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Two Games, Two Playerbases
Consuetudo
Member UncommonPosts: 191
Admit that we are factionalized and that it is our different desires that pit us into the eternal conflicts that exist between us. For example, I frequently see that player who claims to be playing several of these modern games and enjoying them; this is totally inconceivable to me. Now, perhaps I have been overly-harsh to say that these individuals are deceiving themselves into thinking they are having fun--who, after all, am I to determine what you are actually feeling? This determination of what the playerbase as a whole is feeling seems to be an effort then that is impossible, particularly since the playerbase is fundamentally divided, as I am asserting here, and perhaps in contradiction to how I have made things seem previously.
Specifically, there are players who view MMOs as games and this contents them perfectly. Although to me this player seems confused, because the quality of present MMOs is abhorrently lackluster and I can't believe someone could purely enjoy them, I will have to allow that they are perhaps actually enjoying themselves without any deception. This is fine.
On the other hand--and this is what detractors don't wish to admit--there is a sizable population who do not find these modern MMOs to be fun, and who purely do not enjoy them. Now this is one of the hardest things for the detractors to understand, and they are not without their excessive arguments: "oh, you are just an elitist, these games are fun, leap off of that podium;" "you are simply wearing rose-tinted glasses, your previous MMO experiences were no different (even worse!) than what you'd find in a modern game;" "you're just burnt out, wait a bit and you'll have fun again;" "you're just old and embittered and therefore incapable of enjoying these anymore"--etc. All of these excuses must be clung to in order to defend how we can only seem to not be enjoying these games, and to continue to defend that these games are enjoyable.
If you want me to allow that you are having fun playing these games that I find to be literally worthless, why can you not allow that I can validly dislike them, without having to lump on me these mountains of excuses that prevent your modern games from being criticized?
What this amounts to is a real impediment towards getting the virtual world idea realized. No: I know exactly what I want to play--I have even pitched the idea several times--and it is fine if you do not want to play it, but do not pretend that this population who craves a virtual world does not exist, because I assure you we do! I am not alone in voicing these concerns! I do not have the statistics to show how many people desire the same thing but I guarantee you it is a hefty crowd. And no, the solution is not to tell me "develop it yourself"--I am not a game developer, I am a game player, and I am armed with the experience of a player that entitles me to have criticism, and oh I shall criticize. This has nothing to do with some moral lesson of being burnt out or taking off rose-tinted lenses, this is literally knowing what I want to play and it is not there.
Thus, there are two different games we are requesting, and two different playerbases present. However, the problem exists when we see that I am able to acknowledge that you can purely have fun with these modern games, but you cannot accept that those very games might not offer to everyone what they require.
Comments
Way to stack the poll question lol.
Here. I'll add a response poll to yours with options in kind:
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Absolutely. Some players want a game other players want a world, this divide is obvious. I am one that wants a world (limited fast travel, no instances, slow and meaningful progression, stiff death penalties) but my needs would conflict with those who want "game" heavily, they would just be roadblocks to them getting to the action.
We've got two disparate types of players here and the divide has been clear for awhile now. Ever since WoW took off really.
Originally posted by laokoko
"if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
... where every single action you can take ingame, regardless of security rating of the system or who is involved, even if you are alone doing your own thing, is considered Player vs. Players according to CCP, in other words everything you do is a threat to everyone else by design.
That to me is pure Insanity. Unreasonable, Illogical, Insanity. If there's no room for non aggressive action of any kind than it's not a MMO, it's a something else.
Don't want either option in post #1 - I want a sandpark with a good mix of story/quest content and crafting/farming/pet breeding sim content.
About the only part of the thread concept I agree with is that "MMO players" are not at all a unified group, and different factions want different types of game, which is a serious problem for indie and kickstarter attempts to get games made.
Have to totally agree here,why people have to have it one way or the other is beyond me.Why can't we just have a large world with both NPC's giving quests and sandbox deep crafting/building areas?
Edit: and before it is mentioned, not one with AA mechanics,the npc's don't have to have quests hubs that just send you on a path to maximum level.
So because the original poster doesn't like a game, no one else is allowed to like it, either? Right.
This is a different spin on the saying, "Misery loves company."
Help support an artist and gamer who has lost his tools to create and play: http://www.gofundme.com/u63nzcgk
I do agree that there is need for a few player driven MMOs, that doesn't mean that themeparks just should disappear but MMOs at the moment are far too similar.
Same thing with difficulty (Im talking about general difficulty, not the hardest 5% in the games). There should be far more variation in MMOs.
Right now almost every single MMO out there focus on the exact same player group and while they might be the largest group we are still missing many potential players.
And with everyone competing for the same players they will just get a small percentage of that group, if they focused on another group (besides the smallest, like FFA full loot PvPers) they would probably actually get more players, probably a lot more.
Eve is not really that type of game (not much "living" world in space after all). As for EQ it is rather similar to Wow in many ways besides the time it takes to play it and the difficulty.
It would be far better to look on a game like Asherons Call instead, it offered a rather different story and told it in a different way compared to EQ/Wow.
SWG had initially some interesting gaming experience as well besides all it's flaws.
the OP's poll is, we might say, a little tilted in its wording though I am a sandbox fan as well.
the part about not existing currently couldnt be more false, though.
depending on your choice of setting, and whether you want something pvp focused or not, you have Eve (my recommendation), your choice of fantasy survival sandboxes (gloria victis, Darkfall, life is feudal which i realize isn't in its mmo phase), your choice of world building games (trove, minecraft, landmark), if you want a really all-encompassing world in the sense that you can do literally whatever you have entropia.... if you want entropia without combat you have second life. if you want a game where you can follow your own path but also "switch" onto a guided path if you feel like it for a time, you have archeage and eq1, and L2.
also on the horizon are crowfall, Star citizen, the repopulation and CU all of which fit the bill.
come to think of it, when lately have we gotten big hype for a game NOT in the mold of games the OP seeks? EoS?
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Dwight D Eisenhower
My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.
Henry Rollins
The OP's text color should be in PURPLE!! So, yeah, people like different things. I think the old schoolers exaggerate their numbers. Like you said, you don't have real data on this. If you don't support developers who are trying to make games similar to what you want, you won't see that sort of game. Until it becomes possible to make them for much smaller budgets. Put your money where your mouth is.
And I even like the concept of virtual worlds.
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Of course people like different things. Otherwise, there wouldn't be some many genre of games.
The invisible hand pretty much show that there aren't that much demand for the old style virtual world type games. Otherwise, Eve would not be at 500k over so so many years, but 5M. Pretending that people here know more than devs who make millions is just silly.
I'm in this camp as well. RPG's are about Story just as much as anything and as long as that story is not linear and can deviate then I am more inclined to play a game with this this system over another.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Totally wrong,first off Eve is a space game,its nothing like the type of world people are asking for.
Second the way you learn skills is time based so it puts people off starting there as they would be so far behind.Even if the levelling skills wasn't time based people want a new game where you start at or around the same time as other players.
The second reason is why people go back to games like WoW,its because they have invested time in it,when you start from scratch in a game that has already been around for years I at least just feel too far behind.This is the reason over 11 years I have 90% of my mmorpg time spent in EQ2.