Ex-Sony leaves harsh critics to who asks for a refund for NMS

MaxBacon

Here's the tweet at question: 

https://twitter.com/shahidkamal/status/769882257964294144

The guy was a former content director at Sony.

"If you’re getting a refund after playing a game for 50 hours you’re a thief."

That was put towards people who have been asking and getting refunds for NMS after playing for times well over 50 hours. What do you think? Should a player retain the right to refund after playing a game for that long?

SEANMCAD

Sorry but I dont find that harsh at all.

Do you see people walking out of movies near the end and asking and getting a refund?

rpmcmurphy

Personally I would say that's immoral. If they cared about lies, false advertising or poor performance they could have sought a refund far sooner.

One the other side, if the developer (and by proxy Sony) are happy to mislead their customers do they have any ground to accuse people of acting in an immoral way?
I would say they've lost all rights to criticise actions they don't like when it comes to NMS.

MaxBacon

I mean its harsh towards the people who have been playing the game for dozens of hours and asking for refunds, up to the level of the "charge-back" talks.

As far as the topic go, i feel independent of the reason ask for a refund after playing that long is stretching it. The refund should have been asked sooner.

Dragnelus

Why so salt, steam stated they give refunds no matter the time. Means something bout the game right XD

Realizer

If you lie about features to get $50 you're a thief.... 

bsukala

Playing a game that long and asking for a refund is just ridiculous. I remember a time when store has a no return policy of any opened electronic items.

Sovrath

Realizer said:

If you lie about features to get $50 you're a thief.... 

While on one hand I can agree on that (though I'm not necessarily in agreement they lied but that's another discussion) anyone who plays a game for 50 hours and asks for a refund is sort of a thief.

Play for a few and then make your decision.

Octagon7711

SEANMCAD said:

Sorry but I dont find that harsh at all.

Do you see people walking out of movies near the end and asking and getting a refund?

Ah yes, I've heard of it happening.

immodium

50 hours is not a lot in a game that touts to have an infinite universe to explore.

Realizer

Sovrath said:

Realizer said:

If you lie about features to get $50 you're a thief.... 

While on one hand I can agree on that (though I'm not necessarily in agreement they lied but that's another discussion) anyone who plays a game for 50 hours and asks for a refund is sort of a thief.

Play for a few and then make your decision.

 How about when you're promised the whole price of the game will be worth it when you see the awesome mystery in the center of the galaxy? Then you get there and the game spits on it's finger and shoves it in your ear?

Edit: Flames aside, steam counts log in time if you're sitting there at the launcher screen afk.

laserit

Realizer said:

If you lie about features to get $50 you're a thief.... 

Agreed

Leaving NMS out of the conversation.

If your misrepresenting your product.  Knowingly making false statements and false promises.

You a swindler, a Snake Oil salesman and a Thief.

Bring out the Tar and Feathers!

MaxBacon

immodium said:

50 hours is not a lot in a game that touts to have an infinite universe to explore.

50 hours allows you to pretty much complete a game like Mass Effect... Completionist level = Game + Extras + Achievements.

It's a game that can take as much hours as you want to complete, depending of how you play it. But if you decide to take 200 hours to reach the center of the galaxy to "end" NMS, and then decide a refund... Yeah O.o

SEANMCAD

MaxBacon said:

immodium said:

50 hours is not a lot in a game that touts to have an infinite universe to explore.

50 hours allows you to pretty much complete a game like Mass Effect... Completionist level = Game + Extras + Achievements.

It's a game that can take as much hours as you want to complete, depending of how you play it. But if you decide to take 200 hours to reach the center of the galaxy to "end" NMS, and then decide a refund... Yeah O.o

and there is the problem.

different games, different play times

xelrah

And that guy is right. No matter how bad game is it can't be justified to have full refund after 50+ hours in.

MaxBacon

SEANMCAD said:

and there is the problem.

different games, different play times

Yeah but this opens a really weird precedent.

Where i live i CAN'T refund a physical game i bought on a store, after i open the sealed box. Not even if the game was NMS and i claimed it is not as advertised. I'm not sure how on other people's places this would play out.

That's why i find this whole thing that surrounds the digital version when it comes to refunds quite interesting.

SEANMCAD

MaxBacon said:

SEANMCAD said:

and there is the problem.

different games, different play times

Yeah but this opens a really weird precedent.

Where i live i CAN'T refund a physical game i bought on a store, after i open the sealed box. Not even if the game was NMS and i claimed it is not as advertised. I'm not sure how on other people's places this would play out.

That's why i find this whole thing that surrounds the digital version when it comes to refunds quite interesting.

you OP is misleading to your position on this subject

Void425

If you played 50 hours and expected the game to be 300 hours, then I guess you should only ask for a refund for $50 of your money...the other $10 is considered well spent.

winghaven1

How is it any better to lie to the customer about your product and then getting upset when they realize it's nothing like you described and ask for a refund. Who is the real thief here?

Kyleran

At first thought I would agree, but then again, it might take you that long before you realize the game doesn't deliver what you were promised or expecting.

I probably had 40 hours or so into ESO before I understood the direction they were taking the game and decided to ask for a refund. (which was denied BTW) 

Octagon7711

I think it's usually on a case by case basis.  No rule is absolute even if retailers want you to believe it is.  People have gotten refunds for games even in opened sealed boxes if their case was compelling enough or the retailer saw it was less trouble to just give them their money back or they complained to the attorneys general office, or they had a lawyers draw up a letter about pursuing it in court if they didn't get a simple refund.  A good credit card company (they also often supply additional warranties) may grant you a refund if you're considered a good customer and rarely ask for such things just as a good will policy.

bartoni33

Not a black and white issue here.

I could tell that their was much "stretching of the truth" by the Bearded Hipster One about 6 hours in, and I was still on my starter planet at that time. Using your brain and reading all the threads on Steam you should have known that The BHO misspoke about many things well before 50 hours in. You should not get a refund if you spent more that an actual day playing NMS. That is silly.

BUT as soon as it was apparent that BHO did lie or however you want to put it about what was actually in NMS then you should be allowed to get your money back.

BUT it should not take you 10+ hours to see this. Use common sense. Hell we knew before the PC launch that BHO flat out lied about seeing other people in the game. That in itself is enough grounds for a refund, if seeing other people was important to you.

TL;DR Yes 50 hours is ridiculous and should not be refunded, but a reasonable time frame should be OKed by Steam/GOG/ whoever.

EDIT: Oh yeah as far as the Tweet, yes he can go straight to Hell or whatever crap he believes in. If I get conned by a con man and I take my stuff back it is not stealing.

MaxBacon

SEANMCAD said:

you OP is misleading to your position on this subject

Oh i didn't put my position on the thread itself. Overall i see people abusing refunds when it comes to actually play the game, even finish it / get bored with it and then refund it. On how i see it the product has been "used", same way you can't (or hardly can) refund a movie (cinema or DVD), concert and so on after they finish, or even before.

bartoni33

MaxBacon said:

SEANMCAD said:

you OP is misleading to your position on this subject

Oh i didn't put my position on the thread itself. Overall i see people abusing refunds when it comes to actually play the game, even finish it / get bored with it and then refund it. On how i see it the product has been "used", same way you can't (or hardly can) refund a movie (cinema or DVD), concert and so on after they finish, or even before.

The only way the Movie analogy works is if the movie was advertised as 3D and when you get there you wait and wait for the 3D to start working and it doesn't. Then when you ask the usher why no 3D he says "oh yeah it was recorded in 3D but we didn't print it to film that way".

Sovrath

Realizer said:

Sovrath said:

Realizer said:

If you lie about features to get $50 you're a thief.... 

While on one hand I can agree on that (though I'm not necessarily in agreement they lied but that's another discussion) anyone who plays a game for 50 hours and asks for a refund is sort of a thief.

Play for a few and then make your decision.

 How about when you're promised the whole price of the game will be worth it when you see the awesome mystery in the center of the galaxy? Then you get there and the game spits on it's finger and shoves it in your ear?

Edit: Flames aside, steam counts log in time if you're sitting there at the launcher screen afk.

I've seen arguments where they didn't promise what was in the center of the universe and that it was something that came from the players. I can't speak to that as I didn't see those interviews but I can easily imagine players running away with that information.

It's a shame that I'm rarely an advocate for the players but I see too much nonsense coming from the disenfranchised to take it seriously.

But let's say, for argument's sake that they did come out and say "wait 'til you get to the center of the universe!".

And of course players get there and see what is currently in the game and hate it. Well, that's subjective. Maybe they think it's awesome or clever but players don't see it that way.

how can you rely upon something that is going to be taken differently for each person? Whenever a developer gets excited about something you have to take that with a grain of salt. Just take games for what you know about them not what is tantalized or promised or hinted at.

Because then when the game doesn't meet what's in the player's mind they will start with the "you prawwwwmised" bit.

MaxBacon

bartoni33 said:

The only way the Movie analogy works is if the movie was advertised as 3D and when you get there you wait and wait for the 3D to start working and it doesn't. Then when you ask the usher why no 3D he says "oh yeah it was recorded in 3D but we didn't print it to film that way".

Well it's not as announced is one thing, the customer stands a point. Though on digital games it really gets to the point you already played dozens of hours and you possibly even finished the game... This is a rather unique case, specially on the Sony's side.