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You simply cannot discuss deep old school mmorpg elements with newer mmo players.
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You are forgetting that for the most part that grouping was pretty much necessary, so it was less that people had things in common, it was that they had no choice but to group if they wanted to progress. That in itself was both a blessing and a curse. A blessing in that it was your server reputation that often determined if you could get a group/guild (definitely something missing from the paid server transfer/name change reputation dodging that exists today), a curse in that if you played at odd hours getting anything done in-game when there were few people around was a bitch.
While I agree with the majority of your post (including its overall intent), I must place a disclaimer:
DAoC BGs were nothing like the instanced PvP you see in modern MMORPGs. They were persistent, with a keep to fight over control of 24/7 featuring siege, wall-climbing, and all the trimmings of DAoCs RvR system. I miss them so.
Ah yes, the old bitter EQ1 vet that thinks modern MMOs are easy and have no grouping content because leveling is easy. I'm sorry to inform you but modern MMOs have ample group content and challenging group content.
But, I get it, Mythic raiding isn't your thing. What you want is super challenging leveling to bring back the magic days when you were a teenager. It's too bad no one outside a dwindling pool of people who were in love with EQ1 have any desire to bring this back.
That said hopefully with the demise of Wildstar the linear quest grind is on it's way out and something a bite more free form will take it's place, certainly nothing as punishing as oldschool leveling but hopefully something less scripted than what we've gotten over the last 10 years.
Please show me another mmo with challenging group content with truly unique classes where everyone doesnt share some of the same thing? Please show me another mmo where community relies on each other? Please show me this mmorpg that is about group leveling?I never said there isnt group based content that wasnt challenging I said mmorpgs are easy in general now days.
To name a few recently released or still being updated
FF XIV
EVE Online
Wakfu
And of course there's a ton of new and upcoming indie projects that are all about that kind of old school MMO feel.
Is a man not entitled to the herp of his derp?
Remember, I live in a world where juggalos and yugioh players are real things.
Yea ff is ok but the auto combat and semi turn based is pretty outdated, eve online isnt very fun to me due to the fact its not much of a pve game, and wakfu isnt really that interesting because of the art style and silly tone it has which is great when your in that kind of mood.
Another newer mmorpg player who thinks they know everything about older mmorpg players and assume its all nostalgia yet you got it all figured out guy those mmorpgs meant nothing, its no wonder everquest 1 got shut down along with many others all those years ago they didnt last long at all.
FFXIV Combat gets better at max level. Combat at level 13 is no where near combat at level 50. Low level combat was designed for new MMO players which is boring for Vet MMO players. However you can level very fast and get to the good part.
Well, depending on class you get a handful of skills that are off the gcd that you can use in between "turns"
It gets way more exciting though.
See red on the ground => move out of red => wait two or three seconds to see if you passed the latency check or get one-shot
I just might give it another shot thank you.
Yea this is probably a big part of the issue.
I understand the issue and sympathize, I once tried to talk to a friend who had started WoW back in 2012. I tried to explain why I was leaving last November and not coming back, I explained all the changes that had happened over the years and how the game has declined in Quality since TBC.
His response was there was nothing wrong with teh game, it had many things to do and then there were the Amazing raids and dungeons....
I was stumped then it hit me.... How do you explain something that they never experienced?
No matter how much you tell them the games have changed they will never understand it because they cannot grasp the content that no longer exists. They never ran the older raids with the resistances or better mechanics, They wont understand the different level of skill required to complete a raid because all they have ever known is the item level requirement...
Its frustrating, and theres no real answer for it since Developers like Blizzard wont create retro servers and Private servers tend to go monty python and screw things up in their own ways. Its a losing argument and unfortunately most old school players go through this with long running games.
Played: UO, LotR, WoW, SWG, DDO, AoC, EVE, Warhammer, TF2, EQ2, SWTOR, TSW, CSS, KF, L4D, AoW, WoT
Playing: The Secret World until Citadel of Sorcery goes into Alpha testing.
Tired of: Linear quest games, dailies, and dumbed down games
Anticipating:Citadel of Sorcery
Thank you for coming here and posting this, its nice to have support in these ideals people will defend there favorite mmorpgs to the bitter end same goes for single player games, and its really to bad now greedy companies have got what they want, a bunch of people believing there lies.
I think everyone understands that these games have changed, it's a matter of whether they think those changes were the right direction or not, regardless of being there or not. It's a matter of what people seek, considering that; there's really nothing to get frustrated about.
Secondly; which this isn't directed at you, rather the overall thread. I find it frustrating that many of the posters often leave an important element out of these discussions. Something that could explain why many fellow veterans and non veterans alike don't exactly miss the old games. Content/gameplay.... as much as grouping was fun at the time playing SWG or DAOC... The only really interesting thing about those games was the player interactions that were allowed. The games themselves were pretty bland. Without those players they would have been nothing at all really. The little I saw of EQ seemed as though it was the same there, as well as AO, L2, etc... Tech simply didn't allow for much more considering all resource was really put into getting the engines and multiplayer aspects working back then.
That's where games have moved forward, sadly at the cost of multiplayer aspects.
I get that RPers don't really need that, that's how many of us made SWG, UO, etc.. as interesting/engaging as they were. Yet even then it was a relatively low percentage of the overall server base taking part in that stuff on a community level (outside of their guilds).
I think it's completely understandable people would rather play scripted content, experience stories with VO, etc..etc.. with other people. Rather than create their own stories night after night...
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Depends.
Is it long downtimes between battles ?
Endless travel times ?
Having to sit down as a healer during battle and just watch health bars all the time ? (Many games still do that)
Having to battle even ordinary mobs with a full group for half an hour ?
No, I really dont want to discuss that. Thats "old school" in a really bad way. A MMO can be more mainstream. I like it when I can kill critter with a single spell on a highlevel mage. I dont mind a battle that lasts half an hour or even two hours, but it should be an epic boss and not some critter.
And the truth is very simple: if there is no MMO around thats fun to me - I wont play. I dont care if millions play a MMO. The crucial part is if I myself enjoy it.
The evolution of MMOs simply shows how selfish people are. Don't get yourself fooled OP. Your "friends" only hanged with you because they "needed" you. As a vet that had a few constant parties, all those "nice communities" you speak of left me in the dust whenever I wanted to try a different game.
Yeah, f*** that. I'd rather solo than dealing with MMO douches. Or play with a small circle of friends. No more 40-man raids or sick shit like that. After so many years in the MMO world, I'm done dealing with spoon fed assholes, which some of MMO gamers are.
Read more posts before you reply, and oh yes this is completely comparable to the difference of sound, there is nothing in older mmorpg design that should be around all because you think its simply old amazing logic there!