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Flag Burning Ban.....
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The bill won't make it out of the Senate. Since it is a proposed Constitutional Amendment it requires a 2/3 majority vote. Then it goes before the citizens of the U.S.A. for a vote. It will never become a part of the Constitution.
Sure I would, i'd even give it to them for a souvenir.
Hahaha. Props to Dekron.
Hahaha. Props to Dekron.
the veterans cry, and those who gave their lives cry, and America cries when the children of their sacrifice turn around and bite the hand that feeds.
don't like the country dek? stop absorbing the benefits and move out. People have made a sacrifice so you can live in freedom, you turn around and spit in their faces.
I'm truly disgusted.
Truly disgusted, and ashamed that you are an American.
Disgusted and ashamed dekron, from the bottom of my heart.
I cry for the future of America if people continue to think like you.
http://www.facebook.com/murtb
So, you aren't in support of free speech?
"Whoever controls the media controls the mind..-'Jim Morrison"
"When decorum is repression, the only dignity free men have is to speak out." ~Abbie Hoffman
So, you aren't in support of free speech?
dude, we moved from political to a direct attack on veterans who gave their lives. Ther'es a huge difference. Respect is required, they gave their lives to save you and your future, to save your family, to save that mail man you know...to save that cafeteria lady, to save the dude down the street. They gave their lives to save people they did not know. I believe you need to show more respect.
and I do believe that even democrats would agree with me on that one.
*edit
I reread and see what you mean by "freedom of speech" that he has the freedom to wipe his ass in the veteran's faces. Now I'm going to give you my "freedom of speech"
I am disgusted and ashamed to call you American. That is all.
http://www.facebook.com/murtb
It's one thing to burn the flag in protest, it's another to directly disrespect vetrans that have fought and continue to fight for our rights in that manner. You may have the right to do so, but it'd be extremely immoral at best.
Lol, this is why I support mandatory civic duty for citizenship and voting rights.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
I am against the ban. Would I ever burn a flag? No, but I hardly think that burning a symbol of any kind should be against the law. We don't need the laws of communist and facist governments.
Burning the flag is kind of a fire hazard.
Lol, what do you mean by 'even democrats' Serien. I think Sen Max Cleland may question the tone of your statement there. Then again, I'm sure Dick Cheney could talk mounds about his military serverice ... oh wait.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
ya know Dek.... your such a stupid ass.... how dare you say that.... man your such a sore loser....
im just speechless.....
Dek... if your an american.... i cry... i cry for those who died so that YOU can be free..... I CRY FOR THOSE WHO HATE THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. many people whouldnt be here if it were for us... we fough for you people...
Europe... yeah we saved you from Hitler..... and germany.... for letting us become our own nation.... hell we could have stayed here in isolation and never did a thing, but because we felt and knew what was right... we helped you...
i dont know where im going with this reply, but Dekron, what ever race, religion you are... remember you are what you are today because of the United States of america, im not saying this for me... or you..... im saying this to all American citizens, and our troops...
Main character in Pure Pwnage, Jeremy as himself and Teh Pwnerer...
http://www.OriginNow.com
yea, my point in saying "even democrats" was another way to say "even the complete opposite of me would agree with me on this issue" it wasn't meant in any way to offend anyone, and I apologize if it did.
http://www.facebook.com/murtb
Lol, I'm just messing with you Serien. Even though Fox News would disagree, not all of us liberals are evil.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
I've since learned that from the election and befriended some of your kind
haha, jp
http://www.facebook.com/murtb
America saved europe from hitler? and the millions that died there dosnt exist? Thats too selfish you know. By the way, I'm not american, nor european, and still I live in freedom, I dont have to worry about burning flags because people simply dosnt do that here, maybe because they do not have a reason to prostest like that, anyway burning the flag is protest, and i guess people have the right to do it if they disagree with something.
And before you said anything about the veterans and the soldiers that died, you should remember why they died, and dont fool yourself saying that they died for freedom, they died for money, and for economic supremacy. I'm really happy to live in a country that dosnt spend 50% off its money in weapons, and that lets its own people starving.
Tunai Raiol
Sorry Phrequency but the united states didnt enter world war II out of the goodness of their heart. We did it because germany and japan declaired war on us. And even then there was a large portion of the united states against getting involved. We were more than willing to let germany destroy europe.
And stop calling people anti-american for using their freedom of speach. As a vet I find you people more offnesive than the people wanting to burn the flag.
This place is full of tree-huggers and tofu fartn' faeries...
Yes, America saved Europe from the Nazi military. I don't think too many historians would argue that. Does that detract from those that fought outside the US military, no.
Also, don't forget about the Marshal Plan that enabled Europe to rebuild.
I'm sure your 'enlightened' country is one that has benefitted from our protection.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
Yes, America saved Europe from the Nazi military. I don't think too many historians would argue that. Does that detract from those that fought outside the US military, no.
I'm sure your 'enlightened' country is one that has benefitted from our protection.
If you're saying opression is protection than yes... Still, I dont know where you studied history. Maybe you should remember that the only reason Hitler lost that war was due to Stalingrad battle and the memorable winter of 1943, where his lunacy made him stay in the winter, with no food, no ammo, in the middle of burnt cities left by the russians. American D-day and omaha beach wanst nothing but plan B, and they arrived at Berlim very late I may add, the russians were already there. The europe may have a debt yes, but its with Russia. Still I cant argue that USA is the one that saved China and other countries in the pacific scenario, without them they would never win that war, still, I dont think A-Bomb can be called victory in anyway, is always a defeat for mankind...
So you're trying to tell me that Europe would have been fine after the fall of France and the push back of British soldiers? Yeah, Russia did a great job of showing their support of Europe after WWII. I'm sure countries like Poland would agree with you.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
This place is full of tree-huggers and tofu fartn' faeries...
hihi, that struck me as incredibly funny.
and while fundemental muslims do cause a lot of problems, so do all other fundementalists
sadly it seems, from an outsiders point of view, that the US is populated with fundementalists, who scream rape and murder as soon as you dare question the percieved superiority of the US
So your saying that our invasion of France had nothing to do with the fall of Germany, that the Russians all on their own defeated the Nazis? Our bombing of Germany had no affect, nor the Atlantic supply lines, nor any of the other myriad of ways the US prosecuted the war.
The US didn't have all of it's troops in Europe either. Like Germany, we fought on two concurrent fronts.
For arguments sake, even if as you suggest our forces had little to do with the fall of Germany, at least after the war the US decided to financially support and build democracies in Europe unlike Russia, which preferred subjugation.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
I always thought it interesting how it has been "protected" as free speech. At no point is burning a flag the same thing as freedom of speech. On a side note, just because you have freedom of speech does not mean you have the right to be heard. I err on the side of banning the burning of any flag, not just ours. I say this even as I say I hate our government and wish its collapse.
My rationale for federal involvement in the manner is that in instances where the states disagree on a specific law as it may apply to them, the federal government justly should step in to equalize the playing field. If Iowa outlawed it and Minnesota allowed it, it would be inconsistent as it applies to the flag of this country.
The flag is also bigger than just representing the government currently elected. It represents the country and everything the founders wanted for all who followed in their footsteps. There is nothing stopping you from standing against everything the current administration stands for but yet loving the Constitution, which I do.
He nor I ever said that the USs involvement in the war had no part in the fall of the reich, but to claim the US was the deciding factor is just completely wrong. Especially when there was another country that bore more of the brunt of the better trained, better armed, and a majority of the german troops before the US even landed in europe and continued to push the germans back into their own country while we were their.
And your point is missing a vital fact in the pacific theater. The british, and australians played a very large role in the fall of japan also. So in that view, the british also faced a dual front didnt they? The fact is the US is owed no more debt than any other country that faught against germany and its a purely selfish and biased view to claim that it does.
This place is full of tree-huggers and tofu fartn' faeries...
What I find interesting is that people always say to remember what they did that was good. What about their crimes? What about the innocents killed that didn't deserve it? An example, Hiroshima. There are many more war crimes that US soldiers committed in conflicts, but of course, history won't teach you that. From grade school you are fed propaganda of how the US is a great and mighty country that sets the example for life for the rest of the world, but in truth, it isn't so. If any other country other than the US did something to that extent, the US would say it was genocide. However, since it is the US, people say "they were protecting your freedoms".
What possible freedoms did I have to lose if we didn't go to Iraq? None. In fact, with the Patriot Act, we have actually lost several freedoms. Have you ever lived outside of the country? I lived in Budapest, Hungary for over a year. Not once did I see the difference in life there than here, if anything, it was better.
Honestly, name one benefit to living in the US that I couldn't get living in the UK, Canada, Netherlands, Switzerland, Hungary, Italy, Greece, etc. I'm not trying to start a major argument, but Murt, you are obviously a hardcore American, I am not. If I had a choice, I would have been born in another country, but hey, life doesn't work like that.
Be disgusted, be ashamed, but know that the US is already on a downward spiral and will suffer the same fate as the Roman Empire, the Ottoman Empire, and every other empire that has stood throughout history. In their end days they were over confident and had utter disregard for the feelings of their people and neighboring coutries. This is how the US is today, and it will crumble in years to come.
And lastly, I could call you "un-American" as well. In the start, political parties were not at each others throats as they are now. You go as far as showing your support for your party by creating images of Howard Dean killing babies. Now, not that I minded that, but that could be considered "unpatriotic" by many people. What if Dean won? What if Kerry won? Would you still hold your views and agree with how they run the country? Or would you be so far out over the right wing that you couldn't find yourself to agree. Are you only patriotic to your party, or just your leaders? It's sad when a guy with the IQ of 90 can become president. That is just plain scary. Your president has brought more hatred towards the US in the last 5 years than in last 50 years.
Anyways, with that aside, how's the weather down there in Florida, any hurricanes yet?
(obviously trying to keep this friendly
)
Actually, you are the one who brought up veterans, I said nothing about them. In some aspects yes, they deserve respect, but in some aspects, no they don't. A recent example, the abuse scandal.
As for the flag, it was said before, it is nothing but a piece of cloth.
Would you still be so supportive of it if it looked like this: