Looks like the Division was written by some clueless people too. You have to wonder what bubble these developers live in, certainly NOT the real world.
I feel sorry for those that enjoy these games, but not much you can do with such a design when the end game is basically pvp. A client/server rewrite is completely out of the question especially since Daum does not have these problems in Korea.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
The game doesn't need a better "anti-cheat system". It needs to get core game mechanics OUT of the client and on to the server!
I'm glad I don't care about this stuff. I'm still enjoying the game.
Well put. This is bad game design pure and simple. Camelot Unchained is doing their engine right so crap like this doesn't happen.
You know that on several "Hack" Sites the package system of CU is already dismantled, right ?
You will face the same results as here, not that bad, but they can Workaround CDs, Speed and teleport hack.
Of course Daum need to improve the codebase, but its the asslings that use the hacks that should get blamed. Even in EQ you could use speed hacks, teleports and my favorite, back this days EQUlti, a program they use for CU as well btw. Where you can see the Mobs on your Radar, the pathing and the loot they have.
Before you say.. oh you are a hacker? no, i am not, but i am a dev and interessted in the code. As some of the hacks are very good designed.
Report as many cheater you see, don´t get on the same lvl and help the community.
sure you can blame the hackers all you want but human nature is going to lead to cheaters especially in E sport style pvp games or domination. Good companies who do not cut corners plan for stuff like this and if shit happens anyways they still get it fixed asap. DAOC had radar hacks and warhammer online had warbuddy so obviously no company is perfect and can make their games 100% hack free. But they can also be diligent as much as possible and not let this issue linger very long either or their credibility is out the window. Part of the reason blizzard caught so much slack still to this day over bots is because they let it run rampant for so long that no one took them serious. Radar hackers in DAOC were reported and banned right away as soon as evidence was presented, same with warbuddy users. But my point is blaming the hackers isnt going to solve the problem, people are going to cheat its human nature it happens daily outside of games with crime, but pushing the company for a fast response will help the entire problem.
It should be a top rule of game design. Players will exploit what you allow them to exploit.
The sad fact is that traditionally project managers have often given insufficient care regarding these situations.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
They're screwed because there is no easy way to fix this. I don't think they're going to develop their own anti-cheat software and I don't think they're going to spend time making all the values server side or at least make it so the servers don't trust everything the client tells them as that would require a fairly huge effort.
They're screwed because there is no easy way to fix this. I don't think they're going to develop their own anti-cheat software and I don't think they're going to spend time making all the values server side or at least make it so the servers don't trust everything the client tells them as that would require a fairly huge effort.
pretty sure only way to do so if they rewrite teh whole game from zero, and taht will not happen, and since any anti-hack software is useless (since well you will rewrite the exe to not use the anti system).
guys here is teh deal as long there is a rule some people will break it, only way to prevent thing go wrong is if the adm will use his head and do something about it, or just ignore and milk the max he can, and we know what they will do
I wish just ONCE that an MMORPG launching with hype behind it would take a lesson from Steam/Valve and let the players fight the hackers directly through reporting programs. This crap always ends the same way... people get demoralized and fatigued by how long it takes to get any cheater removed and eventually they just give up on reporting them entirely.
This won't really be fixed ever. They are not going to redesign the whole game. I guess in Korea they don't have the same amount of retarded spoiled brat little shits who have to cheat in video games because they got picked on in school or something early in life. This game is nothing but a boring grindfest that leads to nowhere anyway. The servers are laggy and total garbage and the main endgame mechanic is not even in the game yet. All we need now is some totally abusive cash shop crap like energy potions or some kind of RNG bonus item to finish this game off. RIP.
Well I am actually half Chinese, my mom was born in Anhui and immigrated over to the US when she was 4. And you know, I find that comment funny lol. Just like in school everyone thought i knew karate and left me alone haha.
I wouldn't say Chinese though, I would say Korean. Every Korean MMO I play ends up being a hacked piece of garbage. I really hoped BDO would be different, but I was wrong.
I will stick it out, since I already invested $230 into the game, but this is a huge slap in the face. I even waited a few weeks to see if there were cheats AND THERE WEREN'T ANY. So I bought it, only to have these very cheats come out 14 days after I gave Da$m my money. Urge to kill rising.
$230 :O not even near that yet. But now I don't feel so bad
They are very serious about repairing these hacks...
Are they?
How long have they been in place in Korea?
And have they been repaired in Korea?
I arest my case....
These types of things don't happen in Korea because players must register their number given to them by their Government to play the game. If they hack and get caught they get blacklisted, with no easy fixes like we have by simply changing IP, and getting a new account.
sure you can blame the hackers all you want but human nature is going to lead to cheaters especially in E sport style pvp games or domination. Good companies who do not cut corners plan for stuff like this and if shit happens anyways they still get it fixed asap. DAOC had radar hacks and warhammer online had warbuddy so obviously no company is perfect and can make their games 100% hack free. But they can also be diligent as much as possible and not let this issue linger very long either or their credibility is out the window. Part of the reason blizzard caught so much slack still to this day over bots is because they let it run rampant for so long that no one took them serious. Radar hackers in DAOC were reported and banned right away as soon as evidence was presented, same with warbuddy users. But my point is blaming the hackers isnt going to solve the problem, people are going to cheat its human nature it happens daily outside of games with crime, but pushing the company for a fast response will help the entire problem.
People still Radar and Speedhack in DAoC, the same programs from 14 years ago still work just fine. In fact right now they are struggling because they have less than 2k subs and so many people are cheating that they cut into their bottom line heavily if they ban. So they are giving 3 day suspensions for cheaters, because they don't want them to unsubscribe. I even know for a fact Broadsword are also reinstating accounts banned for hacking if you send an E-mail saying you'd like another chance and you want to resubscribe.
Not a very good game to use for an argument against cheating, as much as I love DAoC, it's far from perfect.
They are very serious about repairing these hacks...
Are they?
How long have they been in place in Korea?
And have they been repaired in Korea?
I arest my case....
These types of things don't happen in Korea because players must register their number given to them by their Government to play the game. If they hack and get caught they get blacklisted, with no easy fixes like we have by simply changing IP, and getting a new account.
Well. it does make it harder but hackers use "borrowed" KSSNs as do many western players wanting to play on their IP locked servers. Not a damn thing is 100% foolproof.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Posts trying to minimize this issue certainly are naive. Just curious, do you use blinders when playing?
Considering I mention sensationalism, I assume this could be about my post? It's hard to tell when you just lay out a blanket statement.
Anyway I'm still in that waiting period ( seeing how things go before jumping in) so no, no blinders are needed here. I would say though that for most people not into competitive PVP this will be a non-issue.. Maybe it's that type of player that really doesn't care? To those folks this would be a minimal issue to their experience.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
They are very serious about repairing these hacks...
Are they?
How long have they been in place in Korea?
And have they been repaired in Korea?
I arest my case....
These types of things don't happen in Korea because players must register their number given to them by their Government to play the game. If they hack and get caught they get blacklisted, with no easy fixes like we have by simply changing IP, and getting a new account.
Well. it does make it harder but hackers use "borrowed" KSSNs as do many western players wanting to play on their IP locked servers. Not a damn thing is 100% foolproof.
True, but it does cut back the problem drastically. I think we will start to see more phone number registrations the more these people try to ruin these games like Valve has started to try with CS:GO. With the graphics and smooth game play people expect it's very hard to get all these actions server side without spending crazy amounts of money on servers instead of developers. Then you get issues with server lag, and the possibility to load the servers with command prompts and cause forced lag as well. It's just another thing to make games cost more, getting us less content for our money. I really wish kids who install these garbage hacks would figure out how they ruin future possibilities by making companies shift resources into anti-cheat.
They are very serious about repairing these hacks...
Are they?
How long have they been in place in Korea?
And have they been repaired in Korea?
I arest my case....
These types of things don't happen in Korea because players must register their number given to them by their Government to play the game. If they hack and get caught they get blacklisted, with no easy fixes like we have by simply changing IP, and getting a new account.
Well. it does make it harder but hackers use "borrowed" KSSNs as do many western players wanting to play on their IP locked servers. Not a damn thing is 100% foolproof.
True, but it does cut back the problem drastically. I think we will start to see more phone number registrations the more these people try to ruin these games like Valve has started to try with CS:GO. With the graphics and smooth game play people expect it's very hard to get all these actions server side without spending crazy amounts of money on servers instead of developers. Then you get issues with server lag, and the possibility to load the servers with command prompts and cause forced lag as well. It's just another thing to make games cost more, getting us less content for our money. I really wish kids who install these garbage hacks would figure out how they ruin future possibilities by making companies shift resources into anti-cheat.
It IS definitely a plague on gaming and something some enterprising gaming journalist might just want to write an article about... hint, hint @BillMurphy.
The technical details on how they do it is one thing but why it has become so widespread in all games is a much more interesting and bigger story.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
It's not a bad game design, It's the limitation of the internet technology. If they put everything on the server you'll get almost turn based WoW-like combat with global cooldowns to filter out the lag.
PA are pushing for high action combat and this just has to be done on the client side. Every high action combat game has things firing off at the client side.
Currently only korean games have the balls for it and thus they inject software like gameguard or xigncode3 to monitor your system and make sure you are not toying with things.I'm sure they'll update xign to catch the godmode hack and all will go back to normal.
You'd be surprised how many games are not being because of possibility of unwarranted cheating.
The the HP, energy/mana pools can be validated with ease server side without crushing the servers - this has been done with 16 year old tech back in UO and EQ1 days when the server power and internet latency and connectivity was in stone ages compared to what we have today.
Xignocode no matter how updated will NEVER work because every hack bypasses it and makes xigncode completely useless. That's the problem with 3rd party tools like Gameguard/Hackshield/Xigncode - the ease of bypass is so trivial it's as if they don't even exist.
So the day they update xignode the same hack will be tweaked to bypass it - this has been happening with the the infamous *buddy programs for all major MMOs over the last several years.
Are you comparing the combat of UO/EQ1 with the combat of BDO?
These types of things don't happen in Korea because players must register their number given to them by their Government to play the game. If they hack and get caught they get blacklisted, with no easy fixes like we have by simply changing IP, and getting a new account.
What the actual fuck? Is that really a thing? Wholly shit no wonder they take their games seriously. I would too.
Jesus tits that is crazy to even think about. I thought The Patriot Act and the snooping that ISP are allowed to do were bad. That is bat shit insane.
On-topic: Games are going to be hacked. It's up to the Devs to prevent it.
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
These types of things don't happen in Korea because players must register their number given to them by their Government to play the game. If they hack and get caught they get blacklisted, with no easy fixes like we have by simply changing IP, and getting a new account.
What the actual fuck? Is that really a thing? Wholly shit no wonder they take their games seriously. I would too.
Jesus tits that is crazy to even think about. I thought The Patriot Act and the snooping that ISP are allowed to do were bad. That is bat shit insane.
On-topic: Games are going to be hacked. It's up to the Devs to prevent it.
Yep, that's how it is there. I hope we don't ever see anything like that in the West, but if more of these games start failing due to hacks you can bet it won't be long for game companies to start lobbying for legislation.
It's not a bad game design, It's the limitation of the internet technology. If they put everything on the server you'll get almost turn based WoW-like combat with global cooldowns to filter out the lag.
PA are pushing for high action combat and this just has to be done on the client side. Every high action combat game has things firing off at the client side.
Currently only korean games have the balls for it and thus they inject software like gameguard or xigncode3 to monitor your system and make sure you are not toying with things.I'm sure they'll update xign to catch the godmode hack and all will go back to normal.
You'd be surprised how many games are not being because of possibility of unwarranted cheating.
The the HP, energy/mana pools can be validated with ease server side without crushing the servers - this has been done with 16 year old tech back in UO and EQ1 days when the server power and internet latency and connectivity was in stone ages compared to what we have today.
Xignocode no matter how updated will NEVER work because every hack bypasses it and makes xigncode completely useless. That's the problem with 3rd party tools like Gameguard/Hackshield/Xigncode - the ease of bypass is so trivial it's as if they don't even exist.
So the day they update xignode the same hack will be tweaked to bypass it - this has been happening with the the infamous *buddy programs for all major MMOs over the last several years.
Are you comparing the combat of UO/EQ1 with the combat of BDO?
He is talking about data validation and how it should work on the server side like any competent developer has known for 20 years.
You too could have known he was talking about the tech and not the combat by reading words like validation, technology, server side, internet latency and connectivity.
It's not a bad game design, It's the limitation of the internet technology. If they put everything on the server you'll get almost turn based WoW-like combat with global cooldowns to filter out the lag.
PA are pushing for high action combat and this just has to be done on the client side. Every high action combat game has things firing off at the client side.
Currently only korean games have the balls for it and thus they inject software like gameguard or xigncode3 to monitor your system and make sure you are not toying with things.I'm sure they'll update xign to catch the godmode hack and all will go back to normal.
You'd be surprised how many games are not being because of possibility of unwarranted cheating.
The the HP, energy/mana pools can be validated with ease server side without crushing the servers - this has been done with 16 year old tech back in UO and EQ1 days when the server power and internet latency and connectivity was in stone ages compared to what we have today.
Xignocode no matter how updated will NEVER work because every hack bypasses it and makes xigncode completely useless. That's the problem with 3rd party tools like Gameguard/Hackshield/Xigncode - the ease of bypass is so trivial it's as if they don't even exist.
So the day they update xignode the same hack will be tweaked to bypass it - this has been happening with the the infamous *buddy programs for all major MMOs over the last several years.
Are you comparing the combat of UO/EQ1 with the combat of BDO?
He is talking about data validation and how it should work on the server side like any competent developer has known for 20 years.
You too could have known he was talking about the tech and not the combat by reading words like validation, technology, server side, internet latency and connectivity.
If you validate everything, you get WoW/Lineage2/FFXIV/EQ/UO
If you don't you get more interesting things like Gw2/TESO/BDO
Don't speak as if you know how things work.
The global internet hasn't improved much *LATENCY* wise in the past 10-20 years. We just have wider bandwidth connections which help you exactly 0% in a highly dynamic game. Intercontinental play still warrants at least 120ms ping. Oceania are still fucked up when it comes to online gaming.
Tradeoffs must be made, perhaps BDO went a step too far and they rely on xign to fix their shit. But if they don't do that you can never have as dynamic combat as BDO has.
I mean you can go batshit crazy and validate everything, but the rubberbanding and broken combos you'd get would kill your game faster than any cheat/hack/whatever would
Maybe someday when we learn how to have internet through quantum entanglement we could have nice things, but right now it's nothing more but a wishful thinking and tradeoffs
Comments
Are they?
How long have they been in place in Korea?
And have they been repaired in Korea?
I arest my case....
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I have to wonder about that as well.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
It should be a top rule of game design. Players will exploit what you allow them to exploit.
The sad fact is that traditionally project managers have often given insufficient care regarding these situations.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
guys here is teh deal as long there is a rule some people will break it, only way to prevent thing go wrong is if the adm will use his head and do something about it, or just ignore and milk the max he can, and we know what they will do
Oh it will be the typical "My guild leader got banned; and he didn't do anything, HELP!"
$230 :O not even near that yet. But now I don't feel so bad
Not a very good game to use for an argument against cheating, as much as I love DAoC, it's far from perfect.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Anyway I'm still in that waiting period ( seeing how things go before jumping in) so no, no blinders are needed here. I would say though that for most people not into competitive PVP this will be a non-issue.. Maybe it's that type of player that really doesn't care? To those folks this would be a minimal issue to their experience.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
The technical details on how they do it is one thing but why it has become so widespread in all games is a much more interesting and bigger story.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
I am so good, I backstabbed your face!
Jesus tits that is crazy to even think about. I thought The Patriot Act and the snooping that ISP are allowed to do were bad. That is bat shit insane.
On-topic: Games are going to be hacked. It's up to the Devs to prevent it.
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
You too could have known he was talking about the tech and not the combat by reading words like validation, technology, server side, internet latency and connectivity.
If you don't you get more interesting things like Gw2/TESO/BDO
Don't speak as if you know how things work.
The global internet hasn't improved much *LATENCY* wise in the past 10-20 years. We just have wider bandwidth connections which help you exactly 0% in a highly dynamic game. Intercontinental play still warrants at least 120ms ping. Oceania are still fucked up when it comes to online gaming.
Tradeoffs must be made, perhaps BDO went a step too far and they rely on xign to fix their shit. But if they don't do that you can never have as dynamic combat as BDO has.
I mean you can go batshit crazy and validate everything, but the rubberbanding and broken combos you'd get would kill your game faster than any cheat/hack/whatever would
Maybe someday when we learn how to have internet through quantum entanglement we could have nice things, but right now it's nothing more but a wishful thinking and tradeoffs