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Gold Sellers gone wild.

filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
in Blade & Soul
Man I tell you I been in this game since launch and this morning is the worse I have ever seen on any mmo ever with gold sellers.  They are rotating characters every minute constantly creating new accounts.  Honestly I don't know how they are doing it so fast.  I blocked 10 people this morning then within 5 minutes there was another 10.  Then 5 minutes later there's another 10.  Right now they are showing up every minute and its just plain ridiculous.  The only thing I think NCsoft can do is ban the IP for 48 hours.  That way they would at least have to reset their routers between their creating new accounts and their spam.  This situation isn't easy to handle I wonder if there's a better idea out there.  Probably just put a chat ban on anyone with new accounts then they would stand around everywhere using say instead of zone.  The good thing they don't have 1 gold seller in the second zone.
Are you onto something or just on something?
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Comments

  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    edited January 2016

    So reading ncsoft's response they are hesitant to give anyone the power to simply ban someone without first investigating.  I'm sure it is also a tactic of the gold sellers to spam support tickets about how they are innocent further bogging down the process.  I would hope they just need gm's who can take screen shots and ban accounts but they don't have that right now the gm has to file a claim and someone else does the banning.


    I just want to give an update.  This thread was created on Sunday and I guess ncsoft doesn't have full staff on Sundays so there wasn't anyone around to stop the gold spammers.  Today is Monday and its 12:00 pm and its back to the regular 8 gold sellers.  So once you block those 8 then all is quiet.

    Post edited by filmoret on
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • JohnxboyJohnxboy Member UncommonPosts: 104
    edited January 2016
    You really think blocking 10 or 5 gold sellers at a time does anything? Do you understand the amount of people that play these games? thousands....How you surprise yourself after 20 gold sellers astound me. [mod edit]
    Post edited by Vaross on
  • waynejr2waynejr2 Member EpicPosts: 7,771

    Gold Sellers gone wild...  I bought the first three of those

    Gold Sellers gone wild porn videos.  They were very disappointing.



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  • RaxeonRaxeon Member UncommonPosts: 2,288
    lol would be easy to auto mute anyone that repeats the same sentence over and over
  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    DMKano said:
    It's multiple gold selling companies using scripted account creation and many of them don't even use the client - they pipe chat into game via 3rd party tools that bypases the client entirely.

    So they create accounts and can blast chat with spam without client launch via direct com channel to game servers. If they are banned - it matters not - another account is ready in less than 1 second.

    That's how they do it so fast - not having to launch the game client speeds things up tremendously.

    There are games that ban over 100K accounts at launch every day - this is what BnS is experiencing right now - it's a no win situation.

    As a side note players always think that GMs are the answer - no human force can deal with automation of this magnitude - that's why auto-bot creation is best dealt with auto-ban automation which is what NCSoft is doing.

    It's one scripted system fighting another


    Hmm I didn't know they could bypass the client entirely.  Yea its crazy how fast they are coming up with new accounts.  I had an idea but it does require that the client be started and unless they can fix that problem well this won't work.

    I wonder if they can block the computer by putting some kind of tag on it.  Making them reinstall the game unless it gets unlocked by a gm with a certain code.  Sorta like how the newer games have tried to stop piracy.  IDK how exactly that would work but it can definitely work and idk how much coding it would require.  So basically whenever someone tries to log into the game from a recently banned IP it immediately runs an update that locks the program and prevents it from being run unless an unlock code from a GM is given.  OH crap I should be getting paid for this.

    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Even P2P MMOs get some of this at launch and it takes them a while to get it under control with all the other stuff they have to deal with. Add free account creation into the mix and it's gold spammers gone wild.

    As long as there's a market, there will be sellers spamming chat. And F2P games don't really want to get rid of the buyers since they will likely also be the cash shop's best customers.
    "Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”

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  • stayontargetstayontarget Member RarePosts: 6,519
    Its just a bad game design.

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  • QuesaQuesa Member UncommonPosts: 1,432
    edited January 2016
    Iselin said:
    Even P2P MMOs get some of this at launch and it takes them a while to get it under control with all the other stuff they have to deal with.
    True, but it's far less of a problem and far easier to make a dent when there is a pay wall.
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  • HarikenHariken Member EpicPosts: 2,680
    Like i said before,this game is a gold sellers dream. Don't have enough gold to bid on that item just like at chat and buy some.
  • barasawabarasawa Member UncommonPosts: 618
    I've played a game that had around a couple hundred gold sellers spamming the first couple of zones. It was insane. You couldn't even say anything that anyone could read because it was instantly offscreen because of all the spam. Someone made a great addon that blocked the gold spam based on a variety of filters that worked really well. Two bonus features are you could add your own filters, and it also had a default filter to block all chuck norris comments! Loved the addon, but the game was just ok.

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  • ceratop001ceratop001 Member RarePosts: 1,594
    Gold Sellers Gone Wild sounds like a new reality TV show...
     
  • Righteous_RockRighteous_Rock Member RarePosts: 1,234
    There is a lot it seems, what's the best price you have seen though? You have to watch the prices and they play off of each other too. Right now I wouldn't pay more than $10 for 20k gold.
  • GhavriggGhavrigg Member RarePosts: 1,308
    It wouldn't be so bad if they didn't cap the goddamn block list at 50 people. I used that up in a couple days.

    Then I immediately went to the cash shop to see if they were selling additional block space.
  • IselinIselin Member LegendaryPosts: 18,719
    Torval said:
    Iselin said:
    Even P2P MMOs get some of this at launch and it takes them a while to get it under control with all the other stuff they have to deal with. Add free account creation into the mix and it's gold spammers gone wild.

    As long as there's a market, there will be sellers spamming chat. And F2P games don't really want to get rid of the buyers since they will likely also be the cash shop's best customers.
    This is why B2P has become my favorite revenue model. It reduces drive by asshattery (gold spammers included in this). Nothing is going to stop it, but small hurdles can slow it down tremendously.

    This has been a plague on mmos since I played Lineage. The problem really is the players. The more popular and willing players are to cheat the more the cancer grows. The less willing and supportive the players are then it dies. It can't live without players.
    It's true that it has been around forever but now it's much more noticeable with every new launch. They're more organized and they blitz new releases with their spam in ways well beyond anything I remember from even 4 or 5 years ago. It was certainly not this bad when LOTRO, Warhammer Online, Rift, SWTOR, etc. launched. 

    IMO, it's happening and will continue to happen because the customers - the online playing public - is more conditioned now to accept cash for in-game advantage as a normal part of playing thanks to cash shops. And I'm not talking just about MMOs. FB and mobile gaming took F2P to a whole new level of cultural penetration and made billions doing so.

    It's ironic in that I remember discussions about how once the developers themselves started selling gold, the 3rd party gold market would die down. Obviously that did not happen. All it really did was influence how much gold your get per dollar spent. 3rd party sellers just need to look at the going rate for what the players themselves are buying in the cash shop and then selling in the AH for gold and adjust their conversions to provide a better return.

    Enough people will go after the bargain despite the riskier transactions. And their potential customer base keeps getting bigger thanks to FB, mobile gaming and MMOs selling a new generation of gamers on the idea that paying cash for advantages that would otherwise take a lot of time to earn by playing (if that's even realistically possible) is a perfectly OK thing to do.

    All the developers can do is say, "hey guys don't support those scummy bastards who will steal your credit card info" trying to scaremonger their players back into their own cash shop. But most can no longer (at least the full-blown F2P ones can't) say, "hey guys, just earn your rewards by playing the game - it's more satisfying that way" because they've designed their games around the need to use the cash shop -- that is also now their own business model.
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  • ReizlaReizla Member RarePosts: 4,092
    filmoret said:
    So reading ncsoft's response they are hesitant to give anyone the power to simply ban someone without first investigating.  I'm sure it is also a tactic of the gold sellers to spam support tickets about how they are innocent further bogging down the process.  I would hope they just need gm's who can take screen shots and ban accounts but they don't have that right now the gm has to file a claim and someone else does the banning.
    NCSoft is NOT BANING bots or goldsellers at all. I've played Lineage II for years on their servers and I have never really seen known bots disappear. They've used the banhammer only twice in the last 10 years for L2 - the first time in 2007, the 2nd only recently where ONLY ~8000 accounts have been banned.

    Fun thing, my message about the RMT and quitting immediately I had a lot of negative responses, including 'just block them'. From that I've seen that 10 minutes I've been on the goldsellers are the same as in L2 and I know how they work, which is exactly as you describe. I'm so happy I decided to leave immediately!
  • JudgeUKJudgeUK Member RarePosts: 1,698
    edited January 2016
    Ghavrigg said:
    It wouldn't be so bad if they didn't cap the goddamn block list at 50 people. I used that up in a couple days.

    Then I immediately went to the cash shop to see if they were selling additional block space.
    This block limit needs increasing by x10
    The only way to block further sellers is to unblock older ones and hope they've gone - but a lot still appear to be around.
  • StoevixStoevix Member UncommonPosts: 37
    It would be more fun if caught spamming it would auto flag you for PVP. Least that way we could kill the spammers just for fun.
  • tom_goretom_gore Member UncommonPosts: 2,001
    The best part is those hundreds of gold sellers are taking spots from players actually wanting to play and having to sit in a queue instead.
  • OzBuzzardOzBuzzard Member UncommonPosts: 5
    I don't see any gold seller spam unless I'm queuing for cross server dungeons.  Just keep party finder and faction channels in their own tab.  Simple .  Those channels are not needed in main chat tab.
  • HatefullHatefull Member EpicPosts: 2,503
    edited January 2016
    Torval said:
    Iselin said:
    Even P2P MMOs get some of this at launch and it takes them a while to get it under control with all the other stuff they have to deal with. Add free account creation into the mix and it's gold spammers gone wild.

    As long as there's a market, there will be sellers spamming chat. And F2P games don't really want to get rid of the buyers since they will likely also be the cash shop's best customers.
    The problem really is the players. 
    This is the best point of the whole conversation.  People, humans get so damn lazy when it comes too playing games and they have every excuse under the sun.  I work full time, I have kids, I am going to school, yadda yadda.  All bullshit.  If you are that damn lazy or busy then go play something that does not require the time investment that most MMO's do.  This will always be an issue as long as the lazy and the 'gotta have it now' crowd are involved with games.  

    No market = no gold spam.  Big market = lots of gold spam.  I would also hazard to say that most of the people bitching about the spam are the biggest supporters of the gold sellers.  Why?  Because they are the ones sitting around in chat (not leveling or grinding out what they need) and getting annoyed by all the gold spam.  The players that are out there playing the game will generally be on Guild chat or some other private(ish) channel and largely ignore the gold spam.

    The problem is (some of) you.

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  • Eno777Eno777 Member CommonPosts: 5
    Raxeon said:
    lol would be easy to auto mute anyone that repeats the same sentence over and over

    Like WTS - #### x gold msg me pls  

    ??? :awesome:
    I hope you get the irony

    Everyone copy pastes their WTS and WTB messages so ... i don't know
  • Octagon7711Octagon7711 Member LegendaryPosts: 9,004
    Reizla said:
    filmoret said:
    So reading ncsoft's response they are hesitant to give anyone the power to simply ban someone without first investigating.  I'm sure it is also a tactic of the gold sellers to spam support tickets about how they are innocent further bogging down the process.  I would hope they just need gm's who can take screen shots and ban accounts but they don't have that right now the gm has to file a claim and someone else does the banning.
    NCSoft is NOT BANING bots or goldsellers at all. I've played Lineage II for years on their servers and I have never really seen known bots disappear. They've used the banhammer only twice in the last 10 years for L2 - the first time in 2007, the 2nd only recently where ONLY ~8000 accounts have been banned.

    Fun thing, my message about the RMT and quitting immediately I had a lot of negative responses, including 'just block them'. From that I've seen that 10 minutes I've been on the goldsellers are the same as in L2 and I know how they work, which is exactly as you describe. I'm so happy I decided to leave immediately!
    I remember one of the ban waves.  They took the servers down for maintenance and thousands of accounts were hitting the servers trying to auto-relog in.  So they banned them.  Last time I played L2 there were bots all over the place.  It's been awhile since I played Aion but there were a lot ingame also.

    GW2 has a nice tool that mutes you for spamming in chat.  I use to always post in beta forums, 'What are you guys going to do about bots and gold sellers?"  It's always the same, rarely do they consider it a problem until it becomes one.  It's like anything else not legal, as long as there's a market for it someone will create a supply.  It's a never ending problem.  Even when games try to undercut gold sellers by offering products in their stores and instant level characters to stop power leveling services, they get accused of being P2W.  

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  • AkulasAkulas Member RarePosts: 3,029
    Ok will come back in a month and if it's not sorted there are other games to play in my spare time. Limited time to worry about spam.

    This isn't a signature, you just think it is.

  • filmoretfilmoret Member EpicPosts: 4,906
    Well the good thinig is I haven't seen 1 gold seller past the starting area.  Which happens around lvl 12 if you do all the quests and get the weapon evolve.
    Are you onto something or just on something?
  • someforumguysomeforumguy Member RarePosts: 4,088
    edited January 2016
    In my MMO experience, gold sellers are often a problem in games with a ton of gold sinks that can only be countered by serious grind. In other words, poor game design can lead to higher demand for gold sellers. Or design specifically aimed at making you buy cash shop items (specifically consumables like xp potions etc).

    So how is character progression working in this game? Do you get enough gear from quests? Or is the droprate good enough if that is the major source for gear? What kind of balance are they working with here?
    Also ,does the ingame shop sell items that influence this?

    I am curious about this. Just so I know that I can skip this game if its just grind grind grind. I am one of those players who just stops playing instead of buying xp potions/gear from cash shop, and I refuse to buy gold too.
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