This still P2W?

raystantz

I bought this a while back.. and I'm kicking myself now for paying that much for it.. ugh.

I played it for a bit and then got bored, suffering from the same thing all of these games suffer from.. nobody to play with.

I felt like I was just playing a single player game. I ran into very few people. I was hoping I was getting into a really awesome Sandbox PVP game... 

I've also heard it's very P2W.. is this true?

I'm going back through old MMO's and seeing if I want to try any of them again.. 

TrackFlare

Like all games of this genre. You need to find a nice guild to settle in. Plenty of people playing the game currently. Will be even more full when the servers merge into a mega server on the 30th of this month.

I wouldn't classify this as P2W either. There are some items you can purchase with real money and put on the market in game. But there isn't anything game breaking that you 'have' to buy with real cash. Almost everything can be gotten in game, including the 30 day 'subscription' which people list on the in game market.

Azaron_Nightblade

DMKano said:

Since P2W has no agreed upon definition, and anybody can call anything P2W for ANY reason,

How could anyone possibly answer this question objectively?

Inmate Kano pretty much nailed it. :P

To some it will be, on the count that RL money can be turned into in game currency through the market place.

In the grand scheme of things, I would say no, but it comes down to personal tastes in the end.

LIOKI

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

kitarad

If you cannot spend a few Euro on a game to support it why bother playing it.

Bloodaxes

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

- You can level strength for extra weight limit, you can attach gems that increase weight limit, there's gear like the hercules set that gives extra weight limit and you can save your daily loyalty points and increase your weight limit.

- Pets are a neccesity not a make/break. I'll agree they are important if you are going to grind, but they aren't important at all if you want to be a farmer or horse tamer. You can buy them from auction now I believe.

- Horse skill reset and also player full skill reset are indeed annoying. However you can buy horses from the stable if you don't want to grind one (Which most people would rather not do).

Full skill reset is p2wish and that is where I'd rather have them let people get one by ingame means.

There are ways to get money besides grinding btw.

corvas

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

not in my opinion, all these items arent in any way giving you an advantage in combat against another player.

And also most of these items can be bought cheap at the market if it hits the market.

hatefulpeace

The game is not as pay 2 win as some. One there is a limit of 5 pearl items you can sell a week, which equals at most like 150m, since the devs are the ones who control the prices. You wont be winning anything with that, since in game you can make that really easy. Second is that this game is mostly not pvp, I dont see what your gonna be winning, so no you dont get any advantage with paying them money. The market to get things is 100 percent random, meaning that its on a bid system so, since 30 day packs only go for 10 mil, which a new player would have in like 6 hours, they go really fast, so every one has to sit there and hit bid, and hope they get one. The whole game is random, so its not about who pays more, who grinds more, its about who is lucky. 

So here examples, 2 people start playing BDO one with 10 grand, one with just the 5 dollar game, they both play the same. Since the game is 100 percent random, the guy with 10 grand has a huge chance to be worse off than the guy who only paid 5 bucks, since the devs in this give you a whole bunch of free stuff randomly. So if those 2 characters dueled after say 20 hours of playing, it would be up in the air who would win. 

Take another game I play eve online, which is pay 2 win. If you take those 2 same people one with a 15 dollar sub, and one with 10 grand.  The guy who had the 10 grand, could buy a account in game, and a bunch of disposable ships. So if you took those 2 people, after 20 hours, and dueled them, the guy with 10 grand would win every time with out even trying. 

So no you can't spin BDO as pay 2 win, because the game is based on pure luck in everything, and you just cant spend enough money to mean anything. 

Another pay 2 win game is Uncharted waters online, if you took the same 2 people, the guy with 10 grand would have a bunch of high end boats, and if they dueled the 10 grand guy would win every time. 

Laughing-man

Bloodaxes said:

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

- You can level strength for extra weight limit, you can attach gems that increase weight limit, there's gear like the hercules set that gives extra weight limit and you can save your daily loyalty points and increase your weight limit.
- However, you only gain 1.5 pounds of carry weight.  At level 50 that's only 75 extra pounds of weight. 4 Polar bears at T4 give you 80 carry weight.  That's just pets, not counting the cash shop for buying weight, the cash shop for letting you summon your storage to put things away, and more.
- Pets are a neccesity not a make/break. I'll agree they are important if you are going to grind, but they aren't important at all if you want to be a farmer or horse tamer. You can buy them from auction now I believe.
- You kill things far too quickly for you to be bending over and picking up items.  Pets are needed if you want to grind effectively.  The best way to grind is to kill things that you can kill with low kill time per monster. It just gives you better money per hour. That being done you need pets to be able to loot while you run to the next pack or your money per hour takes a massive dive, and you are essentially working twice as hard or more.
- Horse skill reset and also player full skill reset are indeed annoying. However you can buy horses from the stable if you don't want to grind one (Which most people would rather not do).
- Those are nothing, what about the item that makes durability go down slower, that you can use on fishing rods?  So you can make a Balenos Fishing rod last literally 13 hours or more.
Full skill reset is p2wish and that is where I'd rather have them let people get one by ingame means.
- Not really, the game doesn't have 'customization' like most games, the goal is to have every skill maxed out, I don't see why people skill reset, this is a grinding non stop soulessly forever game.
There are ways to get money besides grinding btw.
- Not really, Life skills can be done WHILE grinding. You should have your workers out doing things while you are grinding and then you stop for a moment or two to process everything and make packs, then back to more grinding.

The game is probably pay to win.
It's also a shameless cash grab.
Why? It's a theme park game with no rides.

I've tried to get people to explain where the sand in this sandbox is, they all end up saying "oh I guess it's a theme park then."  Ok.. Where's the beef?  Where's the dungeons, the character customization, the gear progression, the bosses, the MEAT?

It's just a shameless cash grab.
I'm on Edan, grinding and hating myself.

hatefulpeace

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

Which is not true, since the game is 100 percent random. If you took that person with the weight gain and 3 pets, which you can buy all the pets in the in game market place, and you took a person who only paid 5 bucks, but was super lucky, the person with 5 bucks would win a duel. As far as the difference between a person who bought that extra weight thing and not, it is so minor its not even worth talking about. As for your horse skill ahah, I don't see what that will get you, since you can buy tier 7 horses, and skip that 5 month grind of horses any ways.

It def doesnt put you behind on anything. I don't think you actually played the game, if that is what you came up with. Because you would know, this game only equals random luck, as far as getting gear is concerned. 100 extra weight is meaningless, and a horse with a better skill is meaningless.

As the many flaws this game has, pay 2 win is 100 percent not one of them. The major flaw it has is it is utterly random, the devs control the market place, and they give out way 2 much free stuff.  

Laughing-man

hatefulpeace said:

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

Which is not true, since the game is 100 percent random. If you took that person with the weight gain and 3 pets, which you can buy all the pets in the in game market place, and you took a person who only paid 5 bucks, but was super lucky, the person with 5 bucks would win a duel. As far as the difference between a person who bought that extra weight thing and not, it is so minor its not even worth talking about. As for your horse skill ahah, I don't see what that will get you, since you can buy tier 7 horses, and skip that 5 month grind of horses any ways.

How is the game random? They have removed the random stats, the game is action combat which means skill based combat.  If you mean the RNG on enchanting?  I'd probably give you that one... 
Extra weight is NOT minor, you can add over 580 from the cash shop alone, and that's not counting the maids.

It def doesnt put you behind on anything. I don't think you actually played the game, if that is what you came up with. Because you would know, this game only equals random luck, as far as getting gear is concerned. 100 extra weight is meaningless, and a horse with a better skill is meaningless.

It makes it so you have to run back nearly twice as often as someone who paid money... that is a lot of time wasted.

As the many flaws this game has, pay 2 win is 100 percent not one of them. The major flaw it has is it is utterly random, the devs control the market place, and they give out way 2 much free stuff.  

I don't think you're aware of what you're talking about with all due respect. Your numbers are WAY off.



As you can see here, you can purchase each one of these 1 time per character.
That's 500 weight right there.
Then the polar bear pets?  they're 50 pounds each.  4 of them is 200 pounds...

That brings our grand total of weight you can buy from the game to be... 700 pounds...

Most people only can carry 600ish by default...

Meaning you can literally over double your carry weight by paying...  That's not nothing

MaxBacon

I am playing it again, though you have to live with some points:

1. You're going to grind like a true strong Korean
2. There's parts of the game that push you towards that "p2w", if you accept that you can get past some annoyances with a bit of money.

The big and most controversy seems to surround PvP.

Bloodaxes

Laughing-man said:

Bloodaxes said:

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

- You can level strength for extra weight limit, you can attach gems that increase weight limit, there's gear like the hercules set that gives extra weight limit and you can save your daily loyalty points and increase your weight limit.
- However, you only gain 1.5 pounds of carry weight.  At level 50 that's only 75 extra pounds of weight. 4 Polar bears at T4 give you 80 carry weight.  That's just pets, not counting the cash shop for buying weight, the cash shop for letting you summon your storage to put things away, and more.
- Pets are a neccesity not a make/break. I'll agree they are important if you are going to grind, but they aren't important at all if you want to be a farmer or horse tamer. You can buy them from auction now I believe.
- You kill things far too quickly for you to be bending over and picking up items.  Pets are needed if you want to grind effectively.  The best way to grind is to kill things that you can kill with low kill time per monster. It just gives you better money per hour. That being done you need pets to be able to loot while you run to the next pack or your money per hour takes a massive dive, and you are essentially working twice as hard or more.
- Horse skill reset and also player full skill reset are indeed annoying. However you can buy horses from the stable if you don't want to grind one (Which most people would rather not do).
- Those are nothing, what about the item that makes durability go down slower, that you can use on fishing rods?  So you can make a Balenos Fishing rod last literally 13 hours or more.
Full skill reset is p2wish and that is where I'd rather have them let people get one by ingame means.
- Not really, the game doesn't have 'customization' like most games, the goal is to have every skill maxed out, I don't see why people skill reset, this is a grinding non stop soulessly forever game.
There are ways to get money besides grinding btw.
- Not really, Life skills can be done WHILE grinding. You should have your workers out doing things while you are grinding and then you stop for a moment or two to process everything and make packs, then back to more grinding.

The game is probably pay to win.
It's also a shameless cash grab.
Why? It's a theme park game with no rides.

I've tried to get people to explain where the sand in this sandbox is, they all end up saying "oh I guess it's a theme park then."  Ok.. Where's the beef?  Where's the dungeons, the character customization, the gear progression, the bosses, the MEAT?

It's just a shameless cash grab.
I'm on Edan, grinding and hating myself.

Again you are assuming everyone that plays BDO or is interested in BDO is only going to grind which is not true.

Anyone that only farms, fishes or horse tames/train won't need multiple pets or any nor an absurd amount of weight limit.

Laughing-man

Bloodaxes said:

Laughing-man said:

Bloodaxes said:

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

- You can level strength for extra weight limit, you can attach gems that increase weight limit, there's gear like the hercules set that gives extra weight limit and you can save your daily loyalty points and increase your weight limit.
- However, you only gain 1.5 pounds of carry weight.  At level 50 that's only 75 extra pounds of weight. 4 Polar bears at T4 give you 80 carry weight.  That's just pets, not counting the cash shop for buying weight, the cash shop for letting you summon your storage to put things away, and more.
- Pets are a neccesity not a make/break. I'll agree they are important if you are going to grind, but they aren't important at all if you want to be a farmer or horse tamer. You can buy them from auction now I believe.
- You kill things far too quickly for you to be bending over and picking up items.  Pets are needed if you want to grind effectively.  The best way to grind is to kill things that you can kill with low kill time per monster. It just gives you better money per hour. That being done you need pets to be able to loot while you run to the next pack or your money per hour takes a massive dive, and you are essentially working twice as hard or more.
- Horse skill reset and also player full skill reset are indeed annoying. However you can buy horses from the stable if you don't want to grind one (Which most people would rather not do).
- Those are nothing, what about the item that makes durability go down slower, that you can use on fishing rods?  So you can make a Balenos Fishing rod last literally 13 hours or more.
Full skill reset is p2wish and that is where I'd rather have them let people get one by ingame means.
- Not really, the game doesn't have 'customization' like most games, the goal is to have every skill maxed out, I don't see why people skill reset, this is a grinding non stop soulessly forever game.
There are ways to get money besides grinding btw.
- Not really, Life skills can be done WHILE grinding. You should have your workers out doing things while you are grinding and then you stop for a moment or two to process everything and make packs, then back to more grinding.

The game is probably pay to win.
It's also a shameless cash grab.
Why? It's a theme park game with no rides.

I've tried to get people to explain where the sand in this sandbox is, they all end up saying "oh I guess it's a theme park then."  Ok.. Where's the beef?  Where's the dungeons, the character customization, the gear progression, the bosses, the MEAT?

It's just a shameless cash grab.
I'm on Edan, grinding and hating myself.

Again you are assuming everyone that plays BDO or is interested in BDO is only going to grind which is not true.

Anyone that only farms, fishes or horse tames/train won't need multiple pets or any nor an absurd amount of weight limit.

All of those activities are to augment grinding.
They are not to replace it.
They make FAR FAR FAR less money than grinding.
To level a horse to T 5 could take you about 3 days of just AFKing, that horse isn't even worth jack, getting a T7?   A month or more of non stop afking...  And that there people might not even buy, and if they do is it worth 100 million?  Yeah but I can earn that in two days of grinding...

The only life skills worth doing is imperial trading, and you can do that WHILE grinding.

P.S. Sitting in a fishing boat fishing is still grinding.  It's just not as good a time cost benefit use of your time.

Caffynated

There's definitely some level of P2W. The biggest being Artisan's Memory being gated behind loyalty or pearls. The player who buys it with money can repair their weapons after failed attempts pretty much at will. The ones using loyalty points are either going to have to wait 4 days for each AM, or burn through 2-5 times as much gold trying to upgrade.

It's not Archeage where normal players will never be near gear parity with the P2W crowd. Duo (+17) and even Tri (+18) equipment is within reach for anyone who plays regularly for a few months, and no lifers will get there easily.

Sassy_Gay_Unicorn

The problem I have with defining something as 'pay to win' is that it silently presupposes that all players have the same goals.


BDO isn't PtW for me because my goal is to just wander and look at stuff, mindlessly grind when my mind needs a distraction. I could not care less if I ever become competitive at PvP or make it into the upper echelons of the PvE strata.


I bought a Samurai costume because it looked nice. Didn't put any more thought into it than that.

kitarad

Exactly I never even used my pet for looting my pet from the game I bought initially . I used to take her out for show and just to watch her land on my shoulder. I did take the sub because I needed bank space and inventory space.  I was only interested in the PvE aspects of the game which I thought was brilliant.

Bloodaxes

Laughing-man said:

Bloodaxes said:

Laughing-man said:

Bloodaxes said:

LIOKI said:

You all forget the pets that pick up for you, that you buy with cash. Then there is the weight limit increase, that you buy with cash. Then the horse skill resets. In my opinion this game is pay to win, it's not as direct, as in you pay cash for in game currency exchanges, but without the carry weight increase and pets you will be far far behind the curve in terms of wealth gain, which in turn puts you far behind the curve in terms of gear acquisition.

- You can level strength for extra weight limit, you can attach gems that increase weight limit, there's gear like the hercules set that gives extra weight limit and you can save your daily loyalty points and increase your weight limit.
- However, you only gain 1.5 pounds of carry weight.  At level 50 that's only 75 extra pounds of weight. 4 Polar bears at T4 give you 80 carry weight.  That's just pets, not counting the cash shop for buying weight, the cash shop for letting you summon your storage to put things away, and more.
- Pets are a neccesity not a make/break. I'll agree they are important if you are going to grind, but they aren't important at all if you want to be a farmer or horse tamer. You can buy them from auction now I believe.
- You kill things far too quickly for you to be bending over and picking up items.  Pets are needed if you want to grind effectively.  The best way to grind is to kill things that you can kill with low kill time per monster. It just gives you better money per hour. That being done you need pets to be able to loot while you run to the next pack or your money per hour takes a massive dive, and you are essentially working twice as hard or more.
- Horse skill reset and also player full skill reset are indeed annoying. However you can buy horses from the stable if you don't want to grind one (Which most people would rather not do).
- Those are nothing, what about the item that makes durability go down slower, that you can use on fishing rods?  So you can make a Balenos Fishing rod last literally 13 hours or more.
Full skill reset is p2wish and that is where I'd rather have them let people get one by ingame means.
- Not really, the game doesn't have 'customization' like most games, the goal is to have every skill maxed out, I don't see why people skill reset, this is a grinding non stop soulessly forever game.
There are ways to get money besides grinding btw.
- Not really, Life skills can be done WHILE grinding. You should have your workers out doing things while you are grinding and then you stop for a moment or two to process everything and make packs, then back to more grinding.

The game is probably pay to win.
It's also a shameless cash grab.
Why? It's a theme park game with no rides.

I've tried to get people to explain where the sand in this sandbox is, they all end up saying "oh I guess it's a theme park then."  Ok.. Where's the beef?  Where's the dungeons, the character customization, the gear progression, the bosses, the MEAT?

It's just a shameless cash grab.
I'm on Edan, grinding and hating myself.

Again you are assuming everyone that plays BDO or is interested in BDO is only going to grind which is not true.

Anyone that only farms, fishes or horse tames/train won't need multiple pets or any nor an absurd amount of weight limit.

All of those activities are to augment grinding.
They are not to replace it.
They make FAR FAR FAR less money than grinding.
To level a horse to T 5 could take you about 3 days of just AFKing, that horse isn't even worth jack, getting a T7?   A month or more of non stop afking...  And that there people might not even buy, and if they do is it worth 100 million?  Yeah but I can earn that in two days of grinding...

The only life skills worth doing is imperial trading, and you can do that WHILE grinding.

P.S. Sitting in a fishing boat fishing is still grinding.  It's just not as good a time cost benefit use of your time.

And? It's a game not a job.

Average player, plays to have fun not to min/max their gains 24/7.

Who cares if selling horses is not the best money making if that person doing it is having fun? Next time you see someone ingame doing something other than grinding be sure to tell them they are doing it wrong and only your way is the best way.

Laughing-man

kitarad said:

Exactly I never even used my pet for looting my pet from the game I bought initially . I used to take her out for show and just to watch her land on my shoulder. I did take the sub because I needed bank space and inventory space.  I was only interested in the PvE aspects of the game which I thought was brilliant.

But what PVE?  No offense.  I mean they add in one world boss every few months that essentially you gotta zerg down and hope you get a drop from, other than that you kill scores of monsters with rarely any mechanics.

The sub giving you 16 extra storage spaces PER CITY and 16 extra inventory slots is really fantastic, and adds weight to the pay to win side.  I like how I can constantly redye my armor with the same 15 dollar fee, because frankly all the armor in the game looks pretty garish.

Laughing-man

Caffynated said:

There's definitely some level of P2W. The biggest being Artisan's Memory being gated behind loyalty or pearls. The player who buys it with money can repair their weapons after failed attempts pretty much at will. The ones using loyalty points are either going to have to wait 4 days for each AM, or burn through 2-5 times as much gold trying to upgrade.

It's not Archeage where normal players will never be near gear parity with the P2W crowd. Duo (+17) and even Tri (+18) equipment is within reach for anyone who plays regularly for a few months, and no lifers will get there easily.

Exactly.  The Artisan Memories are kinda P2W.  Yesterday they sold 10 for 2 dollars and 25 cents, very tempting.  It doubles the durability regain when you are repairing, saving you millions per artisan memory, which is probably an hour per each one.  

10 Hours saved for 2 dollars and 25 cents?
Tempting...

kitarad

Laughing-man said:

kitarad said:

Exactly I never even used my pet for looting my pet from the game I bought initially . I used to take her out for show and just to watch her land on my shoulder. I did take the sub because I needed bank space and inventory space.  I was only interested in the PvE aspects of the game which I thought was brilliant.

But what PVE?  No offense.  I mean they add in one world boss every few months that essentially you gotta zerg down and hope you get a drop from, other than that you kill scores of monsters with rarely any mechanics.

The sub giving you 16 extra storage spaces PER CITY and 16 extra inventory slots is really fantastic, and adds weight to the pay to win side.  I like how I can constantly redye my armor with the same 15 dollar fee, because frankly all the armor in the game looks pretty garish.

I like trading, the worker set up,breeding horses and fishing and just exploring and finding new fish to catch. I also enjoy making things with my workers and selling them on the marketplace. Different strokes.

Laughing-man

kitarad said:

Laughing-man said:

kitarad said:

Exactly I never even used my pet for looting my pet from the game I bought initially . I used to take her out for show and just to watch her land on my shoulder. I did take the sub because I needed bank space and inventory space.  I was only interested in the PvE aspects of the game which I thought was brilliant.

But what PVE?  No offense.  I mean they add in one world boss every few months that essentially you gotta zerg down and hope you get a drop from, other than that you kill scores of monsters with rarely any mechanics.

The sub giving you 16 extra storage spaces PER CITY and 16 extra inventory slots is really fantastic, and adds weight to the pay to win side.  I like how I can constantly redye my armor with the same 15 dollar fee, because frankly all the armor in the game looks pretty garish.

I like trading, the worker set up,breeding horses and fishing and just exploring and finding new fish to catch. i also enjoy making things with my workers and selling them on the marketplace. Different strokes.

Those are nice, I just feel like they're not very fleshed out.  
Having a horse run in loops to make it level isn't very action based, in an actiony game.  I'd prefer them boost the exp while ACTIVELY playing the horse and keep the afk leveling where it is.

Same for Fishing, they need to dramatically boost the rewards for ACTIVE fishing, and keep afk fishing the same.

The workers system has a lot of potential, they've revamped it's UI about 3 - 4 times since launch and it's really looking good but I think they maybe should add more depth to it. More ways to interact with the workers.  It sucks once one gets to 30 and fails to promote and it's stuck blue.  I spent months working on that guy and now he's forever not as useful as others that I can just buy and spend a week leveling.  Maybe adding in quests with the workers would really help.

I just feel like the E part of the PvE is a bit lack luster and needs some love.

Edit:  I think it's a bit discouraging that Fishing level doesn't really help you at all.  I think the benefit for leveling life skills should be more than one meager benefit per skill.  I.E.  When you level Trading you're getting better deals, maybe it also makes you drive a wagon faster.

kitarad

I don't afk run my horses I do trade routes.  I do afk fish though.

Laughing-man

kitarad said:

I don't afk run my horses I do trade routes.  I do afk fish though.

Yes but I mean no one is going to argue that nearly 3 weeks of afking needed to get a T7 horse is a bit absurd, and that's not even a max rank horse, and that's not even a 100% chance on it, and it doesn't even sell for very much if you did sell it.  

It would be nice if "Taming" increased your chances of having better breeding success.

kitarad

True many improvements can be made but my reasons for playing it were those I mentioned and I like it and even if I might wish for things to be changed to improve it for now I cannot really find a game that looks this nice and world that looks alive to play and do the things I enjoy.

I also never leave my computer on for very long so I don't worry about the time as I am not competing with anyone. I am just enjoying the game.

Scorchien

DMKano said:

Since P2W has no agreed upon definition, and anybody can call anything P2W for ANY reason,

How could anyone possibly answer this question objectively?

yea .. This.... Its up to each individual to decide if any game is P2W to them ..

  To me BDO was P2Untedioum , as every action you take in the game is tedious and the cash shop is built around relieving said tedium...