Is EQNext Vaporware?

Panther2103

I think EQ next will come out but it will be completely different than what we saw. They haven't said anything about it ever since the giant uproar about the graphics being too cartoony and had team changes left and right. I really hope they continue to develop it however they want EQ to be though. Not how the fans want it to be. Because devs only tend to make great games when it's their vision. Not trying to live up to the vision of every other person. Unless their vision is money, then screw that.

MrSnuffles

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

GeezerGamer

MrSnuffles said:

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

I don't think it was a deliberate scam. They just couldn't deliver.

MrSnuffles

GeezerGamer said:

MrSnuffles said:

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

I don't think it was a deliberate scam. They just couldn't deliver.

Someone knew in advance that SONY is selling it's games division. These deals usually take 2-3 years plus the time it takes to find an actual buyer. It's pretty safe to say that SONY Management knew at least 3-5 years ahead of time that they are going to sell.

EQN and Landmark were announced August 2013. The announcement that it was sold was made in February 2015. That is 1.5 years.

You can not convince me that no one knew in August 2013 that the company will get sold and EQN most likely never going to be developed but Landmark would be a quick cash grab as it basically is just a tech demo created in less than a year.

CrazKanuk

MrSnuffles said:

GeezerGamer said:

MrSnuffles said:

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

I don't think it was a deliberate scam. They just couldn't deliver.

Someone knew in advance that SONY is selling it's games division. These deals usually take 2-3 years plus the time it takes to find an actual buyer. It's pretty safe to say that SONY Management knew at least 3-5 years ahead of time that they are going to sell.

EQN and Landmark were announced August 2013. The announcement that it was sold was made in February 2015. That is 1.5 years.

You can not convince me that no one knew in August 2013 that the company will get sold and EQN most likely never going to be developed but Landmark would be a quick cash grab as it basically is just a tech demo created in less than a year.

Sooooo, you're saying that when a company enters into talks to sell, they should immediately stop doing whatever the company does? Stop stamping metal, stop making clothing, stop writing code? Sorry, but it's the most asinine thing I've heard. You do realize that there are expectations during the sale of a business, too, right? CN wasn't buying the sign hanging over the door. They're buying the properties, existing and in development. OH! And they could still walk away at any given point up until that sale agreement is signed. Also, you're assuming that everyone knew this was happening, which is not likely the case. It's very rare that talks about selling a company are leaked to employees, it just creates chaos and panic, and people end up leaving, thus hurting the value of the company. Until told otherwise, it's business as usual. 

Wizardry

Buccaneer said:

Muke said:

blueturtle13 said:

I think it will come but after a long time.

My guess it will be released but in a stripped version and not as the game they intended it to be and with a well thought out ingame Cash Shop.

Unfortunately I agree.  It will be released as a basic quest driven themepark that is designed to milk the player base through the cash shop and expensive alpha pre-purchases.  Once they have milked the pre-purchases it will launch FTP and be left to rot.

This is 100% the feeling i get and not based on a gut feeling,i am looking at the SOE developer side of things and their trends.Sure Daybreak might have a bit of influence on change but so far i have not seen it,i still look at H1Z1 and i still see SMALL increments of change.For a game supposedly in earliest Alpha stage i have seen almost no effort put into the game,so obviously this Daybreak operation is still operating as SOE did.

They are just moving a small team of people around from game to game doing just enough to move onto to another game.

99% of the entire "show the public" process behind EQNExt has been showing us PLAYER WORK ,not SOE/DB work.I almost get the feeling that this is exactly what their plan was all along and that they somehow feel we already know this.It takes absolutely no effort whatsoever to create the blank world,after that all i see these guys doing is plotting down some player created assets and calling it a game.That is why they wanted to use Storybricks,they did not need a team to toss in quests then,a couple people could use that template to easily throw in a bunch of simple quests.

Now my gut side of things tells me to only expect about 5% of the game to be SOE/DB effort,the rest is all player made assets that so happens they got suckers from Landmark to PAY THEM to make those assets for them.

Nanfoodle

@Wizardry 

The meat of your post can be summed up in your gut feeling as the reset is conjecture and false info. I will just address one part of your post. H1Z1 not getting updated but in a small way...

http://h1z1.gamepedia.com/Update_notes#.287.2F28.29_July_28th.2C_2015

• 1 Alpha Release Update Notes
  • 1.1 August, 2015
    • 1.1.1 (8/12) August 12th, 2015
  • 1.2 July, 2015
    • 1.2.1 (7/28) July 28th, 2015
    • 1.2.2 (7/16) July 16th, 2015
    • 1.2.3 (7/7) July 7th, 2015
  • 1.3 June, 2015
    • 1.3.1 (6/24) June 24th, 2015
    • 1.3.2 (6/16) June 16th, 2015
    • 1.3.3 (6/9) June 9th, 2015
    • 1.3.4 (6/2) June 2nd, 2015
  • 1.4 May, 2015
    • 1.4.1 (5/27) May 27th, 2015
    • 1.4.2 (5/21) May 21st, 2015
    • 1.4.3 (5/19) May 19th, 2015
    • 1.4.4 Ban Wave #1 (24,837 Banned)
    • 1.4.5 (5/15) May 15th, 2015
    • 1.4.6 (5/8) May 8th, 2015
    • 1.4.7 (5/1) May 1st, 2015
  • 1.5 April, 2015
    • 1.5.1 (4/24) April 24th, 2015
    • 1.5.2 (4/16) April 16th, 2015
    • 1.5.3 (4/9) April 9th, 2015
    • 1.5.4 (4/2) April 2nd, 2015
  • 1.6 March, 2015
    • 1.6.1 (3/27) March 27th, 2015
    • 1.6.2 (3/23) March 23rd, 2015
    • 1.6.3 (3/19) March 19th, 2015
    • 1.6.4 (3/17) March 17th, 2015
    • 1.6.5 (3/15) March 15th, 2015
  • 1.7 February, 2015
    • 1.7.1 (2/25) February 25th, 2015
    • 1.7.2 (2/20) February 20th, 2015
    • 1.7.3 (2/12) February 12th, 2015
    • 1.7.4 (2/10) February 10th, 2015
    • 1.7.5 (2/5) February 5th, 2015
    • 1.7.6 (2/3) February 3rd, 2015
  • 1.8 January, 2015
    • 1.8.1 (1/30) January 30th, 2015
    • 1.8.2 (1/27) January 27th, 2015
    • 1.8.3 (1/26) January 26th, 2015
    • 1.8.4 (1/23) January 23rd, 2015
    • 1.8.5 (1/20) January 20th, 2015
    • 1.8.6 (1/18) January 18th, 2015
    • 1.8.7 (1/17) January 17th, 2015

Mendel

GeezerGamer said:

I don't think it was a deliberate scam. They just couldn't deliver.

A deliberate scam, especially one of this magnitude, would have required some great intelligence.  I don't think SOE/Daybreak had that quality to the degree that would be necessary to perpetrate such a hoax.  I'm definitely in the 'can not deliver' camp.

Rzep

I think it is a simple case of announcing and showing a game way too soon. It takes ages to make an mmo thats why you should only reveal it when its nearing beta.

saker

Trust no corporate -EVER- they are very simply the distillation of evil and nothing less.

Kyleran

There is a still a chance they'll deliver some sort of game under the EQN banner, but as others have said, I'd be surprised if it really includes much of the original vision that was set forth. 

It's possible the entire EQN project was more about making SOE attractive to potential buyers than really delivering a title in the long run.

Nanfoodle

Kyleran said:

There is a still a chance they'll deliver some sort of game under the EQN banner, but as others have said, I'd be surprised if it really includes much of the original vision that was set forth. 

It's possible the entire EQN project was more about making SOE attractive to potential buyers than really delivering a title in the long run.

Yes because an investment firm as large and smart as CN fell for a sugar coated lie. This is not the first time they have bought into tech and software. I am sure they had a full look under the hood by some very talented people. 

jonp200

Nanfoodle said:

Kyleran said:

There is a still a chance they'll deliver some sort of game under the EQN banner, but as others have said, I'd be surprised if it really includes much of the original vision that was set forth. 

It's possible the entire EQN project was more about making SOE attractive to potential buyers than really delivering a title in the long run.

Yes because an investment firm as large and smart as CN fell for a sugar coated lie. This is not the first time they have bought into tech and software. I am sure they had a full look under the hood by some very talented people. 

Really?  I was under the impression CN hadn't done a whole lot of investing in game companies.

CrazKanuk

jonp200 said:

Nanfoodle said:

Kyleran said:

There is a still a chance they'll deliver some sort of game under the EQN banner, but as others have said, I'd be surprised if it really includes much of the original vision that was set forth. 

It's possible the entire EQN project was more about making SOE attractive to potential buyers than really delivering a title in the long run.

Yes because an investment firm as large and smart as CN fell for a sugar coated lie. This is not the first time they have bought into tech and software. I am sure they had a full look under the hood by some very talented people. 

Really?  I was under the impression CN hadn't done a whole lot of investing in game companies.

They actually have a whole company dedicated to investing in TECH. Maybe not games, but tech. That being said, the tech side of their portfolio is extremely diversified. You should check it out. They actually do have a lot of cool toys. 

Nanfoodle

jonp200 said:

Nanfoodle said:

Kyleran said:

There is a still a chance they'll deliver some sort of game under the EQN banner, but as others have said, I'd be surprised if it really includes much of the original vision that was set forth. 

It's possible the entire EQN project was more about making SOE attractive to potential buyers than really delivering a title in the long run.

Yes because an investment firm as large and smart as CN fell for a sugar coated lie. This is not the first time they have bought into tech and software. I am sure they had a full look under the hood by some very talented people. 

Really?  I was under the impression CN hadn't done a whole lot of investing in game companies.

From what I have read Guitar Hero is one of theirs or the company that made it. Outside of that, most of CN is made up of tech firms of many types and my point stands, you know they have some very talented people who check into what they are planing to invest into. Thats what they do. Or do you think they run around hoping what they are spending money on works out ok? lol Also if investment firms as big as CN dont have experts in an area they need, they would contract someone who knows to do that for them. Thats just how this kind of stuff works. 

Rusque

If EQN truly is vaporware, it will be the first vaporware game to have won E3 Best of Show. And it will be glorious.

I do think it's unraveling, and I don't think Columbus Nova bought SOE in order to publish an MMO - seems like a losing bet. I think they may have either built a good engine that they can turn around and license to other development companies or they're holding the EverQuest name for future IP related spinoffs. I really don't know, it's all speculation. But still, best of show.

Nanfoodle

Rusque said:

If EQN truly is vaporware, it will be the first vaporware game to have won E3 Best of Show. And it will be glorious.

I do think it's unraveling, and I don't think Columbus Nova bought SOE in order to publish an MMO - seems like a losing bet. I think they may have either built a good engine that they can turn around and license to other development companies or they're holding the EverQuest name for future IP related spinoffs. I really don't know, it's all speculation. But still, best of show.

This could be, DGC has had non stop listings for hiring programers. 

iatesand

MrSnuffles said:

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

Not to poke fun at you.. but really guy, this is the exactly the type of doom and gloom tin foil hat conspiracy theory post that people laugh at.

EQN and EQLM use the Forgelight engine don't they? and that engine has proven to be viable to support giant maps and well over 1000 players in close proximity so how exactly is it shit? By what standards to bias this?

And how is Landmark a disaster? Its a  crafting and building game, have you logged in and seen the stuff people build?  some of them are amazing, its not supposed to be a better minecraft,  Its not a alpha for EQ:N, its not even supposed to be similar. its just the tools. The people that play Landmark play it for what it is, crafting and building and showing off your skills with the tools provided.

Wizardry said:

Now my gut side of things tells me to only expect about 5% of the game to be SOE/DB effort,the rest is all player made assets that so happens they got suckers from Landmark to PAY THEM to make those assets for them.

How naive do people have to be to think that a few buildings make a game? Lets look at EQ2, how much of that game was cities? How much of any game is cities?  How ignorant of a games development process do you have to be to think that the contrubution of a  few art pieces is equal to 95% of  a game?

Here is  test.. Go download Unity, and then download the 1 of thousand of pre made towns or buildings you can buy one or you can use a free one.  Do you have a game? No?   Do you have 95% of a game? No? oh.. you have a empty world with some buildings.  DBG is offering to allow players to be part of the art direction of the game and to showcase their work. But the total sum of player made contributions is a fraction of what it takes to make a game.  And even then its DB that is providing the tools and over all art direction that the players are using.

I just don't comprehend the level of ignorance that a internet forum can showcase. It is alike to the Jerry Springer of the web. And there are a 1000 + forums with a 100+ threads filled with it.  I can kinda see why Ultron decided to kill off the human race after 5 minuets with access to the internet.

The worst part in all of this is that to even point out this level of stupidity I have to side with & defend DBG. That by itself kinda give you a dirty feeling.
 

jonp200

CrazKanuk said:

jonp200 said:

Nanfoodle said:

Kyleran said:

There is a still a chance they'll deliver some sort of game under the EQN banner, but as others have said, I'd be surprised if it really includes much of the original vision that was set forth. 

It's possible the entire EQN project was more about making SOE attractive to potential buyers than really delivering a title in the long run.

Yes because an investment firm as large and smart as CN fell for a sugar coated lie. This is not the first time they have bought into tech and software. I am sure they had a full look under the hood by some very talented people. 

Really?  I was under the impression CN hadn't done a whole lot of investing in game companies.

They actually have a whole company dedicated to investing in TECH. Maybe not games, but tech. That being said, the tech side of their portfolio is extremely diversified. You should check it out. They actually do have a lot of cool toys. 

Cool.  Fair enough.  Will check it out.  Didn't recall seeing game properties but thanks for the response

MrSnuffles

CrazKanuk said:

MrSnuffles said:

Someone knew in advance that SONY is selling it's games division. These deals usually take 2-3 years plus the time it takes to find an actual buyer. It's pretty safe to say that SONY Management knew at least 3-5 years ahead of time that they are going to sell.

EQN and Landmark were announced August 2013. The announcement that it was sold was made in February 2015. That is 1.5 years.

You can not convince me that no one knew in August 2013 that the company will get sold and EQN most likely never going to be developed but Landmark would be a quick cash grab as it basically is just a tech demo created in less than a year.

Sooooo, you're saying that when a company enters into talks to sell, they should immediately stop doing whatever the company does? Stop stamping metal, stop making clothing, stop writing code? Sorry, but it's the most asinine thing I've heard. You do realize that there are expectations during the sale of a business, too, right? CN wasn't buying the sign hanging over the door. They're buying the properties, existing and in development. OH! And they could still walk away at any given point up until that sale agreement is signed. Also, you're assuming that everyone knew this was happening, which is not likely the case. It's very rare that talks about selling a company are leaked to employees, it just creates chaos and panic, and people end up leaving, thus hurting the value of the company. Until told otherwise, it's business as usual. 

Look at the timeline. It's less than 2 years. I am saying they announced EQN to sell Landmark when they knew that they are not going to finish it. If you think an investment company will finish anything you are in for a surprise. What an investment company does is buy a business, cut cost down by firing employees and closing stores or scraping projects. They aim to generate profit not develop games.

I have seen a couple of sales and mergers in my lifetime and even employees knew at least a year in advance while middle and top management like me knew 2 years in advance so we could plan and prepare severance packages for all employees. Companies are legally bound to offer their employees exit strategies at least a year in advance in case of a merger. You obviously have no idea how corporate business works.

Daybreak bought the existing games portfolio which they now sell with an all access pass. That is really all they are interested in and i go on record here now by saying that Landmark and EQN is dead within the next 24 months. Probably even earlier.

Arclan

EQN seemed possible when it was first publicized years ago.  The likelihood has been in steady decline ever since.

ste2000

It is not vaporware, it's there already!
It's Landmark.......... EQNext Lite.

MrSnuffles

iatesand said:

MrSnuffles said:

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

Not to poke fun at you.. but really guy, this is the exactly the type of doom and gloom tin foil hat conspiracy theory post that people laugh at.

EQN and EQLM use the Forgelight engine don't they? and that engine has proven to be viable to support giant maps and well over 1000 players in close proximity so how exactly is it shit? By what standards to bias this?

And how is Landmark a disaster? Its a  crafting and building game, have you logged in and seen the stuff people build?  some of them are amazing, its not supposed to be a better minecraft,  Its not a alpha for EQ:N, its not even supposed to be similar. its just the tools. The people that play Landmark play it for what it is, crafting and building and showing off your skills with the tools provided.
 

No, it does not use the same engine as Planetside 2. Landmark uses a really bad marching cubes engine that deteriorates dramatically with small viewing distance while Planetside 2 uses a polygon based terrain that has a huge viewing distance with high fidelity.

I'd post 2 screenshots to compare but it's so  ridiculous saying they are the same i won't even bother. The two could not be more different.

Landmark is a disaster, nothing has happened with it. Just because a handful of nerds have build a few houses does not make it a success. If you think that this is going anywhere you will be in for a surprise.

Nanfoodle

MrSnuffles said:

iatesand said:

MrSnuffles said:

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

Not to poke fun at you.. but really guy, this is the exactly the type of doom and gloom tin foil hat conspiracy theory post that people laugh at.

EQN and EQLM use the Forgelight engine don't they? and that engine has proven to be viable to support giant maps and well over 1000 players in close proximity so how exactly is it shit? By what standards to bias this?

And how is Landmark a disaster? Its a  crafting and building game, have you logged in and seen the stuff people build?  some of them are amazing, its not supposed to be a better minecraft,  Its not a alpha for EQ:N, its not even supposed to be similar. its just the tools. The people that play Landmark play it for what it is, crafting and building and showing off your skills with the tools provided.
 

No, it does not use the same engine as Planetside 2. Landmark uses a really bad marching cubes engine that deteriorates dramatically with small viewing distance while Planetside 2 uses a polygon based terrain that has a huge viewing distance with high fidelity.

I'd post 2 screenshots to compare but it's so  ridiculous saying they are the same i won't even bother. The two could not be more different.

Landmark is a disaster, nothing has happened with it. Just because a handful of nerds have build a few houses does not make it a success. If you think that this is going anywhere you will be in for a surprise.

His post is bang on. DGC made the forgelight engine and it used in PS2, Landmark, H1Z1, EQN and they are currently upgrading to forgelight engine 2. Voxels is just a system used in forgelight engine and can be added to just about any game engine. As always so much miss information and people who have no clue posting crap thats just way off base. 

iatesand

MrSnuffles said:

iatesand said:

MrSnuffles said:

Looking at the disaster that is Landmark i would say chances are EQN will never be released. Personally i think the whole thing was a scam to get people to pay for a crappy Minecraft clone called Landmark.

There i said it! They never intended to release a EQN because they realized that their Landmark Engine is just shit.

Glad i got into Landmark for free to witness that disaster. It was quite amusing how bad it was.

Not to poke fun at you.. but really guy, this is the exactly the type of doom and gloom tin foil hat conspiracy theory post that people laugh at.

EQN and EQLM use the Forgelight engine don't they? and that engine has proven to be viable to support giant maps and well over 1000 players in close proximity so how exactly is it shit? By what standards to bias this?

And how is Landmark a disaster? Its a  crafting and building game, have you logged in and seen the stuff people build?  some of them are amazing, its not supposed to be a better minecraft,  Its not a alpha for EQ:N, its not even supposed to be similar. its just the tools. The people that play Landmark play it for what it is, crafting and building and showing off your skills with the tools provided.
 

No, it does not use the same engine as Planetside 2. Landmark uses a really bad marching cubes engine that deteriorates dramatically with small viewing distance while Planetside 2 uses a polygon based terrain that has a huge viewing distance with high fidelity.

I'd post 2 screenshots to compare but it's so  ridiculous saying they are the same i won't even bother. The two could not be more different.

Landmark is a disaster, nothing has happened with it. Just because a handful of nerds have build a few houses does not make it a success. If you think that this is going anywhere you will be in for a surprise.

I cant  tell if you are being willfully ignorant, trolling, or really are just completely out of your depth here. But I'm happy to carry on the conversation.

They both use the Forgelight, it the same engine, Landmark is polys too man, (pss that is why you can fall through the world and peak through the walls)  they package the Voxel Farm Engine in polys.   This may be going to far in left field for this topic but our grapx cards are all based off polys, and the only way you could actually make a  "marching cubes engine" we can call them Voxels would be to write a engine that bypassed the hardware and was  just a software engine, but instead of dong that, they just convert the Voxels into poly meshes. Now Im not an expert on the Voxel farm or the mesh conversion, I just repeated in a dumbed down fashion what I remember about  EQ:LM and Voxels, if somebody know more details on how it works \ feel free to jump in but in general ... it is the same thing guy. So these 2 things that "cant be more different" could  be a little more different by not being the exact same thing.

So let me get this right, they made a game where you build things and craft stuff, and that game is a disaster ( by your own standards) based on the fact that a "handful of nerds" are building things and crafting? Inversely it is funny that "handful of nerds have build a few houses" is also the same thing as the players making 95% of EQ:N content. 

I do not know if the game is going anywhere, the concept was always rather obscure and artistic in nature, and I am not privy to what the there long term goals or aspirations for the game are. Maybe in that regard, it is a failure. Or maybe its doing exactly what they wanted it to do, I'm just not in that loop