Unless SC has a persistent universe that supports multiple thousands of players, rather than the odd dozen or so, then its a bit of a silly question, a bit like how many elephants can you fit in a mini.
Well from watching some of the stuff at gamescon it was pointed out that there will be options in the game settings for SC to choose how you interact with others, in a similar way to E:D.
Players can choose to play openly, with friends only, to participate in PvP, or not etc. If that holds true for the release of the game then it will be nothing like EVE.
Besides being space simulators they are rather different games and Eve have become the game it is today due to a long process, It was made by a handful of people and released '03 with just 20K players. Then it slowly grew into the game it is today.
SC is a high budget game, it is pay2win and have a very high profile just now, And it seems to me that they aren't going for exactly the same type of players either.
The question is like asking if Lineage Eternal will become another Wow.
EVE is as P2W as SC. You can buy powerful characters, skills, and materials. You can absolutely buy pvp advantage.
At first perhaps, but by design there is little impact on long term players from any advantage sold by CCP.
Can't think of a single instance where I felt a paid for advantage defeated me.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
EVE? Silly. EVE was a low budget slow starting niche game. Now its high budget but still niche. SC is one of the most expensive games world has ever seen, it will either be the best there was or just another major flop. It will never get the slow start chance EVE had, it will shine or burn.
SC already has a problem with excess hype. With all the things promised it will be interesting to see exactly what makes it into the game, how much is dropped, and how much is added later. It promises a lot, will have to wait and see what's delivered.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Unless SC has a persistent universe that supports multiple thousands of players, rather than the odd dozen or so, then its a bit of a silly question, a bit like how many elephants can you fit in a mini.
Well from watching some of the stuff at gamescon it was pointed out that there will be options in the game settings for SC to choose how you interact with others, in a similar way to E:D.
Players can choose to play openly, with friends only, to participate in PvP, or not etc. If that holds true for the release of the game then it will be nothing like EVE.
How can players play only with friends or choose not to PvP in an open PvP world with a few safe zones?
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Unless SC has a persistent universe that supports multiple thousands of players, rather than the odd dozen or so, then its a bit of a silly question, a bit like how many elephants can you fit in a mini.
Well from watching some of the stuff at gamescon it was pointed out that there will be options in the game settings for SC to choose how you interact with others, in a similar way to E:D.
Players can choose to play openly, with friends only, to participate in PvP, or not etc. If that holds true for the release of the game then it will be nothing like EVE.
How can players play only with friends or choose not to PvP in an open PvP world with a few safe zones?
Your mistake is in assuming it's an open PvP world/universe with a few safe zones. There will be very large areas that are PvE areas, and there will be large areas that are PvP. CR has said he wants there to be a balance between them, so it's not primarily PvP if that's what you're thinking.
Your mistake is in assuming it's an open PvP world/universe with a few safe zones. There will be very large areas that are PvE areas, and there will be large areas that are PvP. CR has said he wants there to be a balance between them, so it's not primarily PvP if that's what you're thinking.
I could list 10 things off the top of my head and give you links to things CR has said that he has since reversed his position on. At this point, EVERYTHING is speculation.
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
Talonsin said: I could list 10 things off the top of my head and give you links to things CR has said that he has since reversed his position on. At this point, EVERYTHING is speculation.
Well if you have worries about the changes on that design from what he said back on 2013... towards where does this topic stands on today:
(4:50), the question rewarding PvP, comparing to that plan he talked about back on 2013, the direction is still the same.
If griefing is possible, there WILL be griefers. Don't bring up Eve, I've been ganked in every noob system while in the starter ship within an hour every single time. Let's see, I've tried their trial 3 times over the years, and I think there are 4 factions you can start with (If it's only 3, correct the math please), so that makes 12 characters in a row podded and ganked by griefers in the High Sec starter areas. Yeah, Eve is NOT a good example, so don't mention it please.
If the universe is divided into PVE and PVP areas, that is usually a detriment to PVE players as it's very common that those PVP areas will be places they will HAVE to go to. Either to get the better resources their crafting now requires, or to fulfill a quest, or just because it's a travel choke point that's pretty much unavoidable. (And if it's a 4 sector travel with one of those PVP or 20 sector avoiding PVP, that's going to be about the same simply due to the sheer boredom with that much pure travel for no good reason.)
Private servers where you can turn off PVP are ok, but that kind of removes the M in MMO, so it's a substandard solution.
Though there are those who feel they should be allowed to kill anyone anywhere at anytime and are very vocal in their protestations about anything that restricts that, the truth is there are a lot more people that don't care about, or even dislike non-consensual PVP for any reason, it's just that they aren't making as much noise about it. The howler monkeys may be the loudest voice in the jungle, but they aren't the most populous one. :winky:
I really, really, really doubt it becomes Eve...in fact if Eve launched in 2016 it would have never have become Eve either....It is a niche game that found a niche audience at the right time....Star Citizen has its backers but has a very long ways to go.
If griefing is possible, there WILL be griefers. Don't bring up Eve, I've been ganked in every noob system while in the starter ship within an hour every single time. Let's see, I've tried their trial 3 times over the years, and I think there are 4 factions you can start with (If it's only 3, correct the math please), so that makes 12 characters in a row podded and ganked by griefers in the High Sec starter areas. Yeah, Eve is NOT a good example, so don't mention it please.
Interesting, how did that happen? Can flipping, baiting or somesuch? I know in all the time I played EVE I never got killed once in a high sec system.
No Star Citizen, will not become EVE. As, Star Citizen is wing commander privateer, star lancer, and free lancer rolled into one, just as Squadron 42 is wing commander. All of which, is being revamped to 15.0 type standards, and modernized.
And those of you thinking you are going to have free reign over the in game verse, the Vanduul. Xi'an,all unrevealed militaristic aliens,all corporations, and pirate factions who's lively-hood you are trying to fuck with, are going to get blown to bits, as a response.
Remember Freelancers REP system, and how many would attack when we the player went pirate in any system of the verse.
If griefing is possible, there WILL be griefers. Don't bring up Eve, I've been ganked in every noob system while in the starter ship within an hour every single time. Let's see, I've tried their trial 3 times over the years, and I think there are 4 factions you can start with (If it's only 3, correct the math please), so that makes 12 characters in a row podded and ganked by griefers in the High Sec starter areas. Yeah, Eve is NOT a good example, so don't mention it please.
Ok, I call bullshit on that. Firts of, ganking n00bs without a reason is actaully a banable offence, so not many actually chance that. Yeah. There is that: CCP do have a stand on this, and they DO ban for it.
If you where really ganked in a n00b ship, you must have actually provoke it. Either by being an idiot in local, or more likely, do something that makes you flagged for free ganking, such as looting other players cans etc.. If you do stupid stuff like that, yeah, you will get ganked, but then you deserve to.
I simply refuse to belive you have been randomely ganked 12 times. That is not how EVE works.
Right now SC has a max of 16 players in the same location. Their goal is only going to be 64 players. Until they can remotely come close to that number then no.
Right now SC has a max of 16 players in the same location. Their goal is only going to be 64 players. Until they can remotely come close to that number then no.
24 players* you're outdated.
And it's not even about player numbers, even if they managed 200 per instance still doesn't change how the game-world is not driven much less controlled by the players, unlike EvE.
I think its safe to say SC will become it's own game. Might have a few similarities with other games such as EVE, but it won't be anything close to EVE2.
Right now I think the key thing is what features will the MVP include, and will they deliver enough gameplay to satisfy a significant sized player base over the long term once the shine of a new release wears off.
Endlessly comparing it to EVE or expecting it to be anything like EVE really serves no purpose.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Unless SC has a persistent universe that supports multiple thousands of players, rather than the odd dozen or so, then its a bit of a silly question, a bit like how many elephants can you fit in a mini.
Well from watching some of the stuff at gamescon it was pointed out that there will be options in the game settings for SC to choose how you interact with others, in a similar way to E:D.
Players can choose to play openly, with friends only, to participate in PvP, or not etc. If that holds true for the release of the game then it will be nothing like EVE.
How can players play only with friends or choose not to PvP in an open PvP world with a few safe zones?
Your mistake is in assuming it's an open PvP world/universe with a few safe zones. There will be very large areas that are PvE areas, and there will be large areas that are PvP. CR has said he wants there to be a balance between them, so it's not primarily PvP if that's what you're thinking.
I look at the game the way it is now. Now in alpha it's open world PvP with a few safe zones. Once I see that change CR and you are talking about, perhaps in late alpha, perhaps in beta, perhaps right before launch then I will stand corrected. As far as what he said, he just described Eve Online. Players being able to stay in a safe zone and trade and PvE if they want to. Risk vs reward, the greater the risk they take the greater the reward. Other players being able to attack players in safe zones and get a bounty on their heads for doing so, as an incentive not to.
It's interesting he said if you don't want to do PvP you can sort of avoid it. Sort of? At no time does he address the size of these areas. Some have said that CR said NPC's will maintain order in zones to keep PvP under control, we shall see.
CR wants to appease both sides by making the PvP and PvE players happy. We'll see if he does it. Many MMO's have tried to find such balance.
Some of his backers are on different sides of the fence.
Is SC envisioned to be a open world PvP, PvP areas, instanced/matched PvP or limited PvP MMO?
All I know for sure is when the game comes out you won't be able to play both sides. Either he will have to create huge PvE only zones for PvE players or not. Only time will tell what he actually does when faced with players who love to gank and don't really care about good reputations, only destroying that expensive ship some other player owns.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Talonsin said: I could list 10 things off the top of my head and give you links to things CR has said that he has since reversed his position on. At this point, EVERYTHING is speculation.
Well if you have worries about the changes on that design from what he said back on 2013... towards where does this topic stands on today:
(4:50), the question rewarding PvP, comparing to that plan he talked about back on 2013, the direction is still the same.
I'll be surprised if a PvP slider actually makes it into the game. I hope your faith in CR to actually do something like that and make it work is justified.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I'll be surprised if a PvP slider actually makes it into the game. I hope your faith in CR to actually do something like that and make it work is justified.
Well, it's still the same plan as before, PvE / PvP areas, however there shall always be the possibility of PvP.
If we go back to freelancer that has this design, you can still PvP but you will easily get rekd if you do so on the so-called "safe areas". So on that question if you listen to his answer he already kinda implies the PvP Slider will not be there, specially on the part they plan to have big instances now instead of smaller instances where it would be possible to have to put a player on an instance with other PvE / PvP players.
I certainly hope it becomes another EVE online in this sense, considering that CCP gives you all the tools you need to not get ganked, should you choose to use them. PvP in EVE online is consensual. You can do the math and carry as much isk in your cargo ship as it costs in destroyers to blow you up in highsec and you'll never get killed. You can use scouts and your fleet will never fight a fleet you don't think you can take. You can incorporate your directional scanner into the core of your being and never ever get caught with your pants down while grinding isk. You can set up insta undocks and never be caught at a high or lowsec station. I really do hope SC gives me the same tools.
Besides being space simulators they are rather different games and Eve have become the game it is today due to a long process, It was made by a handful of people and released '03 with just 20K players. Then it slowly grew into the game it is today.
SC is a high budget game, it is pay2win and have a very high profile just now, And it seems to me that they aren't going for exactly the same type of players either.
The question is like asking if Lineage Eternal will become another Wow.
EVE is as P2W as SC. You can buy powerful characters, skills, and materials. You can absolutely buy pvp advantage.
Nah man, EVE's pay to lose. You can buy anything you want and someone out there will still turn your tricked out faction battleship into an explosion.
We can discuss that forever, but as long as some of the relevant game mechanics are not in, it is all just speculation: E.g.: How does interruption of quantum speed work? How easily can you run from a fight? How well does the system distinguish between piracy and griefing? etc.
The stated goal was and is that players can reduce but never avoid player contact (that is not necessarily PvP), that piracy is a thing you have to deal with (player or NPC initiated), and that griefing will not be tolerated.
We will see how it turns out. So far I was never frustrated playing the alpha :-)
SC will be a different game than EVE, with some possible comparisons. If it will be a better game will very much depend on your personal preferences. But if you like space games (and I would assume most EVE players do), I would give it a try
Feel free to use my Star Citizen referral link to get a small sign-up bonus.
Comments
Players can choose to play openly, with friends only, to participate in PvP, or not etc. If that holds true for the release of the game then it will be nothing like EVE.
Can't think of a single instance where I felt a paid for advantage defeated me.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Don't take my word for that, listen to the man himself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypx5pqzzOS0
(4:50), the question rewarding PvP, comparing to that plan he talked about back on 2013, the direction is still the same.
Lost my mind, now trying to lose yours...
Don't bring up Eve, I've been ganked in every noob system while in the starter ship within an hour every single time. Let's see, I've tried their trial 3 times over the years, and I think there are 4 factions you can start with (If it's only 3, correct the math please), so that makes 12 characters in a row podded and ganked by griefers in the High Sec starter areas. Yeah, Eve is NOT a good example, so don't mention it please.
If the universe is divided into PVE and PVP areas, that is usually a detriment to PVE players as it's very common that those PVP areas will be places they will HAVE to go to. Either to get the better resources their crafting now requires, or to fulfill a quest, or just because it's a travel choke point that's pretty much unavoidable. (And if it's a 4 sector travel with one of those PVP or 20 sector avoiding PVP, that's going to be about the same simply due to the sheer boredom with that much pure travel for no good reason.)
Private servers where you can turn off PVP are ok, but that kind of removes the M in MMO, so it's a substandard solution.
Though there are those who feel they should be allowed to kill anyone anywhere at anytime and are very vocal in their protestations about anything that restricts that, the truth is there are a lot more people that don't care about, or even dislike non-consensual PVP for any reason, it's just that they aren't making as much noise about it. The howler monkeys may be the loudest voice in the jungle, but they aren't the most populous one. :winky:
Lost my mind, now trying to lose yours...
Interesting, how did that happen? Can flipping, baiting or somesuch?
I know in all the time I played EVE I never got killed once in a high sec system.
And those of you thinking you are going to have free reign over the in game verse, the Vanduul. Xi'an,all unrevealed militaristic aliens,all corporations, and pirate factions who's lively-hood you are trying to fuck with, are going to get blown to bits, as a response.
Remember Freelancers REP system, and how many would attack when we the player went pirate in any system of the verse.
If you where really ganked in a n00b ship, you must have actually provoke it. Either by being an idiot in local, or more likely, do something that makes you flagged for free ganking, such as looting other players cans etc.. If you do stupid stuff like that, yeah, you will get ganked, but then you deserve to.
I simply refuse to belive you have been randomely ganked 12 times. That is not how EVE works.
And it's not even about player numbers, even if they managed 200 per instance still doesn't change how the game-world is not driven much less controlled by the players, unlike EvE.
Right now I think the key thing is what features will the MVP include, and will they deliver enough gameplay to satisfy a significant sized player base over the long term once the shine of a new release wears off.
Endlessly comparing it to EVE or expecting it to be anything like EVE really serves no purpose.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
It's interesting he said if you don't want to do PvP you can sort of avoid it. Sort of? At no time does he address the size of these areas. Some have said that CR said NPC's will maintain order in zones to keep PvP under control, we shall see.
CR wants to appease both sides by making the PvP and PvE players happy. We'll see if he does it. Many MMO's have tried to find such balance.
Some of his backers are on different sides of the fence.
Is SC envisioned to be a open world PvP, PvP areas, instanced/matched PvP or limited PvP MMO?
https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/339789/All I know for sure is when the game comes out you won't be able to play both sides. Either he will have to create huge PvE only zones for PvE players or not. Only time will tell what he actually does when faced with players who love to gank and don't really care about good reputations, only destroying that expensive ship some other player owns.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
If we go back to freelancer that has this design, you can still PvP but you will easily get rekd if you do so on the so-called "safe areas". So on that question if you listen to his answer he already kinda implies the PvP Slider will not be there, specially on the part they plan to have big instances now instead of smaller instances where it would be possible to have to put a player on an instance with other PvE / PvP players.
Nah man, EVE's pay to lose. You can buy anything you want and someone out there will still turn your tricked out faction battleship into an explosion.
E.g.: How does interruption of quantum speed work? How easily can you run from a fight? How well does the system distinguish between piracy and griefing? etc.
The stated goal was and is that players can reduce but never avoid player contact (that is not necessarily PvP), that piracy is a thing you have to deal with (player or NPC initiated), and that griefing will not be tolerated.
We will see how it turns out. So far I was never frustrated playing the alpha :-)
SC will be a different game than EVE, with some possible comparisons.
If it will be a better game will very much depend on your personal preferences. But if you like space games (and I would assume most EVE players do), I would give it a try