GW2 doesn't feel p2w because it uses a fairly horizontal progression system, has a dedicated pvp system that has no gear/level advantages, and makes it quite easy to get competitive gear for its world vs world pvp. The cash shop in GW2 will pretty much let you buy power, but no matter how much you spend there is no way to become super OP like in most other mmos.
BDO is based on an extreme vertical progression system, with an almost limitless power cap and substantial grinds needed to obtain that power. Its almost a guaranteed recipe for pvp to fail over the longer term as the gap between new and veteran players becomes nigh insurmountable, resulting in a miserable experience for new players who will become discouraged and leave, and a lack of challenge for veterans.
I agree with you though that this looks like an amazing game, and I think its going to be a lot of fun in many ways. I don't like what they have done with the power scaling, but in many respects it seems to be the most innovative and immersive mmo I have ever seen. Hopefully that will carry it over the almost guaranteed pvp woes, and maybe I will just be wrong about the pvp and that will turn out amazing as well.
I believe +20 is currently the cap and despite BDO being out for quite some time with its terrible P2W cash shop that everyone HAS to use to compete, +20's aren't the norm.
The level and gear scaling, paying for it or not, eventually balances out, just a bit rough until people make it there, assuming people actually feel the need to reach that point at all or quickly.
I've yet to be randomly killed by any of the high level folks I see as I work my way up, although I'll be dropping KR for NA soon as I can.
GW2 could very easily sell gear, potions, insert whatever that made players OP. Nothing stopping them, except it would be a pretty poor business decision and I don't see how that would be any different for BDO, regardless of the "limitless" scaling as there are very clear soft caps and goals people seem to reach for.
If I know my fellow NA/EU gamers, the crys and rage will probably force the their hand to make more chances to keep people around. KR gamers and culture are very different than NA/EU. If they want to keep BDO running, going the AA or whatever route is going to be a short term situation, unless that's all they want. But I have to ask myself why when the game is tons of opportunity not doing so.
I agree that there won't be much P2W at launch. If all you want is 20-150 hours out of BDO it will probably be decent aside from the casino crafting and gear stat scaling.
The problem is for people who want to experience more of the content and stick around after a month or 2 when digital sales slow down. Being a rational consumer isn't trolling, fanbotting on the other hand...
Where are you getting your numbers from?
You do realize people of all types (F2P to Bajillionaires) have been playing KR version for quite some time?
Honestly don't know if you have any clue what you are talking about beyond baggage/issues from other games.
What is this "more content" you speak of and what happens after 2 months? Have you taken a look at BDO KR's cash shop which has been a live and running without the game imploding?
Really curious what you think people are even buying that is resulting in P2W or causing those that don't pay a lot to quick.
Some of the "best" players as in gear, level, skill are not billionaires forking over thousands each day. Really would love to know what you base all of this negativity on that actually pertains to BDO, Daum, and the other parties involved.
The populations in both KR and Russia tanked massively. It has had server merges and is not some mega smash hit. The way gear scales and lack of content makes it impossible for it to ever see the type of success GW2 has had in the West.
As I said people who are not serious pvpers and don't mind being random plebs that have no effect on the server politics and wars can probably do just fine. How they can enjoy a game that has no pve and is completely based on grinding for pvp power is beyond me and I doubt they will stick around past 1-50(s) which is ways less than 150 hours.
The populations in both KR and Russia tanked massively. It has had server merges and is not some mega smash hit. The way gear scales and lack of content makes it impossible for it to ever see the type of success GW2 has had in the West.
As I said people who are not serious pvpers and don't mind being random plebs that have no effect on the server politics and wars can probably do just fine. How they can enjoy a game that has no pve and is completely based on grinding for pvp power is beyond me.
If you don't like this game so much then why you trolling its forums so much bro? BTW what you just said don't hold any water. Kr and Ru don't have multi servers, they have a mega-server so how the fuk can they have server mergers... haha
calling you out.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
The populations in both KR and Russia tanked massively. It has had server merges and is not some mega smash hit. The way gear scales and lack of content makes it impossible for it to ever see the type of success GW2 has had in the West.
As I said people who are not serious pvpers and don't mind being random plebs that have no effect on the server politics and wars can probably do just fine. How they can enjoy a game that has no pve and is completely based on grinding for pvp power is beyond me and I doubt they will stick around past 1-50(s) which is ways less than 150 hours.
Based on this it is clear you have no idea what you are talking about.
Claiming BDO doesn't have any content? Seriously?
Can you source the massive tanking the game has done please?
GW2 is trashed constantly and you are holding it up as the goal for other companies?
What is a serious PVPer? Goes back to Crowfall, you honestly believe someone will buy the game and that's it to stay competitive?
Clueless. Unless I'm feeding someone under a bridge, would make a lot more sense.
Biggest take away is you asking "How they can enjoy a game." Huge FYI, not every game is designed with you in mind.
How are millions playing WoW, League, insert whatever is popular. Can't stand any of them, yet I understand their attraction and accept them for what they are, games not for me.
The populations in both KR and Russia tanked massively. It has had server merges and is not some mega smash hit. The way gear scales and lack of content makes it impossible for it to ever see the type of success GW2 has had in the West.
As I said people who are not serious pvpers and don't mind being random plebs that have no effect on the server politics and wars can probably do just fine. How they can enjoy a game that has no pve and is completely based on grinding for pvp power is beyond me and I doubt they will stick around past 1-50(s) which is ways less than 150 hours.
It has a lot of things to do, it is just not the typical themepark/questing pve type of game. Personally I am looking forward to the trading system, horsebreeding, and exploration. I would like to hire myself out as a guard or mercenary, but because of the grind needed to get good gear that's obviously not going to happen.
I have seen some people say things like "it has no content" or "has no pve", "completely pvp" and I want to try and bridge the difference in perspective here. You see, when I look at the game I see almost endless content and a really immersive world, and although I love pvp, I am not particularly interested in BDO from a pvp perspective because I know I won't have the time or want to spend the money required (to gear up) for that to be fun. I don't look at it from the perspective of how many dungeons it has, or if it has raids or good quests/story.
What I see is a game where my relationships with the world and players around me really matter and adventure, exploration, and danger is everywhere. I don't know if I have explained myself well, but basically it comes down to whether you view pve only as the traditional fight mobs/quests/dungeons etc or you have a somewhat broader view of what constitutes pve.
So ironically to me BDO is attractive as a pve/social game, and I'll probably stick to GW2, ESO or Smite for my pvp. And that is saying a lot, because I basically only pvp in the mmos I play.
Going from multiple servers to a mega server is a server merge. I suggest you read up on MMO company PR tactics.
I am discussing the merits of a game on a gaming forum. If you don't like 'complainers' then maybe you shouldn't complain about them.
They never had multiple servers to begin with. lol [mod edit]
Post edited by Amana on
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I think the biggest problems the game faces is it's lack of normally accepted end game PvE. I'm not saying there's nothing to do but there are no dungeons to run endlessly, no raids/gear treadmill. Love it or hate it but that's the accepted norm in the west and people expect to see it.
If that's missing people are going to think, what do I do? There is alternative content there, but will it be enough?
I think the biggest problems the game faces is it's lack of normally accepted end game PvE. I'm not saying there's nothing to do but there are no dungeons to run endlessly, no raids/gear treadmill. Love it or hate it but that's the accepted norm in the west and people expect to see it.
If that's missing people are going to think, what do I do? There is alternative content there, but will it be enough?
So glad that is not really a part of the game, like a breath of fresh air.
I think the biggest problems the game faces is it's lack of normally accepted end game PvE. I'm not saying there's nothing to do but there are no dungeons to run endlessly, no raids/gear treadmill. Love it or hate it but that's the accepted norm in the west and people expect to see it.
If that's missing people are going to think, what do I do? There is alternative content there, but will it be enough?
There definitely is no path laid out for you. But you could do anything you want. Generally most people will be focusing on the PVP endgame, with seiges and whatnot.
But you can do other things like become a wealthy horse breeder.
They also announced some open world dungeons being released in the KR version, but they're not traditional dungeons and certainly nothing that you could queue up for in a raid finder.
Overall the endgame is a lot more sandboxy than most MMORPGs, but that's something people have been saying they've wanted for a long time. Do they actually want it? We'll see.
I don't think the lack of traditional endgame is the biggest potential problem, honestly. The biggest problem I see is that you need a pretty good computer to it.
I think the biggest problems the game faces is it's lack of normally accepted end game PvE. I'm not saying there's nothing to do but there are no dungeons to run endlessly, no raids/gear treadmill. Love it or hate it but that's the accepted norm in the west and people expect to see it.
If that's missing people are going to think, what do I do? There is alternative content there, but will it be enough?
True, but at least the people that do not like running dungeons endlessly will have a place to pitch their tent so to speak. And we have far too many themepark mmo's on the market as it is, so its nice to see a game cut away from the norm.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I think the biggest problems the game faces is it's lack of normally accepted end game PvE. I'm not saying there's nothing to do but there are no dungeons to run endlessly, no raids/gear treadmill. Love it or hate it but that's the accepted norm in the west and people expect to see it.
If that's missing people are going to think, what do I do? There is alternative content there, but will it be enough?
Most people are praising the sandbox elements. Nobody ever complains of lack of stuff to do in EVE, which doesn't have traditional PvE content.
BDO looks to be a blend between sandbox and theme park. They just came out with two big content updates in "Valencia" and added some open world bosses.
I havne't played it yet, but i think this game is hard to put into a box.
The whole point of the crafting and gathering professions is to acquire money which is then used to buy the materials for gear upgrade attempts.
Instead of dungeon boss RNG drops, its crafting casino RNG upgrading just without any cool fights. Farm money and mats from basic mobs, toss them into the crafting box and hope for the best - no different than how it works in Las Vegas.
Most Western games remove the RNG by allowing you to farm tokens in actual content like dungeons or PvP then buy the gear.
BDO is just like ArcheAge in that the endgame is about repeating the same tedious tasks over and over all in the name of upgrade attempts which is why people say it has no content. Its not like being a master horse breeder or farmer has any meaning beyond its ability to provide access to upgrade attempts.
Once someone who has spent 8 hours grinding mobs only to have all of that work lost instantly due to a failed upgrade attempt, they get real salty real fast. Its at the point that the cash shop usually starts advertising a convenient solution all for just 500 pearls!
The whole point of the crafting and gathering professions is to acquire money which is then used to buy the materials for gear upgrade attempts.
Instead of dungeon boss RNG drops, its crafting casino RNG upgrading just without any cool fights. Farm money and mats from basic mobs, toss them into the crafting box and hope for the best - no different than how it works in Las Vegas.
Most Western games remove the RNG by allowing you to farm tokens in actual content like dungeons or PvP then buy the gear.
BDO is just like ArcheAge in that the endgame is about repeating the same tedious tasks over and over all in the name of upgrade attempts which is why people say it has no content. Its not like being a master horse breeder or farmer has any meaning beyond its ability to provide access to upgrade attempts.
Once someone who has spent 8 hours grinding mobs only to have all of that work lost instantly due to a failed upgrade attempt, they get real salty real fast. Its at the point that the cash shop usually starts advertising a convenient solution all for just 500 pearls!
altho i mostly agree with your post.. there alot off ways to make money in bdo through crafting..
If you wanne become rich through crafting thats very possible
The whole point of the crafting and gathering professions is to acquire money which is then used to buy the materials for gear upgrade attempts.
Instead of dungeon boss RNG drops, its crafting casino RNG upgrading just without any cool fights. Farm money and mats from basic mobs, toss them into the crafting box and hope for the best - no different than how it works in Las Vegas.
Most Western games remove the RNG by allowing you to farm tokens in actual content like dungeons or PvP then buy the gear.
BDO is just like ArcheAge in that the endgame is about repeating the same tedious tasks over and over all in the name of upgrade attempts which is why people say it has no content. Its not like being a master horse breeder or farmer has any meaning beyond its ability to provide access to upgrade attempts.
Once someone who has spent 8 hours grinding mobs only to have all of that work lost instantly due to a failed upgrade attempt, they get real salty real fast. Its at the point that the cash shop usually starts advertising a convenient solution all for just 500 pearls!
PVP costs money in BDO. Declaring and maintaining hostile position against a guild is expensive.
BDO has more than just "crafting" but yes it is all for gaining currency. But some people seem to really enjoy all the various mini games it provides. Someone can be an expert transporter or whatever and not focus on PVP at all yet still support their guild.
While BDO does have "casino" upgrading, they also have "safe" upgrading that comes with an attached cost. RNG route can be much cheaper or a lot more, safe system is pretty set. People have options, so no it is not entirely like Vegas.
Haven't played a "western" MMO in a long time but at least the old ones used to be very RNG with boss drops. Farming dungeons/raids didn't guarantee anything in EQ/WoW for example.
The "everyone is a winner" design which came after (thanks again to WoW), seems to be your preference. Just show up and do XYZ and you'll get a price. Not bad, simply different system. Relies more on time investment than skill, just like RNG.
No clue how AA is, but BDO has tons of ways to make money and means to whatever end people are aiming for.
There are boss mobs and boss gear, not just crafted or dropped from random mobs.
Not like those people farm tokens in western games for any meaning beyond gear upgrades. Trying to justify one system that does the same thing is silly. All these games are designed to make us stay in game, fork over money at some point, and not notice any of it happening.
You do have loss in BDO, which I like, but it isn't entirely all or nothing. Clearly you have a limited concept of what it actually offers and while you aren't exactly trolling, making up "facts" to argue or prove your point doesn't deviate too far away.
Just show up and do XYZ and you'll get a price. Not bad, simply different system. Relies more on time investment than skill, just like RNG.
More like it ensures nobody is wasting their time by losing dozens if not hundreds of hours gone down the drain in the RNG casino.
And no it is not simply a 'different' system, its has proven to be the most successful model in the west by a huge margin and does the only thing that matters which is retain players far longer. Of course this doesn't matter to you since you are apparently an expert on MMO design despite not having played a Western game in the last decade.
Just show up and do XYZ and you'll get a price. Not bad, simply different system. Relies more on time investment than skill, just like RNG.
More like it ensures nobody is wasting their time by losing dozens if not hundreds of hours gone down the drain in the RNG casino.
And no it is not simply a 'different' system, its has proven to be the most successful model in the west by a huge margin and does the only thing that matters which is retain players far longer. Of course this doesn't matter to you since you are apparently an expert on MMO design despite not having played a Western game in the last decade.
Could you give me some examples of these games you speak of?
WoW comes to mind obviously, being it is allows everyone to "win" and is the most popular mmorpg in the west.
Sad that you justify what a quality game is by simply it appealing to the masses. But makes sense and why games like Crowfall that promise to be after "a different type of player" will most likely bend the knee to the masses as well. So much for being "hardcore" or not for everyone.
All of these games are a huge waste of time. You can not justify any of them to being anything but that.
If a game provides zero risk and you always win something, where's the challenge?
Not saying I'm in love with the RNG gods, but I understand the purpose.
I've played many western mmos (actually not an eastern fan for the most part) in the last decade (last two for that matter) and that is why I find myself on these and other sites wasting my time instead of playing these games. They lack any real challenge beyond whom can give up on real life the most and or open their wallets more.
I also enjoy FPS/CCG and more "fair" PVP genres, doesn't mean I can't like and appreciate systems that function differently.
BDO isn't perfect and up until a month or two ago I wouldn't have considered it, but after trying it, it isn't terrible and the features allow for a lot of entertainment without going broke.
I'm not a blind fanboi saying it is the second coming, just trying to point out that your logic/opinion is flawed and has no real foundation to stand on. Your reasoning seems to be that all KR games are the same, AA was bad, therefore BDO is without it even making it to launch in NA/EU yet. You could be 100% correct, but to state your prediction as fact is silly.
At this particular moment in the history of the MMORPG scene, it looks
laughably easy to manipulate kids because we have at least a decade of
gaming companies laying the ground for it. I mean look at the SC fiasco, shocking really.
So
I'm thinking, instead of trying to be the voice of reason I should
really just take advantage of this and get in this MMO development
racket. Big thank you to all you delusional 'gamers' for letting me realize this.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
At this particular moment in the history of the MMORPG scene, it looks
laughably easy to manipulate kids because we have at least a decade of
gaming companies laying the ground for it. I mean look at the SC fiasco, shocking really.
So
I'm thinking, instead of trying to be the voice of reason I should
really just take advantage of this and get in this MMO development
racket. Big thank you to all you delusional 'gamers' for letting me realize this.
And by kinds you mean adults that have money to burn and choose to do so on video games?
I find it hilarious that some of you believe everyone else lacks common sense and are being robbed by these companies.
Some folks simply don't care that much and or won't miss $100-$10k. Amount I've put into BDO is a decent dinner on date night, if it turns terrible in a couple months, I won't be starving.
Not to say there aren't probably a few that don't take 5 seconds to look into what they are charging to their credit card, but those folks can't be helped regardless.
At this particular moment in the history of the MMORPG scene, it looks
laughably easy to manipulate kids because we have at least a decade of
gaming companies laying the ground for it. I mean look at the SC fiasco, shocking really.
Yes kids are giving them all this money... delusional.
So
I'm thinking, instead of trying to be the voice of reason I should
really just take advantage of this and get in this MMO development
racket. Big thank you to all you delusional 'gamers' for letting me realize this.
The 2 big Western P2W studios SOE and Trion are now both pariahs in the industry. Maybe Trion made some money, but they will never recover from the reputation hit.
The mobile market / browser social media games are where Western devs are cashing in.
Just show up and do XYZ and you'll get a price. Not bad, simply different system. Relies more on time investment than skill, just like RNG.
More like it ensures nobody is wasting their time by losing dozens if not hundreds of hours gone down the drain in the RNG casino.
And no it is not simply a 'different' system, its has proven to be the most successful model in the west by a huge margin and does the only thing that matters which is retain players far longer. Of course this doesn't matter to you since you are apparently an expert on MMO design despite not having played a Western game in the last decade.
Could you give me some examples of these games you speak of?
WoW comes to mind obviously, being it is allows everyone to "win" and is the most popular mmorpg in the west.
Sad that you justify what a quality game is by simply it appealing to the masses. But makes sense and why games like Crowfall that promise to be after "a different type of player" will most likely bend the knee to the masses as well. So much for being "hardcore" or not for everyone.
All of these games are a huge waste of time. You can not justify any of them to being anything but that.
If a game provides zero risk and you always win something, where's the challenge?
Not saying I'm in love with the RNG gods, but I understand the purpose.
I've played many western mmos (actually not an eastern fan for the most part) in the last decade (last two for that matter) and that is why I find myself on these and other sites wasting my time instead of playing these games. They lack any real challenge beyond whom can give up on real life the most and or open their wallets more.
I also enjoy FPS/CCG and more "fair" PVP genres, doesn't mean I can't like and appreciate systems that function differently.
BDO isn't perfect and up until a month or two ago I wouldn't have considered it, but after trying it, it isn't terrible and the features allow for a lot of entertainment without going broke.
I'm not a blind fanboi saying it is the second coming, just trying to point out that your logic/opinion is flawed and has no real foundation to stand on. Your reasoning seems to be that all KR games are the same, AA was bad, therefore BDO is without it even making it to launch in NA/EU yet. You could be 100% correct, but to state your prediction as fact is silly.
what level of resilience do you need for the challenge of RNG or zero risk? im not defending wow or any traditional pve oriented game, but why cant the challenge come before the definite prize?
and from what ive seen about BDO there is no chellenge in ANY thing you obtain gear wise - whether that being those lame ass open world dungeons, or those long winded tank and spank boss fights with no mechanics. The only "challenge" ive seen (not played, so plz correct me if im wrong) is the time sink needed to be the best type of trader/crafter and the mental fortitude to withstand some RNG for gear upgrades (pvp will have it for sure seeing as its situational).
Im not saying the games that have come out in recent times need to copy and paste what popular ones of the past have done to the T. But I cant for the life of me see why the sudden change in good challenging content.
Comments
The level and gear scaling, paying for it or not, eventually balances out, just a bit rough until people make it there, assuming people actually feel the need to reach that point at all or quickly.
I've yet to be randomly killed by any of the high level folks I see as I work my way up, although I'll be dropping KR for NA soon as I can.
GW2 could very easily sell gear, potions, insert whatever that made players OP. Nothing stopping them, except it would be a pretty poor business decision and I don't see how that would be any different for BDO, regardless of the "limitless" scaling as there are very clear soft caps and goals people seem to reach for.
If I know my fellow NA/EU gamers, the crys and rage will probably force the their hand to make more chances to keep people around. KR gamers and culture are very different than NA/EU. If they want to keep BDO running, going the AA or whatever route is going to be a short term situation, unless that's all they want. But I have to ask myself why when the game is tons of opportunity not doing so.
You do realize people of all types (F2P to Bajillionaires) have been playing KR version for quite some time?
Honestly don't know if you have any clue what you are talking about beyond baggage/issues from other games.
What is this "more content" you speak of and what happens after 2 months? Have you taken a look at BDO KR's cash shop which has been a live and running without the game imploding?
Really curious what you think people are even buying that is resulting in P2W or causing those that don't pay a lot to quick.
Some of the "best" players as in gear, level, skill are not billionaires forking over thousands each day. Really would love to know what you base all of this negativity on that actually pertains to BDO, Daum, and the other parties involved.
As I said people who are not serious pvpers and don't mind being random plebs that have no effect on the server politics and wars can probably do just fine. How they can enjoy a game that has no pve and is completely based on grinding for pvp power is beyond me and I doubt they will stick around past 1-50(s) which is ways less than 150 hours.
calling you out.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I am discussing the merits of a game on a gaming forum. If you don't like 'complainers' then maybe you shouldn't complain about them.
Claiming BDO doesn't have any content? Seriously?
Can you source the massive tanking the game has done please?
GW2 is trashed constantly and you are holding it up as the goal for other companies?
What is a serious PVPer? Goes back to Crowfall, you honestly believe someone will buy the game and that's it to stay competitive?
Clueless. Unless I'm feeding someone under a bridge, would make a lot more sense.
Biggest take away is you asking "How they can enjoy a game." Huge FYI, not every game is designed with you in mind.
How are millions playing WoW, League, insert whatever is popular. Can't stand any of them, yet I understand their attraction and accept them for what they are, games not for me.
I have my doubts about this game, but i'll give it a shot when the time comes.
Tried it, but felt like almost like a Korean grinder or Asian game which will rely on a heavy ingame cash shop.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
I have seen some people say things like "it has no content" or "has no pve", "completely pvp" and I want to try and bridge the difference in perspective here. You see, when I look at the game I see almost endless content and a really immersive world, and although I love pvp, I am not particularly interested in BDO from a pvp perspective because I know I won't have the time or want to spend the money required (to gear up) for that to be fun. I don't look at it from the perspective of how many dungeons it has, or if it has raids or good quests/story.
What I see is a game where my relationships with the world and players around me really matter and adventure, exploration, and danger is everywhere. I don't know if I have explained myself well, but basically it comes down to whether you view pve only as the traditional fight mobs/quests/dungeons etc or you have a somewhat broader view of what constitutes pve.
So ironically to me BDO is attractive as a pve/social game, and I'll probably stick to GW2, ESO or Smite for my pvp. And that is saying a lot, because I basically only pvp in the mmos I play.
[mod edit]
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
If that's missing people are going to think, what do I do? There is alternative content there, but will it be enough?
But you can do other things like become a wealthy horse breeder.
They also announced some open world dungeons being released in the KR version, but they're not traditional dungeons and certainly nothing that you could queue up for in a raid finder.
Overall the endgame is a lot more sandboxy than most MMORPGs, but that's something people have been saying they've wanted for a long time. Do they actually want it? We'll see.
I don't think the lack of traditional endgame is the biggest potential problem, honestly. The biggest problem I see is that you need a pretty good computer to it.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
BDO looks to be a blend between sandbox and theme park. They just came out with two big content updates in "Valencia" and added some open world bosses.
I havne't played it yet, but i think this game is hard to put into a box.
Instead of dungeon boss RNG drops, its crafting casino RNG upgrading just without any cool fights. Farm money and mats from basic mobs, toss them into the crafting box and hope for the best - no different than how it works in Las Vegas.
Most Western games remove the RNG by allowing you to farm tokens in actual content like dungeons or PvP then buy the gear.
BDO is just like ArcheAge in that the endgame is about repeating the same tedious tasks over and over all in the name of upgrade attempts which is why people say it has no content. Its not like being a master horse breeder or farmer has any meaning beyond its ability to provide access to upgrade attempts.
Once someone who has spent 8 hours grinding mobs only to have all of that work lost instantly due to a failed upgrade attempt, they get real salty real fast. Its at the point that the cash shop usually starts advertising a convenient solution all for just 500 pearls!
If you wanne become rich through crafting thats very possible
BDO has more than just "crafting" but yes it is all for gaining currency. But some people seem to really enjoy all the various mini games it provides. Someone can be an expert transporter or whatever and not focus on PVP at all yet still support their guild.
While BDO does have "casino" upgrading, they also have "safe" upgrading that comes with an attached cost. RNG route can be much cheaper or a lot more, safe system is pretty set. People have options, so no it is not entirely like Vegas.
Haven't played a "western" MMO in a long time but at least the old ones used to be very RNG with boss drops. Farming dungeons/raids didn't guarantee anything in EQ/WoW for example.
The "everyone is a winner" design which came after (thanks again to WoW), seems to be your preference. Just show up and do XYZ and you'll get a price. Not bad, simply different system. Relies more on time investment than skill, just like RNG.
No clue how AA is, but BDO has tons of ways to make money and means to whatever end people are aiming for.
There are boss mobs and boss gear, not just crafted or dropped from random mobs.
Not like those people farm tokens in western games for any meaning beyond gear upgrades. Trying to justify one system that does the same thing is silly. All these games are designed to make us stay in game, fork over money at some point, and not notice any of it happening.
You do have loss in BDO, which I like, but it isn't entirely all or nothing. Clearly you have a limited concept of what it actually offers and while you aren't exactly trolling, making up "facts" to argue or prove your point doesn't deviate too far away.
And no it is not simply a 'different' system, its has proven to be the most successful model in the west by a huge margin and does the only thing that matters which is retain players far longer. Of course this doesn't matter to you since you are apparently an expert on MMO design despite not having played a Western game in the last decade.
WoW comes to mind obviously, being it is allows everyone to "win" and is the most popular mmorpg in the west.
Sad that you justify what a quality game is by simply it appealing to the masses. But makes sense and why games like Crowfall that promise to be after "a different type of player" will most likely bend the knee to the masses as well. So much for being "hardcore" or not for everyone.
All of these games are a huge waste of time. You can not justify any of them to being anything but that.
If a game provides zero risk and you always win something, where's the challenge?
Not saying I'm in love with the RNG gods, but I understand the purpose.
I've played many western mmos (actually not an eastern fan for the most part) in the last decade (last two for that matter) and that is why I find myself on these and other sites wasting my time instead of playing these games. They lack any real challenge beyond whom can give up on real life the most and or open their wallets more.
I also enjoy FPS/CCG and more "fair" PVP genres, doesn't mean I can't like and appreciate systems that function differently.
BDO isn't perfect and up until a month or two ago I wouldn't have considered it, but after trying it, it isn't terrible and the features allow for a lot of entertainment without going broke.
I'm not a blind fanboi saying it is the second coming, just trying to point out that your logic/opinion is flawed and has no real foundation to stand on. Your reasoning seems to be that all KR games are the same, AA was bad, therefore BDO is without it even making it to launch in NA/EU yet. You could be 100% correct, but to state your prediction as fact is silly.
I mean look at the SC fiasco, shocking really.
So I'm thinking, instead of trying to be the voice of reason I should really just take advantage of this and get in this MMO development racket.
Big thank you to all you delusional 'gamers' for letting me realize this.
I care about your gaming 'problems' and teenage anxieties, just not today.
I find it hilarious that some of you believe everyone else lacks common sense and are being robbed by these companies.
Some folks simply don't care that much and or won't miss $100-$10k. Amount I've put into BDO is a decent dinner on date night, if it turns terrible in a couple months, I won't be starving.
Not to say there aren't probably a few that don't take 5 seconds to look into what they are charging to their credit card, but those folks can't be helped regardless.
The mobile market / browser social media games are where Western devs are cashing in.
and from what ive seen about BDO there is no chellenge in ANY thing you obtain gear wise - whether that being those lame ass open world dungeons, or those long winded tank and spank boss fights with no mechanics. The only "challenge" ive seen (not played, so plz correct me if im wrong) is the time sink needed to be the best type of trader/crafter and the mental fortitude to withstand some RNG for gear upgrades (pvp will have it for sure seeing as its situational).
Im not saying the games that have come out in recent times need to copy and paste what popular ones of the past have done to the T. But I cant for the life of me see why the sudden change in good challenging content.