At this point, the basic plan, once I get back to messing with my newer computer is:
1) Pull the CMOS battery to reset the BIOS and see if that fixes anything. 2) Unplug and reset power cables at both ends. Also unplug the SSD entirely and see if it can at least POST. 3) Start swapping components so that I can verify that at least some components are known to be good.
But I don't want to fuss with all of that immediately after getting home from work. I'll get to it sometime this weekend.
If the motherboard is dead and the new computer is going to be out of commission for a while, I could at least move the power supply and video card to my old computer. Then I'd be able to plug in my good monitors and have a decent enough computer in the meantime. A Core i7-860 is rather dated by now, but still not that bad.
We will be holding funeral services for Quizz's computer later tonight livestream on mmorpg.com. Our director will be some random guy wearing a priest collar and a turban.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
As a windows server / VSphere systems administrator for nearly 14 years now, every single time I've had an issue with machines not posting, it has been a motherboard issue.
In fact, I just got a server back last week that wouldn't post and the technicians who repaired it under warranty swapped the motherboard and now it works. I replaced the exact same model of server about a year ago under the same circumstances. No post, replaced motherboard, everything works.
EDIT: Also, when I finally broke down and updated to Windows 10 despite all of my reservations, I did not do the upgrade route. I backed up all of my data, downloaded a free and legal copy from MS and installed it fresh, then reinstalled all of my apps. One things I've learned over the years is that Windows upgrades, especially for clients and home PC's is finicky as shit.
As a Dell field tech most of the repairs I made were in this order for frequency; laptop motherboards, desktop motherboards, desktop PSUs, laptop LCDs, desktop CPU fans.
The CPU fans were mostly for a specific small form factor model that used squirrel cage type fans. Power buttons were never diagnosed during the client's phone calls to Dell. Power buttons were the least frequent repair and usually meant spending 30 minutes on the phone convincing their L1 tech that I knew what the fuck I was doing.
"I used to think the worst thing in life was to be all alone. It's not. The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel all alone." Robin Williams
Some people have brought up the power supply as a potential issue. That's possible, though the Seasonic Snow Silent I have was arguably the best consumer power supply on the market when I bought it. Even the best power supplies can fail, of course, which is why the really mission-critical stuff goes for redundant power supplies, in addition to high quality. One would hope that it's less likely than if I had bought some cheap power supply. Regardless, it's possible to test by swapping it out.
I'm leery of trying to power a Fury X with the 7 year old 525 W power supply in my old computer, though seeing if it boots into Windows should be safe. A stress test would be a bad idea. It would probably be fine, but it's a dumb risk to take. That's why if the motherboard is the culprit, I was planning on moving both the power supply and video card together into the old computer.
The meanings of various codes varies by BIOS. Your own link says that, too. According to the list in MSI's manual for my particular motherboard, 10 doesn't mean anything.
Well, thare are basically 3 kinds of bios, AMI bios, Award and Phoenix (or so I learned when I read networking). Those 3 have different codes and certain manufacturers also get custom stuff in their BIOS (like Alienware). The code I listed is by far the most common. And Phoenix is BTW the superior but also the most expensive, it is unlikely MSI have it but not impossible.
MSI would have gotten their code from one of those 3 and even if they havn't placed a custom code for code 10 there is obviously something there. Doesn't really matter, the Bios usually just report the first error and if the entire card is messed up you would have a bunch of more errors as well you can't see.
If the PSU is messing and not giving enough power it would also report the first thing not getting enough power (starting with the PSU followed by ram).
And yeah, I could have written all that to add to my already long post. Anyways, I give 90% Motherboard, 9% CPU (including cables & contacts) and 1% something else (ram of GFX card). CPU is extremely unlikely since you would get a beeping sound from that.
At this point, the basic plan, once I get back to messing with my newer computer is:
1) Pull the CMOS battery to reset the BIOS and see if that fixes anything. 2) Unplug and reset power cables at both ends. Also unplug the SSD entirely and see if it can at least POST. 3) Start swapping components so that I can verify that at least some components are known to be good.
But I don't want to fuss with all of that immediately after getting home from work. I'll get to it sometime this weekend.
If the motherboard is dead and the new computer is going to be out of commission for a while, I could at least move the power supply and video card to my old computer. Then I'd be able to plug in my good monitors and have a decent enough computer in the meantime. A Core i7-860 is rather dated by now, but still not that bad.
Your card probably have a jumper to reset the CMOs as well but pulling the battery should work just fine.
And yeah, start pulling off all things you don't need to get into the Bios. Everything.
Personally I would after that try the old PSU first with the same barebone setting before switching any more components, taking the PSU off the suspect list is a huge step.
If your worried about frying the Fury with the old PSU, just pull it out and let it post on iGPU.
I do tend to agree, the issue is probably the motherboard, but I would put the known working PSU in the culprit computer just as a cross check before I put a potentially culprit PSU into an otherwise known working computer.
The motherboard is dead. BIOS failures or electrical failure may make you wonder, but mechanical failures don't. A PCI Express slot is no longer physically attached to the motherboard. When I tried to remove the video card, the PCI Express slot stuck more firmly to the video card than to the motherboard. Yes, I'm aware of the locking mechanism and released it.
The good news is that the power supply, video card, and memory all work. I've got them in my old computer and am posting this from it now. I wasn't sure if the memory would work, as 8 GB DDR3 modules didn't exist when the motherboard came out, but it works and it recognizes all 16 GB.
It's unlikely that I'll ever buy or recommend a Corsair case again. When I built my Windows 10 computer, I spent more than I had previously for what I expected to be a nicer $100 case from Corsair. It seemed harder to assemble than I had recalled from smaller, cheaper Antec and Cooler Master cases in the past. When moving components around between the Corsair Carbide 400R and Antec 300 Illusion cases, it was a much more direct comparison, and a huge difference.
Objectively, the Corsair case is 23% larger than the Antec case by volume as measured on the outside, as it's both taller and deeper, while the two cases are the same width. But the Corsair case sure feels smaller on the inside, as it feels like stuff is just laid out poorly. In the Corsair case, it was a major pain to figure out what to do with the Fury X radiator. In the Antec case, just stick it in place of a case fan and done. The screw holes to secure the video card lined up right on the Antec case and not the Corsair case. When trying to turn those screws, the Antec case gave a clear path for the screwdriver and the Corsair case made you turn it at an awkward angle.
The next question is what to do now. I could try to send the motherboard in for warranty service, but I'm not sure what MSI would say about the detached PCI Express slot. And I'm not entirely sure that I want a replacement motherboard of the same type. Even before it died, it had a flaky BIOS right from the start. Still, the Core i7-4790K is definitely worth something.
I'm more concerned about reliability than I am about the money. I'll likely roll with this computer for a while, with its mix of new and old parts, before coming to a decision. I replaced it about a year ago, but now with a newer video card, memory, and power supply, it might be viable for quite a while. The SSD is less than 3 years old, and really with only 2 years of wear on it because it was unplugged for a year. USB 2.0, SATA 2.0, PCI Express 2.0, and especially a Core i7-860 aren't ideal, but they're not crippling, either. A non-upgraded 4 GB of memory or Radeon HD 5850 that can't handle my good monitors would have been much bigger problems.
Objectively, the Corsair case is 23% larger than the Antec case by volume as measured on the outside, as it's both taller and deeper, while the two cases are the same width. But the Corsair case sure feels smaller on the inside, as it feels like stuff is just laid out poorly. In the Corsair case, it was a major pain to figure out what to do with the Fury X radiator. In the Antec case, just stick it in place of a case fan and done. The screw holes to secure the video card lined up right on the Antec case and not the Corsair case. When trying to turn those screws, the Antec case gave a clear path for the screwdriver and the Corsair case made you turn it at an awkward angle.
That's why i recommended a friend get thermaltake core v51
Pure unobstructed airflow when u remove all the inside cages , easy access magnetic filters, back mounted hard-drives, and direct front intake. There's plenty of similar cases, with more unconventional ssd mounts, etc, ...
That's why my primary requirement for any new pc case is : can i remove everything inside and get unobstructed airflow + it makes working inside the case a breeze.
P.S. from personal experience when you suspect a mobo is failing/failed, take a few pictures of it as proof it's physically in good shape, before you send it for R.M.A. I've had a authorized repair service company mishandle the mobo and then claim user negligence due the box of the motherboard being dusty and scraped on one side, ...
It is possible the flaky bios was a result of a faulty mobo from the beginning. And eventually it just slowly became worse and died. I'd check reviews for that mobo if they exist maybe you just got a lemon and the rest are good to go.
It is possible the flaky bios was a result of a faulty mobo from the beginning. And eventually it just slowly became worse and died. I'd check reviews for that mobo if they exist maybe you just got a lemon and the rest are good to go.
That is possible but on and off have motherboard manufacturers cranked out series with problems, even premium boards like ASUS (they had one 10 years ago where every third died due to faulty capacitors within months after installments if they even worked at all). If you get a crap board don't replace it with the exact same model or you are begging for problems. A-BITs Shanghai factory made a model where all hundred a store I know where useless from the start.
So it is not worth the problem, Quizz don't have to stay away from MSI but if I were him I would at least stay away from that particular model.
Had three PC's over the years that started acting like they were going senile, on one the MB was faulty and the other two were both the HDD. Last one it was my SSD that screwed up, popped in a replacment and no problems since ( touch wood ).
I never have computer hardware problems. I have 2 degrees in Comp Sci, maybe I'm lucky or maybe I actually know what I'm doing. You younger generation aficionados don't understand the basics, and how operating systems work. Some of you talk a good game and sound knowledgeable, but in the end do not have a clue. Sorry I'm ranting, but do your homework on motherboards. MSI is notorious for faulty Motherboards. There is a reason why some people get A's in classes and some get C's barely getting buy. What I'm saying is do your homework and learn the true ways of things. I've seen many fly by night encyclopedic commenters on this site that talk a good game, but in reality are ignorant. The ones who think they know, and are convinced they have the right answer tend to be the most uneducated. I'm tired, and will willingly go back to my corner. If you truly need advice pm me and I will try to help you. I wont even charge you.
I never have computer hardware problems. I have 2 degrees in Comp Sci, maybe I'm lucky or maybe I actually know what I'm doing. You younger generation aficionados don't understand the basics, and how operating systems work. Some of you talk a good game and sound knowledgeable, but in the end do not have a clue. Sorry I'm ranting, but do your homework on motherboards. MSI is notorious for faulty Motherboards. There is a reason why some people get A's in classes and some get C's barely getting buy. What I'm saying is do your homework and learn the true ways of things. I've seen many fly by night encyclopedic commenters on this site that talk a good game, but in reality are ignorant. The ones who think they know, and are convinced they have the right answer tend to be the most uneducated. I'm tired, and will willingly go back to my corner. If you truly need advice pm me and I will try to help you. I wont even charge you.
Peace...
Thanks for adding nothing to this thread. Maybe you could at least attend the funeral stream.
I never have computer hardware problems. I have 2 degrees in Comp Sci, maybe I'm lucky or maybe I actually know what I'm doing. You younger generation aficionados don't understand the basics, and how operating systems work. Some of you talk a good game and sound knowledgeable, but in the end do not have a clue. Sorry I'm ranting, but do your homework on motherboards. MSI is notorious for faulty Motherboards. There is a reason why some people get A's in classes and some get C's barely getting buy. What I'm saying is do your homework and learn the true ways of things. I've seen many fly by night encyclopedic commenters on this site that talk a good game, but in reality are ignorant. The ones who think they know, and are convinced they have the right answer tend to be the most uneducated. I'm tired, and will willingly go back to my corner. If you truly need advice pm me and I will try to help you. I wont even charge you.
Peace...
Never having computer hardware problems is at least partially a matter of luck. Even the best hardware can fail; at most, it can have a lower probability of failing.
Note that he didn't offer his services until the problem had been diagnosed and solved? It's always easier to solve a problem after someone else has already solved it.
"I used to think the worst thing in life was to be all alone. It's not. The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel all alone." Robin Williams
Sounds more to me like Mr. 2 CS degrees hasn't done a lot with computer hardware in his life, if he's never had anything fail on him. Stuff breaks, it's just a matter of time. Entropy always wins, and to pretend that you are somehow better than that is pretty ignorant.
Comments
1) Pull the CMOS battery to reset the BIOS and see if that fixes anything.
2) Unplug and reset power cables at both ends. Also unplug the SSD entirely and see if it can at least POST.
3) Start swapping components so that I can verify that at least some components are known to be good.
But I don't want to fuss with all of that immediately after getting home from work. I'll get to it sometime this weekend.
If the motherboard is dead and the new computer is going to be out of commission for a while, I could at least move the power supply and video card to my old computer. Then I'd be able to plug in my good monitors and have a decent enough computer in the meantime. A Core i7-860 is rather dated by now, but still not that bad.
jkin , hope ya get it fixed:)
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
In fact, I just got a server back last week that wouldn't post and the technicians who repaired it under warranty swapped the motherboard and now it works. I replaced the exact same model of server about a year ago under the same circumstances. No post, replaced motherboard, everything works.
EDIT: Also, when I finally broke down and updated to Windows 10 despite all of my reservations, I did not do the upgrade route. I backed up all of my data, downloaded a free and legal copy from MS and installed it fresh, then reinstalled all of my apps. One things I've learned over the years is that Windows upgrades, especially for clients and home PC's is finicky as shit.
The CPU fans were mostly for a specific small form factor model that used squirrel cage type fans. Power buttons were never diagnosed during the client's phone calls to Dell. Power buttons were the least frequent repair and usually meant spending 30 minutes on the phone convincing their L1 tech that I knew what the fuck I was doing.
I'm leery of trying to power a Fury X with the 7 year old 525 W power supply in my old computer, though seeing if it boots into Windows should be safe. A stress test would be a bad idea. It would probably be fine, but it's a dumb risk to take. That's why if the motherboard is the culprit, I was planning on moving both the power supply and video card together into the old computer.
MSI would have gotten their code from one of those 3 and even if they havn't placed a custom code for code 10 there is obviously something there. Doesn't really matter, the Bios usually just report the first error and if the entire card is messed up you would have a bunch of more errors as well you can't see.
If the PSU is messing and not giving enough power it would also report the first thing not getting enough power (starting with the PSU followed by ram).
And yeah, I could have written all that to add to my already long post. Anyways, I give 90% Motherboard, 9% CPU (including cables & contacts) and 1% something else (ram of GFX card). CPU is extremely unlikely since you would get a beeping sound from that.
And yeah, start pulling off all things you don't need to get into the Bios. Everything.
Personally I would after that try the old PSU first with the same barebone setting before switching any more components, taking the PSU off the suspect list is a huge step.
I do tend to agree, the issue is probably the motherboard, but I would put the known working PSU in the culprit computer just as a cross check before I put a potentially culprit PSU into an otherwise known working computer.
The good news is that the power supply, video card, and memory all work. I've got them in my old computer and am posting this from it now. I wasn't sure if the memory would work, as 8 GB DDR3 modules didn't exist when the motherboard came out, but it works and it recognizes all 16 GB.
It's unlikely that I'll ever buy or recommend a Corsair case again. When I built my Windows 10 computer, I spent more than I had previously for what I expected to be a nicer $100 case from Corsair. It seemed harder to assemble than I had recalled from smaller, cheaper Antec and Cooler Master cases in the past. When moving components around between the Corsair Carbide 400R and Antec 300 Illusion cases, it was a much more direct comparison, and a huge difference.
Objectively, the Corsair case is 23% larger than the Antec case by volume as measured on the outside, as it's both taller and deeper, while the two cases are the same width. But the Corsair case sure feels smaller on the inside, as it feels like stuff is just laid out poorly. In the Corsair case, it was a major pain to figure out what to do with the Fury X radiator. In the Antec case, just stick it in place of a case fan and done. The screw holes to secure the video card lined up right on the Antec case and not the Corsair case. When trying to turn those screws, the Antec case gave a clear path for the screwdriver and the Corsair case made you turn it at an awkward angle.
The next question is what to do now. I could try to send the motherboard in for warranty service, but I'm not sure what MSI would say about the detached PCI Express slot. And I'm not entirely sure that I want a replacement motherboard of the same type. Even before it died, it had a flaky BIOS right from the start. Still, the Core i7-4790K is definitely worth something.
I'm more concerned about reliability than I am about the money. I'll likely roll with this computer for a while, with its mix of new and old parts, before coming to a decision. I replaced it about a year ago, but now with a newer video card, memory, and power supply, it might be viable for quite a while. The SSD is less than 3 years old, and really with only 2 years of wear on it because it was unplugged for a year. USB 2.0, SATA 2.0, PCI Express 2.0, and especially a Core i7-860 aren't ideal, but they're not crippling, either. A non-upgraded 4 GB of memory or Radeon HD 5850 that can't handle my good monitors would have been much bigger problems.
Pure unobstructed airflow when u remove all the inside cages
That's why my primary requirement for any new pc case is : can i remove everything inside and get unobstructed airflow
Phanteks Enthoo Pro M is also really cool
http://www.phanteks.com/Enthoo-Pro-M.html
P.S. from personal experience when you suspect a mobo is failing/failed, take a few pictures of it as proof it's physically in good shape, before you send it for R.M.A. I've had a authorized repair service company mishandle the mobo and then claim user negligence due the box of the motherboard being dusty and scraped on one side, ...
So it is not worth the problem, Quizz don't have to stay away from MSI but if I were him I would at least stay away from that particular model.
I wouldn't wait on warranty, those can take many weeks. But I would file for warranty - if/when you get the warranty replacement back just ebay it
Peace...