And another Kickstarter game runs away with the money...

Seelinnikoi

Well well well... who would have thought that after the numerous Kickstarter fiascos, namely Greed Monger, etc... that another game would have the nerve to just disappear and steal $30,000 out of the backers.

Some articles about it:
http://www.giantbomb.com/articles/developer-ghosts-with-over-30000-raised-on-kicksta/1100-5278/

http://kotaku.com/video-game-kickstarter-disappears-with-over-30-000-1733558273

People, always, always remember that anything you give money to on Kickstarter, is considered a DONATION according to Kickstarter Terms and Conditions.

When you give money to any and all projects, consider that money lost and WHEN or IF the project is completed, consider the pledge perks as a bonus. Other than that, consider that money gone for good, if you understand that, you will have less stress in the likely event that things wont materialise...

Personally, I never used Kickstarter and never will... let the suckers make the game and lose their money while I wait for the final and proper release, if ever.

goboygo

Working as intended.  I'd say 50% of kickstarters will fail, its part of the model. There is no way anyone is expecting them all to succeed, you just have to hope the one you invested in is one of the ones that does.

Lorgarn

This is sad news..

However, this doesn't deter me from using Kickstarter to support projects I believe in. Sure, as with everything in life there is bad apples in the bunch. You just need to minimize the chances of picking one up and make sure the money is disposeable. I've backed four projects on Kickstarter, two of them are fantastic games and the other two are still in development. (Divinity: Original Sin, Elite: Dangerous, Crowfall and Camelot Unchained)

Just be careful, do some research on the guys behind the project and as OP is saying; consider the money a donation for a cause you believe in.

filmoret

30,000$ wont even pay the salary of 1 coder.  So I would like to say that the person who was behind the project lost out a lot more then any of the backers.  Don't complain because a kickstarter never produces anything.  They need millions of dollars to produce a game and without full and complete funding you will never see it.  Cant expect coders and developers to work for free can we.

mmoguy43

This anti-KS campaign isn't going anywhere.
Being smart about what you put money into can really pay off. Being dumb with your spending will get you burned.

FlyByKnight

Kickstarter is used by game industry predators to get infront of marks and career victims. Stop giving good advice. I haven't finished putting together my "perfect mmo" pitch, and running off with these dweebs hard earned money.

laserit

It isn't a loss for Kickstarter, they still got their 5%

They make money no matter what, doesn't matter if a project fails. It's no skin off their ass.

Sovrath

Seelinnikoi said:

People, always, always remember that anything you give money to on Kickstarter, is considered a DONATION according to Kickstarter Terms and Conditions.

I don't see an issue with this. If people want to just throw money at things without a moment's thought then let them.

So far all the kickstarters I've donated to have made it to completion with the exception of those still in development (or just started).  I believe Torment and Bard's tale will also make it to launch as the developers have already successfully launched other games.

My only "dark horse" is Camelot Unchained. I don't expect it "not" to make it but it is the most risky.

The issue is people just giving money to "anyone" without them thinking "have these people launched products before, what is the chance that a product can be launched based on the money that they are asking.

A good many people don't think. Or aren't willing to just laugh and say "oh well", if it fails.

nariusseldon

goboygo said:

Working as intended.  I'd say 50% of kickstarters will fail, its part of the model. There is no way anyone is expecting them all to succeed, you just have to hope the one you invested in is one of the ones that does.

"hope" .. so you agree that KS is selling wishful thinking?

nariusseldon

Sovrath said:

I don't see an issue with this. If people want to just throw money at things without a moment's thought then let them.

absolutely. But we can tell them "i told you so" and have some fun in the forum, right?

Loke666

goboygo said:

Working as intended.  I'd say 50% of kickstarters will fail, its part of the model. There is no way anyone is expecting them all to succeed, you just have to hope the one you invested in is one of the ones that does.

At least 50% but getting out a singlerahter different MMO would be all worth it...

But one should consider the kickstarter money as a gift you probably wont get much out of, giving some money to a talented dev so he or she can continue to work on their pet project will lead to at least some interesting games. 

LacedOpium

Like any other financial investment risk, one should only invest what one can afford to lose.  The problem being that some people are very gullible/naive and are unable to understand this very simple investment rule.  These are the real victim's in these crowd-funded/kick-starter projects.  Many of these victims have families and in their inability to restrain themselves, they impulsively "contribute" thousands of dollars leaving themselves and their families in dire financial straits.  Some to the tune of destabilizing family bonds and even losing their families.  This is a major reason why, not unlike many ventures in life that tend to take advantage of the naive and gullible in life if not regulated, these crowd-funded/kick-starter pose the same risks and need to be receive equal attention and regulation.  

iridescence

nariusseldon said:

goboygo said:

Working as intended.  I'd say 50% of kickstarters will fail, its part of the model. There is no way anyone is expecting them all to succeed, you just have to hope the one you invested in is one of the ones that does.

"hope" .. so you agree that KS is selling wishful thinking?

It's a risk. Much better odds than playing the lottery that you'll get something back but like with any gamble you have to accept the possibility of losing everything or just avoid doing it and put your money in the bank.

CrazKanuk

Loke666 said:

goboygo said:

Working as intended.  I'd say 50% of kickstarters will fail, its part of the model. There is no way anyone is expecting them all to succeed, you just have to hope the one you invested in is one of the ones that does.

At least 50% but getting out a singlerahter different MMO would be all worth it...

But one should consider the kickstarter money as a gift you probably wont get much out of, giving some money to a talented dev so he or she can continue to work on their pet project will lead to at least some interesting games. 

Actually, 83% ship, and that's not even completely updated. I've got stats on 422 projects that were successfully-funded up until the end of 2013. 

Actually, just based on the 2013 successfully-funded projects alone, nearly 50% (45% to be exact) of those titles have already shipped (again, I'm not done updating those numbers either).

Axehilt

Someone should post that giant google doc with all the success/fail launches, to keep things in perspective. 

Almost nightly you can see news coverage of a car crash.  Yet most of us consider driving safe enough to do it daily.  Much of the risk involved in driving is manageable (that guy's swerving a lot; better steer clear.)

It's the same deal with Kickstarter. Most of the risk is manageable, and in spite of the occasional "crash" the platform overall is pretty safe.

Sovrath

Axehilt said:

Someone should post that giant google doc with all the success/fail launches, to keep things in perspective. 

Almost nightly you can see news coverage of a car crash.  Yet most of us consider driving safe enough to do it daily.  Much of the risk involved in driving is manageable (that guy's swerving a lot; better steer clear.)

It's the same deal with Kickstarter. Most of the risk is manageable, and in spite of the occasional "crash" the platform overall is pretty safe.

I think that's perfectly correct. It's manageable. All people have to do is use a little common sense.

Dullahan

It will happen. Doesn't mean something is inherently wrong with crowdfunding.

Not really sure how its any worse than so many shallow titles created in the last decade that turned out to be created solely to make an easy buck emulating something else.

CalmOceans

goboygo said:

Working as intended.  I'd say 50% of kickstarters will fail, its part of the model. There is no way anyone is expecting them all to succeed, you just have to hope the one you invested in is one of the ones that does.

It's not about succeeding or not, this game wasn't even made.

The crowdfunding model won't last if they let these thing go by and don't go after the scammers. They're losing people trust.

When a bank lends money, and you don't pay it back, they come after you. Kickstarter lets people get scammed and doesn't act, they lose people's trust and eventually people will stop giving Kickstarter projects money.

Sovrath

nariusseldon said:

Sovrath said:

I don't see an issue with this. If people want to just throw money at things without a moment's thought then let them.

absolutely. But we can tell them "i told you so" and have some fun in the forum, right?

I suppose. I just don't see how that could even be considered fun. Then again, I'm not really a vindictive person. Not that I would pat them on the back and go "there there ... there there ...".

You get what you get. I'm a firm believer that we make our own hells.

Thorkune

I can't believe this amazing free money generating concept has failed!

/sarcasm off

CrazKanuk

Axehilt said:

Someone should post that giant google doc with all the success/fail launches, to keep things in perspective. 

Almost nightly you can see news coverage of a car crash.  Yet most of us consider driving safe enough to do it daily.  Much of the risk involved in driving is manageable (that guy's swerving a lot; better steer clear.)

It's the same deal with Kickstarter. Most of the risk is manageable, and in spite of the occasional "crash" the platform overall is pretty safe.

HA!!! Share information?!?!? Next thing you'll tell me is that I can just go onto some distributed network of computers and search for ANYTHING!! Never happen!  

Actually, I never even considered uploading this to google docs. 

Anyone who's interested in seeing the data I've collected so far, feel free to check it out 

Axehilt

Relevant to my earlier post, I just noticed this Battletech kickstarter campaign.

It's the first KS project I've backed in a while, but is exactly the sort of "safe bet" that's always worth kickstarting.

• Experienced developers (bonus points: experienced developers of multiple launched kickstarter projects)
• Already funding base game on their own
• Using Kickstarter to fund the Campaign feature; asks for enough money to do it right

So in terms of risk-management this is the sort of thing that's really safe to donate to.

Certainly one might criticize that the first two traits sort of work against the Kickstarter "ideal" (is KS only for proven developers? Is it only for people with enough money to basically fund a game already?) but I'll leave those points for someone else to make since I feel the platform works well enough for delivering games like this one that very likely wouldn't get produced otherwise.

filmoret

If its so easy to turn 30k into a game then why don't you do it?

Distopia

Sovrath said:

Seelinnikoi said:

People, always, always remember that anything you give money to on Kickstarter, is considered a DONATION according to Kickstarter Terms and Conditions.

I don't see an issue with this. If people want to just throw money at things without a moment's thought then let them.


The issue is people just giving money to "anyone" without them thinking "have these people launched products before, what is the chance that a product can be launched based on the money that they are asking.

A good many people don't think. Or aren't willing to just laugh and say "oh well", if it fails.

Exactly what my thoughts on it are, and as I've said many times if you can't afford to walk away with nothing, do not kickstart...

nariusseldon

iridescence said:

nariusseldon said:

goboygo said:

Working as intended.  I'd say 50% of kickstarters will fail, its part of the model. There is no way anyone is expecting them all to succeed, you just have to hope the one you invested in is one of the ones that does.

"hope" .. so you agree that KS is selling wishful thinking?

It's a risk. Much better odds than playing the lottery that you'll get something back but like with any gamble you have to accept the possibility of losing everything or just avoid doing it and put your money in the bank.

Taking a risk on games that have a tons of alternatives that i can buy now? Not for me.

But of course if you want to spend your money that way,  it is your prerogative.

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