Game autopsy...

fatears

I realize it is not quite a cold, dead corpse yet, but it is safe to say that this game never lived up to expectations. 

So my question is, what factor(s) resulted in its fall from grace? Personally I believe it was the result of many poor design choices, but I am offering up some options for a vote, because... polls are entertaining.  Obviously this is not an exhaustive list, and many of you may feel there are other reasons for the lackluster performance, if so please share. 

bartoni33

For me the game just looked too childish with all of the... whatever they were going for.

Actually the first three options in the poll would all be acceptable IMHO. 2-3-1 would be the order of the death blow.

rodingo

I think if they would have streamlined some elements for, and released on, consoles along with going to B2P like ESO did to right their ship then Wildstar would probably be in a little more healthy state.  Alternatively, if they would have put the game out between 2005-2009 they would have probably had a better chance since that seemed to be when the bulk of Western subscription based themeparks were dumped on us.

EDIT: To stick with the the poll though, it's definitely more than one of those issues, and could possibly be almost all of them.  So I couldn't really pick one.

LIOKI

None of the above. The game itself is fun and entertaining to play. It's "mmorpg" players that's the issue.

Horusra

you choices blow when you group stuff.  The flashing backgrounds did me in.  The supposed "childish" graphics is just people's immaturity showing when they believe this.

zaberfangx

The game was taking order from to many wrong type of peoples. So far AMD cpu problem is gone from Wildstar. It's just AMD in general would still have problem catching up to intel. As there no magic to make it as good as intel cpu. Combat was not to bad. But it put a lot people that can't get use to a new type of combat. And the big push trying to get a lot of ex wow raiders was one big down fall a lot of them went back to wow. When people who stay mostly is people that don't raid and not much for them to do.

Over all is a nice game best free to play model that is out there. Just time will tell if it's going get axed soon.

fatears

Horusra said:

you choices blow when you group stuff.  The flashing backgrounds did me in.  The supposed "childish" graphics is just people's immaturity showing when they believe this.

I agree, I actually like the graphics, but I HATED the "look at me" look at me!" attention-whoring flashing text. However, I did feel that cartoony graphics were incongruous with the hardcore label; mainly because I can't imagine a self-identifying hardcore fan enjoying cartoony graphics.  

Octagon7711

fatears said:

Horusra said:

you choices blow when you group stuff.  The flashing backgrounds did me in.  The supposed "childish" graphics is just people's immaturity showing when they believe this.

I agree, I actually like the graphics, but I HATED the "look at me" look at me!" attention-whoring flashing text. However, I did feel that cartoony graphics were incongruous with the hardcore label; mainly because I can't imagine a self-identifying hardcore fan enjoying cartoony graphics.  

Even the marketing was cartoony and mentioned nothing about hardcore, so the marketing was off and wouldn't attract hardcore players.

I liked the graphics but found the progression to slow for this game.

zaberfangx

One more thing I seen a lot people talk about cartoony Graphics but the market still sell well for it. Like Overwatch with it's own cartoony look and it works fine with the 10 mil they sold and still going even wow still looks cartoony and that still going. Graphics is fine that's was the the problem with the game, look how good BDO looks people drop off from that a bit. Graphics is not everything.

viletot0

I enjoyed the game honestly, i liked most of what it offered but I couldn't get past the feeling that I was playing an arcade game instead of an MMO.  i think a lot of factors played into that.  

Dullahan

I can't say for sure, but if I was to venture a guess it was the focus on the "hardcore" label.

It was claimed that this was the game that would bring back what everyone loved about vanilla WoW, but it did not look to achieve this. Not only was the combat off, but vanilla WoW was not a hardcore focused game. Most of the content was by and large fun group oriented questing, grinding and dungeon running. Yes, it had hardcore raiding, but that was NOT the primary focus.

I feel like that is where they missed the mark.

observer

I'd have to say the cartoon art style.  It would've been better if it was stylized to reflect more realism, with less exaggerated features.  The MMO playerbase is averaged around ages 28-30 i think.

zaberfangx

Dullahan said:

I can't say for sure, but if I was to venture a guess it was the focus on the "hardcore" label.

It was claimed that this was the game that would bring back what everyone loved about vanilla WoW, but it did not look to achieve this. Not only was the combat off, but vanilla WoW was not a hardcore focused game. Most of the content was by and large fun group oriented questing, grinding and dungeon running. Yes, it had hardcore raiding, but that was NOT the primary focus.

I feel like that is where they missed the mark.

A lot MMO try to push same idea of Vanilla WoW. Is not like they miss the mark. What people say they want never really want when it's out. Even Blizzard avoiding going back Vanilla like as they seen in the market when a other MMO try it people hate it. I know there was a emulator of wow Vanilla did have a lot people but was only a small % that played it from the real game. Is the same % of any other mmo thats is out there if there was emulator server.

k61977

I saw the biggest mass exodus when people started hitting the grinds to even be able to do the 40 man content.  An then when they made it to the actual raids they complained and left again because of the time spent just getting everyone together to do them.

Overall I enjoy the game play but will never again do anything over 10 man or 5 man content.  10 man even pushes it for me anymore.  Don't have the time to wait around for other people to decide it is time for them to get started.  Its probably more of aging issues or just getting older.

I am one of the few that actually likes the cartoony feel of the game.  I enjoy the relaxed humor as it is a game for me not a real life sim.

Dullahan

zaberfangx said:

Dullahan said:

I can't say for sure, but if I was to venture a guess it was the focus on the "hardcore" label.

It was claimed that this was the game that would bring back what everyone loved about vanilla WoW, but it did not look to achieve this. Not only was the combat off, but vanilla WoW was not a hardcore focused game. Most of the content was by and large fun group oriented questing, grinding and dungeon running. Yes, it had hardcore raiding, but that was NOT the primary focus.

I feel like that is where they missed the mark.

A lot MMO try to push same idea of Vanilla WoW. Is not like they miss the mark. What people say they want never really want when it's out. Even Blizzard avoiding going back Vanilla like as they seen in the market when a other MMO try it people hate it. I know there was a emulator of wow Vanilla did have a lot people but was only a small % that played it from the real game. Is the same % of any other mmo thats is out there if there was emulator server.

But they did miss the mark. The only thing like vanilla WoW that Wildstar achieved was the harder aspect of endgame. That is not what made v-wow so appealing to the average player.

svandy

MMORPG fan base was the issue, not the game.

Xarko

The game has like billion problems, but one of the bigger ones in my opinion  was the game has literally 0 atmosphere and immersion. Anytime I tried it, I felt like Im playing arcade platformer.

zaberfangx

Dullahan said:

zaberfangx said:

Dullahan said:

I can't say for sure, but if I was to venture a guess it was the focus on the "hardcore" label.

It was claimed that this was the game that would bring back what everyone loved about vanilla WoW, but it did not look to achieve this. Not only was the combat off, but vanilla WoW was not a hardcore focused game. Most of the content was by and large fun group oriented questing, grinding and dungeon running. Yes, it had hardcore raiding, but that was NOT the primary focus.

I feel like that is where they missed the mark.

A lot MMO try to push same idea of Vanilla WoW. Is not like they miss the mark. What people say they want never really want when it's out. Even Blizzard avoiding going back Vanilla like as they seen in the market when a other MMO try it people hate it. I know there was a emulator of wow Vanilla did have a lot people but was only a small % that played it from the real game. Is the same % of any other mmo thats is out there if there was emulator server.

But they did miss the mark. The only thing like vanilla WoW that Wildstar achieved was the harder aspect of endgame. That is not what made v-wow so appealing to the average player.

If 100% copying WoW then yes they did miss the Mark. But on the grouping and making thing that you need people to talk to each other. Just to get to endgame as they didn't miss the mark there. In what people want more of Vanilla is the social part more. And the endgame dungeon was more pushing for people to talk more with each other and plan the next move or work with each other on some stuns so don't kill the group. Hell even slow leveling was in play and I keep hearing people hate it when other mmo makes leveling to easy but that slow leveling kills off new players when after 30 then the game was all about faction and endgame.

It's just going back in time trying to use a old system was it was new at the time does not work this age of time. When there are better system out there for everyone to enjoy it with out leaving anyone out.

When I see a MMO push for more endgame idea for the few then people start dropping off like from the game. Pushing more ideas what Vanilla was great back then does not work to well in the long run seem to be death to a MMO when they push any Vanilla ideas then pushing there own and let everyone be part of it. That was Vanilla was more of endgame part of it. Just like wildstar when it started not much outside out of raids or dungeons or dancing night elf on the mail box lol.

And you right does not give a appealing to the average wow player.

Quizzical

The biggest factors to me are two that aren't on your list:

1)  A bizarre control scheme that made it feel like you were fighting more against wonky controls than the mobs that were your nominal opponents.  How did someone decide it was a good idea that the same keys could be either strafe or turn, depending on how long it has been since you last attacked?

2)  A frequent reliance on help from other players for no good reason in an abandoned game world where the other players you need help from simply don't exist.

reeereee

Octagon7711 said:

fatears said:

Horusra said:

you choices blow when you group stuff.  The flashing backgrounds did me in.  The supposed "childish" graphics is just people's immaturity showing when they believe this.

I agree, I actually like the graphics, but I HATED the "look at me" look at me!" attention-whoring flashing text. However, I did feel that cartoony graphics were incongruous with the hardcore label; mainly because I can't imagine a self-identifying hardcore fan enjoying cartoony graphics.  

Even the marketing was cartoony and mentioned nothing about hardcore, so the marketing was off and wouldn't attract hardcore players.

I liked the graphics but found the progression to slow for this game.

Exactly, the elements all worked against each other.  The graphics and combat were practically designed to turn off the hardcore crowd but the entire endgame was built around hardcore.  So the people who would enjoy the graphics or combat enough to get to endgame hated what was waiting here.

Wildstar had absolutely no sense of it's target audience.  It was like every element was designed to annoy people who would enjoy the other elements of the game to craft something truly no one wanted.

Xeno.phon

The game does have some decent systems, and great housing. Though imo it really isnt orientated towards hardcore or adult anything. It is almost like the threw in some bleeped out F bombs and called it 18+ or something.

During my 2 weeks of play I kept having the feeling that a Disney add was going to pop up, or a commercial for some new kids cartoon. Also the combat is just not hard. In todays world this style of movement and positional based combat is not new, people that have played one can play them all really.

The classes were VERY meh as welll, imo. I am currently playing Skyforge and honestly loving it. It has very similar combat to wildstar, but the graphics are amazing and realism based, not cartoon. Due to the combo based combat, mixed with the positional combat you have to really pay attention to timing of enemies, your own combos and all positions in relation to the fight. Instead of just position and cooldowns like wildstar. Just one more step, yes, but it makes all the difference imo.

I hope wildstar succeeds, its not a bad game honestly. Its just not a good game either, imo.

Phry

I picked the cartoony graphics as i felt they were one of the most applicable as to why i didn't like it, although i would have to add the combat mechanics too, but they were just two of several factors as to why i think this game did so badly, but when you look at the list to choose from, it kind of highlights why the game is a failure, its a long list to choose from, i think if the OP was to put in a 'all of the above' option between the 'problems' and the 'the games okay' bit, it would probably gain most, if not all of the votes, and chances are people would still come up with more reasons why it didn't succeed.

Koboli

I never got to the endgame because the world design was so poor and dull. Wildstar is, at its heart, too sarcastic and flippant to be taken seriously. I get that they were trying to inspire this kind of 'carefree, wild west' universe, but it's like watching Jimmy Fallon on SNL - when you're giddy and laughing constantly at your own jokes, there's no room for the audience to giggle with you... much less experience any impact (mirthful or otherwise) from the skit itself.

SoloAnything

I was called names and insulted before release when I tried beta as I clearly said the game sucks and will die very quickly. Well my 13 years of mmorpg experience proved me right and all the so called white knights which now troll the game wrong. Biggest among the white knight trolls was someone that wrote in green letters and had a dumb ass avatar don't recall his name.

Jacobin

The raid keying process was a disaster.

The raids were a disaster.

BGs were decent but only had 2 maps, one of which was terrible.

Arenas were a complete joke due to win trading, sync queuing and balance problems.

PvP itemization was an absolute disaster.
- Accessories had massively OP procs
- Skill augments that were mega rare were absolutely essential to the class' balance meaning you were gimped until you got that aug (trigger fingers)
- T2 and T3 pvp gear was insanely powerful meaning that people who rushed gear would crush noobs. Noobs were forced to fight these people since the MMR was terrible which caused the pvp population to drop which made the MMR even worse.

Warplots were terrible and broken. One of the biggest wastes of development resources ever seen in an MMO.

Volgore

The poll is missing the most important choice:

[x] Carbine