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New round table from Pantheon dev's
Zandil
Member UncommonPosts: 252
https://www.pantheonrotf.com/forums/topic/1749/developer-round-table-2-28-15
Just finished it myself and some good stuff in there
Comments
Thanks Zandil
I had no idea there was no crafting,that is just sad.That is why i struggle to accept budget games because they are going to cut corners all over the game design.
Sanctums not cities,it really sounds like a cop out on design,cutting more corners.I don't agree what so ever,FFXI starts you in 3 different cities and anyone can go into those cities.The guards might not help you and certain npc will snub you but anyone can travel like you would expect in a world.
I don't like the corpse run that is an old idea proving they still can't get outside their one dimensional bubble on game design.They NEED to think more creatively.
If players new it was going to be dark in a dungeon,they would of course have lighting sources like a torch,so that part should keep it real and not just a total black out.
They should go to the maximum and just have elemental properties per weather and day and dungeons.I like the idea of no light spell in a dark dungeon,i hope they do a LOT more of that,like no fire spells in water,poor physics for projectile attacks in water ect ect.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
I am not sure we listened to the same Developer Round Table Wizardry?
o Crafting/Diplomacy in at release Yes, base crafting will be in at launch, no thoughts on Diplomacy or similar spheres yet but we are open to possibly implementing something like that down the track as an expansion.
o 3 Starting cities They are Sanctums (monolithic structures) not hubs or starting cities, each race will get its own starting city similar to EQ and not all will be the same.
o Death Penalty Not set in stone, death needs to hurt but dying is part of the game and means you are taking risks, we dont want to discourage that. It will be at least as painful as Vanguards Death penalty if not more painful. Corpses and Experience can be retrieved but we need to find the balance between the environments and to not deter you from exploring and taking risks.
I have put together a written and consolidated version of the Dev Round Table which can be found on the Pantheon site.
Developer Round Table Written Recap
Possibly, but I have no problem with corpse runs and I know there are people on this site who like the idea of corpse runs.
Death penalties are hard things to get right for everyone.
It would not bother me at all if a game I was playing had corpse runs. I'd rather have that than some debuff or just reappearing in some graveyard somewhere.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Ahhhh.... Listening to these round table discussions makes me more and more excited to finally play the game!
I particularly like the question and answer about the AA system. Who knew Brad was the person who originally had the idea for the AA system in EQ1?!
Corpse runs are a heavily requested feature among the games backers.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
I was interested when I heard him say that too! I didn't know that either
Pretty hilarious coming from a Wizardry online fan. You don't like Sanctums and small towns for each race but you like 1 town in WO? FFXI towns were terrible, they had this conquest system that was inconsequential. You weren't really punished at all for going to a town your nation was at war with. Pantheon will actually have factions, elves that kill Ogre's on sight etc. Don't compare apples to dog ****.
You don't like corpse runs but you like permadeath? lol. Not to mention WO cut more corners then Tony Hawk and had about 1000x the budget. There's almost too much hypocrisy to address in one response.
Pity I wasn't there. Then I would have asked the awesome devs following questions:
1) In EQ no weapon of same weapon type had same DPS or same stats. It meant that it was always a better weapon for your class to be found which had better DPS. Will it be the same as in EQ?... Or equal boring as more or less all other MMOs where all weapons which is dropped from a certain mob of same level have more or less same DPS, which is really boring.
Please remove all colored weapons (as WoW has) and let no weapon have same DPS or same good stats.
2) How will loot table work? Like in EQ where it worked like round robin or like WoW where it was completely random which took away that you could learn something from the mobs you fought.
In EQ I think it worked something like this....
Ice goblin loot table:
i) goblin tooth
ii) goblin ear
iii) goblin ear
iv) necklace +1 stamina
So for example first time goblin dies it drops the goblin tooth, next 2 times it drops the ear and after that the necklace. All ice goblins have different starting item which they drop which is randomized when the server starts up. This means that you max need to kill same ice goblin 4 times in this case before you get the loot you want. (this is just an example)
I really dislike how most other MMOs works where it's completely random what you get each time and you can't learn anything.
3) Will mobs wear equipment they drop as in EQ? So when you saw an hill orc wear a shield or staff in EQ you know he would drop that and it will be worth some extra coins. That created excitement when you saw those mobs spawn.
This has been discussed a few times on the Pantheon Forums and from memory it is something the team are going to try and implement
Thanks Zandil. I would like my other 2 points to be implemented also as I wants no item to be the same. In most other games most items have more or less same DPS or armor with little variation (of same level) like in WoW. That's really boring. So it would be epic if no items had same armour or DPS like in EQ (except maybe epic weapons). Also a better loot system than what we see in other games would rock to, so we can learn things.
I would also want to have so we don't get to much loot like in WoW where bags are quickly filled with junk, so we can go out on a longer journey without worry to much that we need to go back and sell all the time. Separate quest item bag would be great to have also.
I really like what I have been hearing so far. While I wasn't an early supporter (financially), I've kept a neutral stance on the vision and development, also making a point to not indulge in the mud-throwing that happens from time to time. It seems that Pantheon is an underdog, but also a contender to gain and (hopefully) maintain the interests of a crowd of people that have been looking for exactly this type of game.
If it keeps moving forward, and I'm sure it will, count me in as a future player.
The same: if Pantheon delivers what is being discussed on their website I will be playing.
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
Who said i wanted perma death,there is no such thing as real death in these games,i would prefer the term KO,in which case you should be injured and have to take some time to recover the way FFXI did it.You could go right back and fight injured but your stats would be very low and taking a big risk,but it much more accurately represents what is actually happening because nobody is actually dying.
As to corpse runs,well i just made my point on that,why are you making a run when you don't really die?I also happened to play EQ and EQ2 and corpse runs NEVER flew so not sure what community wants that because i know in the games people did nothing but complain and blame others for dying.It got so bad some people would d/c on purpose to let a player die so they didn't have to make the corpse run,that makes for really lame game play.I still stick by my point,they need to learn to be more creative,they only have 15-20 years in the industry and the best they can do is the same old idea?
Yes crafting will be half ass tossed in but not a solid crafting system,more like just so they can say it's in there but even the lead said it won't be a full on crafting system yet,so ya a RUSHED product,same mistake VG made.
There is only one way to make a solid triple A game and that is to go VERY small but pack as much punch into that small game world as you can.Then after release and making money,you can slowly add more maps and more assets and more models and more classes,more weapons,armor and even more systems.
Again on not changing their ways,why does it have to be the SAME,you know the term CREATIVITY?Why does each town,faction have to be at war,why do they have to attack on site,that was done very poorly in VG to the point i often felt like quitting.The reason is simple,they used proximity UNREALISTIC aggro properties,so you couldn't even sneak up or around,as soon as you hit that proximity,the entire village attacked you,it looked very dumb and poorly designed.I hit one pixel and the entire village of 30 orcs knows i am there and all act on the same AI,which has always been another bad design flaw,too many creatures sharing the same AI.
Dude knows how to half ass make a solid game but i have always said he needs help in creative direction ,he is too stuck on doing everything the same way ,even if proven does not work.We already have EQ1 and EQ2 so why on earth do we or Pantheon want to copy that again,makes no sense.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
It's not that Brad's stuck, it's the ideas he's presenting is what Pantheon's community wants. There was no crafting going to be implemented at all, so basically, he's tossing a bone for the community because they asked for crafting to be in at launch. There was removal of the cash shop due to forum discussion and not wanting Pay to Win. There was changes to the starting cities, yes, with factions implemented as that is what the community wanted.
The death penalty mechanic is still up in the air, but on the Roundtable he said it will be at least as penalizing as VG (which respawned you with all your gear and you didn't have to do a corpse run if you didn't want to) or potentially as punishing as EQ which had the naked corpse runs. Pretty much all Pantheon's community is on board with the fact that there needs to be consequences at death to make you both fear it and want to become a better player in order to avoid it.
There are plenty of topics that have been discussed that are unique to Pantheon or at least most MMOs (although, admittely, I will have to see how they play out before I'm 100% on board if they are great ideas): the Rights of Passage System, Multi-Colored Mana, Dynamic Zone events to name a few, but the idea of Pantheon has been it will take the best of EQ/VG and add new ideas that will make it unique from both.
It appears it is more than this is just the type of game that you do not want to play, which is fine, but there's plenty of others that have some of the features that you are wanting Pantheon to implement to choose from - if you know the type of game he already makes (EQ/VG) and don't like it, then it's a pretty safe assumption that you wouldn't like his 3rd installment.