The character models look and move terribly

Impsy

Ew. I hope they clean them up. They look so goofy and weird

JamesGoblin

@Impsy While waiting for improved movement (and any other animations) to be implemented in Beta, you can check some of these.

HallowedFallen

The face textures seem slightly different in quality, they're all good, but seem to be made by multiple hands. The armor in the editor screenshot doesn't seem to match the quality of any of the faces though, a bit lower.

Entris38

Just coming out of a true alpha test and into it's first beta, I'm certain there is going to be significant and continual improvements. Remember, they didn't hold an "early access" alpha, it was more of a traditional alpha. I'm guessing we will see soon.

JamesGoblin

HallowedFallen said:

The face textures seem slightly different in quality, they're all good, but seem to be made by multiple hands. The armor in the editor screenshot doesn't seem to match the quality of any of the faces though, a bit lower.

@HallowedFallen All faces were made couple months ago by Jon, CSE's 3D modeller. Anyway my main idea was to give comparison to rather rough (pre-)Alpha test models, say like this (or you can check the video on the official site):



What I am actually worried - or better to say curious about - are new animations and combat. Making things look pretty is the easier part.

adam_nox

Guess we are back to these old excuses.  Been like ten years since there was serious mmo contenders, and during the betas, they all looked awful and everyone always said the same thing, but when release rolled around nothing had been improved especially not graphics or animations.  You don't do that stuff then redo it and redo it again.  Why would you?

JamesGoblin

...except that they are not in Beta.

Franciscourant

adam_nox said:

Guess we are back to these old excuses.  Been like ten years since there was serious mmo contenders, and during the betas, they all looked awful and everyone always said the same thing, but when release rolled around nothing had been improved especially not graphics or animations.  You don't do that stuff then redo it and redo it again.  Why would you?

Yes, that's how it's done generally. The character models and animation used in the early phases of development are meant to help the developers and testers to test the different features. They are often placeholders and have to be replaced later in development.

Example: in Pre-Alpha, developers are testing the physics and projectiles mechanics. They create placeholder character models (human) and basic animations that will facilitate the testing. Then they are allowing some testers to join the test and need to add some new animations (still placeholders), let's say "getting hit by a fireball while running" so the testers have visual feedback when a projectile lands on their character. Later they add new placeholder characters to represent the different races (dwarves, giants, etc.) and test new stuff. etc. etc. At some point, let's say in Beta 3, everything is ready for the implementation of the real animations and models.

Camelot Unchained is still in Alpha, a lot of graphic improvements are coming. Making things pretty is usually one of the last steps.

Ledrir

I'm not a fan of the art work I've seen on the male models.  The shoulders seem thin and the waist and hips seem wide.  The body shape kind of reminds me of how some of the giants looked that I killed for exp in DAoC.

Sovrath

adam_nox said:

Guess we are back to these old excuses.  Been like ten years since there was serious mmo contenders, and during the betas, they all looked awful and everyone always said the same thing, but when release rolled around nothing had been improved especially not graphics or animations.  You don't do that stuff then redo it and redo it again.  Why would you?

I think it depends what games you are talking about.

Games that are going to be released "soon" seem to suffer from this. For instance, the Secret World had this issue, especially with the animations.

But in a game like Camelot Unchained, they are clearly not even in Alpha. Remember that there was a time when Alpha and Beta were actually "Alpha and Beta". And not marketing terms where you get to purchase early access.

So it helps to put things in perspective.

Octagon7711

I think it's good to give voice to opinion because saying nothing is sometimes interpreted as being acceptable.

filmoret

I remember ESO being horrible at beta but I told everyone it wasn't finished and I would assume this game also isn't finished so full animations aren't in the game until they get bugs worked out.

waynejr2

adam_nox said:

Guess we are back to these old excuses.  Been like ten years since there was serious mmo contenders, and during the betas, they all looked awful and everyone always said the same thing, but when release rolled around nothing had been improved especially not graphics or animations.  You don't do that stuff then redo it and redo it again.  Why would you?

Gameplay > graphics. 

Gaming.Rocks2

Graphics is just a bonus for me when a game has depth. And I'm pretty happy with this one's, it's looks decent enough for an MMO. 
Animations on the other hand can be a deal breaker for me, kind of like the only reason I stopped playing TSW was that as a Chaos tank all I did was to spin in a horrendous way. I hope CU does that perfect.

kumoblade

I'm willing to forgive poor quality graphics.  
I am not willing to forgive Poor quality Animations.  
That's what really breaks immersion for me.  
When Animations don't synchronize/and the combat doesn't feel 'visceral' i believe is the word they use for it now a days.  

The animations of Camelot Unchained Made me cringe. There was no 'weight' behind the animations i've seen.  They all look like they're gliding or ice skating across the ground. 

And the attack animations I've seen made me sad.  There was no weight or impact. 

I really hope they fix that, and synchronize the animations with the responses and the damage/numbers/mechanics.

Franciscourant

kumoblade said:

The animations of Camelot Unchained Made me cringe. There was no 'weight' behind the animations i've seen.  They all look like they're gliding or ice skating across the ground. 

The animations in the videos are placeholders. They're working on the new animation system.
(t=24s)

Gitmix

This game is all about large scale PvP, 50 trillion polygon models would only lag everyone into the ground.
If you want kewl graphics go play a solo game like BDO.

SpiritofGame

Scambug said:

This game is all about large scale PvP, 50 trillion polygon models would only lag everyone into the ground.
If you want kewl graphics go play a solo game like BDO.

I think there is wisdom in this.  Having played large-scale RVR (those were the days!) graphic and animation quality should be reduced for the benefit of smoother gameplay and higher FPS with less lag (if possible).

(Update: I just had a look at the brief video at the top of the official website and the animations somewhat remind me of old DAOC with improvements but the terrain looks really amazing for a game that promises very large-scale RVR.  So, I think overall I am satisfied with what I am seeing.)

(By the way, I will be playing a stealth class because I have learned in PVP games it is far better NOT to be seen until you want to be ... )

SEANMCAD

Impsy said:

Ew. I hope they clean them up. They look so goofy and weird

that and peoples reaction like yours is often a sign that this is a good game

because very high on the list of things that arent very important lies 'character models'

Lokero

Torval said:

adam_nox said:

Guess we are back to these old excuses.  Been like ten years since there was serious mmo contenders, and during the betas, they all looked awful and everyone always said the same thing, but when release rolled around nothing had been improved especially not graphics or animations.  You don't do that stuff then redo it and redo it again.  Why would you?

This is a good study in why many AAA studios don't show much, or anything, until very late in the dev cycle. It confuses the rabble and they jump to crazy conspiratorial conclusions.

Yeah, showing such early footage never works out in the studios' favor.  If I were running a big studio, I wouldn't show a bloody thing to the people today.  People get an impression of something and it just sticks with them for life.
And, with the way the media pounces on every little scrap nowadays, a single bad impression from a very early placeholder can turn away thousands.

I wonder, if at some point soon, we'll see studios go back to the old ways of not even discussing a project until it's nearly released.

Shadanwolf

When a game in in Alpha how can you talk about liking/not liking graphics ?

cronius77

i did both DAOC beta testing and shrouded isles beta testing and I can tell you right now if Mark still is doing the same thing as he did back then, you can count on things changing including graphics. Even in shrouded isles beta things constantly changed and they already had the core game up and running. Animations changed spell effects etc. I think most people complaining here have no clue or have not been around long enough to know what a true alpha or beta testing is and not a paid or free demo to try to get more sales before launch.

quarzstein

kumoblade said:

I'm willing to forgive poor quality graphics.  
I am not willing to forgive Poor quality Animations.  
That's what really breaks immersion for me.  
When Animations don't synchronize/and the combat doesn't feel 'visceral' i believe is the word they use for it now a days.  

The animations of Camelot Unchained Made me cringe. There was no 'weight' behind the animations i've seen.  They all look like they're gliding or ice skating across the ground. 

And the attack animations I've seen made me sad.  There was no weight or impact. 

I really hope they fix that, and synchronize the animations with the responses and the damage/numbers/mechanics.

Same here. That's one of the reasons I can't get along with Project Gorgon at the moment.

The game does capture the feeling of an oldschool MMO pretty well and the progression feels interesting, the quests rewarding. The world, while not very pretty, fits the theme of the game pretty well.

Animations however...I hate them. There is no excuse to have such animations in 2016. Some might argue that this fits the game. I do not. Melee feels like punching air and spells have strange interactions.

The difference is that project Gorgon is in alpha while Camelot Unchained is not. I really hope they can improve the animations to the point where I do not have to laugh out lout upon seeing them. While the video seems promising, we yet have to see those animations in action, how they fit into the combat system, how the visuals and the sound reflect the action for example.

JamesGoblin

quarzstein said:

kumoblade said:

I'm willing to forgive poor quality graphics.  
I am not willing to forgive Poor quality Animations.  
That's what really breaks immersion for me.  
When Animations don't synchronize/and the combat doesn't feel 'visceral' i believe is the word they use for it now a days.  

The animations of Camelot Unchained Made me cringe. There was no 'weight' behind the animations i've seen.  They all look like they're gliding or ice skating across the ground. 

And the attack animations I've seen made me sad.  There was no weight or impact. 

I really hope they fix that, and synchronize the animations with the responses and the damage/numbers/mechanics.

Same here. That's one of the reasons I can't get along with Project Gorgon at the moment.

The game does capture the feeling of an oldschool MMO pretty well and the progression feels interesting, the quests rewarding. The world, while not very pretty, fits the theme of the game pretty well.

Animations however...I hate them. There is no excuse to have such animations in 2016. Some might argue that this fits the game. I do not. Melee feels like punching air and spells have strange interactions.

The difference is that project Gorgon is in alpha while Camelot Unchained is not. I really hope they can improve the animations to the point where I do not have to laugh out lout upon seeing them. While the video seems promising, we yet have to see those animations in action, how they fit into the combat system, how the visuals and the sound reflect the action for example.

@quarzstein @kumoblade You are aware that you saw pre-pre...alpha placeholders, likely from 2013?   Also, @quarzstein Camelot Unchained is in alpha - while, again, it's animations (I have these available to public in mind) are not even there.

Jermzy

I was in WoW beta and i told myself then that the game was crap and would be a big flop........

See, my opinion did not mean much because i obviously did not know what i was talking about way back then.  Even if i did, my opinion did not mean squat anyways.

There is a 'moral to the story' somewhere in there.

Adjuvant1

What " I " think is, as the whole "back end" shaped around allowance for "hundreds" of participants in close proximity with some amount of terrain (city wall?) destruction (?), that functionality is going to be first, with combat fun/balance second and optimal character models third or so. I have no expectation the character art will be as nice as BDO, but I'm hoping they work to reach aesthetics of Warhammer Online.

Here's the thing. The game is a mass pvp concept. Where open pvp as Warhammer and SWtOR fell short was the fact the servers didn't (don't) have the technology to accommodate big 150v150 or 200v200 battles.



I believe it can be bigger than 200v200, but I believe there are some sacrifices. Another aspect that probably will be curtailed quite a bit is huge, flashy particle effects. But see, that's going to be the thing. Will you play the game which sacrifices certain detail for a pretty great, important feature.

If you're not even into pvp at all, none of this even matters, really.

I haven't bought in yet, but I might. If I was going to crowdfund something "new" (to me) right now, it would probably be this. The developers have realistic goals, a specific vision, are acquainted with limitations, and are moving toward release at realistic pace. Closer to release, I will probably pre-order, like 3 days or a week, if things keep getting better.