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Marvel Heroes 2016 - Step into 2017 with the Biggest Update Ever - MMORPG.com

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  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 8,067
    edited January 2017
    Nilden said:
    OhhPaigey said:
    Anybody been playing the updated version recently?

    How is it?
    It depends if you were not doing cosmic stuff and just farted about having fun you probably won't notice too much difference.

    If you were doing cosmic and high end stuff with tons of time into your build and gear...

    They nerfed movement and teleport into the ground. Power points are gone, omega system is gone, and you will probably spend an hour or more going through your inventory. You have to redo the costume enchants on a new item slot (which you will need to farm in cosmic midtown or equivalent), like we needed even more item bloat in this game.

    The infinity system is really simplified and pales in comparison to the omega one.

    It's a mixed bag. Most of which is pretty crap for the high end cosmic stuff and general fast pace of the game.
    To be honest, cosmic/high end stuff was mostly crap. I can't speak for raids (as it would seem that most of the community didn't play them to begin with), but cosmic zones and terminals were a cakewalk. Cosmic danger room was pretty much the only relevant solo challenge, and now we're looking at a much wider scope of hard content.

    Movement and teleports needed a hard nerf. Being able to blink twice per second, every second was not healthy for the game. It turned everything into a boss rush and devolved boss fights into "blink out of the instakill areas."  Also, it killed distinction between heroes. Heroes intended to be built around mobility (like Nightcrawler) really struggled for a niche against an entire cast that could do basically the same thing.

    Power points were not compelling for reasons I've covered. Basically, choice was an illusion. Sure, you could spend on whatever you wanted, but almost every hero ultimately devolved into "max your signature, max DoTs, max a spender, max offensive passives, 1-point-wonder defensive passives and stun breaks, max a few cooldown powers, ignore basics." It was pretty boring from a build standpoint. 

    The new costume enchants are a minor nuisance when you first log in. Ultimately, however, it's a massive improvement. Tying stats directly to your costume resulted in some rather unfun interactions with prestiging, and discouraged the use of multiple costumes on a single character (not that most characters have more than one good costume to begin with).

    Neither the infinity system nor the omega system are good. The infinity system is nothing but endless progression at a stupidly slow gain rate, but the omega system suffered from seriously poor balance between options. There were a lot of choices there, but few of them were actually compelling or useful.
  • GruntyGrunty Member EpicPosts: 8,657
    edited January 2017
    Haven't played yet. Had a 5 GB patch yesterday and now have a 6 GB patch today.  I won't let that patch run until I go to bed.   Well, it does say it's playable but I get a black screen and then the client crashes. 
    "I used to think the worst thing in life was to be all alone.  It's not.  The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel all alone."  Robin Williams
  • tawesstawess Member EpicPosts: 4,227
    OhhPaigey said:
    Anybody been playing the updated version recently?

    How is it?
    It is good. Many heroes are now playable as heroes and not as a resource micro management game in tights... 

    Progression is a lot clearer and the absurd powerpoint system will not be missed by me. 

    Sure there is some decreased ability to really min/max (or muchnkin) it but sine that is across the board i feel it will not be missed.

    No clue about PvP.. Never ever touched that.  

    This have been a good conversation

  • Tiamat64Tiamat64 Member RarePosts: 1,545
    edited January 2017
    It's good if you want more tactical thinking in the game play as you're forced to constantly consider whether to use up a movement charge or not (it gives invulnerability frames so instead of twitch eye-balling when you need to move around to a safe spot, you're tactically thinking about when to use a limited-resource movement skill to become invincible for a moment), bad if you want more fast-paced twitch in your gameplay.

    Honestly I suspect by now most of the player base consisted of the latter, so this update is going to hurt the player base of the game drastically in the short term, and possibly the long term if most Marvel Hero fans are the latter.  But time will tell, I suppose.

    Also, it's bad if you primarily played summoner.s  Being forced to use precious now-limited hotkeys on summons or relying on passively spawning summons that die too easily and then take 30 seconds to respawn (a 30 second timer that only starts AFTER the summon dies) sucks.  Team-ups die too easily too.  So sucks all around for those who like playing alongside AI allies, and that's just in terms of the gameplay.  In terms of power, summons did not translate to the new system well as the new Trait system (where you get bonus damage depending on stacking Intelligence or Fighting or Speed or whatever is applicable to your hero) does not apply to summons, and Intelligence in part due to the new trait system does not give summon damage as well.  This causes a slew of both long term (with the infinity system) and short term problems for summoner damage.
  • derkesthaiderkesthai Member UncommonPosts: 2
    Darn, I never got around to trying the Omega system :P
  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,916
    Well the steam reviews are rolling in  and it is getting hammered...

    http://store.steampowered.com/app/226320/#app_reviews_hash

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer

    Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/ 

  • MendelMendel Member LegendaryPosts: 5,609
    Nilden said:
    Well the steam reviews are rolling in  and it is getting hammered...

    http://store.steampowered.com/app/226320/#app_reviews_hash

    Well, consider the source.  The Steam community tends to be more toxic than even this one.

    I put in a solid hour or 2 on Sunday.  It really doesn't seem drastically different to me.  I can't rely on the AoE/Movement skill as much as I did, but that always seemed a bit of a dodgy thing anyway.  I'd do it, but feel bad about myself afterwards.

    Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.

  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,916
    Mendel said:
    Nilden said:
    Well the steam reviews are rolling in  and it is getting hammered...

    http://store.steampowered.com/app/226320/#app_reviews_hash

    Well, consider the source.  The Steam community tends to be more toxic than even this one.

    I put in a solid hour or 2 on Sunday.  It really doesn't seem drastically different to me.  I can't rely on the AoE/Movement skill as much as I did, but that always seemed a bit of a dodgy thing anyway.  I'd do it, but feel bad about myself afterwards.
    Well to be fair it was mostly positive before this, so I am considering the source.

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer

    Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/ 

  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 8,067
    edited January 2017
    Nilden said:
    Well the steam reviews are rolling in  and it is getting hammered...

    http://store.steampowered.com/app/226320/#app_reviews_hash

    Problem is, major overhauls are all but guaranteed to generate overwhelming backlash, even if it is an improvement on the game. Gamers are a particularly excitable group that tends to be very much opposed to change. I guarantee you that if the game versions were reversed, and this version was the old version, the outcome would be the same.

    Looking at the content of the steam user reviews is very telling. Few of them have anything more substantial to say than "I can't spam dashes anymore? Wtf, dead game." 
  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,916
    Torval said:
    I've been playing for the last couple of days and I'm starting to get the hang of things. There are some changes I still don't quite get, but it's coming together.

    For example on the team up panel you don't pick your skills anymore. The team up character has access to all the skills, however 3 of them are still highlighted like they are the skills selected. I'm not sure if this is a bug, signifies something else, or how to find out.

    There are a few more of those situations that I'm still working through, but overall I like the update a lot. The game is a little harder in some situations, at least for Star Lord, but more fun.
    The highlighted ones are the ones for when the team up is away.

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer

    Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/ 

  • TillerTiller Member LegendaryPosts: 11,489
    edited January 2017
    I don't like this change, it's too simple; now and I feel there is less customization to build a specialized character. It's all cookie-cutter, plus they nerfed the hell out of Deadpool's powerslide which I loved for mobility.
    SWG Bloodfin vet
    Elder Jedi/Elder Bounty Hunter
     
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    Lasted 10 seconds then remembered why i uninstalled game last time.
    locked camera,designed exactly like an Arpg only with super hero theme,very low poly characters.
    I noticed Unreal,must be Unreal 1 and even then they did not use better textures that the UE1 can  definitely handle.
    I also remembered just button mashing 2-3 buttons like a ARPG so i lost interest before i even killed anything,it brought back bad memories.If they dumbed it down even further than what it was prior,that would be really sad because to me personally,it had nothing going for it.
    Only positive i can remember from the past was seems like they fixed up the controller because i remember spending days then realizing they did not support controller at the time.
    But soon i realized what game this was ,i was not even interested in going into the field.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    If they would get rid of the cheap locked camera and give me a free camera that alone would make it 50% more playable as i have absolutely no interest in any game with a 1985 locked camera.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • simsalabim77simsalabim77 Member RarePosts: 1,607
    Wizardry said:
    Lasted 10 seconds then remembered why i uninstalled game last time.
    locked camera,designed exactly like an Arpg only with super hero theme,very low poly characters.
    I noticed Unreal,must be Unreal 1 and even then they did not use better textures that the UE1 can  definitely handle.
    I also remembered just button mashing 2-3 buttons like a ARPG so i lost interest before i even killed anything,it brought back bad memories.If they dumbed it down even further than what it was prior,that would be really sad because to me personally,it had nothing going for it.
    Only positive i can remember from the past was seems like they fixed up the controller because i remember spending days then realizing they did not support controller at the time.
    But soon i realized what game this was ,i was not even interested in going into the field.


    You're complaining about an ARPG being an ARPG. 
  • NildenNilden Member EpicPosts: 3,916
    Torval said:
    Thanks. Can those be changed or are they the defaults for each one of the 3 main team up summon styles.
    The only thing you can choose now is the summon style (always, summoned, or away) and the team up hero. They all have access to all their powers.

    Just mouse over the tool tips for the team up powers and you will see the highlighted ones are all away powers.

    Some team ups have 3 some have 4 away powers. Just checked Groot, SHIELD agent which had 4 away powers each and Iron Man Mark II plus Winter Punisher which had 3 away powers each. So it varies by team up hero.


    Also just as an aside I have a cosmic able Squirrel Girl summoner and cosmic able Nightcrawler as my mains.

    "You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon

    "classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon

    Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer

    Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/ 

  • ThaosenThaosen Member UncommonPosts: 7
    edited January 2017
    **EDIT**
    Damn, realized I wrote a wall of text after posting it...


    TL;DR So I've been playing quite a bit since the update. and was able to do a cosmic prestige post-update Overall, I'm having less fun, but still enjoying my time online.

    The "tactical gameplay" some players are talking about isn't really there if you're used to gaming in general. (at least, not yet). If you play as a ranged hero, the game is still quite easy after you put a bit of time in learning your hero. For melees, it can be a bit tricky and the Shield of Perseus legendary goes a long way to help your suvivability. Running in Cosmic Patrol Zones I could see quite a few players who did not seem to realise that they could actually ... run.

    The heroes are unbalanced right now, but the TTK (time to kill, a metric used in game to measure DPS) isn't really relevant at the current time. On the bright side, I haven't played a hero which made me step back and consider that the content was too hard. But then again, it was pretty much the same pre-update.

    The infinity system is... Awful. It will need a lot of polishing. It's very similar to D3 Paragon System but instead of receiving 1 point to spend in an attribute each time you "level", you'd get one fragment of a point that you couldn't use because the attribute would require 3 or 4 points. Thus, if you wanted to increase something like Critical Damage, you would have to get the point in all the categories multiple times to finally be able to increase your Critical Damage by one. The stats themselves also need to be reviewed mathematically.

    As for the talents, I personally enjoyed it more before the update. I always enjoyed systems which allows you to put points in your talents as you see fit. However, I can understand that players who are not really interested by theorycrafting would only take a cookie cutter build and consider that we don't really have options in there... But then again, in this game being the top had very little meaning and the content has always been easy (except maybe for some Cosmic Danger Rooms combos which might be nasty) so I am not too sure why someone wouldn't simply ... try.

    Then, we really feel that we are in a transition right now. Pre-update we used to farm uniques to use them in some recipes that would give us, for example, game currency chests, relics, runes... These are goods that are not so easy to get in-game except by the said recipes. Now, they have removed these recipes, without adding anything new... So players have much less incentive to actually play the game once they hit 60, so we are prestige rushing before they remove the costumes recipes too.

    Also, right now, there is too much that is based on "Trust us, we have a clear vision where we are going" from Gaz. The players keep fighting between themselves days and night because of this update, yet we are told very little about what their "future plan" is. Also, I do not entirely trust the reasons behind this update which seems rather incomplete.

    My post might seem to be negative, but that is because as I've said, overall I have less fun than before the patch and also, I've always considered that it was easier to talk about what I disliked than the opposite. This said, there are some things are are worth mentioning for the plus side too :)

    I'd say that the major upgrade lies in the story mode. Some chapters were reviewed and improved to make it more enjoyable overall. This might score quite a bit of points with newer players as it is more engaging than previously.

    Also, there have been some quality of life improvements. The costume catalyst for example, is a much better system. Previously, we had to "bind" a specific item to our costume. So if you changed costume well... You'd lose your bonuses. Now, it's separate so you can swap your costume as much as you want.

    The slider, while not polished yet, gives some choice to the player about the kind of challenge he wants to face. Feeling like facerolling and stomping your enemies? Normal mode is there, but the rewards are quite low. Want to face a little bit of challenge and get some extra rewards? You can try Heroic or Cosmic.

    Another point to note is that with this massive simplification of the game, I think that it will be easier for the developers in the long run to work on a goal of "balance" between the heroes. With 60 heroes and multiple complex layers as was the case previously, it is understandable that balancing would be a good joke more than anything. Now they can at least try ;)
  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Member EpicPosts: 6,057
    edited January 2017
    Aeander said:
    Undepth said:

    4) In a future patch/update they will be changing how costumes from prestiging works. the biggest change is that you will no longer get a free default costume for prestiging(releveling) a hero. 
    Thanks for the heads up, now I have no reason to come back because that's all I really enjoyed doing was prestiging. What is the point now? Pretty chat colors? No thanks.
    He isn't giving you the whole story. The reason why this change is being delayed until a later update is that a new reward system for prestiging is being developed to replace the duplicate costumes. It won't just be "pretty chat colors."
    and it sure as hell won't be costumes.

    You want to know the one thing they mentioned to replace it, titles if you go through cosmic prestige.  If you know what that grind is you'll see why it's a poor substitution.

    They also removed easy ways of obtaining currency, you can use to buy heroes or teamups, from the story as well as login rewards.  They are making it a longer grind for new players to unlock things.  As a game like this ages they should be more generous to new customers in order to attract and keep them.  They are doing the opposite.


    Post edited by FrodoFragins on
  • DKLondDKLond Member RarePosts: 2,273
    I like many things about this game, but I have the hardest time dealing with items not being reflected, visually, on my character.

    Does that make me shallow?

    It's one of those things I greatly enjoy. I love seeing my new shiny armor or weapon on my dude.
  • FrodoFraginsFrodoFragins Member EpicPosts: 6,057
    Mendel said:
    Nilden said:
    Well the steam reviews are rolling in  and it is getting hammered...

    http://store.steampowered.com/app/226320/#app_reviews_hash

    Well, consider the source.  The Steam community tends to be more toxic than even this one.

    I put in a solid hour or 2 on Sunday.  It really doesn't seem drastically different to me.  I can't rely on the AoE/Movement skill as much as I did, but that always seemed a bit of a dodgy thing anyway.  I'd do it, but feel bad about myself afterwards.
    One of the people with a negative review was a major advocate and youtube content creator for the game and like me has grown tired of waiting for them to add content.  He recognizes that most of the changes are being made to accommodate the leaked console release and that it's clear tehy aren't going to deliver new content/systems to endgame any time soon.

    They diverted their PC dev resources from making content, systems and heroes to almost completely redesigning the game for well over a year.  Not just redesigning, simplifying everything to be able to port more easily to the console.

    Are there people overreacting in their steam reviews? sure.  But they gutted mobility which was the one thing besides the marvel IP that really stood out.  and while the Marvel IP can be a great benefit.  If they changed your favorite hero into something you no longer enjoy, you have a right to be unhappy and post a "do not recommend" review.

    They created dev blogs for everything important except end game.  Their current update plan would be like WOW creating an expansion without dungeons or raids but completely redesigned systems for every class.  and then telling you that they can't add content until all of the systems and new items are balanced properly.

    The update isn't of SWG:NGE horrendousness, but it really took the game back in several key ways.  I do think they can balance things more easily, well once they release the update with brand new item classes.  But anyone that wants an ARPG with a rewarding/evolving endgame needs to look elsewhere.

    As far as the review I wrote, it was also a "do not recommend" with the caveat that if they deliver compelling/rewarding end game systems I'll be happy to reverse it to a recommend rating.  I had to go to other ARPGs to get that type of content.  I'd probably delete my review the moment they took the time to outline their plans for fixing endgame, assuming it sounded like they "got it".

    The problem with MH is they've never really shown that they understood the end game of the ARPG genre.  they tried making typical 10 man raids but not enough people participated.  They created a system similar to POE maps and then dumbed them down to being almost pointless.  they initially were supposed to be endless dungeons.  Instead they are maps of three tiers with different affixes and nothing special regarding loot.  They even held a tournament for the hardest version of one map and made a leaderboard of the fastest times, but refused to even show the heroes used.  Possibly for fear of people questioning the balance if certain heroes were dominating.

    The core structures will probably be in place in about 9 months, hopefully they are already starting work on how to deliver content to the veterans that have become disillusioned and bored.

  • victorvndoomvictorvndoom Member UncommonPosts: 19
    got my first level 60, bought a boost with 99 euros worth (splinters, exp ect), because those old boosts are going away. The problem is that the mobs are now more lethal at their level. Without the skillpoint system you dont have enough (super) power to defeat them but once infinity is unlocked (it is like paragorn system , nice stolen from blizz) it serves fior all new characters. Grining for splinter after the buffs are gone will be a hassel

    question; can bovine sectors be done solo or in group ?
    question : all are powers unlocked from level 1 and talents from level 32 or is that depends the character. or do you still need to level to unlock some powers. Example my scarlet with is 33 and has all powers unlocked but only one traitline

    drstrangeguy in game

  • AeanderAeander Member LegendaryPosts: 8,067
    Aeander said:
    Undepth said:

    4) In a future patch/update they will be changing how costumes from prestiging works. the biggest change is that you will no longer get a free default costume for prestiging(releveling) a hero. 
    Thanks for the heads up, now I have no reason to come back because that's all I really enjoyed doing was prestiging. What is the point now? Pretty chat colors? No thanks.
    He isn't giving you the whole story. The reason why this change is being delayed until a later update is that a new reward system for prestiging is being developed to replace the duplicate costumes. It won't just be "pretty chat colors."
    and it sure as hell won't be costumes.

    You want to know the one thing they mentioned to replace it, titles if you go through cosmic prestige.  If you know what that grind is you'll see why it's a poor substitution.

    They also removed easy ways of obtaining currency, you can use to buy heroes or teamups, from the story as well as login rewards.  They are making it a longer grind for new players to unlock things.  As a game like this ages they should be more generous to new customers in order to attract and keep them.  They are doing the opposite.


    No, it won't be costumes. I rather doubt it will only be a title either. This is something to take a wait and see approach on. It is pointless speculating this early in.

    Also, eternity splinter gains went up, not down. Splinters now drop much more reliably in packs of up to 5, and you can reasonably expect to get several multi-drops in a play session. This is without needing boosts or special item find.
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    exile01 said:
    It got worse. Simplification for the new generation of ultra short concentration players. Digital dementia.
    Drivel.
  • Tiamat64Tiamat64 Member RarePosts: 1,545
    Marvel Hero's Biggest Update Ever:

    No new items to collect.

    No new content to play.

    ....the story of Marvel Hero's life.
  • AlverantAlverant Member RarePosts: 1,347
    I may give it a try this weekend and see how I like it.
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