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What does the MMO community really want?
Bellomo
Member UncommonPosts: 184
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Bellomo
Member UncommonPosts: 184
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Ya what ever just vote [mod edit]
Think pre-battleground WoW regarding PvP on PvE servers and you've got me hooked. Back when you decided to travel for 5-10 minutes simply because you saw on the global defense channel that something was being attacked on the other side of the world. PvP for PvP's sake, for the fun of it and because there was a strong hatred (ingame, not irl ofc) between the factions.
I am not a big PvP fan, but I spend loads of time in PvP in WoW those first months, but then they released (as planned since it was already in the manuals you got at release) the first battleground and "honor" system which turned it into PvP for the rewards and a drag.
World PvP on PvE servers was dead and gone because of it, hardly anyone still did it just for the fun of it and it created a spiral into near instant gratification over time through gear. PvP gear was easier to get and often better than the pre-raid PvE gear so that took the last bit of fun out of PvP for me. People started doing it purely for the rewards.
It is not the type of game for people with PVP as their main focus, but IMO it was a very good accidental circumstance that made it very fun for PvE minded people that like to PvP every now and then. I call it accidental since Blizzard included PvP servers from launch and were already working on those battlegrounds before launch. They just ran out of time and because of that created a short period in which PvP was remarkably fun for people like me.
I will never play a full PvP gankfest mmo and all other combinations, like for example WAR tried just devides the community unless it is done right. The problem is finding that balance and sadly WAR failed in that regard... in many regards sadly which is why it is as dead as a doornail now. ESO does a somewhat decent job atm, but stopped playing that for other reasons and never gave me the same kind of faction pride that WoW did. I can't speak for any mmo's prior to WoW's release since I never did any PvP before it.
I'd start with a meaningful leveling experience.
This can't really be covered IMO as there are different types of PvE games and different types of PvP games.
Some have try to imitate reality more closely and have a lot stiffer penalties. Some have no instances and a lot more competition. Some don't have all the nice convenience tools. There are a lot of different factors for each type listed.
but I bet it's similar to the MMO community's favorite ice cream flavor.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I'd like to play a game where PvE and PvP were blended together, so you couldn't make progress by doing only one or the other. I believe that is the very essence of MMORPG; to tell a story in a fantasy world but utilise the massively part of MMO and make the other players a part of your story as friends or foes.
I see the current MMO design flawed not only in trying to cater as big an audience as possible but segregating them players in different kind of mini games which could very well be separate games on their own rights; many times you can be a raider, crafter, PvPer, etc. and forget every other aspect of the game completely. People often defend this by saying they want to play these games as they wanted and not being told by developers how to play. I think the richness and uniqueness of MMO games is a diverse and non-repetitive content (not meaning grinding).
The way i see it, there should be both PvP and PvE, which are in some way interdependent from each others. Lets say in WoW you couldn't do some dungeon because you performed poorly against players from other faction, or couldn't gather herbs and ore from certain area because the control of the land belongs to your enemies. These are only rough examples since i'm not a game designer, but that's the basic idea behind my reasoning.
It's going to take some inspiration to blend the two, but the first thing is going to be making a good game. This means back to fundamentals and figuring out what is "fun" again. If you make a compelling game where your efforts are persistent over time, it will naturally attract the social metagamers as well. There is no need to focus on one to the exclusion of the other.
Maybe instead of MMORPG it would be more accurate to call it something along the lines of the Virtual World genre.
If anything market data proves that having more people in your MMO is more valuable than having good/sane/fun game mechanics.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
Most games these days though, is gankfest, carnage for all, and that is not to my liking. Though I love PvP, I love PvE as well, and would like to quest in peace once in a while.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
In most themepark games there's an option to join a PVE server or a PVP server which I think is an incredibly outdated concept. What I would like to see instead are two instances of every zone and, when you enter that zone, you are offered the choice of joining the PVP flagged version or the safe zone. This way you have more players aggregated on a single server to do things like raid and join PVP minis. As a bonus for playing the PVP flagged areas, give players a 20% XP increase in those zones for anything they do.
The other concept I like is a modified EVE Online concept, where there is no truly safe space in the game, however I would go a lot further in the punishment area for killing players in the safer zones. All of the supposed punishments, or drawbacks, for killing a player in high security systems of EVE Online are laughable. I would make it much harder to kill players in safe space and I would make the penalties extremely stiff.
Lastly, PVP should not ever ever be a gear grind. It should be a skill based contest between players and the goal of PVP should be territorial conquest with clearly defined winners and losers. PVP gear stratifies the PVP player base and turns the highly skilled players with the best gear into gods which drives other players away.
Sadly , most MMORPG in market lack them .
As for the casual , have to pass 50 levels (nowadays standard) to "bla bla bla , endgame just the begin of true game" don't count as casual for me .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
publishers "Clone game X or Y"
developers "but wouldn't it better for them to play game X or Y instead of a clone?"
publishers "we are gonna steal their crowd with our FLAVOR"
developers "uhuh. of course you are. well we got mouths to feed so w/e. most of us are not gonna stick around a lot once the base game is done anyway so good luck with that LOLOLO"
my top MMOs: UO,DAOC,WoW,GW2
most of my posts are just my opinions they are not facts,it is the same for you too.
http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/C42jJ9bi550/maxresdefault.jpg
MOBAs come close, but they too are susceptible to rock, paper, scissors. The only games I would consider to be true PvP are 1st-person shooters.