammers.
So you mad because a game sells lower than box price. Interesting. Life is feudal is more playable than Rust after a year and a half. How about that.
They have a right to charge what they like for their game. I doubt you are really as much of an expert as you are trying to make yourself appear in game company business practices and market trends. As a consumer your only option is to not buy the game until it comes down in price or suck it up and pay the price you consider inflated. Perhaps It would be helpful to send a note to the devs saying you would buy the game if it were cheaper but posting long rants on forums like this accomplishes nothing.
Also them, in your opinion, overpricing their game has absolutely nothing to do with how trustworthy they are and it's a good thing that they aren't 100% confident that their game will come out in a perfectly finished state, it's called being realistic.
Hmmm,
@OP, how do we know for sure, you are not hired by the "other" game devs like Rust, Dayz, Archeage ect to come here and post what you did?
I'm not playing any game right now, but I am curious to know. Thanks
"My Fantasy is having two men at once...
One Cooking and One Cleaning!"
---------------------------
"A good man can make you feel sexy,
strong and able to take on the whole world...
oh sorry...that's wine...wine does that..."
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
After Double Fine shut down development on Space Base DF-9, another Steam early access game, and saying that the next content update will be the last one, I'd say people should be concerned with ALL early access games.
http://steamcommunity.com/app/246090/discussions/0/613936673464943075/
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
Ive been following this game for a long time and I have tested this game since is earliest pre alpha and i guess someone will call me a fanboi in this thread at some point.
It clearly states that you should not buy this game unless you want to support the making of it. That is what the 40$ is for. Think of it as a kickstarter and not as buying a game.
Bobik and his crew have had an uphill battle when it comes to getting Life is Feudal out. Even though the game had much more to it then alot of other stuff ive seen funded on kickstarter Bobiks LiF project did not meet its goal. I dont know if it was a case of failed marketing or if the timing was bad or even if there just arnt enough people that like these sort of games to do it.
Bobik and his crew did not give up. They worked hard on the game and continued on. By releasing a smaller version of their vision with the features they have complete as early access for YO they can promote, distribute, and fund the "Big Brother" of this game, wich is the mmo version.
Please dont slander good people who still have a love for developping great and unique games and not conform for big profit.
...And this is the most words Ive ever written on mmorpg.com in all the years ive been reading. I just felt the need for some reason for this game. Heh...
Too expensive OP?
You did see all the people that shelled out $150 for Archeage pre-alpha or what ever it was? Sure ArcheAge is more of a Triple A title than LIF, but it seems to me that LIF offers at least as much if not more in gameplay features, if not graphics, for less than 1/4 the price of ArcheAge.
That seems a a bargain to me. And if you are tired of the same old, same old, from the big boys, then I think it behooves you to throw a little support behind the indie guys that are struggling to give you something different.
Pretty sure the big boys have stripped your wallet of at least that much over the years. Lighten up a bit and give them a chance!
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
Well said!
+1
Also having a blast - $35 well spent
(you can it for $5 cheaper on the main website)
The advantage (and disadvantage) of crowdfunding is that you can make a game with little (or no) financial backing. This allows games to be made that would not otherwise be made... but that most of them are going to be terrible. This is the cost of innovation (using someone elses money). These products dont need to be financially viable (i.e. good enough for people to pay for) as they are funded externally.
At this point we are all just paying for innovation. In a few years, it is likely that someone will pick up the ideas that worked out, and use them in a properly funded product... which we will all then be able to enjoy.
Thank you for this info. I like it when people help prevent others from being scammed.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
What ever happened to spending your time looking for a game you want to play. Why do so many spend their time looking for something to take to the forums and bitch about.
I looked at the game. Didn't like what I saw, and moved on. All this OMG TEY ARE EVIL!!!! is just stupid.
It's not like Kickstarter. On Kickstarter you have information about budget required to finish the game, estimated delivery date and list of features that will be included in the final product. And you don't get access to the game - at least not in the first year.
Early access, or whatever model DayZ developers are using, is different. For your money you get access to early version. There are some promises about future development - but it's not what you pay for. Most of the game is already there - and people should not expect to get radically different experience down the road.
LiF (and few others) try to mix the two approaches - so the price is on the level of early access (or higher) - and the access to the game is the main selling point, even if developers declare otherwise. There are no solid milestones, there is no budget, nor list of features that for sure will be included in the final product. Devs seem to want to have a cake and eat it at the same time - and that seems suspicious for many potenatial customers.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/290080
Why Early Access?
“DO NOT BUY this game unless you want to support the development of something really new and original in the sandbox genre..........."
Pretty shady OP !!!
+1
It's all about support and showing some faith in the devs if you don't have some that's your opinion OP.
And while I thank you for bringing this to my attention (never really looked at it from this POV) I don't think it's necessary to actively advise people against buying/supporting the game and thus lowering the devs their chances on making this game all it can (and hopefully will) be
How are they scamming people?
Where in the Gaming Rule Book does it state that all early access games have to be the same price? If I recall most early access games have different tiers that vary in pricing in which the consumer can pledge to.
If the game is early access and it's been early access for awhile and no real changes or updates has taken place in that last 4-6 months... that's something everybody should be alerted about....
Threads pertaining to pricing have nothing to do with the development of the game and should be deleted. If you don't want to support the game don't pay the 39.99.
I hate it when gamer's make it seem like these dev's are providing some kind of utility service... we are talking about video games that are played with high speed internet and a machine that's hundreds of dollars.
Please just stop.
show amazing graphics at trade shows and then at release pairing down the graphics greatly and locking the PC to 30fps.
oh wait no that was ubisoft.
a) They are Russians....
b) They eliminate all posts full of criticism, like in Putin prison camp.
c) It's not an MMO within 64 players server, but this is not about.
I think I don't need to say anything more, about this ;/
OP you are missing the point. Many of us got disposable income and don't mind throwing away $40 even if there is a small percent of success from these Indy developer. We are sick of themepark MMORPG and craving for something new.
I am not alone. LIF just sold 65,000 copies in Steam. Hopefully this project get big and be successful.