If MMORPG.com integrity matters to you...

Kopogero

...you would push for a change, a better change of course. Things are good, but they can always be better about anything as there is always space for evolution. Can we have a more active community here? Absolutely. Can we have a better, more honest and accurate "ranking" system in place? Absolutely. I'll explain at the end of this post how exactly we can make this community better for our own benefit.

I haven't been paying attention until lately but I realized that I only have what 291 points on this site, and honestly how do we determine and truly know if someone is a high quality poster, a useful part of this community and simply someone we would like to see continue being part of it or not?

When I find things "dull" I always prefer to discuss about things that I find interesting, regardless how controversial they might be. Just like as a gamer who's been in every possible environment from being the most disliked, hated, to the most respected and appreciated I approach these forums as I've approached every game and at the end I do prefer to be part of some conflict, to have some "kids" or "n00bs" that usually don't know who exactly they are dealing with to oppose me. So, they will do their cussing and grouping and whatever ganking they can do. They will simply do best from what God has given to them and at the end they will either retire or learn to put some respect, especially if they realize that their methods, their vision, their plans and ways of thinking is not helping them to overcome and bent my will, which is best demonstrated with action and performance.

Most of us want a good challenge, good opponents and that's what makes many games far more enjoyable. Many already are very familiar with me here and clearly have hate grudge, and because they usually can't out "duel" me with logical arguments and facts they just try to get my rating as low as possible by tagging every post I make with "LOL", "LOL", "LOL".

Truth is if I indeed wanted to have a "purple" name on this site, and very high rating I would've had that, but at what cost? At losing my ability to be honest about every single subject, game being discussed around here. Losing my ability to talk about things that matter to me. Example: many already here know I am one of the few who managed to enjoy gaming as much as I have in the last 26+ years, while also I've not come across a new game I've found interesting enough to spend $ on since January 11th, 2011. So, naturally many here dislike me for not spending $ or posting only "positive" feedback about the game they are enjoying.

I like honesty before everything else and I like to see the community here to feel more free to discuss about the things that matter to them and be fully open about how they feel, regardless if they will earn some "haters" here who will continuously flag every single post afterwards" with "LOL" and lower their rating in the process. I've actually seen the same type of ranking and forum format in a game I've been playing "Marvel Heroes Online" and you can go and check it out there, it's exactly the same. So, I dunno if the staff here can actually do something about the ranking or not, but bottom line if you actually want to promote some freedom of speech and honesty around here, make sure you use the ranking system to the best you possible can. After all those who can't argue with you with logic, will be the ones who will just flag your posts with "LOL", "LOL", "LOL" and guess what, if they actually bother enough to do that it only means they care about their own rating even more than you, so you remember that and do the same for those individuals.

I must admit I've had only few posts here that I've tagged as awesome, insightful, agree or lol out of hundreds I've read because that just shows how much I actually cared about the whole ranking system, but at the end if this is the only ranking system available we got I'll use it in the best way possible to see the actual posters that contribute, at the end regardless if I agree with them or not, as long as they contribute, and more importantly replay to my posts to get the credit they deserve, and that's just one step forward to push for a better change and a better, more honest community here.

I do realize and I'm wise enough to acknowledge that regardless of how many different views we have (which we should since people should be different), we are what makes this community, regardless how small it might be. It's us vs everything else out there and more importantly we all have one thing in common that we should be all proud and value within each other and that is our love toward this MMORPG genre.

Distopia

LOL's don't hurt your score...

Koboli

I don't pay any attention to my rankings. Either people are going to read what I say and agree, or they're not. The substance is in what you post, not some nebulous statistics associated with your account.

Realizer

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

Edit: It seems to me, that this site relies on money via advertisements from the very studios you refuse to contribute to. If anything your agenda is making the growth of MMORPG.com take longer. 

Koboli

Realizer said:

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

The key is to not duel at all. I used to fall into that trap constantly when I was younger, but I've come to realize a simple truth as I age: you aren't changing any minds on the internet. It doesn't matter if you're right; it doesn't matter if the other person is a screaming imbecile - they're set in their ways, and so (more than likely) are you. People can be overawed, swayed, brainwashed and intimidated IRL... but it doesn't work on here.

Once you reach that inescapable conclusion, it's a little like ringing a bell in some kind of zen, Buddhist shrine after a long ascent up a lonely Himilayan peak. There's no winning on forums - only losing. And the only way to lose is to engage.

Forgrimm

Kopogero said:

...Many already are very familiar with me here and clearly have hate grudge...

Probably has something to do with the fact that you literally post the same exact thing again and again and again and again and again...It gets old after a while.

Quizzical

I have an assignment for you.  I want you to run an ordinary least squares linear regression.  The y-axis should be someone's score, while x-variables should be his number of insightfuls, agrees, awesomes, and LOLs received.  Get data on 20 or so players with a lot of posts and blue or purple names, but filter out any that have at least 1k of any particular button type, as those don't show you exact numbers.  Come back and report the coefficients you find.

Realizer

Koboli said:

Realizer said:

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

The key is to not duel at all. I used to fall into that trap constantly when I was younger, but I've come to realize a simple truth as I age: you aren't changing any minds on the internet. It doesn't matter if you're right; it doesn't matter if the other person is a screaming imbecile - they're set in their ways, and so (more than likely) are you. People can be overawed, swayed, brainwashed and intimidated IRL... but it doesn't work on here.

Once you reach that inescapable conclusion, it's a little like ringing a bell in some kind of zen, Buddhist shrine after a long ascent up a lonely Himilayan peak. There's no winning on forums - only losing. And the only way to lose is to engage.

 That's not entirely true either, I've seen many posters here come into a thread with limited information, and by time the thread is over they have changed their perspectives because of new information. On the other hand this forums "active" community is smaller so it's easier to know what to expect from certain posters. 

 Everything brings a balance, without different opinions flowing there wouldn't be anything to keep these threads going. The key is separating the emotional responses from logical ones, and having fun. 

Koboli

Quizzical said:

I have an assignment for you.  I want you to run an ordinary least squares linear regression.  The y-axis should be someone's score, while x-variables should be his number of insightfuls, agrees, awesomes, and LOLs received.  Get data on 20 or so players with a lot of posts and blue or purple names, but filter out any that have at least 1k of any particular button type, as those don't show you exact numbers.  Come back and report the coefficients you find.

I realize you posted this ironically, but.........

Koboli

Realizer said:

Koboli said:

Realizer said:

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

The key is to not duel at all. I used to fall into that trap constantly when I was younger, but I've come to realize a simple truth as I age: you aren't changing any minds on the internet. It doesn't matter if you're right; it doesn't matter if the other person is a screaming imbecile - they're set in their ways, and so (more than likely) are you. People can be overawed, swayed, brainwashed and intimidated IRL... but it doesn't work on here.

Once you reach that inescapable conclusion, it's a little like ringing a bell in some kind of zen, Buddhist shrine after a long ascent up a lonely Himilayan peak. There's no winning on forums - only losing. And the only way to lose is to engage.

 That's not entirely true either, I've seen many posters here come into a thread with limited information, and by time the thread is over they have changed their perspectives because of new information. On the other hand this forums "active" community is smaller so it's easier to know what to expect from certain posters. 

 Everything brings a balance, without different opinions flowing there wouldn't be anything to keep these threads going. The key is separating the emotional responses from logical ones, and having fun. 

That's not forum dueling, though. Becoming informed or learning something isn't the same thing as a pitfight between two or more posters sniping at each other. A lot of the longer threads on this website are driven by precisely that kind of back-and-forth -- hardly a day goes by when one such battle isn't occupying top billing on the recent posts ticker. 

Kopogero

Realizer said:

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

Edit: It seems to me, that this site relies on money via advertisements from the very studios you refuse to contribute to. If anything your agenda is making the growth of MMORPG.com take longer. 

@Realizer many like you dislike "freeloaders" but freeloaders are not the issue if the game decided to be free to play in first place. I'm not riding the backs of anyone. I'm playing a product that's free to play and that is exactly that. If the product wasn't free to play I wouldn't be playing it, I would be playing some other free to play product, it's that simple.

In fact the fact I'm using my most precious resource I have, my free time to bother installing that game and be part of it and more importantly one day mention it to communities like this is doing far more for the game than not being part of it at all.

Finally, sorry but this site relies on money via ads from those who can afford the ads more than their competitors to control the ad space for a period of time and this site, this growth of MMORPG.com relies on ads as much as it relies on us, the community to come and visit this site and click on some of its ads.

I care about the staff and their sponsors as much as they care about me. At the end nobody is paying me for being part of this site and contributing to it, yet you don't see me doing any complaining or having some demands or expectations. If the staff here is not receiving the revenue they would like like every other business they need to evolve or move to a career that they are more useful to society to get the $ they need.

It's not my fault if no one new business, product was successful in opening my wallet. As every business they will always prefer delivering you whatever product they can that requires less time and effort on their part. As long as you are buying it they would have no reason to deliver you something better.

Realizer

Koboli said:

Realizer said:

Koboli said:

Realizer said:

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

The key is to not duel at all. I used to fall into that trap constantly when I was younger, but I've come to realize a simple truth as I age: you aren't changing any minds on the internet. It doesn't matter if you're right; it doesn't matter if the other person is a screaming imbecile - they're set in their ways, and so (more than likely) are you. People can be overawed, swayed, brainwashed and intimidated IRL... but it doesn't work on here.

Once you reach that inescapable conclusion, it's a little like ringing a bell in some kind of zen, Buddhist shrine after a long ascent up a lonely Himilayan peak. There's no winning on forums - only losing. And the only way to lose is to engage.

 That's not entirely true either, I've seen many posters here come into a thread with limited information, and by time the thread is over they have changed their perspectives because of new information. On the other hand this forums "active" community is smaller so it's easier to know what to expect from certain posters. 

 Everything brings a balance, without different opinions flowing there wouldn't be anything to keep these threads going. The key is separating the emotional responses from logical ones, and having fun. 

That's not forum dueling, though. Becoming informed or learning something isn't the same thing as a pitfight between two or more posters sniping at each other. A lot of the longer threads on this website are driven by precisely that kind of back-and-forth -- hardly a day goes by when one such battle isn't occupying top billing on the recent posts ticker. 

 The beauty of life, in it's most natural form. A good old rumble in the forum jungle, they are good for the community growth and sales of popcorn world wide. The LOL button is what separates us from the beasts. It's all fun and games till someone uses the report function, then we mourn the fallen and hope we make it out with our usernames intact. 

 I think it's mostly harmless fun as long as it doesn't get heated to the meathead personal threats, and lawsuits level. Public information should be fair game. 

Realizer

Kopogero said:

Realizer said:

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

Edit: It seems to me, that this site relies on money via advertisements from the very studios you refuse to contribute to. If anything your agenda is making the growth of MMORPG.com take longer. 

@Realizer many like you dislike "freeloaders" but freeloaders are not the issue if the game decided to be free to play in first place. I'm not riding the backs of anyone. I'm playing a product that's free to play and that is exactly that. If the product wasn't free to play I wouldn't be playing it, I would be playing some other free to play product, it's that simple.

In fact the fact I'm using my most precious resource I have, my free time to bother installing that game and be part of it and more importantly one day mention it to communities like this is doing far more for the game than not being part of it at all.

Finally, sorry but this site relies on money via ads from those who can afford the ads more than their competitors to control the ad space for a period of time and this site, this growth of MMORPG.com relies on ads as much as it relies on us, the community to come and visit this site and click on some of its ads.

I care about the staff and their sponsors as much as they care about me. At the end nobody is paying me for being part of this site and contributing to it, yet you don't see me doing any complaining or having some demands or expectations. If the staff here is not receiving the revenue they would like like every other business they need to evolve or move to a career that they are more useful to society to get the $ they need.

It's not my fault if no one new business, product was successful in opening my wallet. As every business they will always prefer delivering you whatever product they can that requires less time and effort on their part. As long as you are buying it they would have no reason to deliver you something better.

 You installing and using your free time in a game world doesn't put food on the developers tables, which is the whole reason for having a job in the first place. Game companies aren't making products for the namesake, they are trying to make money. Just because the game is called "free to play" doesn't mean they don't need money to continue it's availability and progress. 

 Edit: That is of course unless you want to see your future games interrupting you during raids with targeted advertisements for Dishwasher fluid, and Pizza Delivery. Also, you aren't the only special snowflake who doesn't get paid to spend their time here. I don't either, so insinuating because you choose to loiter without spending, somehow equates you to a paying customer is a fallacy at best.

Kyleran

Forgrimm said:

Kopogero said:

...Many already are very familiar with me here and clearly have hate grudge...

Probably has something to do with the fact that you literally post the same exact thing again and again and again and again and again...It gets old after a while.

Nailed it. You can be controversial and still receive a ton of points as long as you are interesting and appear informed.

Distopia

@Kopogero do you not see the arrogance presented in your post? It's oozing from it. 

From the "you don't know who you're dealing with" " no one can verbally spar with me" to the "I'm the only honest person here"... That is essentially a self defeatist path to take, you're beating yourself with such dishonesty. Hence why you get (LOLs)...

What you don't seem to realize is there is no winning these arguments, your feelings on the genre are framed in opinion, as are everyone else's. More people simply agree with the opinions others present over yours. Getting passive aggressive over others attaining "purple" status before you (which that's what this is in a nutshell), is just ugly...

Most of those who are "Blue" or "purple" don't post any differently now than they did when such points/rankings didn't even exist. @Torval, @Blueturtle, @DmKano, @Kyleran , etc are not pandering to anyone now, their posts are the same as always... Sorry they're faring better under this system...



 

Kopogero

@Realizer if game companies believed their product is good enough to warrant a fee to access it they wouldn't be releasing it as free, especially as you put it if they are doing it to try to make money. There is a reason why free products are dominating even in this genre recently. They clearly are a vital strategy for producers to earn money.

I as many others here have clearly made a statement we can afford and would gladly spend even $25+ monthly for a product that we see as the clear best option compared to every other we have available. Again, it's not my fault if the product I've tried could not keep me entertained enough to stick around and spend $ on.

Free to play products relay mainly on donations and whales. Those who spend are happy enough with those products. Those who spend also vote what happens and should happen to those products. Free to play products are just an extension of a trial where the players decide how much they truly enjoy that game to quit it, stick around longer or play it and spend $ in the process if they are very satisfied with what it offers.

Realizer

Kopogero said:

@Realizer if game companies believed their product is good enough to warrant a fee to access it they wouldn't be releasing it as free, especially as you put it if they are doing it to try to make money. There is a reason why free products are dominating even in this genre recently. They clearly are a vital strategy for producers to earn money.

I as many others here have clearly made a statement we can afford and would gladly spend even $25+ monthly for a product that we see as the clear best option compared to every other we have available. Again, it's not my fault if the product I've tried could not keep me entertained enough to stick around and spend $ on.

Free to play products relay mainly on donations and whales. Those who spend are happy enough with those products. Those who spend also vote what happens and should happen to those products. Free to play products are just an extension of a trial where the players decide how much they truly enjoy that game to quit it, stick around longer or play it and spend $ in the process if they are very satisfied with what it offers.

 As much as I'd love to beat this dead horse with you, I think everything that needed to be said in this thread has already been posted. Next time you go looking for a job, I hope the employer pays you only only after revenue has been amassed for your work. Maybe then you'll understand the value of it, and understand that if you're playing a free to play game, without ever spending money; you can't expect to have the same experience as a person putting food on the table. 

Octagon7711

It's all about fun and enjoyment.  I actually enjoy myself more with F2P games at the moment.

Kopogero

Forgrimm said:

Kopogero said:

...Many already are very familiar with me here and clearly have hate grudge...

Probably has something to do with the fact that you literally post the same exact thing again and again and again and again and again...It gets old after a while.

Again, opinions, which you are entitled to. You see things as the same while I see things different. Maeby you are missing the small things, the details where things actually do separate and if you indeed believe this is the case then I dare you to post here two exact threads with the exact same meaning, subject that I've opened in the last 1-2 months. Please, do that and your statement will actually be productive, otherwise you are just one of the many who come on these forums to "bait" OP's on whatever subject they are interested to discuss about.

At the end tell me Forgrimm, how hard it is for me to go on every single thread you make and do the exact you just did? It takes no skills to come to OP's and just post "you have no idea about what you are talking" or "this is more of the same".

Finally, your 20 posts vs every single subject shows your 5% participation. At the end forums do require "threads" before the community can discuss about something and at end of the day even if there were similar, but interesting threads happening I would take that all day over no threads at all to discuss about anything.

Dullahan

Koboli said:

Realizer said:

 Not sure about that @Kopogero I've seen you get "out dueled verbally" many times. Usually in threads where you are talking about how you are at the forefront of pushing the genre into the future, by refusing to spend money on products you enjoy the privilege of playing at little or no cost. All while riding the backs of paying customers.  

The key is to not duel at all. I used to fall into that trap constantly when I was younger, but I've come to realize a simple truth as I age: you aren't changing any minds on the internet. It doesn't matter if you're right; it doesn't matter if the other person is a screaming imbecile - they're set in their ways, and so (more than likely) are you. People can be overawed, swayed, brainwashed and intimidated IRL... but it doesn't work on here.

Once you reach that inescapable conclusion, it's a little like ringing a bell in some kind of zen, Buddhist shrine after a long ascent up a lonely Himilayan peak. There's no winning on forums - only losing. And the only way to lose is to engage.

By not dueling at all, you allow people to spread lies and misinformation. The internet was great back in the 90s when conversations were cordial and people were simply interested in exchanging ideas and rational debate, but this is 2016 and that is no longer what takes place.

Now, most of the people going from thread to thread arguing are mostly there to argue. They are smart enough not to blatantly troll, but trolling is what they're here for regardless. As such, they come with enough circular reasoning, circumstantial evidence, and straw man arguments to confuse the average passerby. Without someone to actually bring some real information and objectivity, you'd be left with nothing but a bunch of bored kids that are more than happy to shitpost all day and listen to the sound of their own voice.

So you don't argue for the sake of convincing them, its for the sake of having well informed and rational discussions.

Realizer

Kopogero said:

Forgrimm said:

Kopogero said:

...Many already are very familiar with me here and clearly have hate grudge...

Probably has something to do with the fact that you literally post the same exact thing again and again and again and again and again...It gets old after a while.

Again, opinions, which you are entitled to. You see things as the same while I see things different. Maeby you are missing the small things, the details where things actually do separate and if you indeed believe this is the case then I dare you to post here two exact threads with the exact same meaning, subject that I've opened in the last 1-2 months. Please, do that and your statement will actually be productive, otherwise you are just one of the many who come on these forums to "bait" OP's on whatever subject they are interested to discuss about.

At the end tell me Forgrimm, how hard it is for me to go on every single thread you make and do the exact you just did? It takes no skills to come to OP's and just post "you have no idea about what you are talking" or "this is more of the same".

Finally, your 20 posts vs every single subject shows your 5% participation. At the end forums do require "threads" before the community can discuss about something and at end of the day even if there were similar, but interesting threads happening I would take that all day over no threads at all to discuss about anything.

 Nice to know we're the ones with the problem, while you retain your self perceived "above the rest" mentality. Once again proving the points above. 

[Deleted User]

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Kopogero

Distopia said:

@Kopogero do you not see the arrogance presented in your post? It's oozing from it. 

From the "you don't know who you're dealing with" " no one can verbally spar with me" to the "I'm the only honest person here"... That is essentially a self defeatist path to take, you're beating yourself with such dishonesty. Hence why you get (LOLs)...

What you don't seem to realize is there is no winning these arguments, your feelings on the genre are framed in opinion, as are everyone else's. More people simply agree with the opinions others present over yours. Getting passive aggressive over others attaining "purple" status before you (which that's what this is in a nutshell), is just ugly...

Most of those who are "Blue" or "purple" don't post any differently now than they did when such points/rankings didn't even exist. @Torval, @Blueturtle, @DmKano, @Kyleran , etc are not pandering to anyone now, their posts are the same as always... Sorry they're faring better under this system...



 

Distopia, and thus if you knew better that calling a poster around here "arrogant" is deemed insult and one worthy to be flagged for trolling, which would indeed put your account in danger. Now I'm telling you this, where I could've easily not and just flagged because that's how I would "win" vs you if that was my purpose.

Then you continue to completely mislabel and misplace my structure with phrases that are no where to be seen in my original post for no other attempt but to discredit me because again that is your purpose because it makes you feel better about yourself when you are in a "duel" vs someone like me.

At the end, again you are saying that "most here" as you already have an opinion about this community that their opinions present over mines, and further insulting me as someone who is "passive aggressive" like I actually some issue with individuals like you who have a different color because someone choose out there to give them that color over me for instance.

You earlier stated that "LOL"s don't make difference in your ranking, yet then somehow some individuals here if there was different system of ranking, maeby by post count, I dunno with far fewer posts than me somehow have double or more my points. Bottom line, whatever type of ranking this site has and whatever way its using it, clearly isn't accurate in my opinion. I would personally preferred if there was no ranking at all, in that way no one would have any reason to feel less than someone else, but that's what MMORPG.com staff wants to promote and that's their choices and if I was in their place if I was indeed interested to run such ranking system, I would make it more clear and more accurate than what currently is.

VengeSunsoar

LOL.

This thread was another typical kopo post. Only worthy of that.

bcbully

Git Gud n00b

Thorkune

I get a kick out of the folks on the site that have a purple name and have only been members for months. They are the same ones that race to end game when playing mmo's and have nothing to do and complain about it afterward. Like in game, it will probably take me years to get purple because I don't care about racing to the finish. I enjoy the ride...