If they could turn stations into some kind of deadspace gameplay areas that would be completely EPIC. While so many whiners in the EVE community prevent this game from growing and advancing Star Citizen is creeping up rather quickly.
While it would be disliked by many, the fact is if implemented competently, WIS would open up a facet of the game that could bring in an influx of players who would support and and enhance the game for the players who have no interest in it.
WiS have nothing to offer apart of immersion. Most of EvE activities are out there in space.
Sure for you. And that's fine. You could spend all your time in space. Never leave your pod, have a ball. But there is a player base that likes that level of immersion and I think having them in your game not only doesn't detract from your game, but it adds to it, by increasing revenue as well as just adding a whole nother layer of depth to the game. A layer of depth that adds to your game even if you don't participate in it.
I agree 100% with the title of the post. To extend upon it, EVE will continue to die unless PvE is given some serious attention. Right now the only aspect of the game that is interesting is the PvP aspect, and from having participated in it heavily I can assure you that even that is BORING. Whether it is waiting for an enemy, engaging in hugely one sided battles, or having epic scale fights featuring lag time dilation, there is never much fun from actually playing the game. Nearly all of the fun from EVE comes from the tension of being in genuinely dangerous situations. That is not sustainable and the game needs to grow to offer more.
EVE will never be "fixed". No amount of changes CCP makes will make EVE fun again. The whole point of the game is for the players to create the fun with the tools given. Unfortunately a rather large group decided that in order for them to have fun they had to take the fun away from everyone that isn't part of their group.
This group now has control of pretty much the entire game. The majority of the community reps (CSM, Council of Stellar Management, an elected group of players to liason between the community and CCP) are all members of this group, and have fought hard to make sure that any change implemented is either a benefit to them or atleast doesn't detract from their fun.
I know this sounds pretty tin-foil, but having been playing the game for ages and keeping up with the politics involved it's easy to see it's not a conspiracy theory, it's a proudly flaunted cornerstone of the game. What areas of the game they don't control have seen other groups of varying sizes adopt their same methods and now we have no good PVP, and there never was or will be good engaging PVE.
There are no more fights for actual control of space, there are no more rivalries amongst the coalitions/alliances. There is no fire to start a war with to keep things moving along. This leaves the most interesting aspect of the game in a state of perpetual stagnation and it's driving more and more people out of the game.
Pretty much it's always been and always will be up to the players to make the game fun. Unfortunately no one is interested in doing so, and too many people don't understand this and continue to shout at CCP to fix what we broke.
I don't think WiS is particularly disliked by many Eve players, but i don't think its a particularly important feature either, it could be useful for minigames, RP'ing and perhaps just the social aspect, if players considered it important enough then maybe the dev's would put more resources into it, i think its just one of those supply and demand things, where the demand isn't really there yet, if that ever changes, perhaps we'll see some movement in regards to WiS, until then, its pretty much a 'who cares' subject.
I was about to leave, but read this and just logged for say "+1", as someone said before it would add a layer of gaming/gamers that would benefit the whole game, every group taking benefit from the other as your RP inmersion is bigger thanks to the people making the universe running with his huge corporations and politics, and this ones having more people around that potentially will join them, disturb them and moving economy on a lower scale
Walking in stations is not what this game has been about since 2003. If you commit your developibg resources to something completely unrelated to the core of the game, people who already play will be unhappy, and new players will join the game for the wrong reasons. Oh, and ut has nothing to do with "handling change". There where some drastic changes in how Jump Bridged work recently, and people adapted no problem. Adding some stupid items for an outrageous prices, however, is something any good gaming community will reject in a heartbeat.
Sounds like the world is flat to me.
Who cares about 2003.. its 2015-16 EVE needs to adapt to change. Who cares why new players join long as they have good intent? Who are you to say players join EVE for the wrong reason.. Eve is a great game but the general community of elitist baffles me. Stop acting like you know how a new game mechanic like wis would work with the game experience because you don't know shit negative norman.
Well I think it might be you that isn't up to speed with the game, Klash.
Someone here said WIS would add more socialization to the game. Thats LOL! EvE is probably one of the most social MMO's out there right now. You don't play EvE alone and if you do you are playing it wrong.
All WIS might do is add a bit of immersion to the game. But it is immersion that any serious player of EvE can do without. They probably don't have time for idle chit chat in stations. They can do that in space.
The people who really want this are not EvE players, but EvE wannabees IMO.
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
Eight months ago, before the Jump Drive changes had really started to shape the game, and the Aegis Sov changes I thought that EVE would eventually need WiS to continue.
These days, however, with swaths of older players quitting the game and entire alliances crumbling under the new play style, I'm back to where I was when Incarna released: This game does not need WiS right now. Especially if it's going to be nothing more than dress-up-barbie in station.
Not to mention the fact that the last year and a half has seen dozens of top and mid level game developers fleeing the company. Seeing how many of them are lowering the lifeboats and rowing away from the ship makes me think bad things are going on under the water line where us lowly average players can't see.
I think getting rid of the laser sov crap and having in station fighting to settle captures would be pretty freaking cool. If you don't want to get shot keep them from docking or run away imo
If they could turn stations into some kind of deadspace gameplay areas that would be completely EPIC. While so many whiners in the EVE community prevent this game from growing and advancing Star Citizen is creeping up rather quickly.
Yes SC is going to be the benefactor of a starving space genre that really has no Triple A games.Eve is a far cry from triple A but has zero competition. Eve needs a lot more than just walk in stations,like about 500% more.It would need a new engine for starters and a less greedy developer.CCP has made a ton of money on this game and imo rivals Blizzard for putting very little back into the game that players have invested in.
I have wiped Eve off my grid since i can see that it will never be a playable game for me and yes SC is going to get rich because CCP has been sitting cheap and lazy on their high horse.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I'm surprised you all pay for a game with no avatar......I only tried it for a few days but I thought it was as boring of a game as I ever played.
It's the most intensely exciting game I've ever played. That's the real shame about EvE Online. There's so much beautiful potential there but it's wasted by a development team who have become biased, complacent and lost the original vision - it was never meant to be of personal attacks, personal vendettas, nepotism or Goons in space.
When I say intensely exciting imagine being deep in an alliances territory in a multi-billion isk ship sneaking around murdering their people while tens to hundreds of people hunt you. Every time you uncloak to kill someone might be the last time you uncloak and every time you kill one and re-cloak the anger in the alliance gets more intense. I've literally had trouble moving my mouse around just from the stress of it all.
If they could turn stations into some kind of deadspace gameplay areas that would be completely EPIC. While so many whiners in the EVE community prevent this game from growing and advancing Star Citizen is creeping up rather quickly.
Star Citizen is at this moment nothing but a single race circuit, the same instanced pvp map and a online shop. EVE might be dead by the time SC launches, IF it ever launches.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
I am under a different opinion since I have played Eve since 2005 and can see a massive improvement on the Space game, the UI, the engine rewrite, and the graphics, as well as massive improvements on game play, the space game is a million times better than it was. CQ's to me is brilliant. Yet WiS was derailed by upper management at CCP games and they screwed this feature hence the leaked email and the Jita riots that resulted in the space game getting the space game needed attention. But WiS was nothing more than a social endeavor with no real impact on the Space game and a cash shop for cosmetic items. It would be brilliant to have played Sec Wars on the chess board that they had talked about and to own your own bars. It would have worked and I think it can still work without being a cash grab. But the simple fact is it won't happen. CCP is still learning how to make avatar based game play with Dust514. Dust 514 is much better FPS and should be on the PC.
Let's also look at how the community in Eve reacted to Dust 514 as a PS3 exclusive. They hated it and were surprised how CCP blew the PC community off. Even now we can't get CCP to respond if Project Legion is vaporware. To me the perfect interaction with Eve and Dust 514 is Planetary Interaction within Eve with Dust 514 on the PC. They could create cash flow and expand the CQ's. Sadly - none of this is going to happen.
So I a massive universe to play in...but one engine would have been a better thought.
But there is a player base that likes that level of immersion and I think having them in your game not only doesn't detract from your game, but it adds to it, by increasing revenue as well as just adding a whole nother layer of depth to the game.
This only works if you ignore the fact that development resources are finite.
Been saying this for a very long time and is one of the reasons I no longer play EVE nor recommend it, especially when games like Elite: Dangerous and Star Citizen both will have player avatars. CCP promised to make EVE Online a more complete MMORPG years ago. They teased us with scenes of what walking in stations would be like. Told us they would have social areas we players could come together, play games, chat, make deals and even hinted at PvP FPS and more. They took that all away, because a few "it's a spaceship game" whiners cried and moaned.
Cool thing is, we have games(as I said) like Elite, SC, and even No Mans Sky will have player characters and we'll have our hives of scum and villainy, star ports, stations and be able to do more than just pew pew pew starships. The coolest thing ever though is that when we want to pew pew starships in Elite and SC it's far more engaging and challenging than the push a button and let the game play itself you see in EVE.
In the long run, CCP not following through with WIS will cost them...in a sense it all ready has. They are losing players to Elite all ready, soon SC, then NMS.
I think what alot of people disagreeing with you arent realizing is that this isnt a fix thats focused on the "Core Eve Gamer" but more for someone who could casually play the game.
I have subbed to EvE on three seperate occassions. When Walking in Stations was released I was so excited for it I subbed for three months, just to experiance the more "Human" version of the game. I planned on just using the walk in stations as a glorified chat room for my character.
Unfortunately I had no idea how limited and obtuse the system was, and ended up quiting after a week with nothing really to do in the WIS aspect of the game.
Straight up: A clearer vision for walking in stations with more "Fun" added to it could really bring alot of people into EVE and as the OP has stated before, fix the lack of a real "Human Element".
So many posts here I wanted to quote. Instead, I'll just say what I have to say.
I Agree 100% with the title of this post. WiS did not fail. CCP Failed. They caved in to the crappiest, elitist, spoiled demographic of EVE players. The players didn't like WiS so they left and complained and CCP said "ok fine, nevermind then! come back!" that has nothing to do with whether a full fledged WiS would have been successful or not.
I've been saying for months that CCP needs to just let the current player base go. It's not a lot of players anyways. They won't notice if we're gone and replaced with active new players that begin their years of the EVE journey. Millions of players, not 10s of thousands. It's so pathetic that CCP clings so hard. They hold on to the small player base as if the world will end if a few thousand elitist vets (*myself included) finally got over themselves and stopped playing EVE to make way for the company to actually grow the game in to what they want it to be.
So many posts here I wanted to quote. Instead, I'll just say what I have to say.
I Agree 100% with the title of this post. WiS did not fail. CCP Failed. They caved in to the crappiest, elitist, spoiled demographic of EVE players. The players didn't like WiS so they left and complained and CCP said "ok fine, nevermind then! come back!" that has nothing to do with whether a full fledged WiS would have been successful or not.
I've been saying for months that CCP needs to just let the current player base go. It's not a lot of players anyways. They won't notice if we're gone and replaced with active new players that begin their years of the EVE journey. Millions of players, not 10s of thousands. It's so pathetic that CCP clings so hard. They hold on to the small player base as if the world will end if a few thousand elitist vets (*myself included) finally got over themselves and stopped playing EVE to make way for the company to actually grow the game in to what they want it to be.
E:D devs would likely be thrilled to enjoy a player attrition rate as low as Eve's. Pretty ugly when you consider it doesn't even have a subscription.
Actually CCP would have been estactic if it pulled in the same numbers as Elite has in as short of time. It took EVE over a year before it topped 5000k concurrent users. With the coming launch of Horizons Elite will grow - just as EVE did. Games like EVE and Elite are niche games and take time to build a player base.
While I don't agree, I don't really disagree either.
The game needs new gameplay options. The citadels they're introducing are a great step, but quite frankly the blowing shit up in space aspect is pretty well covered. The RP community would adore some substantive WiS features.
E:D devs would likely be thrilled to enjoy a player attrition rate as low as Eve's. Pretty ugly when you consider it doesn't even have a subscription.
Actually CCP would have been estactic if it pulled in the same numbers as Elite has in as short of time. It took EVE over a year before it topped 5000k concurrent users. With the coming launch of Horizons Elite will grow - just as EVE did. Games like EVE and Elite are niche games and take time to build a player base.
Not really fair to compare 1st year numbers of a title with an unknown IP in 2003 with a title with a well known one in 2015.
If/when SC launches it will impact EVE to some degree, but it will likely extinguish ED.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
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E:D devs would likely be thrilled to enjoy a player attrition rate as low as Eve's. Pretty ugly when you consider it doesn't even have a subscription.
Actually CCP would have been estactic if it pulled in the same numbers as Elite has in as short of time. It took EVE over a year before it topped 5000k concurrent users. With the coming launch of Horizons Elite will grow - just as EVE did. Games like EVE and Elite are niche games and take time to build a player base.
Not really fair to compare 1st year numbers of a title with an unknown IP in 2003 with a title with a well known one in 2015.
If/when SC launches it will impact EVE to some degree, but it will likely extinguish ED.
Eve Online is what it is and the people playing it like it. Who knows what SC will do. If people think SC will be EVE ONLINE with extra features and think that will be extra incentive to pull EO players, I think that remains to be proven. Those extra features might not have any draw with EO players.
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This group now has control of pretty much the entire game. The majority of the community reps (CSM, Council of Stellar Management, an elected group of players to liason between the community and CCP) are all members of this group, and have fought hard to make sure that any change implemented is either a benefit to them or atleast doesn't detract from their fun.
I know this sounds pretty tin-foil, but having been playing the game for ages and keeping up with the politics involved it's easy to see it's not a conspiracy theory, it's a proudly flaunted cornerstone of the game. What areas of the game they don't control have seen other groups of varying sizes adopt their same methods and now we have no good PVP, and there never was or will be good engaging PVE.
There are no more fights for actual control of space, there are no more rivalries amongst the coalitions/alliances. There is no fire to start a war with to keep things moving along. This leaves the most interesting aspect of the game in a state of perpetual stagnation and it's driving more and more people out of the game.
Pretty much it's always been and always will be up to the players to make the game fun. Unfortunately no one is interested in doing so, and too many people don't understand this and continue to shout at CCP to fix what we broke.
Someone here said WIS would add more socialization to the game. Thats LOL! EvE is probably one of the most social MMO's out there right now. You don't play EvE alone and if you do you are playing it wrong.
All WIS might do is add a bit of immersion to the game. But it is immersion that any serious player of EvE can do without. They probably don't have time for idle chit chat in stations. They can do that in space.
The people who really want this are not EvE players, but EvE wannabees IMO.
FFA Nonconsentual Full Loot PvP ...You know you want it!!
These days, however, with swaths of older players quitting the game and entire alliances crumbling under the new play style, I'm back to where I was when Incarna released: This game does not need WiS right now. Especially if it's going to be nothing more than dress-up-barbie in station.
Not to mention the fact that the last year and a half has seen dozens of top and mid level game developers fleeing the company. Seeing how many of them are lowering the lifeboats and rowing away from the ship makes me think bad things are going on under the water line where us lowly average players can't see.
Eve needs a lot more than just walk in stations,like about 500% more.It would need a new engine for starters and a less greedy developer.CCP has made a ton of money on this game and imo rivals Blizzard for putting very little back into the game that players have invested in.
I have wiped Eve off my grid since i can see that it will never be a playable game for me and yes SC is going to get rich because CCP has been sitting cheap and lazy on their high horse.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
When I say intensely exciting imagine being deep in an alliances territory in a multi-billion isk ship sneaking around murdering their people while tens to hundreds of people hunt you. Every time you uncloak to kill someone might be the last time you uncloak and every time you kill one and re-cloak the anger in the alliance gets more intense. I've literally had trouble moving my mouse around just from the stress of it all.
EVE might be dead by the time SC launches, IF it ever launches.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
Let's also look at how the community in Eve reacted to Dust 514 as a PS3 exclusive. They hated it and were surprised how CCP blew the PC community off. Even now we can't get CCP to respond if Project Legion is vaporware. To me the perfect interaction with Eve and Dust 514 is Planetary Interaction within Eve with Dust 514 on the PC. They could create cash flow and expand the CQ's. Sadly - none of this is going to happen.
So I a massive universe to play in...but one engine would have been a better thought.
Cool thing is, we have games(as I said) like Elite, SC, and even No Mans Sky will have player characters and we'll have our hives of scum and villainy, star ports, stations and be able to do more than just pew pew pew starships. The coolest thing ever though is that when we want to pew pew starships in Elite and SC it's far more engaging and challenging than the push a button and let the game play itself you see in EVE.
In the long run, CCP not following through with WIS will cost them...in a sense it all ready has. They are losing players to Elite all ready, soon SC, then NMS.
I have subbed to EvE on three seperate occassions. When Walking in Stations was released I was so excited for it I subbed for three months, just to experiance the more "Human" version of the game. I planned on just using the walk in stations as a glorified chat room for my character.
Unfortunately I had no idea how limited and obtuse the system was, and ended up quiting after a week with nothing really to do in the WIS aspect of the game.
Straight up: A clearer vision for walking in stations with more "Fun" added to it could really bring alot of people into EVE and as the OP has stated before, fix the lack of a real "Human Element".
I Agree 100% with the title of this post. WiS did not fail. CCP Failed. They caved in to the crappiest, elitist, spoiled demographic of EVE players. The players didn't like WiS so they left and complained and CCP said "ok fine, nevermind then! come back!" that has nothing to do with whether a full fledged WiS would have been successful or not.
I've been saying for months that CCP needs to just let the current player base go. It's not a lot of players anyways. They won't notice if we're gone and replaced with active new players that begin their years of the EVE journey. Millions of players, not 10s of thousands. It's so pathetic that CCP clings so hard. They hold on to the small player base as if the world will end if a few thousand elitist vets (*myself included) finally got over themselves and stopped playing EVE to make way for the company to actually grow the game in to what they want it to be.
E:D devs would likely be thrilled to enjoy a player attrition rate as low as Eve's. Pretty ugly when you consider it doesn't even have a subscription.
The game needs new gameplay options. The citadels they're introducing are a great step, but quite frankly the blowing shit up in space aspect is pretty well covered. The RP community would adore some substantive WiS features.
If/when SC launches it will impact EVE to some degree, but it will likely extinguish ED.
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Eve Online is what it is and the people playing it like it. Who knows what SC will do. If people think SC will be EVE ONLINE with extra features and think that will be extra incentive to pull EO players, I think that remains to be proven. Those extra features might not have any draw with EO players.
Plus will SC offer the richness that EO has?
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Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"