This is Diablo 3's paragon level almost down to a nutshell. You even must put one point into the first category before you can move onto the next category, like Defense and then Utility.
Now keeping that said it's a PERFECT change. I bought the Imperial Edition before launch day and loved the game... except the idea of hitting level cap. Knowing it would be a boring experience and with other games coming out I un-subbed. I love the Diablo 3 paragon system and it keeps me playing to this day, to hear ESO is doing something in an mmo setting with great voice acting and graphics that "I" enjoy. I'm going to sub again, even before the change takes place.
Thanks to Zenimax for doing something with us gamers in mind and making a change that must have required a lot of internal struggle and prideful thinking. I'll vote with my dollar and give it to em
Me too! The moment this is fully implemented, I will resub and reroll. Start from fresh.
Yeah, D3's Paragon system was pretty awesome, didn't expect to like it as much as I did, but it was addicting, though I only reached like 130 / 140 or so. It encourages alts and makes you feel rewarded for grinding stuff because you can still get Bonus points.
Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!
Played 3 months at launch, took a 2 month break for AA alpha, came back for a month, took a month break for AA, now I'm back again. The combat and fluid pvp system is what keeps me happy. Any improvements only helps to keep me interested longer.
Haxus Council Member 21 year MMO veteran PvP Raid Leader Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
I'm really pumped for the Champion system and since I've come back to ESO (took a break from games entirely for awhile) I've experienced both lower and upper Craglorn, and have been nothing but happy with what ZOS has done with the game. So much good stuff to come
"I am really surprised. that is one hell of a redesign. What made them do this so early in ESO life? is retention rate really that bad for ESO that they have to do such drastic changes?"
Not really but VR has always been the most criticised thing on the forums from at least month 2. They acted on feedback, something you rarely see in the market, and not by straight nerfing difficulty (though they did a bit) but also by adding horizontal growth and making the game even more TESish
The impromptu survey Paul Sage (Creative Director of Elder Scrolls Online) did during the Champion System presentation explains exactly why they are doing this massive overhaul.
“How many people are Veteran Rank 1 or above?”
*Everyone raises their hands*
“How many people are satisfied with Veteran Content at this point?”
*No one raises their hands except for the two developers in the room*
This pretty much says it all.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
"Boy, did we misread the interests of the players or what? If only they had told us this kind of stuff back when the game was in Beta."
Oh, wait. We did. And then we unsub'd at launch. Message apparently received.
Very few people were playing Vet content in BETA. Only a handful of select supporters were given access to the full game.
The mass exodus was primarily because of how buggy it was (among other thing I'm sure). Those who stayed around started complaining about the Vet content. This wasn't a significant complaint until about 1-2 months after the games release. Then it became a major complaint. A few months down the road and they are implementing a whole rewrite. No complaint here other than a bad initial concept that might have looked good on paper. Honestly I don't hate the current system but it definitely needs an improvement, something more engaging.
I look at this and all it's confusion and unfinished state and say, "As long as there isn't still 1 type of tank and 1.5 types of healer, then I'd be okay with whatever this is."
That's why I quit ESO--no variety. The "variety" they thought they gave us was being able to incorrectly build your character whoever you wanted to! But there was always builds that were clearly the best or there were only certain builds that made what you want to do viable. Hope this system changes all of that. If it does, I'll probably come back.
Sounds...Exactly like the Diablo 3 system. Like a direct copy-paste. "You have to go clockwise, (Warrior, Thief, Mage)" just being Core, Offense, Defense and Utility in D3. I suppose it is a good system that i do like, but jeez is it unoriginal.
I'm a little confused by what the system really is. I like the horizontal progression and I get that. I have a Vet 1 that's on hold until Phase 4 and currently leveling an alt. what I'm trying to understand is how this removes the same content of grinding either Craglorn or the other factions. Is the assumption prior to the release of phase 4 that there will be enough solo content released so that those who don't want to do the other factions but still progress outside of groups will have plenty of additional continent within the same faction? Excuse my ignorance as I havent tried Craglorn and was under the impression it was made for groups.
I wonder when they are going to swallow their pride enough to lower the price or go FTP. I haven't even thought about this game since open beta other than when I see an article on this site.
Only concern if you have to have the champion skill slotted to get the passives like other skills , is this going to make the old skill and weapon Lines obsolete once we hit 50, or are the old lines getting revamped ?
I am really surprised. that is one hell of a redesign. What made them do this so early in ESO life? is retention rate really that bad for ESO that they have to do such drastic changes?
Actually, the population is good (and not too long ago the subreddit was swamped with "I'm coming back, what changed" posts), it's just that nobody likes the current Veteran system, and it's one of the major complaints player have - endgame is a grind. So now they're addressing that complaint.
Originally posted by MyBoot Only concern if you have to have the champion skill slotted to get the passives like other skills , is this going to make the old skill and weapon Lines obsolete once we hit 50, or are the old lines getting revamped ?
The champion system is based on passives that affect stats, not skills or specific weapons. Maybe there might be things like "Light Armour gives you x more magicka regen", but we don't know yet. But so far as I know, it shouldn't affect the skill lines.
Originally posted by keithian I'm a little confused by what the system really is. I like the horizontal progression and I get that. I have a Vet 1 that's on hold until Phase 4 and currently leveling an alt. what I'm trying to understand is how this removes the same content of grinding either Craglorn or the other factions. Is the assumption prior to the release of phase 4 that there will be enough solo content released so that those who don't want to do the other factions but still progress outside of groups will have plenty of additional continent within the same faction? Excuse my ignorance as I havent tried Craglorn and was under the impression it was made for groups.
There are two additional Questing zones that we know of thus far, Murkwood (Argonian focused) and Orsinium. Those two will add an additional avenue for leveling. With the Champion system and moving to a Horizontal progression instead of vertical, there is no need to grind the 50+/50++ zones. You can do dungeons, End Game Trials. Since everyone will be on a somewhat level playing field with the exception of the bonuses from the champion system. Even though the bonuses are pretty decent they are designed in a way that you won't see an incredible difference in power from a level 50 with 500 champ points or a level 50 with 20 points. There will of course be a difference but nothing that we have now, from a level 50 and a VR14, for example.
I am really surprised. that is one hell of a redesign. What made them do this so early in ESO life? is retention rate really that bad for ESO that they have to do such drastic changes?
Actually, the population is good (and not too long ago the subreddit was swamped with "I'm coming back, what changed" posts), it's just that nobody likes the current Veteran system, and it's one of the major complaints player have - endgame is a grind. So now they're addressing that complaint.
Originally posted by MyBoot Only concern if you have to have the champion skill slotted to get the passives like other skills , is this going to make the old skill and weapon Lines obsolete once we hit 50, or are the old lines getting revamped ?
The champion system is based on passives that affect stats, not skills or specific weapons. Maybe there might be things like "Light Armour gives you x more magicka regen", but we don't know yet. But so far as I know, it shouldn't affect the skill lines.
Correct, it is all stat based. not abilities. The ability altering stuff will come with the Spellcrafting tradeskill.
Correct, it is all stat based. not abilities. The ability altering stuff will come with the Spellcrafting tradeskill.
thanks for clarifying. I think Spellcrafting is supposed to add new/improved abilities, while Enchantments will modify existing abilities (eg, there's alreay a bow that adds another effect to the Poison Arrow skill, I think it was a slow or something like that)
I am really surprised. that is one hell of a redesign. What made them do this so early in ESO life? is retention rate really that bad for ESO that they have to do such drastic changes?
The original design was beyond dead on arrival. Literally every character was reaching the soft cap on everything with any equipment and the buffs were useless as they blew so far past the softcaps they actually did nothing to "buff you".
Now you tie this in with an abysmal loot system where i have to grind vet rank 1 to 3 to get a new weapon that did 2 more dmg than my last weapon, and oh ya any new gear was essentially useless as i was way over the softcap to begin with!
So beyond the vet level grind being incredibly long, monotous , insanely boring, they actually created a system that was impossible to have any type of meaningful end game content as well, for the reasons mentioned above.
Then lets tack on really absurd stuff like i reach level 50 cool! I goto my first veteran dungeon it is hard as hell, and the drops.....da da duh I need to be VETERAN RANK 5 to use this new sword that has a proc that does 3 more dmg than my vet 1 sword and has a dmg rating of 4 more than my veteran rank 1 sword!. Now go grind 40 hours to equip it talk about incentive!
Not a surprise the game hit rock bottom and all but died so fast (not even taking into account the myriad of other game breaking balance issues, like vampires being able to become 100% immune to dmg permenantly and killed 40-100 people at once by themselves.
change like this? i'll be back for certain if they do it correctly. game might just be fun instead of a tedious boring task.
I am really surprised. that is one hell of a redesign. What made them do this so early in ESO life? is retention rate really that bad for ESO that they have to do such drastic changes?
why can't they just want to make the product better..why is it always about numbers with you people?
"Beliefs don't change facts. Facts, if you're reasonable, should change your beliefs."
"The Society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools."
Currently: Games Audio Engineer, you didn't hear what I heard, you heard what I wanted you to hear.
Comments
Me too! The moment this is fully implemented, I will resub and reroll. Start from fresh.
Looking forward to it!
Help get Camelot Unchained made, a old-school MMORPG, with no hand holding!
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained
Zenimax is making the right moves and faster than any other developer has ever done. Now I see why the wait for the console versions.
Let's not get all bent out of shape if you don't give them help testing game. Only way to get rid of most game breaking bugs is with us.
Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event
4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.
http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/
Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!
"Boy, did we misread the interests of the players or what? If only they had told us this kind of stuff back when the game was in Beta."
Oh, wait. We did. And then we unsub'd at launch. Message apparently received.
21 year MMO veteran
PvP Raid Leader
Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
"I am really surprised. that is one hell of a redesign. What made them do this so early in ESO life? is retention rate really that bad for ESO that they have to do such drastic changes?"
Not really but VR has always been the most criticised thing on the forums from at least month 2. They acted on feedback, something you rarely see in the market, and not by straight nerfing difficulty (though they did a bit) but also by adding horizontal growth and making the game even more TESish
The impromptu survey Paul Sage (Creative Director of Elder Scrolls Online) did during the Champion System presentation explains exactly why they are doing this massive overhaul.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Very few people were playing Vet content in BETA. Only a handful of select supporters were given access to the full game.
The mass exodus was primarily because of how buggy it was (among other thing I'm sure). Those who stayed around started complaining about the Vet content. This wasn't a significant complaint until about 1-2 months after the games release. Then it became a major complaint. A few months down the road and they are implementing a whole rewrite. No complaint here other than a bad initial concept that might have looked good on paper. Honestly I don't hate the current system but it definitely needs an improvement, something more engaging.
I may resub for this upon phase 4 being implemented. Who knows? maybe I will even level an alt !
If they do this successfully and then afterwards release on consoles with a B2P model, who knows what the future of this game could be?
Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
I look at this and all it's confusion and unfinished state and say, "As long as there isn't still 1 type of tank and 1.5 types of healer, then I'd be okay with whatever this is."
That's why I quit ESO--no variety. The "variety" they thought they gave us was being able to incorrectly build your character whoever you wanted to! But there was always builds that were clearly the best or there were only certain builds that made what you want to do viable. Hope this system changes all of that. If it does, I'll probably come back.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
There Is Always Hope!
Actually, the population is good (and not too long ago the subreddit was swamped with "I'm coming back, what changed" posts), it's just that nobody likes the current Veteran system, and it's one of the major complaints player have - endgame is a grind. So now they're addressing that complaint.
There are two additional Questing zones that we know of thus far, Murkwood (Argonian focused) and Orsinium. Those two will add an additional avenue for leveling. With the Champion system and moving to a Horizontal progression instead of vertical, there is no need to grind the 50+/50++ zones. You can do dungeons, End Game Trials. Since everyone will be on a somewhat level playing field with the exception of the bonuses from the champion system. Even though the bonuses are pretty decent they are designed in a way that you won't see an incredible difference in power from a level 50 with 500 champ points or a level 50 with 20 points. There will of course be a difference but nothing that we have now, from a level 50 and a VR14, for example.
Correct, it is all stat based. not abilities. The ability altering stuff will come with the Spellcrafting tradeskill.
thanks for clarifying. I think Spellcrafting is supposed to add new/improved abilities, while Enchantments will modify existing abilities (eg, there's alreay a bow that adds another effect to the Poison Arrow skill, I think it was a slow or something like that)
The original design was beyond dead on arrival. Literally every character was reaching the soft cap on everything with any equipment and the buffs were useless as they blew so far past the softcaps they actually did nothing to "buff you".
Now you tie this in with an abysmal loot system where i have to grind vet rank 1 to 3 to get a new weapon that did 2 more dmg than my last weapon, and oh ya any new gear was essentially useless as i was way over the softcap to begin with!
So beyond the vet level grind being incredibly long, monotous , insanely boring, they actually created a system that was impossible to have any type of meaningful end game content as well, for the reasons mentioned above.
Then lets tack on really absurd stuff like i reach level 50 cool! I goto my first veteran dungeon it is hard as hell, and the drops.....da da duh I need to be VETERAN RANK 5 to use this new sword that has a proc that does 3 more dmg than my vet 1 sword and has a dmg rating of 4 more than my veteran rank 1 sword!. Now go grind 40 hours to equip it talk about incentive!
Not a surprise the game hit rock bottom and all but died so fast (not even taking into account the myriad of other game breaking balance issues, like vampires being able to become 100% immune to dmg permenantly and killed 40-100 people at once by themselves.
change like this? i'll be back for certain if they do it correctly. game might just be fun instead of a tedious boring task.
why can't they just want to make the product better..why is it always about numbers with you people?
"The Society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools."
Currently: Games Audio Engineer, you didn't hear what I heard, you heard what I wanted you to hear.