What new content can MMOs create?

monochrome19

MMOs typically have the same content: PvP, PvE, some type of housing or building content, crafting/gathering, and exploration. Outside of this there is nothing new or unique. Its hard to feel like each game is a unique world when you do the same thing in each one. So I ask, what new type of content would you add to MMOs to make them unique? They csn be completely revolutionary or a spin on traditional content. But how would it be separate from everything else?

Daikuru

I think its not only about creating new content, its more about making the current content better and deeper, since most content is made half-assed like crafting in most games, or pvp, some games doesnt even have exploration or housing, i think all that should be "standard" in MMOs nowadays. 

I would love to see more elements from other genres like adventure games, climbing mountains, jumping over walls, using utilities.

Some elements from other genres already found their way into MMOs, would love to see more of it, to make MMOs feel less stiff.

Loke666

Well, there are a bit more really. Some MMOs allow players to build their own cities or fotrtresses. We also seen sieges of said content. It is pretty rare in PvE themeparks but not unheard of, AoC for example have a limited version of this with their guildcities. Yeah, you could call that "building" but it is far more than just player housing or guildhalls.

Content like that have a lot of potential both for PvE and PvP. For example could you allow guilds to build and maintain a dungeon, either in a PvP game run by themselves or in a PvE game with hired or captured monsters (and if you are nasty can you put in a commander function that allow a guildmember with the right skill or rank to issue orders to mobs and remote control certain traps and spells). The guild would then earn points for how well the dungeon do against other players (preferably from other servers and not allowing players who have a member of the hosting guild as a character to participate).

It would add a little sandbox to a themepark game while giving players an almost unlimited number of dungeons. It would certainly need some balance and some rules that give the dungeon a rating and forces the guild making it to put in certain types of crafteed or dropped gear in the treasure room (and the game could also generate loot from the mobs for free).

Another type of content that is common and you didn't mention is minigames. Having stuff like tournaments with jousting, dust, archery contests and similar activities and real world holidays can be very fun.

One thing I think would be fun in MMOs would be to have missions like robberies, assasinations and similar where the players get a map and some info and can plan the mission before hand. A group of thieves might try to steal the crown jewels and get a map of the palace, the guards usual patrols, what time the guards change and so on and figure out a way to sneak in and steal the jewels without getting discovered. This require that you can randomize the missions somewhat so you just can't wiki them but it would be really fun 

nerovergil

new content like what? flying house?

Flintsteen

i definedtly think a well-developed foundry system would be a good thing in a new mmo.  I know it's not exactly a new thing,  but i still like the idea.  It would be nice if it had a group feature so you could open foundry as a group and build new content with friends. 

IsilithTehroth

As Loke said there are tons of things they can do but they are obsessed with the tried and true WoW formula that ironic is making their games flop. It just comes down to lazy developers, and/or push dates too soon, and investors not want to to deviate from the norm.

There are a ton of new things that could be done, from truely dynamic quests that could be player created to "rust" style building.

sunandshadow

I really like breeding systems as a type of crafting that is rarely seen.  Some safeguards need to be taken so that each player has to do the breeding themselves though.

I also like minigames in general as an alternative to both PvP and PvE.  PvP minigames include things like mount racing and card games as well as battling pets against each other.  PvE minigames can be basically any small game type, from match 3 and tetris through sudokus and shooting galleries to long-term sims or sidescrollers.

Wizardry

Wel lit is true and in general tough to add too many ideas without going off in space ...ahem GW2 anyone lol.

I'll tell you how much i despise stupid ideas,if for example FFXI added in jump maps or puzzle maps,i would likely instantly delete the game.Stay focused on the game design and it's LORE i don't want stupid ideas added in just to say we added in new content ideas.

Yes a breeding system is nice,FFXI had breeding chocobos but could have expanded on that way more without going outside the LORE...example SHoopuffs.

We still have not seen a single game with an eco system.

We already have the idea of building and Voxels but that needs a lot of fixing/tweaking to become more than just Minecraft.

I would like to see more invasions or an idea like FFXI Besieged, that is great fun.

I would like to see a sort of AOE approach,have living races/communities that when  reach a certain point in advancement ,they wander out and perhaps attack players or creatures or even steal your harvesting nodes.

I would also like to see tweaks on for example nodes,i do not like instant or fast re-spawns,perhaps the same for mobs as well.
I would like to see a lot more depth with npc's in several areas.

I guess i just want a REAL or better rpg game,instead we get crap that looks like it came off an assembly line.

nariusseldon

Daikuru said:

Some elements from other genres already found their way into MMOs, would love to see more of it, to make MMOs feel less stiff.

One element i have not seen is environmental base stealth gameplay .. but that can only be done well in instances.

Divona

Current MMO are pretty much static. If you login today or next week, the world state will still be the same as last week. What need here after is to make the virtual world come alive, where things are evolving over time. Make the based game as a virtual reality platform, and add in fun mechanic on top, expand it horizontally. If real life can be dynamic, so the MMO world. All the current MMO I've played aren't feel like a world to hang out and live in anymore.

acidblood

Not sure how much qualifies as 'new' content but some things I would like to see added to the typical theme park are:

• Dynamic elements in otherwise static content.
• random trash in instances, e.g. 50/50 chance of 1 large mob or 3 smaller mobs
• special events that change instances up a bit
  
• Fewer, but larger, more dynamic and repeatable quests with optional objectives
  
• the same quest could have different objectives for different players (based on class / group composition?)
• quests that take you all over the map and take hours (days? weeks?) to complete, but the payoff is big
  
• More small group content in the open world
• strong mobs that take 2-3 equal level players to take down should be common (but avoidable)
  
• shareable quests that allow a group to complete objectives together, with shared rewards (note: ties into optional objectives, some of which would only be possible / practical in a small group)
• Permanent changes to the world
• Settlements should progress over time, change faction or get wiped out, permanently.
  
• Massive events that change / advance the world. Don't be afraid to remove, streamline and upgrade old content over time

Konfess

TLDR;  Player Made Content (PMC) is too risky for the Developer.  Quests will be built by a RNG, so that no progression will be the same.  And range from short quest within 500m to long quests within 10km.

Remember that an MMO is just a graphical front end to a database.  The data has the form of an Object, that we can get or set.  Such as set the text for the quest, set the rewards for the quest, set the task of the quest, set the mobs for the quest.  I read so often that gamers want a Game of Thrones type quest.  And I say, “You mean escort Jaime to King's Landing?”  The gamer responds no, they want diplomacy.  So I say how about, “Bring me Ten Rate Tails and there shall be peace between our two nations.”

In my game the player request a meeting with the an NPC representative (diplomat) of the faction the player seeks diplomacy with.  The NPC diplomat gives the player a list of their needs.  This is usually involves remove 3 opposing faction bases from a zone, building/repair diplomacy faction base structures, and or kill X number of opposing faction players.  Bring the diplomat 3 items of tribute.   Such as enough food to feed their army for a week (ie. 1.000 units of meat or 600 crafted meals).  A super siege weapon, this can be either crafted, PvE looted, or PvP reward.  The last item is usually a treasure, say a ring that can be crafted, PvE looted, or PvP reward.

At first I liked the idea of player made content (PMC).  But then I read the horror stories.  PMC that copied real life tragedies, or PMC that was used to plan real life tragedies, ie. Sandy Hook Elementary.  PMC that copies other IP, “isn’t this dungeon level four of King’s Quest 8?”  Or PMC that is either meant to be or unintentionally is offensive or vulgar.

Instead of PMC,I am experimenting with RNG quest generation and dungeon maps.  The problem with alts is seeing the same quests again.  But if the quests were RNGed on the fly.  Maybe there would be some variance or newness to questing.  One possible problem with this would be conflicting quest or player goals.  One player may have a quest to escort a red mobs aways from the blue mob zone, while another player has to assassinate a red mob in the blue mob zone.

IMO, PMC is only safe in a single player game where exposure to the content is by choice of download and install, and not as part of full game content supported by developer and producer.

A game is a streamlined simple one task system sort of like a screw driver.  When you add mini-games, think of it like squeezing three fat men into a three seat airline row.  I won’t say it is impossible, just hard to do.  My gut feeling is when you had varied game play content, you double the complexity per item of variance.  Again gut feeling it will take a new team to implement each variance safely.  And multiple teams still won't guarantee safety.

Again, in my game I am experimenting with sieges and base building.  I liked the combat and fast pace of Planetside 1.  I didn’t like the static world.  In my game you faction declares that a base must be built at location A.  Resources can be shipped overland to location A from a previously established base or gathered on site or close by.  The base layout would be game controlled and random.  But the crafting would be player controlled.  I would hope player crafters would build external base walls, gates, and defensive positions(towers) first.  Then build support structures spawn point, medical, base HQ, vehicle/siege weapon spawn, and base utility second.  But again it is player controlled so wherever the player puts time and effort is what is built first or fastest.  Why waste time on base building?  Because strength activities would be the fastest safest ways to improve combat skills.  Like a football player in the gym, before they go out on the field.

Divona

By player made contents (PMC), I don't see it as player created dungeons, but more of players created events.

I like the contract system where it allow one player to create contract for another players to do their bidding, either that go killed ten rats, killed ten other players, bounty, gathering materials, or move items and houses from one town to another, etc. That's one form of player made contents.

Another type of player made contents is through manipulate the biology and natural system of the game itself. Too many wolves population in the area, will decrease chicken and rabbit population. Causing problem to player's own farms. If the wolves has been killed too often than it can repopulate, it would simply gone from the area, and requires player to change their strategy whether they want to move on to another land, or help repopulate the area themselves. Creatures migration according to seasons also a nice way to make the world feel alive, and requires players to move from one zone to another if they want to hunt such creatures down. If MMO want to be a virtual world, the basic thing it need to do is to simulate how the natural actually work.

Simple things like musical instruments also a nice touch, as I remember fondly in The Lord of the Rings Online where people will foam a musical band, wandering from town to town and perform their street side concert, using their keyboard to play out musical notes in tune with another member in the band. That's another form player created content event.

Those form of mechanism work well in MMORPG, and it help with the social aspect, where it actually bring people on the servers together to do something instead of send each player into the same cookie cutter hero journey to become God and save the world, not to live in it.

Cleffy

One of the best MMORPGs for me was Mabinogi. There have only been a few combat systems in MMOs I enjoyed. One was Vindictus and the other is Mabinogi. Combat becomes much more strategic with good timing in these games compared to others.

Mabinogi also has a decent crafting system. It's other systems like character caloric intake is also interesting. Overrally a complete well thought out game with offputting graphics and point/click controls.

I think the best future concept for an MMO would be player created content. The real work of the game would be developing a system that allows the player to create quests and dungeons around specific parameters. Like total treasure rewards only possible with X number of monsters. Legendary items only possible with this type of boss and so on. It would reduce the main cost overhead of an MMO. Content development. If there was a reward attached for creating quality content then it would be really good. Like at the end of a mission, the players can vote how they liked a particular dungeon. The creator then receives some in-game income from the players who complete a dungeon and rate it highly. To even further balance the system to quality. It could cost the creator some in game currency to create it depending on its complexity.

nerovergil

mmorpg cant make player made contents (PMC), they want profits. if single player game like skyrim yes

Konfess

Divona said:

By player made contents (PMC), I don't see it as player created dungeons, but more of players created events.

I like the contract system where it allow one player to create contract for another players to do their bidding, either that go killed ten rats, killed ten other players, bounty, gathering materials, or move items and houses from one town to another, etc. That's one form of player made contents.

Another type of player made contents is through manipulate the biology and natural system of the game itself. Too many wolves population in the area, will decrease chicken and rabbit population. Causing problem to player's own farms. If the wolves has been killed too often than it can repopulate, it would simply gone from the area, and requires player to change their strategy whether they want to move on to another land, or help repopulate the area themselves. Creatures migration according to seasons also a nice way to make the world feel alive, and requires players to move from one zone to another if they want to hunt such creatures down. If MMO want to be a virtual world, the basic thing it need to do is to simulate how the natural actually work.

Simple things like musical instruments also a nice touch, as I remember fondly in The Lord of the Rings Online where people will foam a musical band, wandering from town to town and perform their street side concert, using their keyboard to play out musical notes in tune with another member in the band. That's another form player created content event.

Those form of mechanism work well in MMORPG, and it help with the social aspect, where it actually bring people on the servers together to do something instead of send each player into the same cookie cutter hero journey to become God and save the world, not to live in it.

I didn't mean to imply that PMC only applied to user made dungeons.  My intent is that all forms of the Quest Development Kit (QDK) would be available.  Here is another problem I'm worried by.  I want others' input on.  A player takes a PMC quest to kill X players of faction A in zone B.  Zone B has a road that everyone commonly uses.  So that player makes a PMC quest that players of faction A will take.  This quest will have them travel on the road in zone B making them easy targets for him to kill.

I thought of the game making these kind of quest as random quest to encourage PvP.  But if a player does it, then I feel it is an exploit.  To lure other players into an ambush.  What do you think?


As for music, when you allow players to compose with game tools the developer runs the risk of copyright infringement.  Players often copy music of the latest songs, think this is free use.  But this is not free use.  And whoever is making money is held responsible.  I think what was done in SWG, with each instrument adding a track to a common song library is cool.  But no in game Taylor Swift songs.

nariusseldon

Konfess said:

I didn't mean to imply that PMC only applied to user made dungeons.  My intent is that all forms of the Quest Development Kit (QDK) would be available.  

Most PMC is crap. I would much rather play a professionally made game. 

waynejr2

acidblood said:

Not sure how much qualifies as 'new' content but some things I would like to see added to the typical theme park are:

• Dynamic elements in otherwise static content.
• random trash in instances, e.g. 50/50 chance of 1 large mob or 3 smaller mobs
• special events that change instances up a bit
  
• Fewer, but larger, more dynamic and repeatable quests with optional objectives
  
• the same quest could have different objectives for different players (based on class / group composition?)
• quests that take you all over the map and take hours (days? weeks?) to complete, but the payoff is big
  
• More small group content in the open world
• strong mobs that take 2-3 equal level players to take down should be common (but avoidable)
  
• shareable quests that allow a group to complete objectives together, with shared rewards (note: ties into optional objectives, some of which would only be possible / practical in a small group)
• Permanent changes to the world
• Settlements should progress over time, change faction or get wiped out, permanently.
  
• Massive events that change / advance the world. Don't be afraid to remove, streamline and upgrade old content over time

Permanent Changes to the world:
Purify corrupted or haunted areas.
Building bridges.

Mass Armies of NPCs and go to war.  Much bigger than PVP.

Tools to allow players to create contests of various types.

Cecropia

nariusseldon said:

Daikuru said:

Some elements from other genres already found their way into MMOs, would love to see more of it, to make MMOs feel less stiff.

One element i have not seen is environmental base stealth gameplay .. but that can only be done well in instances.

Nah.

The original Darkfall did this extremely well in an open world environment; one of my favorite things about the game.

Not only could you use the environment (trees, rocks, bushes etc.) to catch someone off guard and completely unaware of your presence, you could avoid being seen by any incoming groups by hiding when you heard them coming (footsteps and other sounds played a huge role) or while being chased you could attempt to try and get out of the line of sight briefly and then quickly find a good hiding spot. 

It was an amazing experience and made for some nerve rattling situations.

Instances are totally unnecessary for this kind of content.

nariusseldon

Cecropia said:

nariusseldon said:

Daikuru said:

Some elements from other genres already found their way into MMOs, would love to see more of it, to make MMOs feel less stiff.

One element i have not seen is environmental base stealth gameplay .. but that can only be done well in instances.

Nah.

The original Darkfall did this extremely well in an open world environment; one of my favorite things about the game.

Not only could you use the environment (trees, rocks, bushes etc.) to catch someone off guard and completely unaware of your presence, you could avoid being seen by any incoming groups by hiding when you heard them coming (footsteps and other sounds played a huge role) or while being chased you could attempt to try and get out of the line of sight briefly and then quickly find a good hiding spot. 

It was an amazing experience and made for some nerve rattling situations.

Instances are totally unnecessary for this kind of content.

How do you control only ONE operative infiltrating an enemy strong hold? How about environmental stealth kills? (such as pushing someone off a balcony).

SyndromofaDown

Exerpt taken from the Everquest Next forums:

"The developers realize that there are a lot of unanswered questions.

It didn’t make sense to have static quests in an evolving world.

The map in the storybricks demo could represent large regions or small regions like a cursed temple could be a region. You could affect that temple which then creates values that affects a regions which then creates values that affects a country which then creates values that affects the world.

For example if the evil god that is buried in the cursed temple is awakened it may affect a region larger than the temple. If that god starts a religion it could affect the whole country or world.

It’s like overlapping spheres of influences which affects larger or smaller areas

Can I miss content? Yes but there will always be content. There is no scripted content, you are participating in a changing world. This will be problematic for completionists since it will no longer will be realistically possible to do everything. There will always be too much to do and you will never be able to finish all of it. When you log in next there will be different stuff to do.

The more you do for certain factions the more they will ask of you. You can declare that there are things that you care about in the world and invest in that. We know what people of a certain organization wants and if you invest in an organization you will get that kind of content. This means that you can tailor your experience to your playstyle.

When you invest in a faction you will get deeper story, but you will also get access to classes, advanced items and things that the developers couldn’t talk about. “I improved my story as much as my character.”

There is an idea to put the Rohsong online and share it so other people could see your story. There is also an idea to let the Rohsong show only short text or go into a lot more detail about your story. You can also go to a place and learn the story and history of that place. You could for example learn that the nature essence has gone from a region due to devastation and you might be able to work to bringing it back.

The lore, design and the AI is three components of the same thing. Even if the content is generated SOE still would want the lore and story.

If you want to find out what happens in neighbouring areas you could for example go to a tavern and NPC could tell you.

The world shows the state it’s in. If the NPC:S are sick they look sick, if they are famished they looked famished. If they are attacked they are afraid and try to barricade themselves

NPC can react to how you look. If you have a religious item on you NPC can assume that you support the values of that religion and react differently. If for example you look like a knight of justice an NPC can tell you about a justice quest.

If an NPC will get clothes of a queen like in the night elf demo she will act like a queen and other NPC:s will start treating her like the queen. The player could wear the same clothes and get the same response. This will enable a lot role playing. Items you find could could make NPC:s react differently to you and for example different night elves could react differently.

Things that dictates NPC behaviour is among other race, emotions, group belonging, location and traits. An example could be a greedy priest, a violent priest.

Resources are at the heart of this system and we have only shown a few of them but there are resources that are not tied to stuff you can find in the world like gems. It could be security, honor, justice or chaos. If there for example is no stability in the region, well monsters like that alot.

One npc won’t decide that he/she will move from a town but we can have a sim city approach like your level of happiness is not high enough so 10% of the population will move and will not be there anymore.

Organization can change relationship between each other. It works in the same way as relationships between players and organizations.

We don’t want to gate content. We don’t want you  not being able to talk to the orcs if you are friends with the elfs. But the elfs will give you more content and a deeper story.

If you want to make your story about helping farmers for the next 10 years you can do that and travel around the world and help farmers. You will be the farmers hero.

What if I’m the middle of a quest and can’t log on for a couple of days and most other people are working in another direction? Then you might not be able to finish your quest. If you are in a location where there is a large amount of player you are part of a community and the will of that community will shape that location.

Something a lot of players worry about is that a certain group will ruin the experience for everyone else?I don’t think that a small portion of players can ruin the fun for everyone since the world is big and the forces in the world are large as well. That being said the first months of a launch is often plagued by some bugs and you might need to put some checks and balances in place. But if a large amount of players want something this will happen and lead to other events and stories.

Do you expect servers to develop personalities? Yes the world will become a reflection of the population on that server.

We don’t want to lead players into traps but there could be action will lead to bad results. Like if you kill all dryads the forest could become much dangerous. We could give hints like NPC:s saying that I remember before the dryads came and how dangerous it was. Choices are only choices when they are informed.

Indirect pvp, players are working on opposing goals. There could be direct pvp for players interested in that, it’s not the focus of the experience right now. Your actions would matter to other players to. If you have a group of players collection food resources for an army one method to thwart that is that you could burn the food, poison the food and let them deliver it or take the food for you own army.

The game will in general be harder the further away from civilization you are since it would be less secure."

If you'd like to see the innovations of the mmorpg genre head over to our forums (everquest next) and browse a years worth of info

Maquiame

https://www.revivalgame.com/features/live_storytelling
https://www.revivalgame.com/features/living_world

Archlyte

I think that player made campaigns would be pretty awesome. You get 4-8 players and sign them up for a series of adventures, then there are tools to make that story happen. Some of it is instanced, a lot of it isn't. The Campaign could be populated by controlled elements crafted by the creator of the campaign. You can craft a Macguffin, a Main Villain, Sub-Bosses, Foils/Red Herrings, Instanced Locations, Ending Location. 

Would be best if it wasn't a level based game. 

JeffSpicoli

Live npc's and dungeons bosses controlled by GM's/Devs/paid actors.... 

Amathe

Game wide mysteries that everyone can be working on solving. E.g., how to become a Jedi in original SWG. 

Mendel

I think that MMORPGs are currently limited in content for one basic reason -- the only systems that a character can engage in are combat and crafting.  I think the answer to adding new content comes with adding systems that utilize new types of content.

Some ideas I've rolled around in my head for years.  (many slanted towards encouraging role-playing).

• Magic.  Instead of magic being an automatically renewing weapons technology, have magic do 'other' things, as well.  Make the character work to generate mana -- eating rare herbs, meditating.  Move some of the more major magic effects (resurrection and teleportation) into a new kind of magic -- communal or ritual magic.  These take more than a single caster, usually 5 or more to invoke the magic.

• Events.  Allow the character to engage with various types of social events.  Some could be game generated, the Mayor's Ball or an Annual Festival.  Allow characters with enough funds (and permission) to stage their own events, either public or private.  Each type of event could give attendees a minor benefit and the sponsors a more powerful benefit depending on the attendance.

• Voting.  A functional in-game system to record votes.  This could be used for political elections in various towns or villages, for guild leadership and polling purposes, and for evaluating items.  The electorate (person sponsoring the election) could determine who could participate in the vote -- everyone, guild only, persons living in village X, or a restricted list.  A crafting festival could be used to judge who made the prettiest urn (crafting), or performed the best dance (performance) using an 'Evaluate' skill.

• Public works.  One of the things everyone seems to want is the ability to build/destroy the environment.  Rather than allow this willy-nilly, the local government controls these.  Petition to build a bridge, and the government might allow a new project.  Players could interact with a public project with funding, materials and effort.   Funds acquires money from taxes, tariffs and fees, requiring someone to collect the money from NPCs and players.  Materials may involve traditional crafting skills to harvest materials or make needed components (hinges for a new gate).  Effort is general unskilled labor, perhaps time-spent, or (slow recovering) Fatigue.  (Bricks don't stack themselves).

• Religion.  People interact with a pantheon of gods, who are likely to perform major functions for players in return for Piety.  Players can earn Piety points in a variety of ways (religious festivals, special quests, participating in a religious ceremony).  When characters die, they don't automatically respawn -- their spirit goes to an alternate place (where the gods reside) and the body stays behind.  There, players petition the gods to return them to life, with prior actions having a significant impact on the gods' decisions.
  

• Personalities.  Instead of a dedicated game master evaluating how every character acts, players can judge other players' actions by voting another player as 'generous' or 'greedy'.  In-game behavior builds a personality driven reputation.  NPCs can react to these attributes as well -- a good tip to an NPC might generate a 'generous' vote or offering to escort an old lady might generate a 'helpful' vote.  Even the gods have their favorites -- some gods might help the generous character, others might help the greedy character.  Naturally, there would be provisions to restrict these votes.

• Natural healing.  The concept of in-combat healing is an invention of various fantasy games, from the tabletop to CRPGs to MUDS to MMORPGs.  Noncombatants ready to move forward and pull a fallen comrade from the fight, taking their place if necessary.  Medics could provide first aid, which would prevent further damage (limb loss, death), and prepare the wound for more advanced treatment.  A lower magic (low fantasy) game might need a more realistic approach to healing.  Rest, slow recovery times, and medication would give a reason not to engage in 100 life-or-death fights in a single hour of play time.

• Personal Goals.  Everyone has some kind of ambition.  RPGs only seem to encourage a 'Live, Loot and Learn' approach where the only goal is max level.  Some people need other motivations.  See the great wonders of the world.  Defeat a dragon.  Become mayor.  Be the wealthiest character.  Players could have the option to select a specific personal goal that could only be changed infrequently.  Once accomplished, completion of this goal should provide an in-game reward -- a title, a dragon horn to hang on the mantle, reputation in distant lands.

Just some ideas.