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[Column] Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn: Fantasy Hybrids: The Support Class
SBFord
Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
Victor delves into a fantasy topic for FFXIV: ARR. How would a hybrid support class that can fulfill multiple roles work in a game like Square Enix’s?
Read more of Victor Barreiro Jr.'s Final Fantasy XIV: Fantasy Hybrids- The Support Class.
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Comments
oh final fantasy tactics, why were you so good and then never expanded upon in a satisfactory manner?
I have to agree 100%. FFXI was my favorite and most played MMO so when people get upset about trinity I can't empathize. In ffxi we had the holy quatro? Possible more? Typical party wasn't healer, tank, dps. It was healer, tank, DD, support. With either the support or dd performing a pulling role. Later on in meripo the best was support, support, 4x dd, with brd, rdm, samx4 being about the best xp per hour possible baring any stupidity.
I really wish FFXIV would figure out a way to bring in support jobs but I don't know how that would work with the duty finder and 4 party member system they have in place.
Alas I am still waiting for a FFXI-2 but I don't think it will ever happen in my life time.
I would love a FFT Online if it was like the original FFT, but just expanded upon and had multiplayer options.
It's ironic that the article mostly focuses on the Chemist, because I ran two chemists for my support and I literally ran 0 mages for my most successful play through of FFT.
I also have to agree that the job system is seriously lacking in FFXIV. It's far too generic, especially compared to the wonderful job systems that have popped up throughout the lifespan of the Final Fantasy series. They would need to up party sizes for dungeons in order to make true support classes work though, since you'd have to have a slot for a healer, tank and dps as well. Of course, the support could take the 4th slot as a utility DPS, but that could make some runs extremely tedious.
I keep waiting for the thief/ninja to pop into the game so I can resub and give it a whirl. I would love more classic FF classes to make it into XIV though.
If they can implement a support class without breaking the game, without removing the challenge in raids, then I'd be all for it. It would be revolutionary, because every game that tries to break the trinity also removes raid difficulty and class balance and if they did that this game would die in a heartbeat.
The reason that worked in XI is because it wasn't mechanically hard by design. Bosses- not a challenge at all, maybe getting the tag on them was lol. The 1 shot boss abilities were so ridiculously predictable. If you hear somebody tell you XI was the hardest game they've ever played they're mistaking it with grindiest.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
I don't think this is necessarily true. We already have one support class in the Bard. It queues as DPS, but they haven't needed to change dungeons around it.
I don't see any reason why any future support classes couldn't fit into a similar model: appreciable DPS, but not chart topping in most cases, and sacrifices their own DPS for support function (most ballads reduce self-damage by 20%).
That being said, I think it would be absolutely ~wonderful~ if they did expand out the dungeon design ~~for dungeons going forward~~ to include a support class by design, and come up with some more interesting and niche support class options. It could absolutely work in the current 4-man model, and we have a lot of 8-man content already as well, so that isn't a huge barrier to overcome.
Bard is not a support class. It's a DPS class with some poorly implemented support skills.
As someone who hates playing DPS classes and enjoys healing, pure support classes bring me great joy when they're done properly. For an example of this, just look at the now defunct City of Heroes. Buffers, debuffers, controllers, swarmers....the class flexibility in that game was insane. So many fun combinations, and if you wanted to make a class that was 110% support, you could do that, and you could do so without gimping your party.
I remember the time when i leveled to 30 with my Archer.I was VERY excited to be a bard in FFXIV and more than ever when i saw the new 2.0 Trailer, i saw a bard throwing a Regen spell and being a support class.
Then, the horror, that "class" was not a Bard, that was a Ranger class with only 4 songs, and it did not have that regen spell/song that they showed on the Trailer...i remember my Bard on FFXI, they had 30+ songs to play, they could use more than 1 weapon...i mean, Mr.Sakaguchi said himself that he based FF's classes on Dungeons & Dragons classes.What the hell happened?
I never get tired of FFXI vets trying to act like a bow using dps bard is suuuch a huge problem. 30+ songs to play! Bwahahah
Minuet, Mardigal, March, Ballad, Finale, Lullaby, Elegy, Requiem.
The rest is pure, undistilled trash.
I wouldn't welcome a fourth role in my FFXIV. Making party setups even more rigid than they are currently sounds horrible. You couldn't do a thing without getting all four roles in your party. Unless the game is horribly balanced in which case the whole system would suck either way.
FFXI: Yay we have tank, 3 dps, healer... now just need a buffer.
*1h later*
Well no buffer wants a party so I guess we need to disband then.
"So fun, so exciting".
@Hyanmen FIrst Bards in XI used more than that for songs, they were just built for specific uses, which of course would happen because like the ones you listed have the most overall use. There is no way you could get them all to be equally effeicent, but the fact they even got that many to be all high priority was great.
I actually like that bard has some DPS power, but it should not be near the top by any means and should rely more on making everyone else stronger with other types of buffs which would equal them out. Noone wants to sit and just purely buff, which is why i loved the hybrid idea. With hybrids you could still do good damage or off tank or solid heal, but your buffs and debuffs are what set you apart.
As for the second post the BIGGEST issue for me with this game is how stupidly rigid they made everything, from classes to gear. The great part about having a hybrid would be that for say 4 man dungeons you could easily make them going forward have hyrbids in mind or even add a 5th slot for any hybrid type role and make dungeons 5 man. Even if they dont have any avalible for say a 4 man dungeon that slot could be DPS or hybrid and either could take the slot.
If SE did not build things so constricted where you 100% need X amount of DPS/heal/tank all the time, adding in other less strict to the trinity roles would work just fine, but likely for balance sake to make it easier they went hard into the trinity and in turn made it too hard to add much else.
At this point im having a hard time seeing how they could add much more for classes. With the ones we have so far it pretty much runs the gambit, having each role have an opposing version of one another that it leaves very little room to add much else that wouldnt be either too close to what we have now or just in the middle and ignored.
nice article.
At this point man, I'll just be happy if they introduce any new classes at all.
FFXIV really is a great game, but SE really needs to step it up in the classes/jobs department. That being said, I'm really happy they're going to introduce rogue/ninja soon. Duty finder is going to be so packed with ninjas lol!
Ummm...are you trolling? They're dropping a class in a patch before the expansion and youre complaining? I don't know of many p2p's that release classes before an expansion.
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Playing-LoL
Rift tried to do support classes but failed to make them compelling. They aren't needed on 5 man dungeons and you take 2 or 3 in a raid. Usually 1 of a couple souls.
The problem with the 1 trick pony classes from EQ1 or DAoC is that when they're 1 trick is not needed or does not counter balance the loss of a damage class then they are also not needed.
This is why the "holy Trinity" evolved to tank, damage and heals.
For example, if you have a class that specializes in debuffs then either those debuffs need to be so powerful that the class is almost a necessity or the debuffs are too weak and the class is useless.
This game would never make a support class be purely "support". They did mention way back that hybrids were being looked into which makes far more sense. I would love to see a job that is like DPS/Buff that has more focus on the buffs/debuffs (like say Redmage) that can help with heals, do good damage and buff/debuff the PT. Played well they could seemingly be amazing, and be good enough to back up main heals or w/e that if say the WHM ran out of MP (which they do here often) the RDM's heals would be sufficent enough to let the WHM regain some MP or compliment them enough so they WHM could use cleric stance.